Our district's homeschool coordinator just called

[Jen in PA]

Zactly. More than one hser has fallen afoul of various and assorted regs and whatnots because they mushed around Official Grade Levels on paper.

 

Ellie, I have read your opinions on age/grade many times, and do respect them. But in PA a district can accept a child into K at age 4 (although many districts set it higher). We simply started at the earliest age allowed by state law, and have completed a grade level a year (well, you know what I mean, not really that lock-step, but moving ahead without skipping things). Even if dd had attended school, she would still be in the same grade.

[Barb_]

I lived in PA for 5 years. I think if I were you, I would withdraw the grade placement since you don't need that on file anyway. I'd send the super a copy of the law and tell him you are following the law to the letter and will be filing by age only. Then spend the $25 and have her tested as a 3rd grader this year. That way the only hoops you are jumping through have legal basis and you aren't setting a precedent for the incremental pressure on other homeschoolers, but their need for bureaucracy is satisfied.

 

Barb

[Momof3littles]

I am hitting my midafternoon slump and may need some caffeine to think clearly, so if I'm off, please let me know.

 

What would the expectation be of someone transferring in from private school to HSing and declaring their child a 4th grader? Would they be expected to have a 3rd grade standardized test on file before declaring their child a 4th grader?

 

Maybe I am comparing apples to oranges?

[Jen in PA]

I lived in PA for 5 years. I think if I were you, I would withdraw the grade placement since you don't need that on file anyway. I'd send the super a copy of the law and tell him you are following the law to the letter and will be filing by age only. Then spend the $25 and have her tested as a 3rd grader this year. That way the only hoops you are jumping through have legal basis and you aren't setting a precedent for the incremental pressure on other homeschoolers, but their need for bureaucracy is satisfied.

 

Barb

 

I have a 3rd grade test score for her, so I am just going to go ahead and do my thing..... Submit my portfolio, and then only show those old scores if they ask for more documentation. The funny thing is that this was never about test scores -- it really just snowballed after a district official insisted that DD had to be either K or 1st or that I had to document that she had completed other grade levels prior to filing for the first time. It was in the response from the PDE that the test score thing even came up, and it didn't match what I had seen on Pauline's website and read in the law myself. So while the PDE backed me up on the immediate issue with the district, I just couldn't let the other point drop without comment.

[Jen in PA]

I am hitting my midafternoon slump and may need some caffeine to think clearly, so if I'm off, please let me know.

 

What would the expectation be of someone transferring in from private school to HSing and declaring their child a 4th grader? Would they be expected to have a 3rd grade standardized test on file before declaring their child a 4th grader?

 

Maybe I am comparing apples to oranges?

 

You make perfect sense, and that was my basic line of reasoning. The rules of the home ed law only apply to kids who fall under the home ed law.

[Momof3littles]

You make perfect sense, and that was my basic line of reasoning. The rules of the home ed law only apply to kids who fall under the home ed law.

 

I'd love to hear PDE's response (well, in reality it would probably make me want to :banghead:) as to how they plan to handle a situation where a child is transferring from private to HSing, declaring themselves a 4th grader. Do they have to prove they took a standardized test in 3rd? What am I missing?

[dcjlkplus3]

I would think that if you are transfering schools, you would have a record of some sort stating that the child completed upto 3rd grade (or whatever). When we moved when I was kid (a lot) my dad always had to have paperwork to transfer us and some of that would be a school history of some sort. So "proof" that you completed whatever level would still have been provided.

[melissel]

I'd love to hear PDE's response (well, in reality it would probably make me want to :banghead:) as to how they plan to handle a situation where a child is transferring from private to HSing, declaring themselves a 4th grader. Do they have to prove they took a standardized test in 3rd? What am I missing?

 

That was my first thought as well. I would hold the line hard if I were you. I loathe being pushed around by bureaucrats who can't get their details straightened.

 

You know, this is the one issue that prevents me from pushing DH harder to move to PA. We could really (REALLY) use the break financially, but I would lose my mind dealing with the HSing regs. Of course, we have a few NJ legislators who start making noise every few years about much stricter regs here (including annual physicals :confused:). Fortunately, NJ is so broke right now, we really can't see the governor spending anymore money on something like that. For now, anyway...:glare:

[Momof3littles]

I would think that if you are transfering schools, you would have a record of some sort stating that the child completed upto 3rd grade (or whatever). When we moved when I was kid (a lot) my dad always had to have paperwork to transfer us and some of that would be a school history of some sort. So "proof" that you completed whatever level would still have been provided.

 

Is there anything in the law specifying those records have to be transferred from private school to the school district for a *home* schooler though?

 

I know they would be for private to public, but for private to home, is it a requirement that private school records be provided to the district?

[Leav97]

I am hitting my midafternoon slump and may need some caffeine to think clearly, so if I'm off, please let me know.

 

What would the expectation be of someone transferring in from private school to HSing and declaring their child a 4th grader? Would they be expected to have a 3rd grade standardized test on file before declaring their child a 4th grader?

 

Maybe I am comparing apples to oranges?

 

Or someone moving from out of state...

[Momof3littles]

Or someone moving from out of state...

 

Right. I just moved back a yr ago from a state with different laws. I am not yet reporting (one year left to see how things shake out w/ these new "interpretations" from PDE). I don't see how this can be enforced, but I'm not an expert on PA law. I've tried to stay on top of it the last few years knowing we'd likely move back, but maybe I'm missing something.

 

eta: yeah, what if you are transferring from a state that has no requirements for testing or reporting for that matter? How are they going to enforce this?

Edited August 16, 2011 by Momof3littles

[JoyfulMama]

My eldest dtr was in the same predicament, having completed her 3rd grade year while not meeting the compulsary school age. We moved from another state back into PA during that third grade year. She was legally homeschooling in the other state, but when we moved back into PA late in that school year, I did not register her, and did not have her complete testing. I spoke with HSLDA regarding all of it, and there were no concerns. I registered her for the first time as a 4th grader in the state of PA, and have never had any concerns.

 

Glad you got confirmation that the district liason needs to be educated, but don't sweat it on the testing reqirement from before she was registered.

[Maryalice]

Oh bad news people..... I got a very nice, detailed email back from Suzanne Tallman at the PDE. And basically she said I was right, he was wrong, congrats on your great job educating your kid, etc. BUT then she said that I would have to show the district evidence that DD had done the 3rd grade standardized test even though she took it prior to hitting compulsory age. Sigh.

 

 

She wrote:

 

 

You do not have to declare your child’s grade, but you will need to have the two standardized tests completed (3rd and 5th) and the results submitted to begin working on the secondary mandatory classes. Why is this important to you? Because there are very specific graduation requirements listed for secondary education and you would not be able to check these off until you had completed the requirements of the elementary grades.

 

 

 

Basically, you need to submit the required standardized tests and show that the mandatory courses have been completed; if you do that, the superintendent cannot challenge you.

 

 

I wrote back thanking her profusely for her detailed response but let her know that I was not able to find a place in the law that stated that the testing requirement superseded the compulsory age/filing requirements. I asked her to please point me to the part of the law which would make that true. I told her that I did understand the issues that could arise if a family were to try to grade skip only the testing years, but that I would be more than happy to submit test scores for my dc for the years during which they did fall under the home ed law.

 

 

I am sorry for quoting the whole mess, but Suzanne only interprets the law and she isn't even a lawyer. She has misspoken (again). I have advised others in the exact same situation, first affidavit at 8 years old, 4th grade. Laws are not retroactive. If your dau is in 4th grade per you, the supervisor, you will need to test her when she is in 5th gr.

 

She revised the website recently and I wrote a 13 page letter of her errors. They have now pulled in lawyers to address them. She is not the law, nor can they legislate from a memo or website.

 

pm me if you wish.

 

maryalice

[Jen in PA]

My eldest dtr was in the same predicament, having completed her 3rd grade year while not meeting the compulsary school age. We moved from another state back into PA during that third grade year. She was legally homeschooling in the other state, but when we moved back into PA late in that school year, I did not register her, and did not have her complete testing. I spoke with HSLDA regarding all of it, and there were no concerns. I registered her for the first time as a 4th grader in the state of PA, and have never had any concerns.

 

Glad you got confirmation that the district liason needs to be educated, but don't sweat it on the testing reqirement from before she was registered.

 

I am sorry for quoting the whole mess, but Suzanne only interprets the law and she isn't even a lawyer. She has misspoken (again). I have advised others in the exact same situation, first affidavit at 8 years old, 4th grade. Laws are not retroactive. If your dau is in 4th grade per you, the supervisor, you will need to test her when she is in 5th gr.

 

She revised the website recently and I wrote a 13 page letter of her errors. They have now pulled in lawyers to address them. She is not the law, nor can they legislate from a memo or website.

 

pm me if you wish.

 

maryalice

 

Thanks for the encouragement, This is such a nonissue, or at least it should be..... I just got so angry dealing with the misinformation.

[gaillardia]

I haven't read this whole thread, but just wanted to tell you, MaryAlice and Jen in PA, keep on challenging them when they misinterpret the law, or add things that are not required, etc.

 

I started homeschooling in PA and dreaded every year after the first one because I didn't enjoy jumping through so many hoops. It seemed to take the joy out of homeschooling.