Need advice on guiding ds towards quality music for electric guitar (CC)

[PineFarmMom]

12yo Ds is really gifted in this area. He's spent a couple of years playing guitar and has moved on to electric and is to the point of blowing people away with his abilities. I was into hard rock in the 80s and while I can appreciate the giftings of Eddy Van Halen and Stevie Ray Vahn, other than listening and learning from their abilities, I'm really wanting to guide him away from being majorly influenced by that type of music. It's hard because the ex-rocker in me just loves all of that!!! ;) We're trying to encourage him to use the gifts God gave him for God's purposes but also trying to do it in a balanced way without being so strict on the issue that we drive him in the opposite direction, if you kwim. At this point, he seems to appreciate some of that music just for the skill involved.

 

One thing we'd like is for him to learn some Christian music, but from other people whose opinions we trust and from ds, we're seeing that much of it is just repeating chords and not as skill building as would be helpful. Any opinions from musical people or those with kids with this leaning on how to guide this in a positive direction and away from, well, Metallica?? ;)

[Wendi]

Whoa! I can so relate to your post! My ds13 is taking guitar lessons (still using acoustic; we'll probably buy him an electric guitar later this year). He loves heavy metal, including Metallica. There are some Christian metal bands he likes, if that would help. They are: Skillet, The Devil Wears Prada (not specifically Christian lyrics, but the members are all Christians), Demon Hunter, and As I Lay Dying. My favorite of these is Skillet; they have the heavy metal instrumentals, but you can actually understand the lyrics and appreciate the melody. (I can't stand the ones where they're just screaming! But that's just me.)

 

We have to leave for church. I'll talk to ds and check back on this thread later.

 

Wendi

[Teachaheart]

Phil Keaggy is recognized as a top-notch guitarist and is a Christian. Check out this youtube video:

 

[catalinakel]

This may be urban myth, but I am pretty sure that many musicians who have excelled in rock music received a classical music education, which is part of what allowed them to excel. I have a Christian friend who is amazing on guitar, and particularly loves rock, but he can also play classically and is quite adept. I'd maybe require him to get classical training for a specific amount of time from a really amazing teacher.....that's what I'd do.

[mrs.m]

What about joining the band for the youth ministry? Our church has one and it rocks! LOL! :D He may only be playing chords but part of the big picture is playing with others and not just soloing.

[PineFarmMom]

This may be urban myth, but I am pretty sure that many musicians who have excelled in rock music received a classical music education, which is part of what allowed them to excel. I have a Christian friend who is amazing on guitar, and particularly loves rock, but he can also play classically and is quite adept. I'd maybe require him to get classical training for a specific amount of time from a really amazing teacher.....that's what I'd do.

 

 

You know, that's a good point. We're fairly limited here in our location, but the first piece ds learned to play on his electric was a classical piece, canon in d. I've been encouraging "Summer", which is another one that he found as a tutorial on YouTube. His guitar teacher is more blues in style, but again, in our area we are limited!!

[PineFarmMom]

What about joining the band for the youth ministry? Our church has one and it rocks! LOL! :D He may only be playing chords but part of the big picture is playing with others and not just soloing.

 

We're going that direction, he just isn't old enough for it yet.

 

I really want him to learn to play Carol of the Bells before next Christmas. I may need to be more proactive in getting him to learn classical pieces for the moment, then he can do the youth band when he gets into that age range.

[PineFarmMom]

Phil Keaggy is recognized as a top-notch guitarist and is a Christian. Check out this youtube video:

 

 

He is good!! I'll show ds!

[PineFarmMom]

Whoa! I can so relate to your post! My ds13 is taking guitar lessons (still using acoustic; we'll probably buy him an electric guitar later this year). He loves heavy metal, including Metallica. There are some Christian metal bands he likes, if that would help. They are: Skillet, The Devil Wears Prada (not specifically Christian lyrics, but the members are all Christians), Demon Hunter, and As I Lay Dying. My favorite of these is Skillet; they have the heavy metal instrumentals, but you can actually understand the lyrics and appreciate the melody. (I can't stand the ones where they're just screaming! But that's just me.)

 

We have to leave for church. I'll talk to ds and check back on this thread later.

 

Wendi

 

Ds does like Skillet. I'll look into the other bands you're talking about. I'm more of a Lincoln Brewster, Casting Crowns lover, but I don't know if that involves much more that chords. I'll encourage him to go more the Skillet route as well!!

[lllll]

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[mcconnellboys]

I have a very guitar-involved teen, as well. I'd steer him toward classical guitar! Lots of the great rock guys play classical!

[StephanieZ]

FWIW, my ds10 started classical guitar at 6. Got an acoustic (folk) guitar on his last b'day, and an electric for Christmas this year. So, now he has 3.

 

:)

 

Short story: Classical guitar provides such a phenomenal foundation that it is a cinch to pick up any other style. If he wants a real future in guitar, learning classical will be a huge step ahead.

 

Longer story: I hesitate to say a lot about ds10's skills (which I credit to his great Suzuki guitar teacher and ds's own passion for guitar) b/c it will just sound like I am a braggart. (He is a phenom.) If you want more details, PM me and I will answer your questions off-list.

[Old Dominion Heather]

What about The Edge? U2 is classic and not dark. He and some other guitarists just did a documentary about the electric guitar called "It Might Get Loud" that we got from Netflix. It was excellent.

[mcconnellboys]

And I also meant to say that when we used to go to San Antonio, we saw many Spanish players who were just phenomenal on classical guitar. There is some really, really wonderful Spanish music out there that is not too fuddy-duddy at all for a teen. That is, I believe he would really enjoy the music as much as rock.

[catalinakel]

Our now 25yos said he would write a blurb for your thread. He taught himself to play the guitar (unbeknownst to us) by listening to old blues on CD's outside in our shop. I don't like modern Christian music, so I never looked for that. I did try to find things like Bach for guitar. And here he is to offer his own suggetions ...

 

This is not just for Texas T. It's for all parents with sons (or daughters) wanting to learn the guitar, electric particularly.

 

Firstly, make your son begin with an accoustic guitar. This will impress upon him that you make music with guitars, not noise. If he objects, point out to him that most electric guitarists began with accoustic guitars, including the greatest guitarist (Jimi Hendrix, as rated by Rolling Stone magazine and most electric guitarists, including moi). I got an electric guitar first, and I think it was a mistake. Not because I disapprove of the noise, but because I wound up playing it unplugged most of the time. It was too much trouble to plug it up, and when you can't play very well you don't exactly want to amplify it, do you? :001_smile:

 

Once he has learned to play the guitar, give him the option of getting an electric. A good compromise would be to get him a hybrid, an accoustic with an electric hookup, because then he has an option (and he'll choose to play accoustic most of the time, I guarantee it).

 

Secondly, guide your son to GOOD guitar music. Heavy metal is not good guitar music; it might be creative noise, but if you shut off the amplifiers and distortion, it's just childish strumming or whiny bending of strings. Over the years I have discovered good guitarists on my own. The best are the accoustic bluesmen: Leadbelly (Huddie Leadbetter), Robert Johnson (origin of nearly all rock music), Mississippi John Hurt, Blind (Arthur) Blake, Gary Davis (mostly gospel), Charlie Patton, Son House, Jesse Fuller, etc. (You can find most of this music free on ARCHIVE.ORG, although John Hurt is listed as John Hunt. Do Google and Yahoo searches, too.) There are also old time musicians (like the original Carter Family) who were excellent accoustic guitarists. There are countless bluegrass guitarists, living and dead, but the best are probably Norman Blake and Doc Watson.

 

The reason I am guiding you toward accoustic music is that your son has probably not heard much of it, and that's signifigant because rock music came from the accoustic blues. The electric bluesmen got their music from the accoustic bluesmen. Robert Johnson is the godfather, so to say, as his music made its way through Muddy Waters, Howlin' Wolf, and John Lee Hooker to The Rolling Stones (got their name from Muddy Waters' song "Rolling Stone"), Jimi Hendrix, Eric Clapton, SRV, and Led Zeppelin (they stole some of Robert Johnson's words and plenty of Howlin' Wolf's riffs, much to the Wolf's displeasure). Impress upon your son the artistry involved in what eventually led to rock, pop, country, R&B, and bluegrass (all have origins in African-American accoustic blues).

 

Furthermore, most of the accoustic blues sheet music is posted somewhere online (Google or Yahoo it). I found it all over the place (most of it is in TAB form, which your son ought to recognize). Notice, then, that your son can listen to and play all of the best accoustic blues for free, with internet access (which you obviously have). CD's and sheet music are ridiculously pricey. I wish I had known about these resources sooner.

 

Thirdly, I wouldn't even try to come up with a hybrid of rock and gospel. To me, its an oxymoron. Rock music is rebellious, fleshly, fantastic, drug-addled, angry, uncontrolled...Even the name Rock and Roll is a euphemism for sex (bet you didn't know that!). It's like trying to make sure you watch only Christian TV and Movies: you would have to toss out The Wizard of Oz, E.T., Walt Disney, Bugs Bunny, even Shakespeare. In art, you would throw out daVinci, Michelangeo, Monet, Rembrandt, van Gough. In classical music, out goes Beethoven, Mozart, Liszt, Bizet, Rossini. Get the point yet? Out go the best. Nearly all of the most brilliant artists were godless. So ignore the human source. Instead, I studied the guitar work for its own merit. Music is an art. Appreciate art for art's sake, the beauty God created. I nearly always ignore the words of music unless they're creative, humorous, Christian, or poetic. (Most recently I have begun listening to Gaelic music.) My favorite song to this day is "Hey Joe" by Hendrix. It's about adultery and murder, but I never cared; the guitar playing is brilliant. I also like his song "Voodoo Child." Even considering the lyrics, I think it's more godly to listen to Hendrix than a heavy metal band screeching out 'Christian' songs that feature theologically dubious lyrics. Object to the lyrics of Hey Joe? Then we're back to the argument of ditching Shakespeare (plenty of immorality and murder and suicide in THOSE plays), Bizet (have you ever read the Carmen story?), Liszt (wrote many of his songs for women he was having affairs with), most art, as well as pretty much all poetry and motion pictures. (However, I don't listen if it includes profanity.) If you want gospel music, get good gospel music that's sung in a godly spirit. (A brilliant gospel guitar album is Doc Watson's "On Praying Ground.")

 

I don't know if my advice is going to be entirely relevant because I really only like ONE rock guitarist: Jimi Hendrix. I loath '70's and '80's music. I've always thought of it as the hangover of the '60's. Most electric guitarists agree that Hendrix' contemporaries and successors are all inferior immitations. (Eric Clapton locked himself in a room for a year to master the electric guitar, and when he came out he heard Hendrix' "Voodoo Child (Slight Return)" and almost gave up his trade altogether. SRV recorded more versions of Hendrix' "Little Wing" than Hendrix did, and never improved upon it.) Hendrix has always struck me as a sort of mad genius who in three years (died of drugs, the idiot:banghead:) did what no other electric guitarist has been able to manage in his entire career. Also, he wasn't obsessed with the distortion and violence that mark pretty much all rock music. Some of his songs remind me of classical songs (he actually said he listened to a lot of Bach and Beethoven). I would never live like him, I would never write lyrics like he wrote, but if I could, I wouldn't mind playing exactly like him. It's the only reason I took up guitar playing to begin with.

 

Also, don't think that your son who loves rock is a lost cause. I listen to a lot of music with my dad in the car. When I discovered his utter ignorance of accoustic bluesmen, I undertook to educate him, and one of the first artists I got him to listen to was the gentle genius Mississippi John Hurt. My dad loved Hurt's music. He also liked Robert Johnson. (In fact, most of what I have given him so far he likes.) This is a man who loves bands like Led Zeppelin, The Who, James Gang, Talking Heads, Lynard Skynard, Alice Cooper, The Rolling Stones, SRV, and The Beatles.

 

By this time, as with most of my writings, I have forgotten exactly what advice you were asking, and exaclty why I'm writing. So I'll post this and hope someone out there can make sense out of it.

 

Aaannnnd... that was probably more than you ever wanted to know ;); but I'll put it up here anyway. HTH, Kathy

 

Love this look into the mind of your son.....love it! Thanks for sharing. Music is art....exactly.

[lisabees]

Kathy - what a well, written post by your ds! You should be so proud! :001_smile:

 

No advice for the OP, as I am not a musician. But, dh is an amazing guitar player, with a BA in Music, specializing in Jazz Guitar and studying under Pat Martino. Now, he has become obsessed with Blues, because there are actually opportunities for a middle-aged man to play in our area! :lol:

 

My kids have grown up with all kinds of music. Classical, Blues, Jazz, rock, alternative. A good guitar player is a good guitar player is a good guitar player. I encourage you to let your son listen to BB King, Carlos Santana, Stevie Ray Vaughan, Joe Satriani, Steve Vai, Yngwie Malmsteen, Eric Johnson, Pat Metheny, Allan Holdsworth, the list goes on. There are so many and each has a special tone or quality to appreciate. If dh or ds were here, I'd ask for their expert opinion.

 

One thing about guitar players - they know all of the great players and LOVE to talk about them in social settings. They cannot stop. And each of those great players will teach your son along the way.

 

Enjoy the beautiful music. And I hope your son enjoys his journey.

[ereks mom]

What about joining the band for the youth ministry? Our church has one and it rocks! LOL! :D He may only be playing chords but part of the big picture is playing with others and not just soloing.

 

ER plays both acoustic and electric (loves electric best) and also a little bass. He also plays piano and is a voice major in college. He got his start in music by taking music & theory lessons beginning around age 9, and around age 12 he decided to become a guitarist. He started off playing with the praise band at church. They played in a "Battle of the (Praise) Bands" a few years later, and while they didn't win, they enjoyed themselves tremendously. Playing with a group of musicians was probably one of the best learning experiences, musically speaking, that ER ever had. Since then, he has been asked to play at many, many churches, retreats, revivals, mission trips, and youth events. He is currently the guitarist for his college's praise band.

[Ibbygirl]

Joe Satriani, Brett Garsed, Shawn Lane, Guthrie Govan. They're all instrumental guitarists so you don't have to worry about any objectionable lyrics and all of them have mad skills and play interesting music with nice phrasings and in the case of Satriani (my personal fav) he pulls out so many tricks out of his bag you could study him for years and still have tons to learn. Also Steve Vai is a good guitarist. His music isn't my personal favorite, but there's no doubt that he's got chops. Lots of luck to your son. Electrics are a blast to play. :)

[PineFarmMom]

 

My kids have grown up with all kinds of music. Classical, Blues, Jazz, rock, alternative. A good guitar player is a good guitar player is a good guitar player. I encourage you to let your son listen to BB King, Carlos Santana, Stevie Ray Vaughan, Joe Satriani, Steve Vai, Yngwie Malmsteen, Eric Johnson, Pat Metheny, Allan Holdsworth, the list goes on. There are so many and each has a special tone or quality to appreciate. If dh or ds were here, I'd ask for their expert opinion.

 

One thing about guitar players - they know all of the great players and LOVE to talk about them in social settings. They cannot stop. And each of those great players will teach your son along the way.

 

Enjoy the beautiful music. And I hope your son enjoys his journey.

 

 

The two I bolded above are two that ds is VERY into!!! I like the idea of getting him to broaden his horizons a bit. It cracks me up because his guitar teacher told him how to pronounce Yngwie and I corrected him....I was right. ;) I loved Yngwie in my early 20s and for ds to like him now is interesting!

 

We've discussed it all and he has agreed that a lot of what he appreciates is just the abilities that these different guitarists have. He's not as interested in their songs and lyrics, etc.

 

Kathy, your son's post was awesome. Ds and I read it together and discussed. His old guitar teacher, who moved away, played "Hey Joe" at a recital and we both loved it. It's one that ds has played around with.

 

Ds started on the acoustic, so he does alternate, but his favorite is electric. At the moment he has two acoustics and two electrics. I see how people start collecting!! :001_smile:

 

Thanks for all the advice. I think I'll take it and encourage him to open up to different styles, use both guitars instead of aiming so much for his electric, and keep encouraging him to listen to the music for the artistry and not get too caught up in all the rock music and the lyrics.

[lllll]

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[lllll]

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[3byzaz]

I have nothing of any help to write...no musical ability whatsoever. But, it is fun reading this thread as my oldest is a guitar fanatic. He started taking lessons at 7 and is now 12. His teacher will be here any minute! He's a lefty and just loves guitar!

 

My son got to play the worship song that he wrote (with a little help from his friend and band mate) at church yesterday! It was sooo awesome! So cool to see him sharing his God given talent!