rbk mama Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 My dyslexic 10 yo still struggles with this. "Expresses a complete thought" seems to be the piece she doesn't get. Any advice? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monica_in_Switzerland Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 Does she understand that she needs a subject and a predicate? That's really all it means. Like, "A great big angry elephant" is not a complete thought and "climbed through my window last night" is not a complete thought, but put together, they are. So if she neds to answer the question "What climbed through your window?" she'll need to answer it with a noun of some kind, but also restate the action, so, "A great big angry elephant did" is technically a sentence, but "did" is really weak. The reader wants to understand what happened without needing to know what question was asked. A history text that I use has comprehension questions at the end of each chapter. I tell my kids to read the questions, formulate answers, then give those answers in a paragraph that does not require the reader to know the questions to understand. This has helped focus their summaries a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbk mama Posted December 27, 2017 Author Share Posted December 27, 2017 Does she understand that she needs a subject and a predicate? That's really all it means. Like, "A great big angry elephant" is not a complete thought and "climbed through my window last night" is not a complete thought, but put together, they are. Yes, but "When the big elephant sat" is a dependent clause and not a complete sentence, even though it has a noun and predicate. This is what trips her up. If the volcano erupts Where the monkeys were playing Near the laughing clown Noun? check. Verb? check. Sentence? Nope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneStepAtATime Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 What are you using for reading remediation? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monica_in_Switzerland Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 Maybe spend some time flipping questions to declaratives and vice versa, then telling her she needs to flip the question into a declarative AND add the missing information. So: Where was the party? --> The party was where --> The party was where the monkey were playing. Or maybe have her visualize (or actually do) walking into another room and telling a person completely unaware of the question the answer to the question, and needing it to be something they could understand. "Go tell daddy when the helicopters will take off" "If the volcano erupts." "What are you talking about dear child?" "If the volcano erupts, the helicopters will take off. "Oh, I see." But this IS a really tough skill. I can still remember how much it annoyed me to have to do this as a child. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monica_in_Switzerland Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 Ack, sorry, just saw this was on learning challenges board not the regular board. My ideas might not apply, sorry about that! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanin Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 This is a really tough skill that even my dyslexic high school students struggle with. We teach them about the "AWWUBIS" words (see link) and then basically just teach them that if there's an AWWUBIS word (like When, Although, If) at the beginning of the sentence, then they need a comma and a second part to the sentence. It seems like it should be natural, but it's not. https://www.wayfair.com/storage-organization/pdp/viv-rae-folding-toy-storage-bin-vvre2715.html?piid=21419176 You could make a checklist that she uses to proofread single sentences. AWWUBIS word at the beginning? yes/no If yes, second half of sentence? yes/no Punctuation? yes/no That's what I'd do :-) 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbk mama Posted December 27, 2017 Author Share Posted December 27, 2017 Sounds like a good thing to try! (The link you gave was off I think - unless there is an ingenious way to use storage boxes to teach sentence structure, which would be a great concept! :-) ) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbk mama Posted December 27, 2017 Author Share Posted December 27, 2017 What are you using for reading remediation? We used Wilson until her reading was at grade level, which it is now. Her spelling is still atrocious, and I've been inconsistent (and frankly overwhelmed and feeling a bit hopeless about it) - have decided to make consistency a bigger focus after the holidays. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPan Posted December 27, 2017 Share Posted December 27, 2017 Scholastic has a workbook series Success in Writing that starts back at that point. Like it has page after page where they choose the complete sentence, etc. I started my ds in the grade 1. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exercise_guru Posted December 28, 2017 Share Posted December 28, 2017 (edited) Well I have a goofy son who I suspect might eventually run into this. Can you teach her the skill with humor and visual pictures like your example sentence? The brain loves novelty so sometimes Grammer and grinding through stuff can make for frustration. I love love love magnet poetry for this also you can print your own with magnetic sheets from staples. If cost and time is an issue just print sheets of sentences in large font and rearrange them back and forth on the table or a cookie tray. In general when my kids hit a brick wall with a concept I have a few strategies 1.try making it obnoxious funny .. this takes the pressure off so they are more open minded to try it. 2.reward instantly for any correct answer with a smile or que. Then try for 3 in a row and try to catch them before they spin off . 3. Simplify to basic elements and build back up. So start with a simplistic full sentence and then add an element (or take something away)until it trips them. Then build back up 4. Do.something else and circle back to the concept in 3-4 weeks. Sometimes it clicks after a break working on something else. This happens in my son's guitar. He gets overwhelmed or stuck on a song. So the teacher puts it aside for a month and they do other things. Then when he sees it after a break he almost always can play it easily. 5. Keep it short because I have found my kiddos will persevere if they know they just need to give it 100 percent for 1 page or for 15 minutes. 5. Also kids like to spot errors and put things in jail. Have the student put sentences in jail for not following the rules etc. Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk Edited December 29, 2017 by exercise_guru 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanin Posted December 29, 2017 Share Posted December 29, 2017 Ha, here's the real link (I hope): https://www.google.com/url?hl=en&q=http://www.cobblearning.net/howetoreadandwrite/files/2016/05/PDF-How-to-make-complex-sentences-using-AAAWWUBBIS-words-2fjn1nc.pdf&source=gmail&ust=1514599708635000&usg=AFQjCNH2IlTCEeHaO-QtFyLm_bpe85zr7g 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbk mama Posted December 29, 2017 Author Share Posted December 29, 2017 Thanks!! Exercise Guru thanks for the great ideas!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prairiewindmomma Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 We used the Killgallon text Sentence Composing for Elementary School Students to focus on this issue. Almost all of the phrases you list start with a preposition...and the one that doesn't is a conditional clause. Killgallon focuses a lot on using prepositional clauses or conditional clauses to spice up writing. My son is able to recognize patterns as an intermediate step to truly being able to identify and label parts of a sentence. You might check it out---I think I picked it up used on amazon for $10 after I saw it recommended here. I *think* he has this mastered now. We're using Exercises in English, and I'm going to come back around to the topic in a few months to see if it "stuck". He's 11, fwiw. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbk mama Posted December 30, 2017 Author Share Posted December 30, 2017 That looks very interesting, though I suspect it will be difficult for DD. I love the concept of chunking to gain an understanding of phrases and clauses. Also love that the examples are all sentences from good childrens literature. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exercise_guru Posted December 30, 2017 Share Posted December 30, 2017 welcome I am eating popcorn with this thread. I should ask what method this is because I am pretty sure that my 10 year old doesn't know this. I forgot my other favorite tip but it might not work because some 10 year olds don't get irony well especially if there are learning issues involved but you can apply this to real life while you are taking a break from it. Use incomplete sentences when giving directions. Ask your kids to make you clarify what you are saying. When prepositions hang in midair it can be much more obvious than seeing them on paper. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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