soooo what if you are a young earth creationist???

[lcelmer]

To my way of thinking, I would not use the new PHP book simply because it is authored by a man who does not believe that God created the world as He clearly states in the Bible... If Peter Enns doesn't believe that Genesis is literal, then why would he believe that the gospels are? More importantly, why would I let him teach my children anything about the word of God?

 

I firmly believe that:

 

that God made all things of nothing,

by the word of His power, in the space of six days, and all very good;

and that God preserves and governs all His creatures and all their actions.

 

(A modern selection from the Westminster 17th century Shorter Catechism)

 

and that: We believe the Bible to be the only inerrant Word of God. It is our only ultimate and infallible authority for faith and practice.

An Evangelical Statement (Adapted from the National Association of Evangelicals)

 

Ordinarily, I just wouldn't comment on material I am not planning on using, but in this case, there are threads that are all about SUPPORTING the opposite view. So, here I am feeling that I must say something.

 

I really like the WTM book, and also the FLL, and WWE, however in this instance I must part ways with PHP.

 

One of the major reasons we(our family) are homeschooling is our perspective on creation, and the infallibility of the word of God.

 

This is an important enough issue to the Christian faith that I am willing to speak out.

 

If Peter Enns doesn't believe that Genesis is literal, then why would he believe that the gospels are? More importantly, why would I let him teach my children anything about the word of God?

[tntgoodwin]

This again?

[Jean in Newcastle]

All the people I've seen commenting on these threads would fully support the fact that you have researched the issue and know your own mind on it. You just have to realize that other people have researched the issue and know their own mind - some to come to the same conclusions as you and I have and some to come to a different conclusion. Whether you think their conclusions are valid or not is a debate for a different time or place - what's important for this board is that people need the freedom and the encouragement to really dig for the answers so that they can choose for themselves.

[Mandy in TN]

<yawn> You can't argue with someone's faith.

 

And certainly blasting them isn't going to make them think like you.

Mandy

[lcelmer]

"Ordinarily, I just wouldn't comment on material I am not planning on using, but in this case, there are threads that are all about SUPPORTING the opposite view. So, here I am feeling that I must say something."

 

Isn't this an open forum that allows a difference of opinion?

 

I'm just giving mine, and didn't see other threads about this from my point of view. :)

[Shawna in Texas]

To my way of thinking, I would not use the new PHP book simply because it is authored by a man who does not believe that God created the world as He clearly states in the Bible... If Peter Enns doesn't believe that Genesis is literal, then why would he believe that the gospels are? More importantly, why would I let him teach my children anything about the word of God?

 

I firmly believe that:

 

that God made all things of nothing,

by the word of His power, in the space of six days, and all very good;

and that God preserves and governs all His creatures and all their actions.

 

 

 

As an atheist, I've learned lots about the Christians on this board. I've learned some are YE and quite literal and I've learned that some are OE and not quite as literal, but still strong in their love of Christ. I've learned that there are still some trying to figure it all out, but still strong in their love of Christ. I've learned that for some, the Bible isn't as clear on some things, like what to take more literally, and what may have more room for interpretation, in their opinions. They seem to take this on prayerfully. Believe me, they all love Jesus. ;)

 

There are plenty of threads on resources for YE creationists. The reason you see threads of the opposite view is because there is plenty of that here as well. Along with even other views. We are a diverse board.

 

If creation is one of your main reasons for homeschooling, then I could see how that limits your resources. I appreciate the quandary. If Peter Enns' interpretation of Genesis prevents you from using his books, then we all get that. Some of the folks on this board won't be using it for that very reason.

 

One thing I've learned this week is that some YE creationists weren't aware that Christians could be so diverse with interpretations to scripture and still feel strong with Christ. Honestly, I think they should worry more about protecting their children from us non-believers :D, than themselves. :001_smile:

[shinyhappypeople]

To my way of thinking, I would not use the new PHP book simply because it is authored by a man who does not believe that God created the world as He clearly states in the Bible... If Peter Enns doesn't believe that Genesis is literal, then why would he believe that the gospels are?

 

You should ask him. Seriously. I have a feeling you'd get a thoughtful reply. You may not agree with his conclusions and that's fine, but at least you'd know for sure where he's coming from.

[cbollin]

I am in a unique position on some of this.

I am a young earther.

I bought Telling God's Story at convention mostly because of all of the talk about it and wanted to see what it was. After my dh and I reviewed the materials....

 

We decided to use the book this coming year.

 

WHY would I do that? This is the decision process that my dh and I went through. Other young earthers may not agree with this process, but it was something my dh and I decided to do for our house. I respect others decisions to steer away from book, etc. It's your decision. I have chosen to share my reasons and thought process on it for my family.

 

*We are teaching our youngest child. Mr. Enns is not.

*Telling God's Story book 1 is about learning about Jesus. In our youngest child's "Bible cycle" learning, she is at the stage where she will be focusing on learning the "names of Jesus" (as in Light of the World, King of Kings). We wanted to include a few extra hands on activities that were already planned out for us in doable ways with common household items. The student activity book and teacher book in Telling God's Story provides that supplement that we were looking for.

 

So, basically for us, it is a supplement for hands on learning about the same topics that we were already going to teach this coming year.

 

My dh and I have both read the parent guide book (the one with the tree on it) and realized that even though we don't 100% agree with the author on all of this, we like the actual hands on activities in the student book.

 

So, that's from the young earth perspective of someone who plans to use the activity book as a supplement for topics we were planning to teach our youngest child next year anyway.

 

The kid isn't going to be reading the book. I will.

 

I hope that gives some kind of insight.

[Guest]

To my way of thinking, I would not use the new PHP book simply because it is authored by a man who does not believe that God created the world as He clearly states in the Bible... If Peter Enns doesn't believe that Genesis is literal, then why would he believe that the gospels are? More importantly, why would I let him teach my children anything about the word of God?

 

I firmly believe that:

 

that God made all things of nothing,

by the word of His power, in the space of six days, and all very good;

and that God preserves and governs all His creatures and all their actions.

 

(A modern selection from the Westminster 17th century Shorter Catechism)

 

and that: We believe the Bible to be the only inerrant Word of God. It is our only ultimate and infallible authority for faith and practice.

An Evangelical Statement (Adapted from the National Association of Evangelicals)

 

Ordinarily, I just wouldn't comment on material I am not planning on using, but in this case, there are threads that are all about SUPPORTING the opposite view. So, here I am feeling that I must say something.

 

I really like the WTM book, and also the FLL, and WWE, however in this instance I must part ways with PHP.

 

One of the major reasons we(our family) are homeschooling is our perspective on creation, and the infallibility of the word of God.

 

This is an important enough issue to the Christian faith that I am willing to speak out.

 

If Peter Enns doesn't believe that Genesis is literal, then why would he believe that the gospels are? More importantly, why would I let him teach my children anything about the word of God?

 

I see you are not really interested in finding out what Peter Enns believes or says in his book. Otherwise you would have read the free samples that were provided by Justin and that I linked for you in the other thread.

 

If you feel that parting ways with PHP is what is best for your family then that of course is your right. Trying to impose your views on us in not. If you had questions that you wanted answered I could understand but in this case you are here to make a statement and take with you as many followers as you can. I am astounded by what I have been seeing going on here these past few days! It seems that people have come on here with an agenda and then are surprised by people's reaction when we object to it.

Edited March 26, 2011 by Guest

[tiffanieh]

Marie,

 

I too understand where Icelmer is coming from. I did read the free book linked above, and yes, from reading this I can see why everyone is scratching their head over the controversy. I saw nothing at all wrong with this book, nor the parables that were discussed. It looked like a finely written book.

 

The question that I believe many YE christians are having is the author's beliefs in a literal Genesis, in theological evolution, etc. While those issues are NOT discussed in that book, it is wise to know and understand the source of materials, or the basis from which the author writes, that you are presenting to your children if those issues don't jive with your faith.

 

Personally for me, I tend to not go down paths that could become slippery slopes. While this book may very well be sound doctrine, if it is written by an author that has VAST differences in what we hold to be truth, then I would not want to start enjoying a series of books that slowly (it is usually never blatant) twist my personal truths.

 

Listen, there are a TON of various materials out there, THANK GOODNESS!! so we do not need to get hung up on any one particular book, however, for full disclosure, I do agree that any book, all books, should always disclose this type of information so that each family can make their own personal choices on whether its a book for them.

 

Happy Saturday!

[Guest]

Marie,

 

I too understand where Icelmer is coming from. I did read the free book linked above, and yes, from reading this I can see why everyone is scratching their head over the controversy. I saw nothing at all wrong with this book, nor the parables that were discussed. It looked like a finely written book.

 

The question that I believe many YE christians are having is the author's beliefs in a literal Genesis, in theological evolution, etc. While those issues are NOT discussed in that book, it is wise to know and understand the source of materials, or the basis from which the author writes, that you are presenting to your children if those issues don't jive with your faith.

 

Personally for me, I tend to not go down paths that could become slippery slopes. While this book may very well be sound doctrine, if it is written by an author that has VAST differences in what we hold to be truth, then I would not want to start enjoying a series of books that slowly (it is usually never blatant) twist my personal truths.

 

Listen, there are a TON of various materials out there, THANK GOODNESS!! so we do not need to get hung up on any one particular book, however, for full disclosure, I do agree that any book, all books, should always disclose this type of information so that each family can make their own personal choices on whether its a book for them.

 

Happy Saturday!

 

You know what works best for your family and that is your right. What I do object to is being treated like the rest of us don't have a brain of our own to decide what is best for our families. This is how I have been made to feel these past few days. I like to believe that I am a mature adult that can determine for myself who has an agenda and who doesn't. If P. Enns has an agenda, I am sure I will see it. If some feel they are not equipped to tell the difference then what are we teaching our kids? To fear change? To stay away from something simply because we are afraid someone may be trying to slip something under our nose? With this mentality no medical or technological advances would ever have taken place. But hey, to each his own.

[tiffanieh]

You know what works best for your family and that is your right. What I do object to is being treated like the rest of us don't have a brain of our own to decide what is best for our families. This is how I have been made to feel these past few days. I like to believe that I am a mature adult that can determine for myself who has an agenda and who doesn't. If P. Enns has an agenda, I am sure I will see it. If some feel they are not equipped to tell the difference then what are we teaching our kids? To fear change? To stay away from something simply because we are afraid someone may be trying to slip something under our nose? With this mentality no medical or technological advances would ever have taken place. But hey, to each his own.

 

I think you are missing my point. When you publish a theological book, the author's theological stances should be taken into consideration. Some will agree with it, others won't. Those that don't agree with it shouldn't buy it, and those that do, will.

 

And honestly we can't compare impeding medical or technological advances by sticking our head in the sand to being fearful over a book with theological differences. I'm sure a Muslim would not want to buy a Muslim study guide from an author that is actually a devout Christian, would they? Doesn't mean they are afraid of knowledge, but why would they want to spend their time reading something that comes from an author with a completely different bent?

 

I'm probably not communicating properly, but I just wanted to say that I hope my post has not come across as combative. Religion and faith are certainly extremely personal and before anyone purchases materials that present such meaty issues everyone should research the source.

[Guest]

I think you are missing my point. When you publish a theological book, the author's theological stances should be taken into consideration. Some will agree with it, others won't. Those that don't agree with it shouldn't buy it, and those that do, will.

 

And honestly we can't compare impeding medical or technological advances by sticking our head in the sand to being fearful over a book with theological differences. I'm sure a Muslim would not want to buy a Muslim study guide from an author that is actually a devout Christian, would they? Doesn't mean they are afraid of knowledge, but why would they want to spend their time reading something that comes from an author with a completely different bent?

 

I'm probably not communicating properly, but I just wanted to say that I hope my post has not come across as combative. Religion and faith are certainly extremely personal and before anyone purchases materials that present such meaty issues everyone should research the source.

 

Is there a debate that the author is Christian? I think with your example you are comparing apples with oranges. As for the research that is something we do on our own I feel. I research books to find the author's background. This affects me and my decisions about a book or whatever else. I just don't see the point in coming here preaching to others what they should or shouldn't do when my decision is based on my own family's needs. Do we seem in need of rescuing? The majority of posters I have seen come on here these past few days don't care about finding out about what the author's background or stance is. They seem to care more about saving the rest of us.

Edited March 26, 2011 by Guest

[Guest]

I would love to know why this is now going on at night when there are no moderators. Anyway, it is 3:00am my time and I need to get some sleep.

[tiffanieh]

I would love to know why this is now going on at night when there are no moderators. Anyway, it is 3:00am my time and I need to get some sleep.

 

Why is there a need for a moderator? It seems like no one can have a civil conversation anymore without someone running to a moderator and asking for the thread to be put in time out!

 

We are all adults here, and for the sake of intellectual discussion, shouldn't all sides be discussed with civility and respect? I see nothing wrong in our discussions. It's a shame that only ONE side should be allowed to voice an opinion.

[ktgrok]

If Peter Enns doesn't believe that Genesis is literal, then why would he believe that the gospels are?

 

I've never met anyone that takes every single word of the Bible literally. Case in point, pretty much all of the people getting so upset about the importance of reading Genesis 100% literally are equally adamant about NOT reading "this is my body.....this is my blood...." literally. Go figure.

 

Believing that Jesus died for my sin, that I am saved by my belief in him does not require me to believe the Earth was created in 6 literal days. It has nothing to do with "not believing" the Bible, it has to do with believing that certain parts are written for different purposes. I know that some can't understand that, and I'm not asking you to. Just know that how you read Genesis has nothing to do with your salvation.

[Paisley Hedgehog]

Since this thread WILL get locked when the mods log in, I'd better share my .02 now.

 

I am astounded by the tone these boards have taken recently. I am OE and have almost been run off from the faith by the vehemence of YE'ers. And that's no exaggeration. Do the YE'ers not realize that their objections to THIS book are quite similar (though opposite) to the objections that OE'ers have had to Apologia & BJU for years ?!? Yet somehow, the OE'ers manage to find materials that fit their homeschools, to adapt curriculum to explain how they differ or agree with each individual's interpretation of the Bible.

 

If you don't want to use the Ennis book, fine. Don't use it. If you have questions, fine. Ask them. But flaming these boards with your personal convictions -- and attacking anyone who happens to disagree (including your board hostess & her company) -- is totally inappropriate.