S/O Joy in learning

[Alenee]

In the relaxed hs'er thread several people wrote about kids having the 'joy in learning'. The thing is, for me, it's not all that joyful. I hated school growing up. I do enjoy teaching my kids, however, I really have a hard time getting *excited* over any of it. I love learning Latin and we're now going into the Renaissance and Reformation with history which I'm looking forward to. I just don't know how to get the kids excited about learning if I'm not. My 9yo dd does the work w/o complaints but that's really just her personality. My 6.5 yo would rather play all day than sit down and do schoolwork. She does enjoy read-aloud with regard to history and science though.

 

I've heard people say for years, 'learning should be fun'. Why? We all have to learn so yes, if it was fun, it might make it easier to learn. But then again, I don't exactly want to foster a desire that everything be *fun* in my kids. I want them to grow up to be leaders, not waiting to be entertained.

 

Anyone see my dilemma? WWYD? What have you done if you're like me?

[KJB]

Just this year, my 12 yo and my 9 yo and I have had some wonderful discussions when we've done logic together and when we've done philosophy. The meat of the discussion, the argument, the thinking is where we have had a great time.

 

I hear people say all the time they want their kids to "love learning". Well, I don't care if my kids love to learn. Sometimes it's just no fun. I want my kids to love thinking and to learn even if it's drudgery.

 

And, of course, the best thinking (and therefore conversation) happens as kids get older. I say that and my kids are still pretty young which leads me to believe that the best of home schooling lies ahead of us!

[Guest Virginia Dawn]

I am like you, and I've learned to live with myself. ;-)

 

Really, it would stress me out to try to make it my job to make learning fun. Sometimes I just say, "It may not be fun but it has to be done." After 17years, I've stopped feeling guilty about it.

 

What makes it fun is when learning pays off outside of school hours. Then it is so sweet to have an intelligent conversation with a teenager, or see a 9yo get excited to get jeopardy questions right, or hear your 4yo astound someone with something they heard during history read aloud time. :-)

[amy g.]

Well, we really do enjoy learning here.

 

Think of how much a toddler delights in each new accomplishment. I believe that is how all of life can be. I think learning is as inherently enjoyable as eating or exercising or.......tea.

 

The problem is that our culture tells people that work and leisure are polar opposites. It really doesn't have to be that way.

 

We enjoy a little free time to watch a movie together and just relax, but my kids are so used to their hard-working, lifetime-learning role models that they don't know they are "supposed" to resist and avoid learning.

 

I remember once, my BIL said that my kids were going to be so mad when they realized that they had done school year 'round all of their lives when other kids were having summer vacation.

 

My 14 year old said, "That's stupid. Why would you want a vacation from school?"

 

I didn't post on the thread about relaxed home schoolers, but we have tried to give our kids balanced happy relaxed childhoods. I'm sure much of this is their innate temperaments, but they are thriving, and excelling in this environment. They choose interesting and challenging activities to do in their free time.

 

Ds, for example is finishing his Math without complaint because he wants some time to animate Newton's laws on Scratch. Nine year old dd wants to write and illustrate a book for the baby Christmas. We have never made school a chore, and they don't see work as something to be avoided.

[KJB]

My children don't avoid work nor do they complain about the tasks they are required to do. In fact, they work well and compliantly every single day both at school work and chores.

 

However, they don't enjoy or "love" learning their times tables or spelling rules or practicing difficult piano pieces or whatever.... They'd much rather be reading or playing. And, I don't expect them to prefer or "love" their required task oriented work. In fact, I don't ever expect them to "love" rote but necessary learning. I don't love it. I don't know anyone that does love it.

 

I expect compliance and cheerful attitudes. I expect an exceptional work ethic. I expect completed tasks and learning. Asking them to *love* all that is a bit much, for my kids anyway....

 

I wanted to add since my post sounds a little harsh in re-reading...AmyG you are right that there is so much to love in everyday learning. Kids that are fostered in that environment do thrive. Your kids sound wonderful and happy. You seem to have found the perfect balance.

Edited October 21, 2008 by KJB

[Sarah CB]

I think it's entirely possible to have a structured, classical homeschool with a thriving love of learning. In fact, one of the things I notice with all of the various homeschool method books is that each method claims to have the formula for creating lifelong learners who enjoy learning and are self-motivated to learn. I think you can create joyful learners with any approach to homeschooling provided the one leading leads with a joyful attitude.

 

I love learning. I loved school, I loved new books and new classes and new assignments. I'm trying to create an environment where my kids look forward to new challenges, get excited when we have new books to read and take the initiative to go the extra mile with assignments they're excited about. I love to see learning happening in their free time when they really have no "reason" to be learning but they get excited about something and go for it.

 

No, I don't think every grammar lesson should be a party (although my 6 and 8 year olds really like doing FLL). There are things that have to get done even if we don't feel like it. Dd (12) loves math - it's her favourite subject but that doesn't mean that she enjoys every minute of it. Sometimes she has times where she has to slog through some tough parts, but that's part of life. It's like violin. Ds (8) loves violin and most of the time he even has fun practicing - but not every time. Sometimes he'd rather play than practice and he wishes it would just be over...but he still has to do it.

 

One of the aspects I appreciated most about TWTM was that Susan and Jessie gave a lot of freedom for students to get excited about their studies. I love that in the grammar stage they're encouraged to do some extra research and make a narration page about an aspect of what they learned that week that *they* got excited about. There is so much room in TWTM for personalized learning and for the student to take initiative and self-direct some learning.

 

Just today dd (12) was working on some church in history questions for TOG. She was really enjoying learning about the Diet of Worms so she ended up writing a full page summary about it - she didn't have to, but she was enjoying herself and that's what she ended up with. That's what I want. I want kids who aren't always trying to do the bare minimum so they can run off and play. I want them to be inspired by what they're learning about, I want them to get excited about it, and I want them to take ownership over it.

 

It's so much easier to teach a child (and they retain SO much more) when the child is interested and excited about what you're teaching. That's why part of my self-evaluation each year includes whether or not I was able to inspire some excitement in learning in my kids. If not, I adjust. Maybe I add regular games to math, or switch to a curriculum that is still rigorous but more fitting to the student. And when I choose materials I make sure I'm choosing materials that are of a high quality and that will inspire my kids. I want them to see a book and be compelled to pick it up and read it.

 

Anyway, I don't think every day should be a party, but I do think that we classical, structured homeschoolers can raise kids who love to learn just as easily as a relaxed homeschooler.

[Alenee]

My children don't avoid work nor do they complain about the tasks they are required to do. In fact, they work well and compliantly every single day both at school work and chores.

 

However, they don't enjoy or "love" learning their times tables or spelling rules or practicing difficult piano pieces or whatever.... They'd much rather be reading or playing. And, I don't expect them to prefer or "love" their required task oriented work. In fact, I don't ever expect them to "love" rote but necessary learning. I don't love it. I don't know anyone that does love it.

 

I expect compliance and cheerful attitudes. I expect an exceptional work ethic. I expect completed tasks and learning. Asking them to *love* all that is a bit much, for my kids anyway....

 

 

Yep! This is us. My kids are generally well behaved, compliant, and happy kids. They'd just rather reading or playing to math, spelling, etc.

[Sarah CB]

My children don't avoid work nor do they complain about the tasks they are required to do. In fact, they work well and compliantly every single day both at school work and chores.

 

However, they don't enjoy or "love" learning their times tables or spelling rules or practicing difficult piano pieces or whatever.... They'd much rather be reading or playing. And, I don't expect them to prefer or "love" their required task oriented work. In fact, I don't ever expect them to "love" rote but necessary learning. I don't love it. I don't know anyone that does love it.

 

I expect compliance and cheerful attitudes. I expect an exceptional work ethic. I expect completed tasks and learning. Asking them to *love* all that is a bit much, for my kids anyway....

 

I wanted to add since my post sounds a little harsh in re-reading...AmyG you are right that there is so much to love in everyday learning. Kids that are fostered in that environment do thrive. Your kids sound wonderful and happy. You seem to have found the perfect balance.

 

But why couldn't they love spelling or learning times tables? My dd *loves* spelling. Really, she loves it. And I have boys who love right start math games. Right now their favourite game is Corners. They don't know that they're practicing all kinds of mental math skills while playing it, they just love the game. And dd gets very frustrated with difficult piano pieces - but she loves the sense of accomplishment she gets when she *finally* masters something that once seemed impossible. I don't have to force her or bribe her to practice - she is willing to put in the difficult parts because she loves the end result.

 

And memorizing! It can be really fun! We have a great time with memory work even though we do it every day. I'm sure it could easily be drudgery but it definitely doesn't have to be.

 

Learning is so much easier when the kids are excited about learning - when they love what they're doing. And that love of learning can easily be fostered within a structured, rigorous academic setting - in fact, I'm not sure why fostering a love of learning wouldn't be a main goal of homeschooling.

[KJB]

But does your dd who loves spelling also love times tables? Or does your child who loves math games also love writing essays?

 

The thing is that not all kids love all learning. It's unrealistic (to me anyway) to suggest that if we were just Mary Poppins enough about it, that they'd come around. It's not my method, my bad attitude, or my kids...it's just that learning is work. And if you're kids love all work, then they truly are exceptional.

 

For the rest of us humans, getting up and going to work every day can be a bit difficult when the sun is shining and we'd rather be on a sailboat.:001_smile:

 

And that's not to say that some learning for everyone isn't fun. But to say that all learning for everyone could be fun is simply not true. At least, not IMHO.

[Sarah CB]

But does your dd who loves spelling also love times tables? Or does your child who loves math games also love writing essays?

 

The thing is that not all kids love all learning. It's unrealistic (to me anyway) to suggest that if we were just Mary Poppins enough about it, that they'd come around. It's not my method, my bad attitude, or my kids...it's just that learning is work. And if you're kids love all work, then they truly are exceptional.

 

For the rest of us humans, getting up and going to work every day can be a bit difficult when the sun is shining and we'd rather be on a sailboat.:001_smile:

 

And that's not to say that some learning for everyone isn't fun. But to say that all learning for everyone could be fun is simply not true. At least, not IMHO.

 

Well, no, I thought I was clear that they don't love every aspect of every subject every day. I don't think that's realistic. However, I do think that overall we should strive for instilling a love for learning and a strong motivation to learn in our children. I don't want kids who end up in jobs where they're just putting in time until the weekend. I want them to discover areas they love and find a career doing something that inspires them - and no, I'm sure they won't love every day of their work but overall my goal is for them to find careers that are fulfilling and joyful for them.

 

We've had days where my kids couldn't wait to just be done everything and then run and play. I always think afterwards about what I could have done differently. I want them to have many occasions to get so interested in what they're doing that they forget they're actually doing "work".

 

I think that it's possible to inspire our kids to love learning. No every day won't be a party, but I hope that their desire and motivation to learn will carry them through the hard days and that they'll see the worth and the reward in a strong work ethic and the ability to stick to a task and see it through in the end. I want that to translate into a career that is worth getting up in the morning for. More than that, I want them to be lifelong learners who get excited about learning new things and are willing to take on new challenges.

[KJB]

And really aren't our children all just so lucky to have Mamas that care so much if they love how they end up spending their lives?

 

All the children of the world should be so lucky.

 

((Hugs)) to us all that work so hard.

 

Thanks for the discussion!

Edited October 22, 2008 by KJB

[Crissy]

I don't think joy in learning is the same as outward excitement about learning.

 

You know what I think we have around here most of the time? Comfort in learning.

It's like warm socks and a sweater on a cold day. It just feels good.

When there are extra minutes in the day, we sit and read together.

When Hunter hears or sees new birds in the yard, he drags out the field guides to learn about them.

When we have a storm moving in, my husband breaks out the whiteboard to explain high and low pressure to anyone who cares to listen.

When Jeffrey thinks he can stump mom with a math problem (this happens every. single. day), he breaks out his own white board and feels very important.

 

We don't jump for joy over text books, but we're always learning and sharing.

[Crissy]

My 14 year old said, "That's stupid. Why would you want a vacation from school?"

 

.

 

 

My 14yo takes two classes at the local jr. high.

Today he is sick and I've sent him to bed with the knowledge that he'll be staying home tomorrow.

He's trying to will himself better so he can go to math class in the morning.

 

:lol:

[Peela]

I dont think of my kids as having a strong love of learning what I want them to learn,as in "school" learning, yet my mother assures me that compared to their cousins, who we rarely see but she spends a lot of time with, my kids are passionate about learning in general because they have interests and passions and they read and they just have a passion for life. They're not badly behaved or moody or rude (much). SO its not obviously to me but it is to her, that my kids are not disheartened and given up on the whole learning process altogether- even though they may complain on any given day about any given subject.

 

I gave up a few years ago trying to get my kids to love everything we do. Its a quick path to burn out for me. They have been to school and perhaps if they hadnt, their attitude would be better than it is.The like some subjects. They complain, they do their work, they try and get out of their work, they do not read encyclopedias in their spare time- they go and skate board, surf, paint, draw, read good novels, play computer games, talk to their friends, go on camps, go sailing with Scouts....any of a miriad of things that balance their lives. They are happy people, generally, and they dont like putting the garbage out much or washing the dishes, but just like their chores, they do their work, and it doesn't hurt them to have to do things they dont like some of the time. Character building and all that.

[angela in ohio]

My dc have an incredible joy in learning. It is because I don't jump through hoops to make it fun, and we are rigorous homeschoolers. I know most people say relaxed and fun go with a love of learning, but as I look around my homeschooling circle, I really see the opposite.

 

I posted on my blog a copy of a post from the old boards about this... Children Who Desire to Learn.

 

HTH!

[Nestof3]

I can say that "yes" my kids would rather choose on their own how to spend their time rather than do our structured schooling, which I might add is very relaxed in my opinion.

 

BUT

 

For the most part, they do get pretty enthusiastic about our studies as do I. I have to admit there's not much excitement in handwriting or grammar, but I try to read a read-aloud chapter while they do their handwriting, and grammar takes just a short amount of time.

 

Since we use so many manipulatives in Saxon, I think the boys actually like it for the most part. There's very little actual writing involved in this math in the elementary years and much demonstration and interaction. I really love this program. The boys get excited about the timed math facts tests (though I do give them an extra 10-15 seconds because they're both perfectionist and both get very strung out if they're not fast enough). Almost everyday they are folding construction paper squares or using pattern blocks, etc.

 

They love it when I read aloud to them. This includes poetry, artist study, read-aloud chapter book, science and history. Sometimes they munch on pretzels or animal crackers during this time. Our cat Maggie is usually curled up on my lap. It's fun and cozy.

 

They love hands-on things like History Pockets and lapbooks. We did our first lapbook for frogs, and now they are begging to do one for our reptile unit.

 

If you read my signature quote (which I found on another homeschooler's blog), you will see what I truly in my gut feel about formal education. I do feel that a little a day is necessary, but I think that self inquiry is so very important. Due to modern competitors for peoples' passions (namely the entertainment industry) and a lack of respect for "accomplished" or intellectual minds (peer pressure, dumbing down), much of the free time children and young adults do have is wasted away on things that do not give way to creativity and accomplishment.

 

We have tried to make choices to limit mindless entertainment to give opportunity for individual passions to be realized. This is where the true joy of learning takes place. I do think some children will be more active in this, but I also think it is our responsibility to introduce our children to these intellectual and creative outlets -- such as art, music, building/construction toys, items that lend themselves to imaginative play, tools to help them interact with and learn about nature, and of course, great books.

 

I try to keep most of our day open for the above list of outlets, treating "school" time as just one tool to their complete person. Often, the boys will become very passionate about something we have studied and continue on with it once "school" is done. This happens the most in science when they interact with the natural world. For example, after we studied univalve and bivalve mollusks, the boys excitedly grabbed our shell collection and began categorizing them. Nathan even labeled our little science collection drawers with things like "univalve' and "bivalve."

 

One time Ben set up a sign language school in his room. He consulted some books I had on sign language for kids and proceeded to teach those who paid the 25 cents this way of communication. He knew no sign language himself, but once he was done with this "school," he had learned some.

 

Sometimes they set up museums in their room using things from nature that they've collected recently. They create their own books and set up a library in their room as well.

 

They both love reproducing maps and other diagrams and photos from books. Nathan has been reading the Spiderwick Chronicles, and he has begun reproducing the imaginary characters from Arthur Spiderwick's Field Guide. The boys also set up a book shelf in their room full of things Brownies like in order to encourage them to come to our house. A few days ago, Nathan made his own Forest Field guide by consulting a forest book I had. He included life cycles of various animals, a food chain, the layers of trees in a forest, samples of leaves he found in our yard, a bird with its parts labeled and so on. They both copy maps from Winnie the Pooh, and Nathan makes maps of books he reads, like of the Frank Baum Oz books and Narnia.

 

To me, this reproducing of things is quite beneficial because it requires them to pay keen attention and involves a regurgitation of information -- very classical.

 

I also allow them to freely use watercolor and acrylic paints, oil pastels, ink pads, modeling clay and so forth. We have a shelf of drawing books and other art books which they consult a lot. They love watching model railroad display videos that teach how to create the scenery and have learned painting methods from that. My husband takes them to model railroading shows where they get more ideas.

 

So, yes, I think there can be a love of learning -- if there's enough time given for it. :)

[VaKim]

I'm not nearly as eloquent as everybody else here, but I think we all love learning what we are interested in. There are some things, that while they are necessary, are never going to be "fun" or "interesting." Sometimes, it is the means to a bigger goal, thus the "joy" comes in knowing you are working toward that goal.

 

I think if we expose our dc to a wide variety of subjects, they will develop more interests, and therefore truly enjoy the process of learning those things. My dds truly do enjoy learning. They have plenty of time to pursue their individual interests, and you can find them at any time reading, researching, making up games, looking up information about someone or an event they read a snippet about, etc. It is just a way of life. :)