How important is music/art, and extras?

[Bokons]

We have our two oldest dss in piano and violin, and our 3rd ds just started violin in September. Our boys also take skating lessons, swimming lessons and some multi-sport classes through parks and rec.

 

I was talking with my mom last night about activities for my kids, and she said that with our finances the way they are, we shouldn't be putting our kids into all those programs (although, right now with the parks and rec stuff, we have a 75% discount because of our income).

 

When we were kids, my parents put us in gymnastics, tap dancing, piano lessons, and she said that looking back on those now, she feels it was a waste of money since nothing really came out of any of it (we weren't "prodigies" in those things and haven't used them to make a living). She also mentioned my cousins who were supposedly really talented in violin, and their parents poured lots of money into lessons, and now nothing has come of it either. My mom basically thinks that we should limit our kids to one instrument and not force them to do everything (my kids have said that they don't like violin, but like piano).

 

I've always felt that music is very important, but I also took piano up to grade 8, and now can't really play anything, so am wondering if it's really a waste of money in the long run. I do think that we need to cut back on our expenses and am trying to figure out if this is one of the areas where we need to cut back. I haven't discussed this with dh yet since I am out of town visiting my family, but I will once I get back home.

 

We all agree (me, dh, and my mom) that swimming is something the kids have to learn, but everything else is optional.

 

I'd appreciate any insights/opinions.

 

Thanks.

Colleen

[nutmeg]

she feels it was a waste of money since nothing really came out of any of it (we weren't "prodigies" in those things and haven't used them to make a living).

 

Personally, I don't feel that is the point of doing music/art/etc/sports/etc. We do these for the sake of knowledge, as well as for pleasure, or exercise or socialization.

 

If it fits in the budget and it something your family values, I say go for it.

[Wendy in ME]

Due to finances, we have only begun some outside projects. I want the boys to have different experiences as they grow up and maybe even find a hobby that they love and continue with through adulthood. I did sort of feel guilty that I was depriving them of opportunities that other homeschool children are getting but I don't think these things are important enough put yourself through financial stress. Lack of money can be stressful enough without adding to it. I know the boys are now enjoying the few things that we have been able to let them do but in the whole scheme of things, these activities at a young age won't make a huge difference. I do keep college applications in the back of my mind though. I want them to have a few things that the have participated in long-term to add to them. JMHO

[rafiki]

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[Kathy in MD]

When we were kids, my parents put us in gymnastics, tap dancing, piano lessons, and she said that looking back on those now, she feels it was a waste of money since nothing really came out of any of it (we weren't "prodigies" in those things and haven't used them to make a living). She also mentioned my cousins who were supposedly really talented in violin, and their parents poured lots of money into lessons, and now nothing has come of it either. My mom basically thinks that we should limit our kids to one instrument and not force them to do everything (my kids have said that they don't like violin, but like piano).

 

Do you get the idea that I disagree with your mother about the value of the extras? If I only did things that would contribute to my financial well being, life would be very drab. No TV, no theater, no museums, no classes for the fun of it, no light reading books, no vacations, no ....... For just the pleasure they bring, music and sports are worthwhile.

 

But they offer so much more. Music helps train the mind in mathmatical ways. Now it won't make a child adept in math (see my ds for details rolleyes:) but it helps. The intensity in mastering difficult works develops self discipline with a payback of applause when performed for others. (a math test just isn't the same :D ) The piano trains fine motor control, attention to detail and multi-tasking.

 

Sports, where can I start? First most is health. People are decrying the increase in obesity in children, yet the schools cut back on recess and PE and children watch TV and play video games instead of being outside for hours. And lack of activity has long range health effects.

 

Sports and physical activity also has an effect on academics. One, it helps the child quiet twitching muscles and concentrate. Two, I know school that took misbehaving students and made them run for punishment. The kids didn't want to do it AND they were calmer in the classroom afterwards. Three, I believe that it improves blood flow to the brain.

 

Finally, many life skills are learned in sports - preserverence, team work for two. The business press often has written about women's difficulty in breaking through the glass barrier, partially because they didn't have the common experience and language of team sports. And much business is conducted over the golf course. :rolleyes:

 

So I would say that no learning is ever a waste of time or money. Life long lessons are usually the intangible ones learned in the strangest places.

 

Now the money situation is different. I'd look at the sports and music offerings and see how I could stretch my money the furthest. One way, if your dc prefer piano to violin, is to go strictly with piano. It's a great instrument to learn music and theory and you could get away with only one instrument. For sports, I'd try for variety - team and individual sports. I'd want some sports that they could do in their 40's, 50's and 60's and some that are geared mostly for the young. I'd be looking for social and team situations, also.

[Jenny in Florida]

. . . a couple of other folks have already pretty much covered what I was going to say.

 

Personally, I don't agree that exposing children to art and other "extras" is a waste of money if you're not raising a prodigy or a potential professional. I will note that it's difficult to become good enough at something--or, in fact, even know that you love it enough to try--without that initial exposure. However, I believe firmly that arts have a place in everyone's life, without regard to whether you ever earn a penny from them. They make life richer and can provide even amatuers with wonderful years of enjoyment and stimulation.

 

Now, it is, of course, true that it's probably not a responsible parenting decision to let your kids go to bed hungry or risk depriving them of basics in order to finance tap dance classes. But it doesn't sound like that's what you're doing.

 

--Jenny

[Musical Belle]

As a piano teacher, let me give you some encouragement about the value of music education. It's true that most of my students are never going to be professional musicians, and as you have observed, you don't remember much from your childhood music lessons because music requires constant practice and review or it is lost. However, music education has been shown to improve students' basic learning skills and test scores. Music requires the student to use much more of the brain than many other activities and gives the students skills needed to anticipate, forecast, recall, and concentrate. Playing music has also been shown to be physically, mentally, and emotionally relaxing. Even if your student never touches an instrument again, the music education she has received has already been of benefit, so please don't think of it as a waste.

 

If your student has been taking both piano and violin for the past year or two, she probably has a preference toward one or the other. I would say it's perfectly fine to let her choose the one she likes the best and stick with it.

[GothicGyrl]

I'll go against the grain on this one-- the only "extra" that is truly important is some type of physical activity--any kind, even if it is just outside playing.

 

Keep in mind that I am an artist when I say this: Art and Music are not needed for a well rounded education. And I firmly believe that if your kid just does not "get" it or does not "want" it, you should not force it on them (under the guise of it giving them a more well rounded education).

 

Per your question in the OP, I have to agree with your Mom--not that I think being prodigal is the end all be all of anything, but if your kids don't like one instrument over another--why are you making them play it? Get rid of the violin and only give them piano if that's what they like. And don't feel guilty getting rid of the second instrument.

 

You've got them in skating, swimming and multi-sports type things--and they play piano and like it--why put any more strain on them? They are getting a pretty decent "education" right there.

 

Ans especially if finances aren't up to par, cut out what isn't necessary and don't feel like you are shafting the kids doing it. releave yourself of that burden and rest easy knowing what you are giving them is good enough.

 

;)

[frogpond1]

it when we turn on Classical music in the car and make up stories about it etc. We also have jazz and piano music etc. that we play around the home. My kids sing in church and we sing around the house. That is one way to keep music in the home for little or no cost. I still will do anything possible to have music lessons for my children because I think it is valuable to learn how to play an instrument. I don't think I have to pay for lessons at age 4 though. My 2 oldest just started guitar this year at age 12 and 10. My two youngest will get lessons later on. I really want art too, though I haven't had as much time or money for it. We do a lot of artistic things around our home though, projects, pictures etc. in history and literature and science. You may have more art involved than you realize. We have a game called Masterpiece and enjoy playing it. Math is essential, writing essential, Latin right up there for us, and now we are working on adding in the arts. It has taken us a while to learn how to do all the other subjects daily etc. The better I become at teaching the basics, the more able I am to add in the arts. I think it would be a bad thing if I was doing all arts and unable to get to math, writing or Latin.

[Trivium Academy]

We will only allow 1 outside activity per child at a time. Right now, dd7 is taking piano. If she wants to do something else, she needs to decide between piano and the new thing. This is to preserve our wallet and sanity. The only exception to this is parent-driven activities like 4-H. The things we want our children to participate it regardless of their interest (that sounds mean, lol) for their own good (like church). The rest of the stuff- sports, extra curricular activities that cost money to participate. It is 1 at a time.

 

Dd7 took ballet while in kindergarten, and since then she's taken piano. I don't expect her to play an instrument all her life although that would be nice to have fostered that love in her. The kids need to learn time management and how important it is not to "busy" your schedule too much. It's the same with homeschool curriculum, there's just too much GOOD stuff out there to do everything so we need to be very selective with what we choose to invest our time, energy and money.

[lottie j.y6s4ly]

if you can afford it keep the piano and swimming lessons....piano covers the music education and they enjoy it....drop violin if they don't enjoy it, they are getting more than enough from the piano....swimming is a life skill like you said and it covers p.e.....once they are good swimmers then quit the lessons and go into either swim team or some other physical activity that they enjoy....one physical activity is enough unless they are really into it....also, playing outside counts as physical activity in my book or even exercise videos or jumping rope or whatever indoors....

 

right now, my kids are doing piano and homeschool gym class once a week during school year....then in spring soccer for 8 wks....then in fall either flag football or soccer for eight weeks...

 

in the past, we have tried many things just to find out what we like....my children have had swim lessons....also, they swam competively for a few years.....they are excellent swimmers....which is a priority for me....

 

good luck in your decision....

[mcconnellboys]

I will agree with Kathy in that I feel no learning is ever a waste. There is national outcry about the loss of recess time and PE for kids, as well as humanities. All these things contribute to a well-rounded person in body and mind.

 

Now, I don't think you need to drive yourself to distraction by trying to do everything simultaneously. And I don't think you need to drive yourself into debt, either. But I do think it's good to keep on the lookout for opportunities that will allow you to cover these topics (even if sporadically) throughout the year.

 

Regena

[Dayle in Guatemala]

this is my two cents, FWIW.

 

I think music and art are important. I think PE type activities are important. But, I can honestly say, that I don't see the need to spend so much money on lessons, activities, teams, etc. I think that because I also think that the family nucleus is important, too. It takes a lot of time commitment to be involved in all of that and stress on finances that it strains family relationships.

 

We live in an area where these things are just not readily available to us. I used to do all of that and have become aware of the fact that it's not necessary. So, here's what we do:

 

--We have supplied our dc with instruments and books and spend time playing around on them. When they show interest or promise, we start to look at possibly putting them into formal lessons if time and money allow. If not, we keep doing what we're doing at home. My dd11 is teaching herself piano and is loving it and feels a super sense of accomplishment because she's doing it herself. Is she technically correct on everything? NO! But, she loves the piano and can play a LOT of stuff on it by reading music and by chording.

 

--We have a friend who is an artist come to our home and teach drawing, painting, etc to our dc once a week with a few other families who are interested. It's fun and easy for them and they are learning art basics.

 

--We do artist and composer studies each week and have art books around our house. We discuss good paintings and sculptures and musical compositions and love learning more about the artists behind them. It's been fun to learn how to look critically at a piece as a family. My dh and I are learning a lot too.

 

--For PE, we walk as a family, go swimming as a family, do aerobics as a family, or some other type of activity. My dh will arrange soccer for my dc with their friends a couple of times a month as well.

 

I'm not saying that they can't be with other kids, but, I think it got to be too much. The focus was shifted from our family, to outside activities. It's been good to get back to the basics and with the money we save, we can do fun family activities from time to time.

[...................]

Well you didn't say how old your kids are but here are my thoughts.

 

1. Swimming lessons are optional, too. If you can swim you can teach your kid how to swim, usually. They will hate you for it at first and then they will get over it.

 

2. Music- I think if they took one piano class they would be achieving all the goals for music in a classical education. That said, I don't even think the piano lessons are useful unless your dc really love them and are willing to keep going on and maybe play for church or such later. Everyone I know who took piano as a kid can barely tell me anything about the instrument now.

 

3. I think your mom speaks a lot of wisdom. Nowadays we parents love our kids so much and we feel with the modern world, cars, and so many programs available we can pretty much do anything we dream of for them. But this is not reality. In reality, we have to provide a stable loving, calm home for them. When money is tight mom and dad get stressed. Even if you don't show your stress it'll come out in some way at some point. We are broke right now too and the only thing my son is doing is the free Lowe's class and my mom is paying for dd to take Rec gymnastics on Saturdays.

 

We sold my car to stay afloat this year...

 

I really worried about how much they need this or that and every time I go to God and ask Him to provide, He does. I worried that my son would be bored, and he got two new friends right here in the neighborhood that are nice kids and come from loving homes, one is a stay at home mom, so he plays with my son almost every day because none of the other kids get home till 5:00. What a blessing.

 

I really worried that my kids and I would get sick of each other but God is giving us books from all kinds of sources to enjoy together.

 

I could go on and on....I am beginning to learn that I don't need to be God for my kids. He has a plan and I need to be open to be His hands. With that mindset I have been able to see these kinds of things a lot more clearly.

 

Hope that helps a little.

[Michelle T]

I'll go against the grain on this one-- the only "extra" that is truly important is some type of physical activity--any kind, even if it is just outside playing.

 

Keep in mind that I am an artist when I say this: Art and Music are not needed for a well rounded education. And I firmly believe that if your kid just does not "get" it or does not "want" it, you should not force it on them (under the guise of it giving them a more well rounded education).

 

Per your question in the OP, I have to agree with your Mom--not that I think being prodigal is the end all be all of anything, but if your kids don't like one instrument over another--why are you making them play it? Get rid of the violin and only give them piano if that's what they like. And don't feel guilty getting rid of the second instrument.

 

You've got them in skating, swimming and multi-sports type things--and they play piano and like it--why put any more strain on them? They are getting a pretty decent "education" right there.

 

Ans especially if finances aren't up to par, cut out what isn't necessary and don't feel like you are shafting the kids doing it. releave yourself of that burden and rest easy knowing what you are giving them is good enough.

 

;)

 

 

I agree with all of the above.

Michelle T

[kellycbr]

I grew up with a mother who felt art was a waste of time. My husband's mother has a Masters in art, and encouraged all her kids to explore art. My husband is a math and computer whiz, and he attributes it to the art his Mum taught him. He is able to visualize what he wants to accomplish, be it mathmatical, or a computer design. I'm amazed and inspired by what my mother-in-law did, and its applications that I never knew. Not being artsy it's tough for me, but the kids are naturally doing it. This is an inexpensive activity with long term gain. Good luck!

[Mama Anna]

Now, know that I'm a musician and both grew up in a musical family as well as am wife and mother in one now. So maybe I'm biased . . . :) But I have have a theory about music, art, and writing. I feel that every kid needs a method of self-expression. (Isn't that one of the goals of Classical Education - to learn to express your thoughts clearly?) If your kids can really express themselves through writing, you're home free. But what about those who can't? I feel that it's really important to have a method to pour out what's inside and to be good enough at it that you can really enjoy it. This might be art for some, dance for others - for me, it's music. Of course, this might be for me alone, since much of my life is defined by music ;), but I've wondered if some of the messed-up school shooters we hear about on the news would have lived different lives if they had been trained with a better outlet for their angst. I'm not experienced in sports at all, but wouldn't they work as well? As for the multi-tasking thing, I would join in recommending that once your kids find something they love, let 'em just stick with that. It's not easy to be a "jack of all trades, master of none."

Just my opinion!

 

Mama Anna

[Monique]

Our sons are both in violin and piano but they are musically inclined. Their father is a professional musician & composer and they definitely have inherited his gift of music.

 

That being said for over 15 months we had to drop the music due to finances. It was a welcomed break as they started piano at 4 and only took off our vacation time and whatever breaks the piano teacher took (spring break; Christmas break etc.). They took up violin much later and received group instruction with other homeschooled kids for a year then the teacher quit and we couldn't afford lessons. They both missed their instruments and started saying that as soon as we could afford it they wanted to get back into it. They are now back in both instruments since last fall sharing a 45 minute violin lesson and doing 30 minute piano lessons each.

 

The lesson learned was that sacrifices have to be made at times but they got right back on track and what is important is that "they" missed and appreciated their lessons and wanted to get back into music.

 

HTH.

 

Monique

[Bokons]

There's a lot to think about, although I already pretty much agree with everything that everyone has said. I do think that my mom speaks a lot of wisdom to me, but I also think that her values are not exactly the same as mine.

 

Thanks for giving me validation that I'm not wasting money with these activities for my dc. I think that we should probably cut down a bit for now though.

 

Thank you :)

 

Colleen

[Mrs. Readsalot]

If you child shows a strong desire to participate and or a talent and an interest in participating then try to do it if you can. If not I would not think twice about not attending. We recently stopped going to a homeschool sports program because I thought it had run its course with my son i.e. he wasn't really interested and he wasn't gaining anything. He has lots of neighborhood friends and has plenty of social time with them. They play outside a lot and think up games that require imagination. I think this is better for his development. I see so many kids that are very scheduled that don't know how to play or use their imaginations.

[BizyPenguin]

time and money have to be taken into consideration. I get goofy if I have to run here and there to drop my ds off for activities and lessons. We don't overdo these things at all. They are also very pricey, so that's another good reason to limit these things. That said, I don't think music lessons, dance lessons, or whatever is a waste. I took dance lessons from age 4-14 and it was fun, I got good exercise, I learned to perform in front of an audience, and I made great friends. Moderation is the key! I recommend the book Mitten Strings for God: Reflections for Mothes in a Hurry by Katrina Kevenison, to you. I'm reading this now and it talks about this very thing (overscheduling our kids) in the book. I'm participating in an online book study of this book and I posted a review of Chapter 1 on my blog. All the best!

[SoCal Sandra]

His story inspires me in so many ways, but the first part, which explains how a calligraphy class which had no "practical application" led to the creation of Apple Computer and Pixar Animation seems a suitable addition to this great discussion.

 

Here is the text to Jobs' speech:

 

http://news-service.stanford.edu/news/2005/june15/jobs-061505.html