Aops prealgebra - can somebody point to discussions about it?

[Mandarinmom]

I looked at samples of aops prealgebra and liked it. I am in trouble with my student doing Math 6 from K12. It is not working and failing us. Even when she is able to solve the problem, she still doesn't have confidence and a slight variation in the problem scares her. Math becomes a big problem for us. We use many supplemental materials, still not going well. I was hoping that Aops gives more explanation without making the computations very long and tedious like K12 does.

 

Also I would like to ask if somebody will be willing to sell their copy of aops prealgebra text and manual, I don't see any postings on classified, and I would like a price cheaper than on amazon. It is about 50$ for both books on amazon. Please email me at netsitesinc@yahoo.com.Lena

[kiana]

If a slight variation in problems scares her, it might not be the best fit for her. Is there anyone near you where you could borrow the book for a week or so?

[Mandarinmom]

We don't have anybody homeschooling nearby. I have already tried the drill and kill curriculums. Feels like she can not understand the reason why we do this way and so on. The computation part is more or less mastered. She was never a mathy kid, but we did not have any problems until 6th grade.

[wapiti]

It typically would not be a good fit for a struggling math student.  If you search the logic and accelerated boards for aops, you will turn up many discussions about the Prealgebra text.

 

Note that regardless of what math program you use, you can still supplement with the AoPS Prealgebra free on-line videos for concept instruction and with Alcumus for free on-line problem-solving practice.

[boscopup]

Type this into a Google search box:

 

AoPS Prealgebra site:welltrainedmind.com

 

I agree that it's not a good curriculum for a kid struggling. The problems get hard... much harder than a typical Prealgebra curriculum. It's not drill and kill, the explanations are excellent, and the problems are often different from each other. So parts of what you say suggest it could be a good fit, but the struggling part makes me really pause. You could try some of the sample and see if that would work.

[Mandarinmom]

I can try the samples from pdf file and see how she does it. She doesn't think that she is struggling. She thinks that she does very well. K12 made them think if they pass 80% on assessment test, it is all good. I think missing one problem out of any is a red flag.

[boscopup]

I can try the samples from pdf file and see how she does it. She doesn't think that she is struggling. She thinks that she does very well. K12 made them think if they pass 80% on assessment test, it is all good. I think missing one problem out of any is a red flag.

Be aware that in AoPS, it is expected to miss problems. If you can do all the problems correct, you're in the wrong book. So you'll have to shift your thinking if you use AoPS. AoPS problems are harder and deeper than normal math texts.

[zarabellesmom]

Be aware that in AoPS, it is expected to miss problems. If you can do all the problems correct, you're in the wrong book. So you'll have to shift your thinking if you use AoPS. AoPS problems are harder and deeper than normal math texts.

Is this still true if it's the parent working the problems, not the student? I'm not getting 100%. :(

[kiana]

I can try the samples from pdf file and see how she does it. She doesn't think that she is struggling. She thinks that she does very well. K12 made them think if they pass 80% on assessment test, it is all good. I think missing one problem out of any is a red flag.

 

What do you mean by red flag? I mean, yes, students should correct mistakes, but it's normal for students to make mistakes here and there, even on stuff they *do* understand.

 

If a student is getting 100% on every assessment, it's too easy and not making them think hard enough.

[Woodland Mist Academy]

Is this still true if it's the parent working the problems, not the student? I'm not getting 100%. :(

 

Are you talking about AoPS? There's a whole club of us that don't get 100% when we work through the problems!  :cheers2:

 

Do you understand your mistakes after you read through the solution? That's the important part. I always try to see where I went wrong. (Even that can be tricky! Sometimes I don't understand why my way won't work. Usually Lily is patient enough to explain it to me... ;) )

[ErinE]

Are you talking about AoPS? There's a whole club of us that don't get 100% when we work through the problems! :cheers2:

 

Do you understand your mistakes after you read through the solution? That's the important part. I always try to see where I went wrong. (Even that can be tricky! Sometimes I don't understand why my way won't work. Usually Lily is patient enough to explain it to me... ;) )

This has happened to me! I'll lean over DS's work, "What are you doing?!?" He'll explain and I'll feel small. My usual response, "Oh, good job! I didn't think of it that way."

[texasmama]

This has happened to me! I'll lean over DS's work, "What are you doing?!?" He'll explain and I'll feel small. My usual response, "Oh, good job! I didn't think of it that way."

My hobby is overcomplicating problems and writing out gobs of things on the whiteboard while my kids solve it correctly with minimal effort and can explain exactly how they did it.  (Did I mention that I'm a humanities gal?)

[Embassy]

Be aware that in AoPS, it is expected to miss problems. If you can do all the problems correct, you're in the wrong book. So you'll have to shift your thinking if you use AoPS. AoPS problems are harder and deeper than normal math texts.

 

 

I agree.  You can't expect to just miss a few here and there.  Much will be missed. If you get 80% correct on the first try you are doing VERY WELL, imo.   Sometimes I have to sit and puzzle over things for awhile even when I have the solution manual open to figure out how they arrived at an answer.  

[Chrysalis Academy]

My average on Alcumus is 85%  :leaving:

[zarabellesmom]

Thank goodness it's not just me. I keep thinking, I took college Calculus, surely I can ace pre-algebra. This isn't the pre-algebra I took way back when. Sheesh.  Sorry to side track. Back to the original topic...

 

I would agree with others. Math should be a challenge. If you are getting 100%, you aren't working to your potential.  If you are looking for something that answers the "whys?" then AOPs definitely does. It can be very frustrating though (as I can attest to from my own experience) to not be able to get the right answer right away, and if she is a child that already doubts her math abilities I wouldn't think it would be a good fit. Heck, I generally think of myself as pretty good with math, but even I'm wondering right now.

 

Teresa

 

ETA: My husband gets all of them right almost immediately. It's very humbling. Of course, he's freakishly smart...emphasis on the freakish. I love him in spite of it.

[Mandarinmom]

My goal for her is to be very prepaired and able to solve anything that comes on the test. I do math for fun, but I am a workaholic and I don't know what else to do with myself otherwise than work. All I need is to make sure she will score well on SAT or what ever else she need to take and do her math courses in college well.

[Roadrunner]

My average on Alcumus is 85% :leaving:

I won't say mine out loud! :) :)

[boscopup]

Is this still true if it's the parent working the problems, not the student? I'm not getting 100%. :(

I have an engineering degree (plenty of math). I still missed some problems in the Prealgebra book. :)

[EndOfOrdinary]

AoPS is concept based. So you are on track there. The issue that would give me pause is the confidence part. Even more than the 100 percent part, though they might go hand in hand. AoPS is not necessarily a confidence building program. For most kids they go in thinking they are awesome because other programs have been easy, then AoPS chews them up and spits them out. It is a program designed to humble the student. It is used to distinctly not teach a student how to do the problems, but to show them how the numbers fit together. A strong math sense and intuitive feel for mathematics is quite helpful for any feelings of initial success.

 

If your daughter has computation down well but still lacks confidence, this program might be overwhelmingly brutal. Combine that with expecting her to get 100 percent from a program that believes 85 percent and learning is the most important and you might need a psych eval within the end of the year.

 

That said, it might be right on for her. Something is going to have to give, though. She will more than likely need a whole lot of help and a much slower pace for the first couple months. She will probably get quite a few problems wrong, even after she thinks she might get it. AoPS is constantly changing the style of problem so you have to really understand and apply the concept in different ways. It is a program designed for the student to fail before they succeed. When they succeed, there is no stopping them. The program is phenomenal once you get through the hurdles.

 

But it isn't test prep. It isn't quick. It most definitely is about learning not scoring well.