MEP Math - HELP!!!!!!! [emoji20]

[wonder3]

Can someone explain this to me? I just started learning about it but don't have a lot of time to mess around. My 11 year old son is behind in math. Need to catch him up and give him confidence. He needs to memorize his multiplication facts, learn multi digit multiplication, division, fractions among other subjects. Basically the last time he did well on his math was beginning third grade. He should be going into 5th. He has ADHD and ODD. My explanations just frustrate him. I need a scripted curriculum I think. I tried TT but he did not retain much. I hear good things about MEP, I think? [emoji51] He is a very bright capable boy. BAD habits have set in big time. Prefer no computer involvement (it's a major issue with us). His confidence is a zero.

 

If this is a British curriculum, what do you do about the money lessons? Measurements?

 

I'm not very Mathy either.

 

Please help! [emoji30]

 

Ps. He is still forgetting how to regroup in multi-digit subtraction. But he gets very mad when I try to teach him. As of right now he is enrolled in PS for the fall because we are not getting anything done. His father and I want him to stay home if we can find a way to operate together. But his education is top priority!!! I fear that as far behind as he is PS will be worse. Maybe I should get him into someplace like Sylvan?

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[HomeAgain]

We're at the end of Year 2.  MEP is good...but with my little we take it in chunks.  The teacher's plan is totally scripted, complete with breaks built in.  For money, we do the British lessons, but build in money skills in daily life (allowance day, where he has to divvy up his dollars for his different accounts, going to the store, the envelope system the rest of us use..)  I plan on getting the game Allowance again, but until then we'll just stick with the ones we have like Life and Monopoly.  We do Metric measurements for math, incorporate Imperial in science class.

 

MEP is a good programme for children who think outside of the box.  Some of the lessons are wacky (like a series of shapes in interlocking squares, and finding out what each shape stands for if the total of each square is 8).  It also teaches left to right subtraction. You may prefer something like Math U See, where it is more incremental and shows just how things are done.

[travelgirlut]

MEP is an amazing program.  We love it.  But...I would not try to use to for remediation.  MEP is hard to jump into in the higher (4th, 5th) levels because a lot of the thinking patterns are learned in the lower levels.  .

 

There is no built in drill.  It will say something like "Review the x10 table" and that's it.  There's no drill in the worksheets.  I had to do extra drill work with my son using Math Mammoth because it just wasn't there in MEP.

 

The lessons are kind of scripted, but more for a public school teacher than a homeschooler.  They are very doable, we've been using it for 4 years now, but it takes planning ahead of time to make the lesson flow right between using the lesson plans, copymasters, and worksheets.

 

To cover money we used the Math Mammoth topic book on money.

 

However, from the description of your situation, I'm not sure MEP is what you want.  You might want to look at CLE or Math Mammoth (MM).  They are both written to the student, so all the explanations are in the book.  No explainations needed from mom.  CLE has drill built right in.  Lots of it.  My daughter has used it for years and has her facts down cold.  CLE is also spiral, constantly reviewing topics each day.  They also have a placement test so you'd know right where to start.

 

MM does a bit more in the conceptual thinking department than CLE, and we've used it here and there, but my kids haven't loved it enough for us to use full-time, but there are others who love it.  It's more mastery based, meaning you sit on one topic until you've covered it all before moving on to the next.  My kids get bored with this.  They like variety.  But, if you need to target just specific topics, you can buy inexpensive books from MM that are single topic.

 

Good luck finding something that works for you and your son!!  I know the stress you're feeling!

[Farrar]

I agree with the above. MEP is a great curriculum, but it's not good for remediation for most kids. It's hard to make it move quickly. And when you add in the ODD issues... it's a hands on teaching program - it requires you to teach stuff and I'm thinking that with ODD you may want something that is more self-teaching.

 

I'd second MM or CLE as things to look into.

 

If you do decide to use it, we haven't found the money to be an issue - the pound is also on a decimal system so we just swap dollar signs. Once a kid knows the names and denominations on the coins, it's pretty simple. The bigger issue we found was with the geometry portions - many of them have terms that are different or even, in a few cases, that don't have American equivalents. Obviously there's also a lot more metric measurement, but I don't think that hurts American students a bit. Also apparently UK maths programs use a lot more Roman numerals, which makes sense, but you can skip it if you like.

[bibiche]

Yes, agree that Math Mammoth would be a much better choice.

[wonder3]

Thanks for the input. I have some MM 3rd grade I could try with him in the subjects he needs. The reason I was thinking a scripted curriculum is because he generally skips the explanations and just does the work or gives up if he doesn't get it. He has done the same thing with TT, I have to make him watch the lessons first. Then if he makes a mistake after skipping or not paying attention to the lesson he has a fit and quits. So Frustrating!!!! I don't know how we got here. Obviously I let him off the hook to many times. I've made a mountain out of a mole hill.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[travelgirlut]

When my daughter was first using CLE, she would skim through the beginning portion of the lesson, the part with all the new teaching, and then get lots of the problems wrong.  So for a while I had to sit with her and read it out loud to her before she was allowed to move on the the problems.  The teaching is all at the beginning of the lesson, so this is very easy to do.  Eventually she figured out that if she took the time to read, she got more problems right, and she was able to transition to reading it on her own.

 

This would be harder to do with MM since the teaching is broken up between the problems, but it would still be doable if you sat next to him while he worked and read each section as he got to it.

 

Either program would allow him to eventually transition to independent work but are both "scripted" in the sense that you can just read what's on the page to teach him.  If you went with a purely scripted program you wouldn't have the opportunity to transition to independent work.  Just a thought.

Edited July 7, 2016 by travelgirlut

[quietchapel]

You might also consider MUS or R&S. MUS has a DVD with the teaching for each lesson and is fairly easy to use for remediation. There are placement tests on their website. You can also call for more specific how-to's about using the program for remediation. The lessons are short, mastery based.

I agree with above comments that MEP would likely not be a suitable program.

[Tiramisu]

I'm curious about who diagnosed the ADHD and the ODD. The description of his difficulties really makes me think processing issues. I'd be curious about his auditory and visual processing. I think you might both benefit from an np eval if he hasn't had one. If you can't manage that, I'd try a program with a lot of white space. The Singapore or Math in Focus workbooks. MUS. CLE.

 

I'm very inclined to think his fits are from being overloaded due to his processing. Poor visual processing affects math abilities in otherwise bright kids. He had to incorporate your auditory explanations, the visuals on the page, and your frustration, and that's a lot to deal with at once. Third and fourth grade is when these issues become more obvious because schoolwork starts to become more complicated.

 

You could try MM but I'd worry about the visual crowding. I also agree MEP isn't the best choice.

 

If you can't get thorough evals now, I would recommend one before high school at the latest.

[Sherry in OH]

MEP is a great math program.  But, I would be hesitant about using the primary program with a struggling 11-year old.  MEP introduces many concepts earlier than other programs.  Multiplication and division for example are introduced in year 2 and solidified in year 3.  Fractions and decimals are similarly introduced early and expanded upon in later years.  By age your son should be in year 5 or 6, concept-wise he will need to start at a lower level – year 3 or possibly even 2B.  Would you son be discouraged by such a low placement?

 

MEP primary requires active teaching. Are you willing to struggle through a few weeks of learning how to teach a program designed for schools at home?  

 

The carrot you could offer is that if your son successfully completes 2B through 3B, he could choose to jump from 3B to year 7 in the secondary program, skipping years 4-6. The secondary program has a different format than the primary program, however, so there would be another learning curve.  

 

Choosing a different elementary program for remediation and then considering the secondary program in year or two might be a better option.

[Tiramisu]

Just adding:

 

Choose something where you can give a brief explanation and work through an example , but that will allow him to work and think undisturbed for a while.

 

I was just thinking that Rod and Staff on a big white board might be an option because you might not have to back up so much but would still hit all the basic concepts. The book might be overwhelming.

 

How is his writing? Fine motor skills?

Edited July 7, 2016 by Tiramisu

[smfmommy]

You might look at Math Lessons for a Living Education sold by Master Books.  It is skill based rather than grade level.  It has a story line (Christian if that is an issue), but could be a very sit on the couch and work together type curriculum.  Not scripted but something you could do easily together.  You could accelerate by only doing the "new" material and some of the review instead of all of it.  That way you could get through a week of material in a couple of days.
 

You might try Xtra Math for the math facts review.

 

 

 

[wonder3]

Just adding:

 

Choose something where you can give a brief explanation and work through an example , but that will allow him to work and think undisturbed for a while.

 

I was just thinking that Rod and Staff on a big white board might be an option because you might not have to back up so much but would still hit all the basic concepts. The book might be overwhelming.

 

How is his writing? Fine motor skills?

His writing is not good. He definitely has had more challenges with fine motor skills then my daughters. He can write neatly enough for very short stints if he wants to. I have to have him erase and rewrite some of his math work so that I can read it.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Tiramisu]

His writing is not good. He definitely has had more challenges with fine motor skills then my daughters. He can write neatly enough for very short stints if he wants to. I have to have him erase and rewrite some of his math work so that I can read it.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This confirms for me there's something going on with his processing. It just sounds so much like parts of my different dc. Bright with glitches.

 

If you could ever get an eval with a neuropsychologist, I think it would be very worthwhile. My kids seem like they have ADHD but it's really more complicated, and figuring that out has been very helpful. I was blaming myself or blaming my child which was so damaging, when it was really out of our control. But so much healing has happened here in just the last year.

Edited July 8, 2016 by Tiramisu