Math help: Singapore 6A/6B vs. AOPS

[Alice]

I’m sure this topic has been discussed somewhere but I can’t find exactly the answer to my question in my searches so I’m just going to start a new topic. I’m trying to decide on Math for ds next year and my main question is whether it is redundant to do Singapore 6A/6B and AOPS Prealgebra. I’m not planning on doing them together, he’d do Singapore first and then AOPS but I’m not sure if that would be too repetitive.

 

Background:

DS will be in 5th grade next year. He is good at math and gets concepts very easily. I’ll say we haven’t really had any topic yet where he struggled to get it conceptually. We’ve used Singapore from the beginning and it’s been a great fit for him. He enjoys math but he doesn’t LOVE it like some math kids. I see him going into some kind of science/engineering one day (as does he) so I want him to have a very solid foundation in math.

 

He is finishing Singapore 5B now and also working on LOF Decimals/Percents. He loves LOF so I add it in as review and fun math. We will work a little over the summer so he will likely be done with both of those by the fall.

 

My plan right now is to do Singapore 6A/6B next year. Currently he is moving through the Singapore books at about 3 books a year so I’m not sure that will last all of 5th grade. I’m planning on adding in Patty Paper Geometry as he really likes geometry and has expressed that he wants to do more. I may also look into Alcumus for some harder problems for him and to start doing some online learning. I’m hoping that will take us through the year.

 

I’d like to use AOPS with after Singapore. I’d prefer I think not to do Algebra in 6th grade, unless someone tells me it’s really redundant to do Pre-Algebra after 6A/6B. If that’s the case, the other option would be to switch to AOPS now after Singapore 5B.

 

So... to sum up...

-Are Singapore 6A/6B and AOPS redundant for a kid who is pretty quick in Math?

-Would AOPS Pre-Algebra be a better choice after Singapore 5B?

[Dana]

If you've been using Standards, you should be able to move easily from 5B to AoPS prealgebra.

We'll probably be using the Elements of Mathematics instead, but we're moving from 5B away from Singapore. I do intend to use IP and CWP for 6 but not the text and WB.

[Alice]

Thanks Dana.

 

We actually use the US edition. Someone gave me many of the books and I just stuck with it years ago. We also only use the TB and IP book so maybe that’s one idea.

 

Anyone know about the US edition and how it compares to AOPS?

[dereksurfs]

It is also good to keep in mind that many AoPS fans have found the AoPS Pre-Algebra text to be overly complicated for the level of student it is addressing. That by no means is true for all. But rather it is just something to consider as some prefer to start AoPS with the Intro to Algebra text which worked out well for us. We preferred to use something else for Pre-A, TabletClass in our case.

[jennynd]

Did you do SMIP/CWP for SM 5 and 6? If so, you will only have to do few chapters in AOPS preA. If not, you will want to do the entire AOPS-preA. It only took DS about 4 months to finish 6a/b textbook/workbook. If I have to doit again, I will focus on IP and CWP for both 5 and 6 and skip 6 textbook/workbook.

We did AOPS algebra after that but we did go back preA to complete few chapters that SM was missing

[snowbeltmom]

Your son sounds a lot like my daughter. Fwiw, my dd completed Singapore 6A/6B plus the Intensive and Challenging Word Problems workbooks, and then she worked through AoPS pre-algebra book (in 5th grade). If I had to do it over again, I would follow the exact same path.

[Alice]

Did you do SMIP/CWP for SM 5 and 6? If so, you will only have to do few chapters in AOPS preA. If not, you will want to do the entire AOPS-preA. It only took DS about 4 months to finish 6a/b textbook/workbook. If I have to doit again, I will focus on IP and CWP for both 5 and 6 and skip 6 textbook/workbook.

We did AOPS algebra after that but we did go back preA to complete few chapters that SM was missing

 

 

Thanks, for all the input. We now only use the TB and IP book. I found the WB to be too repetitive for him and I wanted him to use the richer IP book. It was too much to do both. I use the CWP books some but also add in other things like LOF, Zaccaro, etc ad enrichment.

 

Your son sounds a lot like my daughter. Fwiw, my dd completed Singapore 6A/6B plus the Intensive and Challenging Word Problems workbooks, and then she worked through AoPS pre-algebra book (in 5th grade). If I had to do it over again, I would follow the exact same path.

 

 

Thanks, that is helpful!

[texasmama]

What we are doing, which may or may not be helpful or relevant to anyone else's situation:

 

Background: My boys have done SM (US Edition) for five years. I did not love 6A and 6B this year with my 6th grader. I will be using a 1985 Dolciani pre-Algebra text with him next year, essentially repeating the material with a different, more incremental and explicit approach. This particular child is very good at math and tested "post high school" on the Stanford this year on all areas of math; however, he lacks confidence, is easily overwhelmed and shut down, and I think the incremental approach of Dolciani will work better for him than SM 6A and 6B did. When he saw a preview of the Dolciani text, he liked it.

 

His 4th grade brother completed SM 5A and 5B this year, and I am going to skip SM 6A and 6B next year for him and put him into AoPS pre-A. He abounds with confidence and loves a challenge so I think it will be a good fit for him. I have not used the program before, so this is an experiment. If AoPS works for him, I will likely have him continue with the next level. If I had heard some of the cons about the AoPS pre-A before purchasing it, I might have chosen differently. I think it will work out just fine, though because this is my adventurous kid.

 

I will spend the summer hitting the highlights of concepts such as negative numbers with both boys. My boys have very different needs/approaches/learning styles. SM worked amazingly well for both of them in the early levels. They have an admirable foundation for higher maths. I had already planned to break with Singapore after level 6 so this just forced my hand earlier for my two students coming up behind my 6th grader.

[Alice]

What we are doing, which may or may not be helpful or relevant to anyone else's situation:

 

 

 

 

It was very helpful. Can I ask what did you not like about Singapore 6A/6B?

[lewelma]

It is also good to keep in mind that many AoPS fans have found the AoPS Pre-Algebra text to be overly complicated for the level of student it is addressing.

 

This is me.

 

My older went from SM IP5 to AoPS Intro Algebra (there was not preA back then), and the transition was not easy. My younger has finished SM IP5, and we are using both Jacobs Mathematics: A Human Endeavor AND Pizzazz Math for PreA. Jacobs teaches students how to investigate and attack a problem that is not straight forward, and it does it in a much more gentle fashion than AoPS PreA. Pizzazz PreA is simply 300 game sheets used it to drill negative numbers, radicals, powers, basic algebraic equations, etc. It is available for free, just google it.

 

Ruth in NZ

[jennynd]

Thanks, for all the input. We now only use the TB and IP book. I found the WB to be too repetitive for him and I wanted him to use the richer IP book. It was too much to do both. I use the CWP books some but also add in other things like LOF, Zaccaro, etc ad enrichment.

 

 

If you do all the IP/CWP. I see you will have no problem to move to AOPS-Algebra

DS did 5/6 IP/CWP after the textbook/workbook. (agree with you, it was very repetitive, but DS was very young so we figure why not) also at the same time, we added "key to algebra" it was a very easy peesy algebra book covers the operation and simple concepts. by the time DS finished SM IP/CWP. he also finished the "key to algebra series" we find that made the transition into AOPS -Algebra pretty easy. like I say, we still use couple chapters in AOPS-PreA that SM didn't cover. I think it was just 2 chapters.

[texasmama]

 

 

It was very helpful. Can I ask what did you not like about Singapore 6A/6B?

My older son has always been able to make the conceptual leaps with Singapore, but 6A/B made more of these and with more advanced/abstract material. My son would have greatly benefited from incremental teaching with some of these concepts. He particularly struggled with the angles and volume problems. Part of this is due to his visual-perceptual issues, but 6 A/B truly had a different "feel" to it for us. It was light on instruction and heavy on complex word problems. My son became overwhelmed, and I realized mid 6B that he would benefit from repeating the pre-A material with a different curriculum. I gave him the option of ditching SM then and beginning Dolciani pre-A (which I already had on my shelf), but he wanted to finish out the program.

 

Part of the issue is my own poor math background and the fact that my mad skills lie in the area of language arts. I am less able to fill in the gaps of a curriculum than more mathy folks. Obviously, not everyone will have this issue. I did make it through pre-calculus and statistics in college, but that was a long time ago. :)

[dereksurfs]

This is me.

 

My older went from SM IP5 to AoPS Intro Algebra (there was not preA back then), and the transition was not easy. My younger has finished SM IP5, and we are using both Jacobs Mathematics: A Human Endeavor AND Pizzazz Math for PreA. Jacobs teaches students how to investigate and attack a problem that is not straight forward, and it does it in a much more gentle fashion than AoPS PreA. Pizzazz PreA is simply 300 game sheets used it to drill negative numbers, radicals, powers, basic algebraic equations, etc. It is available for free, just google it.

 

Ruth in NZ

 

There is a current thread on the accelerated learner board discussing similar experiences with the AoPS Pre-A text here:

http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/473914-ok-so-what-is-going-on-hereaops-pre-a-vs-elementary-algebra/

[Alice]

 

This is me.

 

My older went from SM IP5 to AoPS Intro Algebra (there was not preA back then), and the transition was not easy. My younger has finished SM IP5, and we are using both Jacobs Mathematics: A Human Endeavor AND Pizzazz Math for PreA. Jacobs teaches students how to investigate and attack a problem that is not straight forward, and it does it in a much more gentle fashion than AoPS PreA. Pizzazz PreA is simply 300 game sheets used it to drill negative numbers, radicals, powers, basic algebraic equations, etc. It is available for free, just google it.

 

Ruth in NZ

 

Thanks, Ruth. I think I do remember seeing your comments on PreA before. I’m both appreciative of the new math ideas and thinking NOOOOOO! Can’t handle more options! :)

 

My older son has always been able to make the conceptual leaps with Singapore, but 6A/B made more of these and with more advanced/abstract material. My son would have greatly benefited from incremental teaching with some of these concepts. He particularly struggled with the angles and volume problems. Part of this is due to his visual-perceptual issues, but 6 A/B truly had a different "feel" to it for us. It was light on instruction and heavy on complex word problems. My son became overwhelmed, and I realized mid 6B that he would benefit from repeating the pre-A material with a different curriculum. I gave him the option of ditching SM then and beginning Dolciani pre-A (which I already had on my shelf), but he wanted to finish out the program.

 

Part of the issue is my own poor math background and the fact that my mad skills lie in the area of language arts. I am less able to fill in the gaps of a curriculum than more mathy folks. Obviously, not everyone will have this issue. I did make it through pre-calculus and statistics in college, but that was a long time ago. :)

 

Thanks for the answer. I have Singapore 6A/6B which is part of the issue. I may just try it since I have it and see how he does and then add in some of the other things mentioned.

 

There is a current thread on the accelerated learner board discussing similar experiences with the AoPS Pre-A text here:

http://forums.welltr...entary-algebra/

 

Thanks, I’ll check it out.

 

If you do all the IP/CWP. I see you will have no problem to move to AOPS-Algebra

DS did 5/6 IP/CWP after the textbook/workbook. (agree with you, it was very repetitive, but DS was very young so we figure why not) also at the same time, we added "key to algebra" it was a very easy peesy algebra book covers the operation and simple concepts. by the time DS finished SM IP/CWP. he also finished the "key to algebra series" we find that made the transition into AOPS -Algebra pretty easy. like I say, we still use couple chapters in AOPS-PreA that SM didn't cover. I think it was just 2 chapters.

 

Thanks again, Jenny.

[daijobu]

 

 

So... to sum up...

-Are Singapore 6A/6B and AOPS redundant for a kid who is pretty quick in Math?

-Would AOPS Pre-Algebra be a better choice after Singapore 5B?

 

Does your student have a lot of experience and enjoy doing competition math? If so, then he can jump from 5B to AOPS. If not, you should have him try some math olympiad or mathcounts or AMC problems to see how he does.

[Arcadia]

I have Singapore 6A/6B which is part of the issue. I may just try it since I have it and see how he does and then add in some of the other things mentioned.

 

My older did SM 6A/6B since I bought SM2 to 6 standard edition in one go. I had also bought the AoPS prealgebra book so he has been doing that. It took him a month to finish SM6 but I didn't buy the IP or CWP due to cost. I used some of the mathcount problems instead for him to practice. My younger is likely to start prealgebra later this year, he will also do SM6 first.

 

Math count past questions and solutions link

http://mathcounts.org/pastcompetition

MOEMS sample question link

http://www.moems.org/sample.htm