Outside the Box/Project-Based/Interest-Led ?s

[MyLittleWonders]

I've been reading threads like mad, but something that I can't find an answer for is this:

 

How do you take a kid that seems to have interests (loves Mythbusters and most any documentaries, loves history, loves being read to though doesn't love reading to himself nearly as much (though he has discovered he loves reading Harry Potter), is slowly becoming less writing-phobic/allergic, and used to always ask why) and channel that into taking some interest in his own education? We've been all over the homeschooling map with our oldest (and in some respect our middle; our youngest boy is only in 1st grade and will reap the benefits as will dd). We started out fairly WTM with a lot of read-alouds in K, but quickly moved over to Oak Meadow. That lasted through about 1st grade (still trying to marry WTM and OM though) and then 2nd grade was mostly unschooled as he was very resistant to much (he was mad that his younger brothers didn't have to do school :glare: ). By the end of 2nd grade, we moved back towards WTM, used Hooked on Phonics and All About Spelling to help him begin to unlock the reading code, and brought in Miquon to help with what I can only guess was the over-visually stimulating or just anxiety inducing allergy to Singapore math.

 

Anyway, we moved more towards WTM, his middle brother joined as he approached 1st grade, and we've been doing okay since then. Last year I brought OM back in, which helped lighten our days a bit (we actually became way too at-the-table-bookwork in the beginning of 5th grade). This year, after reading the Andrew Kern Circe thread last spring, have moved to a much more literature-based, CM inspired, me-trying-not-to-freak-out-without-boxes-to-checked year. But, I feel like ds#1 (and by extension ds#2) are just sitting there waiting for me to tell them the next thing, waiting to finish the next assignment, and hoping the day doesn't go too long. I think the two times a day they really love are when I read to them from On the Banks of Plum Creek (they are loving Laura Ingalls; I think I might actually scrap my other planned read alouds for now and keep with the series) and when we do Latin (for the most part - they are enjoying that time).

 

When I ask them what they would like to learn, what they are interested in, it always boils down to mixing vinegar and baking soda (I'm completely serious). Last week I gave them a "home kitchen" type of experiment book for kids their age. They thumbed through and found an activity that involved putting a hardboiled egg in vinegar. Well, they didn't want to go through the work of hard boiling an egg, so they used a raw egg. They also put a chicken leg bone (cooked) in another cup of vinegar, and numerous pieces of chalk in a few more cups. And after the fun of the fizzle of the chalk wore off, they walked away. I tried to even strike up conversations about why things might react the way they did, or show them in the book where it talked about why things happened, but the only thing they wanted was the initial "wow" and nothing more. And that was it. No more "chemistry" and "science" for them.

 

Have I somehow ruined them? (That really isn't tongue-in-cheek.) Have I allowed too much TV to be viewed, turning them into passive learners? How do I begin to encourage them to take some interest in their learning? How do I help them develop passions? Or, even just recognize what might be a passion? Ds#1 does love history and tends to revert to Greek history; I'm tempted to just suck up the money and get him a TC course. But again, maybe that's not right as I'm pushing an interest on him. I swear, aside from me reading to them and most of our Latin lessons together, they are just waiting for the day to be over so they can either watch TV or play with friends. Help!

[Susie in CA]

I wish I had an answer. These are all the thoughts I have (and have had) about my boys. My dss are a couple of years older then yours. They still love the baking soda - vinegar activities. And they still like to do those and then walk away.

 

What I try to do is focus on studying those things which I find are important in the long-run while at the same time allowing for open-ended activities which they love. I find this more difficult now than when they were younger. For years their two main activities were making mud bricks in the backyard and creating their own mixtures for baking. I do have to say that both make very good cooks and bakers now. Therefore I deduce that these activities are indeed beneficial to them. The challenge for me is usually finding a balance to allow for both: academics and explorations.

 

Sorry, I am really just rambling.

[Corraleno]

Have I somehow ruined them? (That really isn't tongue-in-cheek.) Have I allowed too much TV to be viewed, turning them into passive learners? How do I begin to encourage them to take some interest in their learning? How do I help them develop passions? Or, even just recognize what might be a passion? Ds#1 does love history and tends to revert to Greek history; I'm tempted to just suck up the money and get him a TC course. But again, maybe that's not right as I'm pushing an interest on him. I swear, aside from me reading to them and most of our Latin lessons together, they are just waiting for the day to be over so they can either watch TV or play with friends. Help!

Your DS's path sounds very much like mine at that age — he was into Percy Jackson, which led to an interest in Greek mythology and Greek history/warfare/weapons (aided & abetted by the Teaching Company), which then led to an interest in reading real Greek literature and history (Homer, Thucydides, Herodotus, etc.), which eventually led him to learning Greek, and now Latin. So I would recommend feeding your son's interest, and seeing where it leads!

 

I will also say, though, that I think getting rid of video games and TV (except for documentaries, TC lectures, Science Channel, and a few shows like Mythbusters) also made a BIG difference in terms of getting him actively involved in projects instead of just going for passive entertainment as the default option.

 

If you're interested in a good science curriculum that's totally hands-on, inquiry-based, but also includes built-in worksheets and lab reports, have a look at Inquiry in Action — it's real science (not just "demonstrations"), it's produced by the American Chemical Society, and it's absolutely free. It might help you harness their interest in whizz/bang/pop stuff, while also teaching scientific observation & methods in a gentle, fun way.

 

Jackie

[PeterPan]

Wanting to learn doesn't = having the maturity to carry it through.

 

Wanting to explore doesn't = being able to create their own structure.

 

Having struggles shouldn't --->spending all day on the weak points.

 

Being bored too long does --->giving up on a hope that you'll ever figure out how to help them do what they really want to do.

 

It has nothing to do with the tv, seriously. If he's not reading or spelling happily yet, address that. I tended to be on the more aggressive side when my dd was young, working on it quite a bit. I don't regret that a bit now that she's older, because she has an adequate foundation to do what she needs to do. On the writing phobic/pencil phobic thing, that was my dd. She's blossoming this year, age 13. I suggest the farther you take WTM out of the box and rearrange the goal of the writing into something that INTERESTS them more, the better you'll be. Instead of narrations, make ships logs. Don't forgo the creative stuff. Kids like this tend to be very creative.

 

I've always had periodic sit down sessions with my dd where I ask her for feedback. We go through every subject and figure out what's wrong and what's right. It might be you need a radical change, or it might be you just need a little change. If you get some *balance* back it might help. Skills only need to take a certain amount of time. He's 11? I hate sigs with dates, sorry. Anyways, at age 11 I think we were doing 45 minutes of math and an hour-ish of LA a day. Everything else was the fun stuff. So if you keep your skills work really *efficient* you have time for the fun stuff. You can integrate skills into content, or you can separate them out. It's really a question of the psychology of the kid and your time to prep that.

 

What *I* try to do is make our skills really efficient (get in, get it done, get out) and our content really rich (wade in, waddle, enjoy, savor, explore). Kids taking over the project is just sometimes on occasion. That's when they're actually interested and interested beyond what the materials did, lol. It sounds like with your chicken leg you exhausted how interesting it was. No big deal! Just have more stuff like that! Have you tried the Mini-Weapons of Mass Destruction book? Snap Circuits? Sounds like they want to do hands-on stuff, so that's where I'd put your money.

 

I can't make my dd interested in everything she needs to do. There are certain things she needs to do that I keep tolerable. (grammar, WWS...) There are content subjects that she has quite a bit of interest in but where she needs STRUCTURE. She loves history, but she doesn't have the maturity to do a complete study on her own, kwim? She needs guidance. But in all that, I try to make sure I'm doing it efficiently enough that she has energy left to do things on her own. That's OUR balance. It's what fits the psychology of my kid. I've sweated enough somebody saying or implying that if I just did such and such, my kid would love this or be impassioned about that. Go through the list yourself and think about your kid. What are the skills, content, and special interests? What level of responsibility is he willing to assume for each of those? What amount of structure does he need for each in order to get them done to the level of your or his goals? That answer may differ with each thing! For *us* we're pretty happy with our answer of efficient on the things that have to be done, structure to help her achieve her goals that she can't achieve on her own but wants to, and enough free time and materials to pursue her remaining interests on her own. That's the balance that works *for this particular dc*. You can go through those things, inventory, and find your own balance. :)

[MyLittleWonders]

Thank you both for your thoughts; I really appreciate the time. Jackie, that download ebook looks fantastic. I'm going to put it on my iPad and look through it. What I've seen so far, it looks like doable activities that are hands-on enough for them and not too messy for me. ;) And Elizabeth, I really appreciate your break-down of finding the balance. I'm working (in my head) on what is non-negotiable in terms of skills/academics/core and what we can take rabbit trails/interest-led. Your points in the beginning address many of the issues here.

[TippyCanoe]

nm

[Corraleno]

https://parents.diy.org

What a fabulous website, thank you so much for this!!! :w00t:

 

As soon as I saw the Maker Badges and Ken Robinson, I was sold. We already have a cabinet full of "maker materials" they can use to build things, and I love the idea of (1) having specific challenges with badges to earn and (2) having a safe website for them to upload their creations. I recently discovered the "Hacker Scout" badges at Adafruit (which sells all kinds of cool maker kits), but the parentsdiy site is a much more complete program. Love it!!!

 

Jackie

[TippyCanoe]

nm

[lauracolumbus]

Sometimes you never know what is going to flip the switch for your particular child. My oldest dd didn't like to read until I gave her Red Pyramid as part of our ancient studies. She was immediately hooked and hasn't stopped reading since. She became infatuated with Percy Jackson as well. Now history is more relevant to her.

 

My other dd became hooked on reading when I had her keep track of the books she read on the computer. She loved seeing her list become longer and longer. For my ds it was the ability to get away w/staying up at night w/o getting in trouble. As long as he was reading I didn't yell at him to go to bed.

 

I agree w/Elizabeth to 'get in and get out' of the must do subjects as quickly as possible. I like AG b/c it's a bare bones grammar program and my kids seem to retain what they learn. I don't think writing is as difficult as so many writing programs make it out to be. At least until you get to the stylistic aspect of writing. With math you have to find something that clicks w/your kids. For a fun program there's a Simply Charlotte Mason business math program (I think there's a sports store, book store, and we did the pet shop) that is a bit fun. I start our week w/fun day Monday where I pull out our 'fun' curricula like pet shop math, or Beast Academy, or MCT LA. We also do puzzles, logic games, educational dvds etc on this day.

 

You can't possibly have ruined your dc. You'd also be surprised at how much your accomplishing when you're working on a consistent basis. I do monitor how much tv my kids watch b/c kids need to spend time in less passive activities and more on kid led ones, which typically occurs when they have lots of free time.

 

HTH,

Laura

[briansmama]

Have you looked into Project Based Homeschooling? I bought the e-book last week and loved it. The author explains how to be your child's mentor and keep them on track by providing support, recalling their ideas, setting a specific Project Time where you are in the room and available to help/guide them. Her ideas really show me how we can follow my son's interests while keeping his project front and center and gently help him move forward and create/learn.

 

She also talks about keeping parent-directed skills/practice work at a separate time so we don't feel the strong urge to take their projects and turn them into skills/practice work.

 

I think this balance will work great for us. We've also been using a Waldorf-inspired curriculum with my son (since the beginning in K-he's now in 3rd) and with my younger son (K this year). They are doing great with it, but I can tell my 3rd grader is not as engaged, and he voices so many interests to me throughout the day that I just don't have the time to sit down and help him with/support on top of doing our morning main lesson work. So, I've decided to turn main lesson work time into Project Time and keep our afternoon 30min skills/practice work mom-led so we get the best of both :)

[rafiki]

nt

[TippyCanoe]

nm

[rafiki]

nt

[MyLittleWonders]

Michele, that sounds like an awesome website. I'll have to take time to explore and show it to my boys. Thanks for sharing how it works for your family.

[MyLittleWonders]

Doodler, I also love your box/bin ideas with stuff inside for creating. Dh and the boys saw the Mini Weapons of Mass Struction at the store one day. That, along with a bin of supplies might have to be a Christmas present.

[Embassy]

They might also be interested and get ideas and motivation from seeing what other kids have done on their own. This site is attracting a lot of interest:

 

https://parents.diy.org

 

Thank you for this link! My kids are going to go ga-ga for this place. They have an independent learning day tomorrow and I think they will have fun with this site.