Rod and Staff and begin with grade 4 to see how it works out. If it seems too easy, then go to grade 5. It is mastery. Saxon (because of the spiral nature) will just keep an LD's head spinning.

Sort of unrelated, but watch the video they have put together which seems to define Lamplighter's purpose. (Preview before watching with kids; it's too intense for mine.) http://www.lamplightertheatre.com/writing-contest-2

I also love these books. They highlight Christian values, many of which seem to be lost in our modern culture. When reading these many times I am amazed at what we've lost as Christians, the ideals, the behaviors. I have bought some for read-a-louds for my children, and more for myself. I am improved by reading them; I become a better person and a better mom at least for a little while.

I have Rosetta Stone Latin and would not recommend it. A child could do Rosetta Stone all day and may never understand the grammar. Rosetta Stone is good for spoken Latin, but Cambridge plus the CD's is better. It is a whole to parts program, but does take time to explain the grammar. But Cambridge is not a program for a second grader. OK, this message is not making much sense, but I'd like to save you the $$ on Rosetta Stone. My 6th grader is doing Latin Prep and supplementing with Cambridge for additional reading and hearing the spoken Latin on the CD's. We spend about 45 minutes per day, 5 days per week. For a second grader, I'd only spend 15 mins per day learning vocabulary. For a 4th grader, well they may be capable of much more (mine did Latin Prep 1 in fourth, but he had done Prima in 3rd which did serve as a good intro.) Penny

Now I'm feeling inadequate! Oh well, we'll just go on from here. I think I'll use Elementary Greek next year, and for logic, I'll probably just buy every book out there and see what works for us. In fact, I'll probably end up doing this with the Greek too. We did Latin Prep 1 in 4th grade, then I enrolled dc in an outside class that did Cambridge Unit 1. It slowed us down a bit, but maybe it was for the better. In 6th we'll do Latin Prep 2, and keep up with the reading in Cambridge. BTW, Laura, I'm still thankful to you for introducing us to Latin Prep! Penny

I'm reviewing what everyone's using for 6th and not seeing much logic or greek (or modern language). What's the consensus? What's the program for logic? I feel like I need to begin both logic and greek this year having done NOTHING prior to this.

Agree with getting the Elements! I bought RS4K and it just bored my kids because the information is deep, but not explained in a manner that can be fully understood and retained. But the Elements is wonderful. (We do the 'Amazing Atomic Atomizer with chocolate chips...what a GREAT idea for retaining valence numbers and the ways/whys that elements react!!) If you would like to do RS4K or NOEO (which I have and am going to do next), begin with the Elements. Plus it would be fun for a coop.

Thanks, I guess such a thing doesn't exist. Where is that mom who wants to know where the holes are in the homeschooling market????? Penny

That's the book I'm reading from! It does not have the map! OK, it has little bitty ancient maps which don't have all the locations listed and are very difficult to read.

A really good map with the cities and waterways, etc. Reading this without is frustrating!!!!

Applied Behavior Analysis is used to teach kids with LD's and is highly effective. It involves first finding a motivator, then using the motivator to get the behavior you want. It actually gets very complicated, but perhaps you can simplify it. Undesired behavior can be handled in various ways, perhaps by blocking, ignoring (but can be dangerous), or others. If you really want to pursue this, it takes time to explain and you may want to do research. But if your dealing with an LD, you may find yourself getting desparate after the newness of working with you wears off (ie. the child may be fine at first because of being somewhat uncomfortable around you and desiring to perform, then performance may degrade as he gets used to you).

I spend a lot of time reading aloud, going over vocabulary words from the books we read (I make flash cards), reading Latin stories with them and practicing the pronunciation, chanting Latin verbs, calling out spelling words for pre-test, teaching/reviewing math concepts (every day), and I teach the grammar lesson, along with teaching my now 5th grader outlining skills by modeling, and teaching note taking skills by modeling. When dc were younger, I spent much time doing the history lesson (SOTW with activity book) with them and doing dictation. Also, having them read to me and practicing those sight words, and doing First Language Lessons.

Can't seem to find science vocabulary vine...link?? Thanks! Penny

Sorry, last night I didn't have time to explain. My kids use R&S and it does not seem at all advanced, in fact just the opposit. Many on this board comment that it is too slow and won't use it for that reason. When I compare it to ABEKA, Horizons, and definately Singapore, it seems about a year behind. Actually, that is one reason I like it. My kids just finished R&S 5 and they are skipping 6 to go directly to R&S 7 so they can do algebra in 8th grade and still fit in R&S 8. I love R&S and the way it covers the basics so very thoroughly. However, it does spend alot of time on the basics. But, there's nothing like trying a book to see where the dc fits. R&S 6 (I have the book) starts with a review of basic computation, and covers the same material in R&S 5 just with a little more level of complexity added in. However, Teaching Textbooks seems a bit lower level than R&S. Some of my friends that have math challenged children use TT because the child feels on grade level and it helps their self esteem. To a child it is important that when their friends are in 6th grade, their book says 6th grade too! Just a different opinion! Blessings!

Rod and Staff, but I would not go a grade lower.

I just bought PTIW for my rising 6 grader and I am not very happy with it. It is overly complicated delving into sentence structure at the beginning and I am wondering how and if I should use this since I spent $50. Also, if I use it I think I'll need the Teacher's Manual for even more $. The samples I saw did not show what the program is like. I'll probably use IEW again. Penny

We are doing The Elements, by Ellen McHenry. I highly recommend it as a starting point. It wonderfully introduces atoms, the periodic table, electron orbitals, bonding, + more. With this as a starting point, Chemistry is understandable and much more fun. The other books I have looked at seem fine, but just don't start at an understandable beginning like Ellen does. And it is very fun and funny. We began with Real Science for Kids, but then I quickly had to order the Elements as the kids could remember the work (ie. Carbon bonds with 4 other elements, etc) but Ellen explains WHY in a great, fun way. After finishing this, we'll probably quickly go through RS4K again (but it' not much fun) and then do NOEO. Can't tell you much about this. Oh, and somewhere I'm going to fit in Ellen's Carbon Chemistry. I also have Science Explorer, and it is PACKED with information, but it looks good. I might not recommend it for someone who is not interested in science. Penny

Well, SWB doesn't say the work has to be grueling for the child. Anyone who has done First Language Lessons would realize what a child is capable of without the horrible school grind you seem to be refering to. It is VERY gentle and fun, and brings Mom and child close together. Also, STOW Vol 1 is a wonderful, child friendly way to teach. It is easy to mix up methods with what the child should learn. The curricula SWB writes is a testimony of the way she believes children should be taught. Penny

Jan in TX sent me this pm when I had questions about pre-algebra and Lial's. ************************************ To save you some time searching through posts here is some information. Older editions are just fine--in fact they are usually NOT that old--this series was produced for remedial community college use (some high schools also use it) and the CCs require that texts have 'new' editions every 2 years or so...mostly cover and minor problem changes take place. In all cases start with the student text. Once you get it it will have the isbn numbers of any extra parts you might want later... but the student text alone is all that is really needed. Video lessons (for computer viewing) can be purchase for around $35 a set--I've only had one student who actually used them--and then only on occasion. The teaching in the text is VERY good. This program was designed for INDEPENDENT learning so ALL of the lesson material is in the student text. All the odd answers plus answers to tests and such are also there. Lial has 2 programs for Pre-Algebra one called Basic College Math (my FAVORITE) and one called simply "Pre-Algebra". Both cover the same material--but I really really like the approach of BCM. Their Pre-Algebra text seems rushed to me. Look for the 5th, 6th or 7th editions. Again there are 2 programs for Algebra 1. The one I recommend is Introductory Algebra. My own girls use it and I teach from it in my online Math classes. The other text is called "Beginning Algebra". Again same content--but the layout of the texts is different--I just like the look and feel of Intro better. Look for the 7th or 8th editions. Intermediate Algebra is the same as Algebra 2. Look for the 7th or 8th editions. Make sure that you are getting the PAPERBACK text--the hardback text is from her older series (it is OK but I really like the layout of the paperback text best). Hope this helps on your math search. The Lial series is on the same 'level' as Foerster, Jacobs and Larson (what Chalkdust uses). They were all made to the same HIGH math standards. If you are looking for a GREAT inexpensive program then Lial is worth looking into. If you prefer to use DVD instruction then look into Chalkdust--my next favorite program. *********** I don't think she will mind me copying it for you. HTH Penny

We like R&S and it is cheap. It is mastery with lots of review. But, you'll find that others think it is too slow. I love the way it really cements the basics and the progression of problems. My kids just finished R&S 5 and I think we will skip R&S6 and move on to R&S7 which solves the whole slowness issue. However, with my more math averse child I may have to do R&S 6.

Thank you. You've helped very much. Penny (and you have a math genius!)

Thank you Cynthia. What do you recommend for us just beginning Logic? You have done so much! (How do you do it all? How do you do Chalk Dust Geometry with a 6th grader???) Would it be OK to jump into the Art of Argument in 6th grade? Thanks again! Penny

I noticed Sue is using the Art of Argument and after following her link, it looks great! Is this for 7th grade? But, what about the WTM recommendations of Critical Thinking Co.? What is the best way to go about this? I would love to hear what all of you are doing and get your links. Thanks for all of your past and present posts!! Penny Also, I noticed there is another Penny on the board....I'll have to change my name. Anyone know how to do this?

Well, I don't know, but we are doing The Elements now, and after this, I plan on doing everything Ellen McHenry writes! So, I guess we'll be doing Carbon Chemistry pretty soon. Penny

I know the feeling....I go through waves of doubt about R&S because it seems like it is behind. My kids are finishing 5th grade, and I became concerned about having them ready for algebra. After ordering pre-algebra books, looking at Saxon 8/7, I have decided: R&S is a WONDERFUL program. Wow, this program really gets those basics down so that the child can move unhindered by the basics through the higher level concepts. I'm so pleased we have stuck with it! The progression of the problems, and the types of the problems seem to set it apart. When I teach the lesson, I don't always know where the problems are going. For example, I had no idea that the problems where the child does conversions leads to all sorts of fraction and decimal manipulations. Also, the mental math is outstanding. You probably don't see this yet as you are only doing Grade 3 (I believe that is what your post said) but you will see it as you move on. Console yourself in that this is the program the Highlands Latin School has chosen. Console yourself that your child absolutely doesn't need to know geometry yet. I mean you can frustrate yourself and your child by teaching them things that are higher level concepts; it just takes so much time to do so. Why do it when they will learn it quickly when they are ready? R&S waits until the child is ready, and the child needs to know before they introduce those things. Console yourself in that R&S leaves nothing out. Now, I really want my kids to do algebra in 8th grade, and I want them to finish R&S 8 (because it is a REALLY good program). So, my kids are skipping R&S 6 and are now working on R&S 7 (Note that we finished the grade 5 book about 1.5 months ago and we do math during the summers). It may take us longer to go through the book, and for some chapters I will have to regress to the grade 6 book and then go on to the grade 7 book, but I figure that about this time next year the kids will be doing grade 8. After looking at the pre-algebra books (Lials BCM and Chalk Dust) R&S covers everything necessary to go into algebra, and I see no problems. Blessings! Penny