Introduction and Biology Questions

[April in CA]

Greeting from California! I have been a lurker for a bit and I thought I would take the plunge and join the forum in order to benefit from you collective wisdom!

 

My husband and I have been homeschooling our two sons for six years now: older ds is finishing us 10th grade and will turn 16 on 6/2,and younger ds is going to graduate 8th grade on his 14th birthday (6/14).

 

In CA, our public university systems apparently don't appreciate biology courses taught from books by BJU, Abeka, and Apologia, so in order to jump through the UC and CSU hoops I need to pick a secular text with good support materials. An added plus would be an affordable price!:)

 

I have been able to pick up a few used bio textbooks (student versions) from library book sales (cant' beat 50 cents for a book!). Now I am trying to decide if I should use one of them or try to find a used copy of Exploring Life (is that what is sometimes called baby campbell?). Whatever I choose, I need to ba able to get teacher's materials like a teacher's text, lab manuals, tests and answers...

 

Here is a list of the books I have:

Glencoe: Biology, the Dynamics of Life 2000 edition

 

Holt Rinehart and Winston: Biology Principles and Explorations 2001 edidtion

 

Holt: Biology Visiualizing Life, 1998 edition

 

In additon, I will most likely be folding in a couple of other students for labs and tests, so I need to be able to get books, etc, for them.

 

Any thoughts from those of you who have used any of these texts of compared then to Exploring Life? Any and all ideas welcomed and appreciated! Thank you!!!

Blessings to you all,

April

[Maura in NY]

Hi April,

Your post made me grin. Last year I purchased 5 (yes, FIVE) different Biology curricula before making up my mind! I ended up with Prentice-Hall's Biology (aka Miller&Levine's dragonfly book), but not until I'd purchased the student text and study guides for two different Campbell's, the Holt book our local district uses (the name escapes me now, but it has a big brown bear on the cover), and Singapore's Biology.

 

We've been very happy with the Prentice-Hall, but it wasn't cheap because I had to get it new. Everything else I picked up used. I don't have about selecting from your choices, but I wanted to recommend that you try both Amazon Marketplace and http://www.follett.com for the teacher's manuals and study guides for whatever you choose. If you have to buy them new, my experience is that you can get your best price directly from the publisher.

 

Peace,

Maura

[Beth in SW WA]

Hi April,

Welcome to the hive -- (resistance is futile) :)

 

I've been researching Biology Exploring Life, aka "baby Campbell".

 

I found the text, CD Rom, teachers Examview CD and student workbook all from different sources online. Everything is arriving this week and I hope its what I'm looking for. I'll let you know.

 

I understand your angst about finding bits and pieces of EL. I did get the book already used from Amazon for $15.

 

And you do know that Pearson will be happy to sell you everything -- it will just cost you a small fortune. Examview is $129 from PH but I found it for $29 on ebay.

 

The gang here has been helpful here in helping me pick a bio book. You have found a great place to hang out.

[Ailaena]

I am not very familiar with the Holt books, but I do know that the older Glencoe books are minimal and frustrating in their content. Also, the order in which the present the material does not flow (for me). Strangely though, one of the best HS Bio textbooks I have ever seen is Glencoe's 2007 Biology book.

 

DH used "baby Campbell" (:lol:) for a college-level bio class and it seemed like a fine, comprehensive intro-level biology text, but I couldnt help having this nagging sensation like I wanted it to have more... I am certain, though, that the feeling was totally based on my biology background, and had nothing at all to do with the book.

 

In addition to where everyone else said, sometimes people sell sets of stuff of ebay that included everything you need and sometimes, schools will let you have their exam copies of things they dont use. I even recently acquired an intro-chemistry text with all support materials from our CC!

[teachmom3]

 

In CA, our public university systems apparently don't appreciate biology courses taught from books by BJU, Abeka, and Apologia, so in order to jump through the UC and CSU hoops I need to pick a secular text with good support materials.

April

 

Just wanted to comment on the above!

 

We're in California. The brouhaha over Christian textbooks arose with accredited high schools trying to meet the a.-g. UC/CSU entrance requirements. This will only apply to you, then, if you are part of an accredited school.

 

If you're part of an unaccredited school (i.e., just about all private homeschools and ISP's in California), then the UC/CSU system, with an occasional exception (more on that later), doesn't really care what you do, because they're going to largely ignore your courses anyway.

 

The one main exception is the University of California at Riverside, which, two years ago, started a homeschool applicant program. My dd, who graduated from our private homeschool high school, was accepted through this program. Except for chemistry and a genetics elective using a college textbook, we used BJUP and Apologia (and a little A Beka) for her secondary science classes--and I included all of this information in her portfolio for application

 

These Christian publishers must not have bothered UCR too much: UCR gave her a full academic scholarship. (Granted, she had high SAT scores, extra-curricular activities and volunteering, and took rigorous classes with me [with a few outsourced], etc., but the Christian/secular publisher issue was apparently irrelevant.)

 

The UC system in particular has been historically disdainful of homeschoolers. With the exception of UCR, that fact alone will mean that your child will have a black mark as an applicant (unless the system changes). I was concerned about this Christian publisher / secular publisher issue several years ago, but when I realized that it really didn't matter in the larger picture to the UC system, given that we were from an "unaccredited" school, I just used whatever books we felt would be best.

 

Just our experience! UC/CSU policies may change by the time your student is ready to apply.

[TRILLIUM]

My dd did AP Bio this year and I spent the year reading the AP Bio list serv. I'm pretty sure the the "Baby Campbell" is the shorter college textbook Biology Concepts and Connections. When I say shorter I mean compared to the book by Campbell titled simply Biology.

[April in CA]

Thank you , Maura, for the encouragement! I do feel as though I am on the search for the holy grail of biology texts! Could you please tell me how you decided on the text you chose?

Thanks again!

Blessings,

April

[April in CA]

Thank you for the welcome, Beth! I would love to hear what you think about the Exploring Life goodies when you have had a chance to look them over. Congratulations on finding bits and pieces for reasonable prices!

Blessings,

April

[April in CA]

Thank you, Ailaena!

I am curious about what makes the new Glencoe biology book so much better - could you give your opinion? I wonder if it is available used... Did your dh use the CD or web resources available with Exploring LIfe? From what I understand, those activities are pretty foundational to the concept of the course (publisher's point of view)

 

I can appreciate your biology background making you want more. However, do you find yourself concerned with depth vs breadth for an intro course? I look at these texts - some hovering around 1000 pages, and think, "what do we really need to know here?" I really want my sons to get the big ideas (and be able to pass the SAT II, I'll be honest!) and then focus on the topics that interest them most - that would be birds, for younger ds.

Any and all thoughts appreciated!

Thanks again and blessings,

April

[April in CA]

Thanky you Teachmom3!

I appreciate the additional information regarding the UC system. What a waste that most of our publicly funded universities choose to turn up their noses at a vibrant homeschooling community! Congratulations to your daughter! I would love to know more about your decisoin making process regarding colleges - how did you and your daughter decide to look at UCR? Has she been happy there? We are a couple of hours north of Riverside, so we could go down for a visit to check out the campus. Did you find any other CA schools that were/are homeschool friendly?

 

Thank you also for your insight into the science text controversy. We are part of an ISP (unacredited) run by a reasonably large, accredited Christian school, pursuing a college prep diploma. I don't know if my guys will seen as students of the accredited school or not. I suppose it depends on how closely admissions officers read applications!

 

Looking forward to hearing from you,

Blessings,

April

[April in CA]

Thank you for the correction, Trillium! In the case of biology textbooks, shorter does seem to be a relative term, doesn't it? I really like your signature! Maybe someday I'll figure out how to do things like that!

Blessings,

April

[Tammyla]

Welcome~

 

Biology is on our schedule this year too. Best wishes.

[April in CA]

Thanks, Tammy! Blessings to you as you plan for this as well! What text are you using?

April

[TRILLIUM]

We used Holt's Biology 2006 for freshman Biology. I liked the online textbook which was only $16.95. You can find fairly inexpensive teacher's editions of the book. My dh is a biology person he thought biology has changed a lot in the last 20 years so we got a recent text book. My dd took the Biology SAT II. She got a 720.

 

I'm using it with my second dd this coming year.

[Laurie in CA]

and gets an AA then transfers it probably won't make any difference what science he/she took in high school. My son transferred to San Jose State from a community college and it was not an issue. UC may be a stricter but we didn't have experience in that area. We used all Apologia by the way.

 

Laurie in CA

[April in CA]

Thanks, Laurie! We may well have the guys start at the local CC. AV College is just a few files from our house (older son has taken 3 computer classes there as a sophomore). It does make sense financially to go that route! Did your son find the transition from CC to SJS relatively smooth?

Blessings and thanks for chiming in!

April

[Laurie in CA]

from high school to CC and CC to university. He did not care for SJS and only went one year. He was in the art program and did quite well as far as his grades but didn't care for all the hoops he had to jump through to finish the five-year program. Also I would suggest that you make sure each class your student takes at CC will "count" as far as required prerequisite classes for his major. There was no problem for the general education requirements. These seem to be pretty standard across the board.

 

Laurie in CA

[Ellie]

My dd graduated from Evergreen Valley College and transferred to San Jose State. We did c.c. instead of high school :-) All of her credits were transferred.

 

We did c.c. instead of high school. There seemed no point in doing both :-)

 

So that would be my recommendation: just go ahead and do biology at the c.c. and don't worry about doing it at home.

[Janice H]

This is a good deal I think, if you wanted to go with PH. I did not like the busy layout, and if I had it to do over again I would get Bio: Concepts and Connections by Campbell.

 

Here a link to the Prentice Hall TE "nearly new" for $65 from http://www.textbookx.com/exchange_detail.php?isbn=9780132013499.

 

I'm also in CA and was glad to see the post from TeachMom.

[Ailaena]

Thank you, Ailaena!

I am curious about what makes the new Glencoe biology book so much better - could you give your opinion? I wonder if it is available used... Did your dh use the CD or web resources available with Exploring LIfe? From what I understand, those activities are pretty foundational to the concept of the course (publisher's point of view)

 

I can appreciate your biology background making you want more. However, do you find yourself concerned with depth vs breadth for an intro course? I look at these texts - some hovering around 1000 pages, and think, "what do we really need to know here?" I really want my sons to get the big ideas (and be able to pass the SAT II, I'll be honest!) and then focus on the topics that interest them most - that would be birds, for younger ds.

Any and all thoughts appreciated!

Thanks again and blessings,

April

 

 

I am so sorry I took so long to even begin to answer this, I have no excuse! I must admit, though, if I seem distracted, its because it is 10 at night, and for some reason, my neighbor is screaming at someone and I am sitting right next to the window being half-nosy...:blush: TMI, I know...

 

OK, one of the main reasons that I thought the new Glencoe book was so good was because I thought it was just the right mix of cell biology and animal biology for an intro class. I did NOT like the way the chapters were ordered, but that is easily remedied and is my own preference. Really, it was just unit one in the wrong spot, for me. The book actually followed very closely to the Exploring Life book topic-wise, but seemed way more readable and friendly for kids (who may or may not like to read textbooks). Plus, I really like how Glencoe offers free support materials on their website including quizzes and virtual labs. I have seen them used, check amazon because I just saw a TE for $26!

 

As for the Exploring Life book dh used, he did not touch the CD or any of the resource materials and believe me, he struggled with the topics. He should have taken it in person, or paid me for all the teaching I tried to do.

 

I think its really difficult for me to address the depth vs breadth question. I think that it is so important for kids to be exposed to as much as possible as often as possible. That will lead them to areas that they want to study in-depth. I think that pumping fact after fact into a child drains the love of learning. They stop asking why and stop seeing connections to life and begin the process of remembering something long enough to take the test. I hate the whole teaching to the SAT subject test idea, but I know it has to be done (yes, Im sure we could all argue with that). I think that either book, along with a good test prep book, should be a good prep for the test, but I have not actually taken the subject test to know for certain. Do you think they would let me?? What a great idea, we could all sign up for one in our area of expertise and swap notes and know for sure!

 

Another book I just dug out literally two days ago is Campbell's Essential Biology. This book focuses way more on the microbiological side of biology. It still addresses some animal/plant biology and ecology but definitely nowhere near the other books. I really think it would be appropriate for someone who wants to go for the SAT biology M test, or has had enough of protists, fungi, moss and fish. Probably not so interesting for your son who likes birds. Or maybe, you never know!

 

So sorry if I rambled a bunch, hopefully it was somewhat coherent. I really did not mean to get up on a soapbox about testing, I dont always think its a bad thing, I just saw one of my favorite kids get the life sucked out of him this year as a sophomore. I really hope this helped, at least a little bit!

[April in CA]

Thank you Laurie and Ellie for sharing your CC to CSU experiences - I appreciate it!

Blessings,

April

[April in CA]

Thank you, Janice! I appreciate the link - one more book to add to the list of possibilities...

Blessings,

April (beginning to feel that picking a bio text is a full time job!)

[April in CA]

How funny Ailaena! I got a laugh out of your description of your evening!

Thank you for sharing your expeiences with various books. Which edition of the Glencoe book did you evaluate - 2004 or 2007? (my dates might be off here - just going from memory) I have a copy of the 2000 student edition)

Blessings,

April

 

PS - I'm there with you on testing. I understand the need for testing, but how to balance that with love for learning is a puzzle, especially if what you love to lear is not on the test! Trying to find a high school level ornithology book for my son is a lost cause, I think...

My older son is taking the Chem Sat II on Saturday - 85 questions in 60 minutes! should be interesting!

 

Way back in the mists of time, I started college as a Bio major (before I hit the chem wall and changed majors to finance...) I loved bio and anatomy & phys is high school. after looking at current bio texts, it does seem that the emphasis has shifted way to the microbio side - maybe too much.. After all, we get interested in bio because of what we can see around us...just a thought!

more blessings!

[Ailaena]

The Glencoe book was the 2007 version with the zebras on the cover. I like the content and style much better than the older ones, but the free support materials are better for it, as well. The student/teacher center is here: http://glencoe.mcgraw-hill.com/sites/0078695104/

Order from the publisher here: http://www.glencoe.com/catalog/index.php/program?c=1674&s=7415&p=5017&t=2

I have ordered TEs from Glencoe with no problem, I just had to call them, and I have no official teaching credentials.

 

The study of biology has evolved so much in the last 150 years or so. What used to be separate studies of structural anatomy and physiology and cell biology and nature and microbes have all come together into huge 1000-page books that need to be covered in one year for a child to be "ready" for life after high school (or college). When I was a kid, I contemplated boarding school and I remember looking at one school that studied every subject every year, a little bit at a time but very in-depth. I thought they were insane at the time, but now, I think its a really good idea.

 

I should probably rethink my idea of high school science, and develop a plan like that for dd, who really likes in-depth study better. But then I am afraid some university will find out and reject her and she will never forgive me:tongue_smilie: Although, isnt the very idea of homeschooling that we are non-traditional?

 

Sorry I meandered. Two more thoughts, though...

 

1. Did your son that is taking the chem subject test only study HS-level chemistry first? I know a woman teaching AP chem at a high school here that makes her kids take the AP test AND the SAT-II at the end of her class. She said that it was very difficult to get a good score on the subject test after just one year of HS chem. Of course, in retrospect, she is teaching in a public school system that was ranked 49th in the country... Maybe 48th this year, I cant remember.

 

2. I know I once saw someone have a great HS level ornithology set, I will look for it and let you know if I come across it!

[April in CA]

Hello again! DS 1, who is taking the chem SAT II , is finishing up Apologia Advanced Chemistry - actually he will finish it after he takes this test - regular chemistry has been put on hold while he powers through a review book and 3 practice tests - taking one as i write. How's that for grammar!

 

I suppose I could just chuck the search and have DS 2 do Apologia Bio, but he doesn't really like the wordy style. I think I might be creating a few waves here with my real-life friends, since I am the one who will be doing bio labs and we all have the Apologia book already. It will be an issue for some financially and perhaps philosophically, but I really feel I have to put the needs of my son first here. Sigh.

 

If you find info on ornithology, please send it on - ds 2 would be grateful!

Thanks mucho!

April

[kidzr1st]

We used Holt's Biology 2006 for freshman Biology. I liked the online textbook which was only $16.95. quote]

 

Where did you find this??

 

Thanks!

[TRILLIUM]

Many of Holt books are available as one year (actually 15 month) subscriptions.

 

Here's a link to the general biology page. Click on the book you are interested and then hit show components identify yourself as a homeschooler hit continue and you'll find the online edition.

 

Many of the hardcover teacher's editions are available inexpensively. If you decide to get the teacher's edition make sure they agree. The text of the 2004 and 2006 Biology agree, but they reworked the test prep section.

 

I would not say that Holt Biology was great as a textbook, but we did like the mix of online activities that supported the book and the price was good.

[TRILLIUM]

Many of Holt books are available as one year (actually 15 month) subscriptions.

 

Here's a link to the general biology page. http://www.hrw.com/c/dlist.web?nocache@3+s@82AOBh6W9d5XM+curList@0+frompage@tocre Click on the book you are interested and then hit show components identify yourself as a homeschooler hit continue and you'll find the online edition.

 

Many of the hardcover teacher's editions are available inexpensively. If you decide to get the teacher's edition make sure they agree. The text of the 2004 and 2006 Biology agree, but they reworked the test prep section.

 

I would not say that Holt Biology was great as a textbook, but we did like the mix of online activities that supported the book and the price was good.