For a child who cannot take responsibility, WWYD?

[Halcyon]

Yes, yes, yes!!!!!!!!!!!!  Do it!!!!!!!!!!  This is NOT too much!!  It's teaching him how to live with himself.  Why are you writing lists?  Some of this stuff is recurring.  You need to set up a checklist that you print so you can copy and paste and drag the repeating stuff.  Or get some apps and iPad for the child and let it organize his life.  Have you seen Wunderlist?  Errands is another good to do app for the iPad.  Wunderlist is just more beautiful.  Dd has one she really likes where you scratch things off with a very satisfying scratch!

 

Because he needs things FRONT AND CENTER. Putting things on his itty bitty ipod or on an ipad app Will. Not. Work. BTDT. He needs a big-a** list right smack in the middle of him every day. Funny, DH recently started using whiteboards--I thought he was going to get a small whiteboard to write his daily tasks on. Nope. He went to Home Depot, bought the tiling or whatever it was that was talked about here on the boards for months, and got THREE 5x5 boards for his office wall LOL. And he filled them up with different tasks, deadlines, etc. So the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. 

[Halcyon]

dp

[Halcyon]

double post

[Halcyon]

I want to tell you all HOW helpful this thread is to to me. Thank you from the bottom of my heart.

[PeterPan]

Because he needs things FRONT AND CENTER. Putting things on his itty bitty ipod or on an ipad app Will. Not. Work. BTDT. He needs a big-a** list right smack in the middle of him every day. Funny, DH recently started using whiteboards--I thought he was going to get a small whiteboard to write his daily tasks on. Nope. He went to Home Depot, bought the tiling or whatever it was that was talked about here on the boards for months, and got THREE 5x5 boards for his office wall LOL. And he filled them up with different tasks, deadlines, etc. So the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. 

You're a hoot!  Good for you for figuring it out!  Just so you know, I print my dd's checklist for the week onto a full-size sheet of paper in landscape mode and the put it into a Staples better binder with the notebook open.  The binder stays out on the table, always open, always present.  I like your whiteboard.  Maybe find some things to make it easier, like take the routine for the hockey days and type it onto 4 lines in a column that will fit the way you do it on the whiteboard, then cut out and laminate.  That way you can stick it up on a magnet and don't have to keep writing it every week, kwim?  

 

And fwiw, my dh uses a whiteboard for his work too.  :D

[Halcyon]

Great idea. I was just googling mindmapping software, as it might be interesting to see if he can tackle WWS more easily by using mindmapping than with linear outlines. I settled on Coggle, which looks super simple and easy for a kid to use. We'll try it this week. 

[PeterPan]

Also try Inspiration.  It's not so hip, but it has one super marvelous feature...  It converts the map to an OUTLINE and you can toggle back and forth.  This is IMMENSELY helpful for writing.  I'm not sure if other software does this.  You can also import pictures and whatnot.  There's a desktop version and mobile, and you can shove the files between them.  The free version of stuff is a great way to start with it though, just to see if it's useful.  I think we started with Popplet on the iPad.

[Halcyon]

You're a hoot!  Good for you for figuring it out!  Just so you know, I print my dd's checklist for the week onto a full-size sheet of paper in landscape mode and the put it into a Staples better binder with the notebook open.  The binder stays out on the table, always open, always present.  I like your whiteboard.  Maybe find some things to make it easier, like take the routine for the hockey days and type it onto 4 lines in a column that will fit the way you do it on the whiteboard, then cut out and laminate.  That way you can stick it up on a magnet and don't have to keep writing it every week, kwim?  

 

And fwiw, my dh uses a whiteboard for his work too.   :D

 

Yes, his schedule is in a proclick bound book that I made (it's a custom made weekly calender that I hand write assignments on) and it's always open to the week we're on and it's always in a handy spot. He refers to it often. I like the idea of typing the "routines" up and sticking them on the whiteboard. Just thinking out loud, routines that he does all the time include:

 

1. hockey

2. coop/piano/guitar (all in one day, there's a lot to remember)

3. School day out of house (unfortunately what he needs to bring depends on what he needs to do, but usually there's math, science, latin and spanish).

4. Cleaning room and all the steps entailed in that.

5. doing dishes and all the steps down to wiping the sink clean at the end.

6. laundry--folding, etc. 

 

Okay, this is a good start. I feel hopeful. 

[PeterPan]

Some of the alarm apps you can get for the iphone/touch/pad have very involved options, where you can have lots of alarms with different sounds and musics and intervals and recurrences.  If he could get in the habit of using technology for any of that, it could do some of the reminders for you.  Just something to think about for the future.  

 

Glad you're feeling better and finding some things you can tweak to get things moving forward!  You'll get there.  :)

[myfunnybunch]

And fwiw, my dh uses a whiteboard for his work too. :D

Laughing at this, ladies, because mine does too, on the wall right in front of his face.

 

Cat

[myfunnybunch]

Some of the alarm apps you can get for the iphone/touch/pad have very involved options, where you can have lots of alarms with different sounds and musics and intervals and recurrences.

OhElizabeth, do you have any particular recommendations? Ds got an iPod touch for Christmas, and we'd love to use it to help with reminders and scheduling.

[Garga]

Thank you. He works MUCH better when he has a checklist, so I write out his weekly schedule every Sunday, including page numbers for the most part, which he can then check off as he goes. He really does much better with this. He has been using Quizlet for two weeks and LOVES it, and I love it--there is no more whining about memory work for Latin, Science and History. He actually took his tests today (he went away with DH to the Everglades on Friday) and got NOTHING wrong on any of his tests. This is a boy who hates memorizing stuff. So I was very pleased and told him so.

 

I think he needs a checklist for getting out the door, but the problem is that every day he needs something different. For example, on Mondays (IF the sitter isn't meeting us at home) he needs to have his teeth brushed, dressed, etc. For Fridays, he would need his school work as he does work in my office for 3 hours. For Thursday he would need his hockey gear...wait a sec. What if I wrote out a daily schedule of what he needs to take or have completed before we get out the door? Would that be too much handholding? I could put it on the front door. Yay? Nay?

The different checklists is what I was going to suggest just before I read the above post.

 

My boys have a "morning routine" checklist posted in the bathroom. A "lunch routine" posted in the kitchen. A "bedtime routine" posted in the bathroom.

 

I still have to say the words, "Look at your lunch routine checklist" every time we head to the kitchen for lunch, which drives me nuts. Why can't they see that we're all in the kitchen for lunch and just DO the routine on their own? sigh. But at least once I've said the words they look at the list and start to do the routine.

 

If I was having your problem I would say, "Time for the Wednesday pre-work routine," and have every time little thing listed out in the order it has to be done. I did this for our routines in a word document so I could make changes if necessary. I list every time thing in our morning/breakfast/bedtime routine. It saves me from having to spell it out every day. "Brush your teeth, comb your hair, put the toothpaste back in the cupboard, breathe in, take off your pjs, put them away, put on NEW underwear, exhale, etc"

 

Our mornings, lunches, and bedtimes have become much smoother now.

[Erin]

Interestingly, my space cadet 14 year old can be up at 5AM, hooking up the horse trailer, horse caught and standing in the corral, ready to rodeo on a Saturday morning in the summer.  

 

But during the school year he has trouble dragging out of bed before 10AM on his own...and takes HOURS to get his morning started.  

 

 

 

I tend to think this is a priorities issue, rather than a capabilities issue.  ;)

[Azalea]

-use technology.  Get the boy an iPad or iPod touch to use for scheduling.  My girl lives with hers and I know others do too.  It's the ultimate organizational tool.

 

 

OhElizabeth, will you please elaborate on this? What apps does your daughter use, etc.? Thanks!

 

Azalea

[Miss Mousie]

 

I think he needs a checklist for getting out the door, but the problem is that every day he needs something different. For example, on Mondays (IF the sitter isn't meeting us at home) he needs to have his teeth brushed, dressed, etc. For Fridays, he would need his school work as he does work in my office for 3 hours. For Thursday he would need his hockey gear...wait a sec. What if I wrote out a daily schedule of what he needs to take or have completed before we get out the door? Would that be too much handholding? I could put it on the front door. Yay? Nay?

 

A checklist by the door has helped here, but be prepared for it to take years before he actually does it on his own, every day.

 

We've had a "get ready for school" checklist for two or three years now.  He wrote it himself (I thought it would be easier to see it in his own handwriting, and I thought physically writing the list would help him internalize it).  Still, at least twice a week I have to say, "you need to read through your routine and make sure you've done every item" or "clearly you have not completed your routine yet" [the Alfalfa hair is a dead giveaway on that one].

 

I have also always allowed him to read at the kitchen table once everything is done and ready, but I frequently find him reading sooner.

 

"DS, when is it time to read?"

"Later."

"When?"

"When everything is finished."

"Is everything finished now?"

"No." [closes book]

 

Sigh.

 

His working memory and processing scores were both well into the 90th percentile range - so I am reasonably sure it's a motivational issue, not an inability issue.

[PeterPan]

OhElizabeth, do you have any particular recommendations? Ds got an iPod touch for Christmas, and we'd love to use it to help with reminders and scheduling.

Not to be too terribly original, but I've been using Alarm Clock (yes, that's the name of the app, lol) and iCal on my mac.  The iCal stuff syncs, so anything I put on there sets it to ding on all my i-devices too.  Makes 'em easier to find when I lose them, or drives kids batty with trumpets going off, depending on your eschatology.  :D

 

Seriously, you can put tons of stuff into iCal and just go hog wild.  I'm not diligent about implementing it, but at one point I put all my cleaning and landscaping schedules in.  You can do times, days, rotations, everything.  

 

I get daily feeds from AppSaga/App Chronicles, which gives links for apps gone free.  They just had a really unusual alarm app where the person had to get their butt up and PHOTOGRAPH something in order to make it go off.  Seriously, there are so many types, you never know what you'll find.  You just need to find sort of that category buzzword and start search.  Or google adhd apps, SN apps, that kind of thing.  I've got way more apps in my iTunes that I've gotten like that than I could ever use.  I tend to find one and stop, lol.  Whether there's a To Do app that does reminders, I don't know.  I'm keen on Wunderlist these days as a list-making app, but I haven't explored it to see if it has alarm/reminder functions.  I *think* it can recycle lists.  Errands can do that also, so when you have a list you can uncheck the this and re-use it without typing it all again.

[PeterPan]

Interestingly, my space cadet 14 year old can be up at 5AM, hooking up the horse trailer, horse caught and standing in the corral, ready to rodeo on a Saturday morning in the summer.  

 

But during the school year he has trouble dragging out of bed before 10AM on his own...and takes HOURS to get his morning started.  

 

 

 

I tend to think this is a priorities issue, rather than a capabilities issue.   ;)

Ok, I'll take this on.  I agree there's an enthusiasm element to it.  However is he doing anything with his brain during the summer to wear him out?  My dd has an almost 60% gap between her processing speed and IQ scores.  With a gap like that, anything she does with her brain wears her out a lot more, meaning the physical load of summer would, in general, be less wearying than the mental load of the school year.  In fact, she used to melt down by Thursday each week, or on a really bad week Wednesdays.  We finally figured it out with the evals, so now we work really hard to balance her load and I don't quibble about how long she sleeps.  Supposedly neurofeedback can balance some of that mess with the brain waves.  They get too much, is it beta?, going at night and it makes them groggy when they wake up.  During the summer you've got all this physical going and you're sweeping out the sleepy waves.  Do more physical year-round I guess.  

 

I'm looking into cheaper alternatives to neurofeedback.  There's Play Attention, but they're really high-pitched sales, yuck.  There's a company that sells similar equipment that you can buy affordably, around $200 for the equipment and software.  Haven't done it yet, but it's supposed to do quantitative measurements and be good.

[PeterPan]

OhElizabeth, will you please elaborate on this? What apps does your daughter use, etc.? Thanks!

 

Azalea

Again, I wish this list were going to be highly revelatory, but it's not, lol.  I'll put the app and how she uses it.

 

iCal--This is on the iMac and her iPad, so they sync.  She uses it to put dates for events and also dates for assignments for her online classes.  I don't manage that stuff for her, so it's her deal.

 

Notes--She says she uses this for random ideas, notes.

 

Cross It Off--She loves this app for checklists (packing, party prep, that kind of thing).

 

Pages--She prefers to do her brainstorming and any large writing here, because that way she can type into it.  I got her a stylus, but *writing* for large amounts on the iPad isn't the best for her.  Any time she can type, she does.  We don't have wifi btw, so she doesn't have the use of Siri to do dictation.

 

Address Book

 

Paper 53--for journaling, sketching ideas, etc.

 

Edited to add: I'm pretty sure she uses a Bible app, probably Olive Tree.  I know she takes her iPad with her to church, etc.  I got Accordance, which has a really fabulous app with all sorts of options, if that kind of thing interests you.