16DS took SATs and bombed - But he is on Deans List in college ?!?!?

[5KidzRUs]

16DS took SATs and bombed - But he is on Deans List in college ?!?!?

His college GPA is 3.6 and he is entering his 2nd year.

So why did he do so bad on the SATs??

He studied Barron's SAT and the Standard Deviant CDs - I am wondering if these caused him to care too much on technique ie do first 10 problems and only last numbers if you absolutely know the answers etc ...

He earned a 89% in college algebra but bombed the math SAT section.

Any thoughts?

[Mommyfaithe]

Both of my girls bombed to SAT...well bombed as ar as what I expected..especially on the math...

 

One graduated Summa Cum Laude with a 3.98 GPS from Sage College...#7 in her graduating class...

 

My next "bomber" has a 3.9 GPA and is finishing up her Sophomore year...

 

Ummmmm...it proves my point...SAT's do not test ability...they test..test...taking ability....multiple choice taking ability....and quick thinking ability....

 

Give my kids a research project or an essay exam...and WATCH OUT!

 

Anyway...at 16 there is plenty of time to learn SAT tricks andd strategy. SAT is STRATEGY...

 

Or...try the ACT.

 

Good Luck,

Faithe

[G5052]

Indeed some kids with low SAT's are not going to well in college. I don't know what you define as "bombed," but indeed if there's a serious literacy/computational problem behind the lower numbers, they're going to have a very hard time succeeding. I've been a part-time state community college professor for 10+ years, and I've taught some kids/adults who had so far to go in terms of their basic skills in the 3 R's that I wondered if it was reasonable for them to even be there. A few of that kind of student will persist and build the skills they need, but some will not. Our society sometimes leads people to believe that "anyone" can make it if they "want" to, and that just isn't the case. Some will not make it for various reasons, some of it is tied to how far they have to come academically to handle college material.

 

It sounds like though that you gave him the foundational education to succeed in college, and to me that's the bottom line. There are plenty of people who are very successful in college and afterwards whose SAT's were less-than-stellar. Yes, SAT's can open doors, but at a certain point they really don't matter if the student has the basic skills and will apply themselves.:D

Edited June 26, 2009 by GVA

[LoriM]

I'd add that some students who finish college and take the GRE do not score particularly high...even after a college degree. Some people just aren't "test-takers." I think the best predictor of a GRE score is the SAT score! So much so, that most grad schools don't really require a particular score on the GRE, it's just a "check box" of something you must do to be admitted.

 

Consider his SAT box checked, and then pursue admission to a university as a transfer student. Sounds like he's doing great in college!

[Lux Et Veritas Academy]

I bombed it- really bombed it. I have a MS degree and taught for 6 plus years at my University.......I just never did well on those types of tests.....but look at me now:)

[Peggy in Va]

Both of my girls bombed to SAT...well bombed as ar as what I expected..especially on the math...

 

One graduated Summa Cum Laude with a 3.98 GPS from Sage College...#7 in her graduating class...

 

My next "bomber" has a 3.9 GPA and is finishing up her Sophomore year...

 

Ummmmm...it proves my point...SAT's do not test ability...they test..test...taking ability....multiple choice taking ability....and quick thinking ability....

 

Give my kids a research project or an essay exam...and WATCH OUT!

 

Anyway...at 16 there is plenty of time to learn SAT tricks andd strategy. SAT is STRATEGY...

 

Or...try the ACT.

 

Good Luck,

Faithe

 

:iagree:First let me say that while I do not currently have a child in high school, I do have a ds that has graduated, taken the SAT's and been accepted to college.

 

I think Faithe is right when she says he's 16 and he has plenty of time to learn the "tricks".

 

I also think there is a huge difference, as far as the impression the test results give to admissions officers, in the child who has a high GPA and doesn't do that well on the SAT and a child who has adequate grades and aces the SAT. To me, those two scenarios speak volumes.

 

You may or may not have heard about the child who applied to VA Tech and wasn't admitted even though he aced the SAT. The reason the admission officer gave, after the mother raised a stink about this, was his grades didn't fall in line with his test scores. Apparently this kid did well in school and could have had an incredibly high GPA if he had turned in his homework. Because he chose not to do this it dropped his GPA. But, because he knew the material he aced the SAT. Basically the message that was sent to the admissions officer was, "o.k., I'm smart and I am capable of achieving great things, but I'm too lazy to do the work". Not a good candidate for college. Oddly enough, when I mentioned this story to my oldest ds, he proceeded to tell me that was why he wasn't accepted at Tech, or even his 2nd choice school.:glare:

 

Relax, you and your ds have plenty of time to work on this. Pick up some strategy books and practice. He can always take the test again. Or, as Faithe mentioned, take the ACT. Breathe, it's not the end of the world.

[5KidzRUs]

Thank you all for your words of wisdom. DS wants to be a doctor and he takes college very, very seriously. The SAT results devastated him - he scored lower than national averaged. He has only done scantron testing twice before and I am wondering if that hindered him also. I know that this is not an excuse - but the teacher opened the door during the test and let in bees and one student even was stung - they were distracted by the bees during the test.

OK, only "up" from here - right?? :grouphug:

[laughing lioness]

If your son wants to be a doctor I would strongly suggest spending time/money on learning HOW to become a rock-out test taker. He'll be doing test-taking hoop jumping for a long time if he really wants to get a M.D. degree. Having that type of goal means lots more tests, high pressure on high scores and lots of money. The higher the scores generally the more money. Also, if you are looking at a profession with a 1-5% acceptance rate, like an M.D., best to be aware that test scores matter a LOT in getting in to a competitve program, staying in, getting good (paying or well paying) internships, etc.

[forty-two]

Ok, I honestly consider the bee thing an legitimate excuse - I'm terrified of them, and I would have had a horrible time trying to concentrate while worrying about being stung. That could really mess up scores - I'd report it to the College Board; sure, they might not care, but nothing ventured, nothing gained.

 

As for prep, did your ds ever take a practice test under actual testing conditions (timed, no breaks, etc.)? That can help a lot. Does he have any theories about why he did badly - ran out of time, guessed a lot, certain types of problem that caused difficulties? That would give you a good starting point for figuring out what he needs to focus on.

[TravelingChris]

:iagree: with laughing lioness. I may have a similar problem with my daughter, I am not sure since she didn't bomb her 10 grade PSAt but didn't do anywhere as well as her older brother had done. ON the other hand, he didn't suffer from migraines and PMDD and she was having PMDD on the day she took the test. SInce she has decided she wants a very competitive career, I am doing all I can to help. THat means this summer she is going to do CD Sat Math prep. She is alos going to do vocabulary prep. The Math prep course gives SAT tricks and she has had planty of testing practice. By the way, even if your state doesn't require testing, I strongly suggest testing from let's say 3rd grade or so up. It doesn't matter how they do, it matters that they learn to take standardized tests. I had the misfortune to watch a girl take a Stanford test for the first time in the ninth grade. When I mean she bombed, I mean she didn't do most of the test. I was a substitute tester since she had missed the first day of testing. I saw what she had done on the previous day's tests. Most was blank. Now she was reading very well, LOTR was what she brought for extra reading, and my dd hd said she talked as if she was reasonably intelligent. But she hadn't ever done tests nor had she been prepped. The best thing for test anxiety or anything like that is to do lots.

[Guest HSmomof 7]

I'd like to chime in and say that my Ds took the ACT for the first time last year and ...well he didn't bomb (26) he did ok but not do well enough to get into the college in which he would like to go.

 

We plunked down the money for a Kaplan live ACT test course (8 week I think. It wasn't as expensive as most because they were having a "sale". Even this was hard to swallow because we have 7 kids and we are CHEAP!)

 

Anyway, he did raise his score 3 points! Which is great on an ACT scale. Now he wants to take it again because he thinks he can do even better.

 

The point I want to make is that they had him take timed practice tests so many times that he now says "I really don't mind taking the test after doing it so mant times, it doesn't make me nervous at all."

 

That really surprised me, because he is the type of kid who is smart but chokes under pressure. He is enrolled in the university part time and took calculus, organic chemistry etc and got all "A"s. Not saying this to toot my horn but to let you see smart kids can still not be great test takers- he was taking college math and science and those were his lowest ACT scores.

 

Good Luck! And have them do lots of timed test practice!

[Storm Bay]

. Basically the message that was sent to the admissions officer was, "o.k., I'm smart and I am capable of achieving great things, but I'm too lazy to do the work". Not a good candidate for college. .

 

 

Or he could be a highly gifted kid who was bored out of his skull and saw no point to doing the work in high school but who would stop being lazy once he hit university and gets into things he's truly interested in. I've seen students like that, too. However, the admissions officer is unlikely to have any way to discern the difference between the two.

[Deidre in GA]

just curious, what SAT score constitutes 'bombing'? is it anything lower than the National Average - which i'll go google to find out what that is.

[5KidzRUs]

For us, below national average is bombing.

[creekland]

You may or may not have heard about the child who applied to VA Tech and wasn't admitted even though he aced the SAT. The reason the admission officer gave, after the mother raised a stink about this, was his grades didn't fall in line with his test scores. Apparently this kid did well in school and could have had an incredibly high GPA if he had turned in his homework. Because he chose not to do this it dropped his GPA. But, because he knew the material he aced the SAT. Basically the message that was sent to the admissions officer was, "o.k., I'm smart and I am capable of achieving great things, but I'm too lazy to do the work". Not a good candidate for college.

 

Personally, I wouldn't hire anyone like that either. I could just see the future now..."yes, you told me to do that (or do it that way), but I didn't see the need for it..." I'd have no problem at all with someone finding a better way for the company, BUT they need to comply where compliance is warranted - whether they agree or disagree (assuming nothing ethical, of course).

 

Also, refusing to do 'basic' work because one feels they are too good for it reeks of snob to me - not the type that will get along well with others - which is kind of important in most jobs - even when you're the leader.

 

I say kudos to the colleges that turned him down... (esp since Va Tech is my Alma mater!!!)

[Storm Bay]

Personally, I wouldn't hire anyone like that either.Also, refusing to do 'basic' work because one feels they are too good for it reeks of snob to me - not the type that will get along well with others - which is kind of important in most jobs - even when you're the leader.

 

I say kudos to the colleges that turned him down... (esp since Va Tech is my Alma mater!!!)

 

 

Perhaps, but instead of being snobbery it could just be immaturity or they could have been totally depressed due to bullying, life at home, etc. I hate to totally classify a teen based only on his or her teen years. If my teen years, especially those from ages 14-16, were any indication, I'd be a rebellious person who would have never finished university, held down a job, and that is absolutely not the case.

 

My point is only that you cannot make a sweeping assumption based on this. People do grow up, and not all at the same time :). Thankfully, SAT scores aren't required to get a job.

[LaurieinCA]

My husband has B.S. and M.D. degrees from UCLA. He did not score very well on the verbal portion of his SAT, but made up for it with his math score... His mom, a single parent, spent a lot of money on a test-prep course (Princeton Review) for him, which definitely helped. There are definite strategies to be learned for taking these types of tests.

[WiseOwlKnits]

I was 16 when I took the SAT and I did awful on it as well. So bad, in fact, that I didn't even meet the minimum requirements for the (very good) college that I attended. Extra-curricular activities, a perfect interview, a stellar academic record, and sheer luck were what got them to make an exception and let me in anyway. I'm happy to say that I also had a stellar academic record in college and graduated near the top of my class with honors.

 

The SAT isn't all that it's cracked up to be, but if he wants to go to medical school I'd say he should take it again. He knows what's going to be on it this time, he knows the set-up of the test and the environment better. And it will give him valuable practice for the many many standardized, high-stress tests he'll take on his way to becoming a doctor.

[creekland]

Perhaps, but instead of being snobbery it could just be immaturity or they could have been totally depressed due to bullying, life at home, etc. I hate to totally classify a teen based only on his or her teen years. If my teen years, especially those from ages 14-16, were any indication, I'd be a rebellious person who would have never finished university, held down a job, and that is absolutely not the case.

 

My point is only that you cannot make a sweeping assumption based on this. People do grow up, and not all at the same time :). Thankfully, SAT scores aren't required to get a job.

 

This is true, but at this point we're not talking about years later - just the here and now - when he is (at the very least) a bit immature. If/when he had other things to add to his resume, then of course, one should consider them. We do all change, but immaturity fed seldom changes. There's no need. It's something that can grow into snobbery. Immaturity ignored can get results.

 

I still say if someone came to me out of high school with a perfect SAT and issues with schoolwork grades being down due to not completing homework, then I would not hire them since I would feel they'd make a poor employee at that time in their lives. Granted, in reality, I've yet to see anyone put SAT results or grades on their resume for a job... but this is in theory anyway.

 

I do teach in our local public high school. Hubby has employed teens from there in the past (not now due to the economy). I do make recommendations... and only recommend those with a good work ethic. Those are not always the ones with the best grades, but to date they are not ones with really poor grades either. The others might mature - one hopes they do - but if we're hiring now... I'm looking at their personalities now - much like a college admissions officer.