struggles with LOF algebra - need advice

[alisonslp]

I went through LOF fractions/decimals and both pre-algebra with my twin ds/dd last year (they turn 11 in a few weeks). DD did very well. DS needed some review with me but mainly completed it on his own.

 

They are now working through Algebra 1. Around lesson 30 (just getting into graphing). I know 11 is young for typical kids to be learning Algebra, but they have always been very advanced in math so this was the next step.

Again, dd is doing fine on her own but I just realized that ds is having a real tough time. It seems that he is fine with working the equations when they are given plainly but can't get from the word problems to the equations to solve them. I have to admit that some of them even stump me but I understand them after seeing the solution (oh - yes, that's how you set it up). I typically allow them to just do the book on their own, like the author recommends but I check in on them every once in a while, looking to see if there are any consistent problems happening. that's how I realized he's having so much trouble. Well, I went back a little way in the book and have been working with him on breaking down the word problems but, it is like he puts up a wall and then can't solve the equations - it's like he forgets everything he has learned once he tries the word problems.

 

Typically he is getting only 1-2 wrong on the daily work and each of the cities. Averaging in the 80%'s. So I know he is understanding most of the concepts in the book. It's the problems that always stump him

 

I am getting very frustrated with this because algebra (all math really) came very easy to me and same is true of dd and younger ds (so far, at least). I will explain these problems until I am worn out and the light is still is not going on in his head. I know he is getting frustrated too and this makes him just shut down and not really listen.

 

I don't know what to do from here. I have saxon algebra and am very tempted to have him work in that for a while to get the basic equations more automatic for him - thinking if he does a lot of them, he won't get as flustered once he comes to a word problem because he will only have to focus on the breaking down process, if that makes sense. I am also thinking that giving him a break from the problems and feeling more success on just the equations will help him as well.

 

I am also wondering if this is a natural process for many kids with LOF, not really getting it until later in the book. I know the author says that the kids need to work it on their own. And he says the solutions are important for them to look at because it provides explanations and reinforcement. But at what point are they supposed to "get it"?

 

So - Should I just continue what we are doing with the assumption that it will click for him soon or should I take a step laterally (not behind) and use saxon for a while - doing more basic equation work and not worry about the word problems just yet?

 

TIA

 

Alison

[alisonslp]

I forgot to mention that I have their schedule set up to do new lessons on M,W,F and to review those lessons on T, Th. So they have plenty of time to review any problem areas.

[EKS]

I know the author says that the kids need to work it on their own.

 

Just because the author says this does not make it so. If you feel your child would benefit from some direct instruction from a human being, that is what you should do.

 

Generally, when kids are struggling, continuing to have them work independently is not helpful.

[quark]

I have the Beginning and Advanced Algebra books and don't see a Lesson 30 so am not able to say if these links would be relevant, but what we did whenever DS became frustrated was to watch some Khan or Brightstorm videos on the topic.

 

http://www.brightstorm.com/math/algebra/word-problems-using-systems-of-equations/

http://www.khanacademy.org/?video=age-word-problems-1#algebra

 

Or maybe try this book?

http://www.amazon.com/Problems-Algebra-Proven-Techniques-Expert/dp/0071343075

 

We haven't used Saxon at all so am unable to help in that regard. All the best!

[wy_kid_wrangler04]

Check out this website, it may help.

[Cindyg]

For what it's worth, I am finding LOF's Beginning Algebra to be not-like his other books. We've done Fractions, Decimals, and the two pre-agebra books, which we loved. We are not loving Algebra, and it's not because the math is any harder. It's not. It's just not the same. We're using the home companion, and it's driving me crazy to go back and forth between them. I dunno.

[Laura Corin]

Beginning Algebra was a disappointment to us. We had also done Fractions, and Decimals and Percents and had loved both. Calvin got totally bogged down in BA and we jumped ship. He's not someone who likes to puzzle things out and work out different ways of doing them. He wants to understand the underlying logic then work with a clearly-stated method. We moved to So You Really Want to Learn Maths (Galore Park), which is British mixed maths with explicit instruction. I don't think it is the greatest maths book ever, but it was the style he needed.

 

After a couple of years of that and a year in school he just got an A* (highest mark) in his GCSE exam. So he's not bad at maths - LOF BA was just not a good fit for him.

 

Laura

[JeanM]

My ds, who normally loves word problems, had trouble with some of the ones in LOF algebra. For him, the hard part was writing down an equation from the word problem, since he was used to solving things naturally in his head. I supplemented by writing lots of word problems for him (I used a Star Wars theme to keep his interest up), and he only had to write an equation, not solve it.

 

Honestly, both my dc love Fred, but I found it took a lot of supplementing. My older ds is doing geometry now, and he agreed to switch to Jacob's Geometry instead of using LOF.

 

I also agree that just because the author says that they should work it on their own, doesn't necessarily mean that is right for your child. I don't think all children learn the same way.

[AK_Mom4]

I know they are twins and you probably will hate this idea, but maybe he needs a different book? Sounds like he understands the algebra, but LOF's teaching style is a miss in this book. There are plenty of good algebra books out there, I would let him try a different publisher and see if it clicks better.

 

BTW - LOF was a total failure here in the algebra book, too. DD liked reading thru the earlier ones for fun and answering the questions, but she thought there was *too much extra stuff* in the algebra book that didn't have anything to do with the math. She found it distracting.

[8filltheheart]

I know they are twins and you probably will hate this idea, but maybe he needs a different book? Sounds like he understands the algebra, but LOF's teaching style is a miss in this book. There are plenty of good algebra books out there, I would let him try a different publisher and see if it clicks better.

 

 

Foerster provides excellent instruction in how to read word problems and how to set them up step by step. It is also incredibly strong in word problems. Perhaps it would be a better fit for your ds. (FWIW, I have had an 11 yos complete the book, so it is doable w/an 11 yo.)

 

Another option if you think that he would benefit from stepping back from alg for a while b/c of mental attitude would be to go to AoPS pre-alg and move forward w/AoPS. That would ultimately NOT be a step back, but a step forward from LOF over time.

[alisonslp]

I was almost done writing a reply and my computer decided to reboot without warning. wonderful!

 

Anyway - thanks everyone for your insights.

 

I am not looking forward to 2 different paths for the twins but I may have to. My original plan was to have them complete LOF BA and then have them do the tests for Saxon algebra 1. Whatever they didn't understand, they would review those chapters in Saxon. I think I will likely do the opposite for DS - saxon then LOF.

 

As for self-teaching. I am a big proponent of this. They have been self taught from K, with only periodic review session from me to ensure they are understanding and not skimming over hard too topics. But this LOF book is just really different than the previous ones. It just doesn't break down the steps enough and doesn't provide enough practice for DS.

 

I may take a trip to our local homeschool store to look at the math books again too.

 

thanks again....

[alisonslp]

I decided to email Dr. Schmidt to get his input on whether ds would eventually work it out on his own by continuing through the book. He suggested stepping away from Fred for a year or two and let his brain mature more. I was sort of shocked (veering me away from his own books) by that but very pleased that he gave me his honest opinion.

 

I also decided to do a little more digging with dd and realized she is having similar problems, just not to the extent of ds. When asked what she feels, she thinks it's getting too hard and really needs more practice than what the book gives her. So, we are going to stop Fred for this year and use Saxon.

 

I also want to get a book that will give them more word problems at the pre-algebra level so they can regain their confidence. I thought of the AOPS Pre-algebra. Would it be a good book for that content.

 

I am really disappointed that the LOF isn't working for them. I guess I was just thrilled with the prospect of having a fun and challenging curriculum for them. And they did so well in the Fractions-pre algebra books. I know lots of people have warned against LOF as a stand alone but with them doing so well in the lower books, I thought my guys would be fine. Reality has struck... at least for this year. Who knows, maybe with mental maturity, they will be able to go back to it as a primary book.