Help with a new (to us) dog - before she meets an ugly end! (warning:long)

[Janna]

We received a 1yo Cavachon (Cavalier King Charles/Bichon Frise mix) in April from some friends of ours who got her from a breeder when she was a pup. They heard we were looking specifically for a Cavachon and they were looking for a home for her because they could no longer "deal" with her. They both worked full time which meant she was crated all day. When she was let out after they got home, she would chew holes into the carpet and other things and not respond to the training they had given her through Pets Mart. They also said she was "flighty", in that she would bark at and chase anything that moved, even a butterfly. In my mind, I thought her behaviors would easily be corrected because we are home all the time, she wouldn't be crated much at all, and we would give her lots of play, attention and exercise.

 

I was wrong.

 

At the house we lived at when we brought her home for the first time, we had LOTS of geese. Especially in the summer when they were molting. This would drive Daisy (our dog) absolutely nuts. She would scratch at the door and chew the wood blinds on the door to get out so she could chase the geese. We would put her on her stake but she could never get to them. We learned fast that if we let her out without being on a leash she would run and not come back when called. And, if you chased her, she thought it was a game. She would run across the street with no sense about oncoming cars, she would go into the woods with no sense of how to get out. It was exhausting, so we got her a stake.

 

In Aug. we moved. We still have some geese, but more than anything we have lots of little birds. The previous owners had lots of landscape and gardening areas to lure birds. This drives Daisy up the wall. She spends her day barking at them, scratching like crazy at the door, AND, we have a screened in porch in which she has scratched holes in every single screen trying to get at those birds (there is a giant rose bush growing up a trellis against one side of screen that the birds particularly like to settle).

 

We took her back to Pets Mart for puppy training so *I* could see how to do it (having never been a dog owner before) and to reiterate what she had forgotten. It has helped a little in that she will follow basic commands (unless strangers are here in which she ignores every known command, or if she's outside she will ignore "come, Daisy!"), but mostly I thought the training at Pets Mart was kinda dumb (no offense to anyone who loves it).:D

 

We exercise her a ton - in the summer and fall she would get multiple walks a day and on days when she was especially "spunky" I would ride my bike with her so she had to run fast which she *loves*.

 

But now it's winter. It's cold and now we're getting snow. We don't have a treadmill or anything for her to run on inside, but we do have a floorplan that is conducive to throwing balls for her to retrieve or the kids will play "chase" with her a lot. We do this with her everyday, multiple times a day. But it doesn't seem to be helping. She will still bark like crazy to go outside (if she sees even a dry leaf blowing around she whines and barks for it. If she *is* outside on her stake she will sit and bark and bark and bark at :confused::confused::confused:. If she's inside and someone is going for a walk she will run to the door and bark and bark. She's driving me nuts.

 

She also will jump up on people when they come over, ignoring all commands. So we have started putting her in the laundry room when people come over just to avoid that scene. But then she whines the whole time they're here and it's annoying. Oh! And she begs at the dinner table (I have a 2 yr old who loves to "feed" her and she's learned quickly to sit only by him) and has recently become more daring by trying to jump on his lap during mealtimes.

 

She's out of control and I don't know how that happened or what to do. I have watched both Victoria and Caesar (I prefer Caesar), and have read all of Caesar's books. I know that exercise is the key, but even when she got so much during the summer she was still this way. She has become worse as of late due to inclement weather, but what are we to do? If we could afford a fence (wooden or invisible) I think that would be most helpful so she could run all over the yard instead of the 50ft radius she has, but that's not an option right now.

 

I'm so confused because she gets constant attention (playing with the kids, lots of petting [when she's calm she's a great lapdog] and accolades) - *way* more than she did with her previous owners. So why does she still behave this way? Btw, she'll be 2yo in February. If that even makes a difference.

 

Help?

[Remudamom]

Dogs aren't my area, but I wonder if she'll calm down when she gets a bit older? Our two breeds are notorious for trouble making if they don't have enough exercise but that's not a problem on a ranch.

 

I wonder what tomato staking would do for a dog? Zap collar for too much barking?? although I'd hate to put one on a puppy, and I think she's still a puppy.

[Sweet Charlotte]

We got a Husky as a new puppy 11 years ago. She is a beautiful, smart very friendly and social dog. However, we soon determined that the temperment and habits of Huskies are not a good match for our family. Fast forward to now, she is such a burden. She gets out almost weekly, digs holes, gets in the bathroom trash...we have to keep her in the bathroom at night or when we leave because she started peeing on the living room floor.

 

I absolutely know that we did not and don't meet her needs as a social and very active dog. I feel guilty about all that, yet she just has worn down all feelings of warmth and affection. I think that she would be happier in a different family who was a better fit, but she is 11. How many years does she have left? And I can't just dump her at a shelter. A lot of this is because I have not been a good steward, kwim?

 

Anyway, my thoughts for you are--some of your dog's issues she may grow out of, but some may just be part of her temperment and personality. There may be no measure of training that will "cure" her. Get out before it's too late--while she is still young and can have a long life with a family that is a better fit. And while your kids are still young. I feel like the last 11 years with our dog have sorta been "wasted" because all of my kids memories of the family dog will be that she was a nuisance and a source of stress. That makes me sad.

 

Edited to add--we did put our dog thru training at "Man's Best Friend" for quite the chunk of change. It worked to a small degree, but her wanderlust and curiosity was/is just too strong.

HTH.

 

Kim

Edited December 4, 2010 by Sweet Charlotte
typo

[Mom-ninja.]

First, she is very young. She needs a strong handler.

 

I paid a nice chuck of change to hire a dog trainer. The term dog trainer is a misnomer because he trained *me* on how to train dogs. It was worth every single penny.

 

I suggest looking for a really good trainer that will spend time with you and your dog. I don't think the Petsmart class was enough.

 

If you can afford it check out Bark Busters. I have never heard of someone using them and it not solving their dog behavior issues.

 

Call around to local vets and ask for a reputable dog trainer. Call some rescue organizations and ask them.

 

Good luck.

 

 

ETA: Do you have a crate? If not get one...today.

Edited December 4, 2010 by Kleine Hexe

[Jean in Newcastle]

A couple of things come to mind.

 

1. She's a bird dog. That's what spaniels are. I have 2 English Springer Spaniels - they are bred to want to get those birds! So even if she's a mix, the spaniel part of her seems to be strong.:)

 

2. My spaniel - who will not come and thinks running after him is a game, does best if we can go to a fenced dog park or a huge natural area where he can run and run off leash. Once he's tired, then he will come.

 

3. Age does make a huge difference.

 

4. Do you have a fenced yard? I'm not fond of staking - esp. in an active dog. Oops - I just saw where you addressed that.

 

5. Crate her at specific times - meal times, and when visitors come. Give her a new bone or something to do in there (like one of those kongs where you can hide a treat inside) so that she doesn't whine.

 

6. She sounds a lot like my older Springer. We say he has puppy ADHD.

[jazzyfizzle]

I debating on responding because I knew I would want to speak my piece about *designer* :glare: :cursing: mixed breeds. But I will go ahead and speak while severely controlling myself. :tongue_smilie:

 

 

I would eliminate her access or view to the screened porch area by the use of expandable gates/baby gates if possible. This would help give you a breather on this issue until you can hopefully work out a solution.

 

Have you ever tried clicker training? If you have not, this is a method where the dog is rewarded for good or desired behavior. You begin by just clicking -then treating with a super yummy treat. (no dry or boring treats- it needs to be viewed as 'high value' by the dog)

 

After a little while of this you will start to see the dog turn to you or come to you when it hears the clicker, showing evidence that it knows the treat is coming. It has learned to associate the sound of the click with the food reward. You always treat after any click, even if you click by accident.

 

Then you move forward to clicking when you see desired behavior. If the dog happens to be lying quietly while you watch TV, click and treat. At first the dog is like-'on that was nice and unexpected' :tongue_smilie:, then after a few times the dog thinks- 'hmmm she keeps clicking when I am lying quietly,mmmm'. Soon the dog starts to offer the desired behavior before you click. At first you click immediately, then you add in variables- length of time lying quietly before the click, place the dog is lying quietly, ect.

 

Over time, you can work on as many behaviors as you want, and add in a cue- the command. You add the command after the dog is offering the behavior often.

 

Another method that my herding trainer taught me for a super barky sheltie while herding (I can't stand this- I want pretty much silent herding) is such a simple method I never would have thought would work, had I not watched it in action, and then used it.

Ok- the dog is doing an annoying behavior- in my case- running around the pasture annoyingly barking while herding. In your case- yapping crazily at birds or going in circles.

While the dog is in the action of this behavior- walk straight toward the dog. Do not act intimidating in your demeanor in any way. Do not speak. Do not frown/scowl, anything. Walk up normally. Walk toward the dog until it stops this behavior and looks at you. As soon as the dog 'gives' immediately walk backwards, smiling. You can have the choice of not speaking- using only body language (dogs read body language very well- it is their method of communication), or you can give a one syllable praise- 'Good!' quietly.

This takes some work. There is no negativity involved, (unless you call acting the alpha part a negative -which I do not, when it doesn't involve any kind of punishment for the dog) you never speak or act as if the dog is in trouble while you are coming foward. Keep repeating. As soon as the dog starts barking again- repeat. You may have to step toward the dog even while you are very close to them, before it tears attention away from the object (birds in your case). Make sure you never step on the toes or push the dog. Just step forward- this is sort of showing your displeasure as the alpha b*tch :D and in dogspeak saying- I am alpha and I am displeased :coolgleamA:.

Keep repeating this action, it takes a bit of time, but it has worked every time for us- even out in a huge pasture where I would have to trudge down the dog all over the field because she knew what was happening. Very soon I had a blissfully silent! dog working beautifully.

We had to repeat this excercise as we moved from each area- from inside the barn, to a small pen, to a pasture. Each time we had to show her that the same rule applied. You would likely have to do the same for each area or room. It is such a simple activity and it works if worked on.

 

I would second the suggestion of using a crate when you need a break or have company for now. You can do these behaviors with barking at visitors in the same fashion.

 

Some breeds are naturally inclined to bark at birds, ours included.

[Willow]

Jazzyfizzle, thank you for your response, even though i am not the original poster.

 

I have a 5 month old pup, and training is hard hard hard work. I don't think people (certainly ME) realise just how hard it can be to train a dog to fit in with your family and way of life. Our pup is not designer, but she is a shelter mix. She never actually lived at the shelter, but came to us from the foster home at aprox 8 weeks. We have worked so hard at calm behavior, but she barks and barks, so i will try your suggestion. Thank you.

 

When we were looking for dogs I went around the pet shops and every. single. puppy. was a mix breed. Mostly poodle or spaniel cross. I did some research on designer dogs and discovered they do seem to come with problems, although i don't know why.

 

I worry about this because my dog is also a mix. She came from the shelter, but they knew the background. Single older man who did not get his young ***** spayed in time. She had the pups at home and the shelter helped rehome them. She is a collie crossed with an unknown father (but probably a lab by looks) She is lively (she is a pup) but gentle and loving and seems to be easy to train. I didn't know what to do about the barking so i am pleased to learn that.

 

She does take far more time than i thought possible however. Two very long walks a day come rain or shine (I often drive to the beach) plus training time every day (we are working on come!!!!!) I think I give about 3 hours a day to the dog myself in addition to input from others (my kids are teenagers/adults) People tell me it gets easier when they are 2 years old....

I have not tried clicker training. I will look into that. Does it work if you forget your clicker and have to give just the voice command?

Edited December 5, 2010 by Willow

[annlaura]

Wow. I'm going to have to try the walk-toward for barking. My sweetie girl is a 1yo beagle/most-likely-sheltie mix, and sometimes she gets to barking outside. I have always made her sit and lie, then release, but it takes an awful lot of effort sometimes. This sounds much simpler which is good for me and the dog.

 

To the OP, :grouphug:. Dog training is lots and lots of work. FWIW, I don't think there are many, if any, dogs who will come to you if you're chasing them. Especially young dogs. It is difficult, but not impossible, to have a dog without a fenced yard. But I think she may need somewhere where she can just run free to truly get her energy out. Is there a fenced dog park near you? If not, maybe a massive field? You can do "come" training with a super-long leash, 50 ft even, gradually building reliability. My dog has also learned to sit by the highchair. Maybe yours needs to be crated during dinner. I don't always crate my girl during dinner, but if we're eating something she shouldn't have or if she's being too bouncy, she gets crated. I suppose it is possible that the trainer at your petsmart is great, but I agree with others about asking for a quality trainer referral from your vet. Do think about whether this is the dog for you. If you are willing to tough it out and put in the work, there is plenty of hope. All of my mom's dogs have been 1-2yo rescues when she got them. Some had difficult issues that took a year or more to resolve, but they have all resolved and been wonderful dogs. It frequently gets easier at 2yo, but only if you continue very consistent training. Good luck!

[Stacy in NJ]

normally looses control. When she runs over to the window/door to bark at the birds, pull out the bottle, squirt her in the fact and say "NO. Quiet." Lather, rinse, repeat. Do this when someone goes out the door and she barks, or when someone comes to your home.

 

Also, if she's not too nervous, a old, empty soda can with a few loose coins inside can be used as a shaker. When she barks at the door, shake the can and repeat the no command. Try to distract her with treats after you've either squirted her or shook the can at her.

 

You're just strongly letting her know her behavior is inappropriate and you won't tolerate it.

 

I haven't read the other replies, so sorry if I'm repeating what others may have said already.

[astrid]

I debating on responding because I knew I would want to speak my piece about *designer* :glare: :cursing: mixed breeds. But I will go ahead and speak while severely controlling myself. :tongue_smilie:.

 

:iagree::glare:

 

I second JF's recommendation of clicker-training. While exercise is good, she may be getting confused on appropriate "house" behavior because your dc, in an effort to exercise her, are frequently getting her jazzed in the house. If you don't want her to run and bark and act crazy in the house, don't encourage and reinforce that behavior.

 

Also, I'd do lots of training with her, using a clicker. Mental activity is as exhausting (sometimes more so) for dogs than physical activity.

 

Consistency is key--- she's GOT to respect YOUR rules, but you have to set her up to succeed. Don't encourage her to get into a frenzy of barking in the house when playing and then get upset when she opts to behave that way on her own volition.

 

Good luck--- IMHO, everyone thinks little dogs are "so much easier" than big dogs. Give me one of my working dogs any day. Those little guys have SO much energy, and often have very short attention spans!

 

astrid

[laundrycrisis]

My rat terrier was absolutely wild until she was 4 years old. She did become a wonderful dog, after a 3-month intensive training program.

 

If you are committed to the dog, I would find a true professional trainer, and spend the money and time and effort to work her through an obedience program. When we were going through the program, our dogs were either crated or on a short leash with us at home at all times, or loose in our fenced yard. It was a lot of work to go through the program but it made a huge difference.

 

I also think that if you cannot get your yard fenced, this dog would probably be better off in another home.

 

For in the house, we use baby gates to keep our dogs confined to a room near us, where they can hear and see us and move around freely in that room, for all the times when we cannot pay close attention to them. Only one of our three dogs is calm enough to be out of the room unsupervised, so the others are not loose unless we can keep up with their behavior. But they are not crated either. It works well. We are not driven nuts with behaviors we can't stay on top of, but they are not locked in a crate or separated from us.

[Lakeside]

 

Also, I'd do lots of training with her, using a clicker. Mental activity is as exhausting (sometimes more so) for dogs than physical activity.

 

 

Are there any books or resources you recommend that explain how to use the clicker method?

[Bird Girl]

There's an excellent book by Jean Donaldson called The Culture Clash. It covers, in extensive detail, the clicker (or behaviorist) method. I highly recommend it for anyone who's having issues with their dog.

 

There's a lot to be said, though, for a few sessions with a good trainer. They can give you coaching and tell you what not to do just by observing.

 

I will say that Cesar's method, which is based largely on pack-relationship training is probably not the best method for dealing with a small and flighty dog. I would recommend Cesar's method as a general way of being around larger or pushier dogs, but it's entirely possible that your little featherbrain is totally unaware that you are giving her discipline cues.

 

One thing that you can do immediately is to buy her four or five Kong toys and stop feeding her out of her bowl. Stuff all her food into the Kongs, and dispense them throughout the day. You can stuff the core with kibble, then block the hole with a bone-shaped treat that makes her really work the stuff out. Part of the reason that she barks is because she's bored, and if you can spread dinner time out from a five-minute gulp-it-out-of-the-bowl activity into several longer chewy times, it may take the edge off her boredom. You can crate her when you have visitors, and only let her out of the crate once everyone's inside, and the excitement of arrival has settled down a little.

 

Some dogs bark a lot. Shelties are the most notorious, but spaniels can definitely give them a yap for their money. It's controversial, but some caring and kind dog owners think nothing of having their dogs debarked. You may wish to ask your vet. There are anti-barking collars that give a squirt of citronella or a mild shock to a barking pet, but I wouldn't try either of those without help from a trainer--they can make the situation worse if you use them inappropriately.

[jazzyfizzle]

Jazzyfizzle, thank you for your response, even though i am not the original poster.

 

I have a 5 month old pup, and training is hard hard hard work. I don't think people (certainly ME) realise just how hard it can be to train a dog to fit in with your family and way of life. Our pup is not designer, but she is a shelter mix. She never actually lived at the shelter, but came to us from the foster home at aprox 8 weeks. We have worked so hard at calm behavior, but she barks and barks, so i will try your suggestion. Thank you.

 

When we were looking for dogs I went around the pet shops and every. single. puppy. was a mix breed. Mostly poodle or spaniel cross. I did some research on designer dogs and discovered they do seem to come with problems, although i don't know why.

 

I worry about this because my dog is also a mix. She came from the shelter, but they knew the background. Single older man who did not get his young ***** spayed in time. She had the pups at home and the shelter helped rehome them. She is a collie crossed with an unknown father (but probably a lab by looks) She is lively (she is a pup) but gentle and loving and seems to be easy to train. I didn't know what to do about the barking so i am pleased to learn that.

 

She does take far more time than i thought possible however. Two very long walks a day come rain or shine (I often drive to the beach) plus training time every day (we are working on come!!!!!) I think I give about 3 hours a day to the dog myself in addition to input from others (my kids are teenagers/adults) People tell me it gets easier when they are 2 years old....

I have not tried clicker training. I will look into that. Does it work if you forget your clicker and have to give just the voice command?

 

 

Hello Willow, you are very welcome, I hope it helps. *sigh* yes, our herding breeds can love to bark.

Later on in the game you can stop using the clicker once the command and behavior is solid. You won't need the clicker forever. If you want to add in something new later on, you can begin that activity with the clicker.

 

With coming, make that an exciting, happy experience for the dog, clapping, smiling, jumping up and down, woo hoo time. You can also treat for the dog coming, even if the come was 'slow'.

There is a round robin type activity- each family member sits apart with treats and takes turns calling the dog, treating the dog, then the next person calls and treats, using again the overly happy demeanor.

 

Our issue with "designer" dogs is that they are deliberate crosses of purebreds with a sole desired outcome to make the almighty dollar. They are not crosses created for a reason or need, only to line someone's pocket. Most of these people doing the crossing are certainly not experienced or experts in either breed, they buy two kinds of dogs and slap a made up name on it.

 

Keep me posted how it goes!

[jazzyfizzle]

Wow. I'm going to have to try the walk-toward for barking. My sweetie girl is a 1yo beagle/most-likely-sheltie mix, and sometimes she gets to barking outside. I have always made her sit and lie, then release, but it takes an awful lot of effort sometimes. This sounds much simpler which is good for me and the dog.

 

QUOTE]

 

Hi Annlaura, I hope it works for you. It is not an instant fix but as worked very well for us. It is pretty much what you have already been doing but much easier. Had I not watched it in action, I would never have thought that remedy would fix our issue.

 

Good luck!

[jazzyfizzle]

Are there any books or resources you recommend that explain how to use the clicker method?

 

A couple I liked were- Clicker Training for Obedience by Morgan Spector and Don't Shoot the Dog by Karen Pryor.

 

http://www.clickertraining.com/basics