To use a formal Reading Program or not... that is the question

[Annabel Lee]

Ugh. Lack of self-confidence, anxiety to make sure no stone is left unturned, the desire to make peace with inner naggings of "make sure we aren't missing anything" have led to the 2 boxes of BJU Reading curricula sitting here beside me. I planned to review them just to see if it's what I want to use in the fall (3rd & 5th grades by then), and return them if not.'

 

I'm supposed to be comparing these BJU texts to CLE's Reading scope & sequence right now, but my head is spinning.

 

Now I'm debating whether using a curriculum for reading is even the right path for my boys at all. I don't and won't give up their reading of real books. My idea was that hopefully I'd find a reading/lit. program that would be quick & painless that we could carry skills from to our real-book reading. Sort of a "learn it from BJU then practice on real lit." method. Something to replace my lack of literature knowledge. Now I see that trying to do both a curriculum & "do literature class" on real books would take up too much time.

 

If you used to use a formal reading program and left it, do you worry that you're missing all those literary terms & devices? If you don't use one at all, how do you know what to cover? I just can't imagine trying to piece together my own lit. program and include all the literary elements these programs do. I'd go crazy trying to hunt them all down and put them in logical order, and then still have the task of finding them in books we're reading. How do you do it on your own? Is there some middle-of-the-road solution?

 

Thanks, as always.

Edited March 5, 2011 by Annabel Lee

[Hunter]

For teaching literary terms the quickest way to teach them is to use picture books. Susan Hall wrote 4 volumes meant to guide the teacher in using picture books for older students.

 

Volume 2 is my favorite for getting started.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Using-Picture-Storybooks-Literary-Devices/dp/0897748492/ref=pd_sim_b_4

 

I now also use picture books to learn art terms too

 

http://www.amazon.com/Teaching-Books-Kids-Love-Award-Winning/dp/1555914063

 

Picture books are also a great way to celebrate the seasonal changes and holidays.

[micheller1]

I could have written the OP's question myself. I have not been able to find a lit program that doesn't draw battles and tears. But real-book reading just makes them happy as can be. AND they choose GREAT books!! But I constantly have that nagging feeling I'm missing something. I bought this -

http://www.amazon.com/Figuratively-Speaking-Gr-Learning-Works/dp/0881603171/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1299338195&sr=8-1

 

but I cannot figure a way to work it into our day or really use it. Even though it seems so straight forward....do I get the books it mentioned or not? do they read them? what?

 

I'm going to see if my local bookstore has the ones mentioned above.

Thanks a bunch!

[Ellie]

Once my dc knew how to read, I never used any sort of formal reading stuff (i.e., basal readers, workbooks, etc.), and they turned out just fine. They learned literary terms and whatnot when they were high school- and college-ages.

 

If this is causing you so much turmoil, then my vote is to send it back and let your dc read good books. Or so-so books. It's the reading that is important. And if there are specific books that you want them to enjoy that they might not pick up on their own, read those books aloud.

[Crimson Wife]

We are loving Figuratively Speaking so far (we've done the first 6 lessons). We are doing one lesson per week, reading & discussing what is in the lesson a la MCT and then DD does the exercises.

 

DD often chooses her free reading from books she's introduced to via FS, Killgallon, or MCT but I don't assign them unless they happen to correspond with what we're studying in history.

[Holly]

Have you looked at Drawn Into the Heart of Reading from Heart of Dakota? You can use your own books with the lesson plans. I'm planning on starting this next year with my oldest...I think. I keep debating just having her keep a book journal instead.

[Holly]

For teaching literary terms the quickest way to teach them is to use picture books. Susan Hall wrote 4 volumes meant to guide the teacher in using picture books for older students.

 

 

What a great idea! I have a bunch of FIAR guides just sitting on the shelf that would work for this too. I always loved the lit. lessons in the program, but it wasn't a good fit otherwise.

[Annabel Lee]

Thank you for helping me think this through. I spent 3+ hrs. yesterday evening carefully reading through the BJU Reading 5 (I'd already looked through Reading 3 earlier). I really like it for learning literary elements, the stories don't seem dull like another reading program I've seen, we could accomplish oral reading practice per TWTM using it, it reviews phonics & has vocab., and it has critical, open-ended thinking questions. Despite all that, I'm returning it. If I decide to go ahead & use a reading program, I'll buy it again over the summer. But this way, if I've found a way to be confident enough with what I really want to do (teach lit. on my own) by then, then I won't be stuck with this.

 

For now, I'll be digging into my copies of WEM (only got as far as chapter 1 previously) and Deconstructing Penguins. Before choosing to use this, I would want a closer comparison to CLE Reading, and also I need to look at using lit. guides, Teaching the Classics, and those Susan Hall books Hunter mentioned above (thanks!). I have Figuratively Speaking on my shelf - how's that for a laugh? I haven't been sure how to utilize it with real books. I looked at DITHOR awhile ago & can't remember why I didn't persue that... I was looking for something that teaches things like metaphor, simile, personification, antagonist, theme, plot, setting, mood, voice, etc. All of it. CLE seems to lean alot into identifying fallacious thinking and I've read it only takes 15-20 min. per day, where BJU takes 30 min.

 

*sigh* It's all going back on the shelf in my mind for awhile. I don't know if I want an hour (because it would be 30 min. x 2 kids) 4 days a week of "reading program" in my homeschool or not. It just might be what we need for some things. Then again, we're really enjoying our WTM lit. right now. I've learned that when you choose to fill your time with one thing you're making the choice NOT to fill it with all the other things. I can't just keep adding & adding to my kids' schedule. I also wouldn't quit WTM lit. Something would have to give somewhere... so we'll see.

[TracyR]

Okay so why aren't you going with CLE? I'm confused because you keep wanting to compare other curriculums to CLE. You really can't compare because they are all different curriculums that introduce differen things at different times.

[Annabel Lee]

Tracy, I have BJU here that I've been reading through, not CLE. I've only seen the online samples of CLE, so that's why I said that if I decide to go with a reading program, although I like this BJU Reading, I would want a closer comparison to CLE. Meaning, I'll be sure to read all of the CLE Reading thoroughly & takes notes at my local Curriculum Fair this year. If there wasn't that, and by summer I still felt like going w/ a reading program, I'd probably order some Light Units to see more of it before deciding.

 

I'd be comparing BJU Reading & CLE Reading w/ eachother; then comparing the idea of using something like those to the idea of using something very different, like TtC or doing it on my own WTM-style. I realize they all introduce different things at different times, which is why I look at the complete scope & sequence for each. I have to get familiar with what each will cover (or not) by the end (6th, 8th, or later) to find out what I like better.

 

If you think I've confused you, try being in my head with me! lol

[....]

Once my dc knew how to read, I never used any sort of formal reading stuff (i.e., basal readers, workbooks, etc.), and they turned out just fine. They learned literary terms and whatnot when they were high school- and college-ages.

 

If this is causing you so much turmoil, then my vote is to send it back and let your dc read good books. Or so-so books. It's the reading that is important. And if there are specific books that you want them to enjoy that they might not pick up on their own, read those books aloud.

 

:iagree: After searching and agonizing over the best reading program, I actually stopped using a reading program this year for my 9 yro and 8 yro. My 9 yro took the TAKS Reading test in January and only missed a couple of questions. :D

 

That dynamic duo is actually reading through the SL Core 3 Readers right now - and enjoying it! :lol:

[shanvan]

I use BJU Reading up to about 3rd-4th grade just for continued phonics practice, since the stories are reinforcing the phonics in the workbooks. We only use the workbooks sparingly. BUT, once my DC are reading well enough to begin chapter books I also have them reading them in addition to BJU Reading. And, we always have a family read aloud going which we discuss as we read. Often we discuss themes and literary elements used.

 

Around 3rd or 4th grade I drop BJU and switch to reading whole books and discussing. With DS I bought Teaching the Classics, only to find that most of what is recommended I was already doing naturally with the kids. I think because I was an English lit major and am just naturally inclined to analyze everything I read I have taught my kids a lot just from our read aloud discussions.

 

I do have my DS reading through Figuratively speaking and doing some of the assignments in the book. I can see he is gaining literary terms and applying them b/c of our discussions during nightly read alouds. He is constantly pointing out uses of the devices he learned. He does this out in public too when he sees how they apply. Younger DD seems to be picking up a lot just from our conversations.

 

Next year DS will use Windows to the World to help him apply knowledge of literary terms and learn how to write a literary analysis paper. He is currently using CLE 7 Reading, and while it is a thorough program, we feel it is somewhat stifling. Here is what I wrote about it in another thread.

 

The post below is addressing a question about LL vs CLE, so it doesn't address all of your questions, but here is my previous post which expresses some of the dislikes we have about CLE...

 

I find it to be right on target, not too advanced--though I've heard it described that way. I like the inclusion of literary devices and logical fallacies and there are some thought provoking questions.

 

Both my son and I find it tedious. I think it has a way of sucking the life out of reading--but that may be related to the way we use it (mostly independent w/ some discussion). There are also times when I either disagree with conclusions they draw from the material, or think their view is slightly slanted. I also worry about the answer key which does not really allow for much individual interpretation which programs like LL, TOG, and Teaching the Classics encourage.

 

We are going to finish it, because of the content that I like and because it does make for a somewhat independent curriculum (which I need right now so I can work w/ DD). However, DS and I enjoyed LL7 sooooo much more. I don't know if I will repeat it with DD. I don't know that I would say CLE encourages a love for reading, DS can't wait to go back to just reading whole books.

 

About writing, so far we haven't hit much writing in CLE at all. LL7 had a good amount--enough that DS was writing about each book, but could still handle other writing assignments.

 

This has been our experience, for what it's worth. I think CLE might work better if I had more time to devote to discussion, but still we would end up preferring LL.

 

Taking everything said above into consideration, I do think that for a parent who really needs hand holding both CLE and BJU are very good reading/literature programs. We just don't see the need to continue with them.

 

Shannon

[Annabel Lee]

Thanks, Shannon, that is very helpful. I can see how if you already have all that English lit major knowledge under your belt, it would be a breeze. I had a bare minimum (or possibly less) exposure to literary terms & devices and probably couldn't even list all of them. I've never discussed them w/ my kids at all. The extent of our literature discussions has been fiction vs. nonfiction, biography, author, autobiography, and rhyme in poetry. Now that I've been reading through some of these materials it's coming back to me. I just don't know how I'd do it without at least a list of terms with descriptions of them to check off. I don't know if simply pointing them out during reading of whole books would be enough for the kids to remember them.

 

Funny thing, you stop BJU Reading at 3rd-4th, and my kiddos will be 3rd & 5th next year when I'm looking at starting it, but then, they've never had any of this. I've got my work cut out for me (educating myself & researching curricula).