Lori D. - I so appreciate your insights. I think you may just have hit it right. "Enslaving" is the perfect word to describe how I feel about history!! I've spent the last six years trying to figure out how to break free. I had thought doing less would be the answer, but maybe doing it all but spreading it out over more time is what I really need (thanks Coco_Clark too). And you are right about the age appropriateness of the levels. One of the many reasons I chose to start first grade with American history was to make her a year older for the more mature stuff. And trying to squeeze back down to three years would cancel that out. Really my only hesitation with one long cycle is forgetting the early stuff. My son doesn't remember a THING from his early grades. Of course, he doesn't remember a thing from the beginning of this school year either. So maybe we really have nothing to lose! I will be giving this more thought.

I maybe should have explained my thinking on the three years. When I did SOTW with my son, I felt like we put so much effort into it, that by the time we finished the reading, the questions, the narration, and the maps, that then doing the extra literature was just an added burden. And the extra literature was supposed to be the fun part. So for logic stage, I ended up using an encyclopedia as our spine, which took a lot less time to read and summarize than SOTW, and left extra time for the literature. Except then I felt like we weren't covering things thoroughly enough. So next year I decided to have my son go back to SOTW and I'm going to buy the PDF of the comprehension questions. I have finally decided that despite what it was meant for, the full curriculum is really better for older students. So for my younger, we'll listen/read through it, but spend the bulk of our focus on the fun literature. That's why I think zipping through in three years is doable. I've already spent first grade doing an American history survey, so three years on world history will get us back on track to have a full four years of SOTW in logic stage.

FLL is repetitive and easy. Perfect for first and second. By third and fourth it got a bit tedious. Ds has an intuitive understanding of grammar and it felt like overkill some of the time. I would have liked to have had a program that he could have done independently. Since he grasped it so quickly, it seemed a bit of a waste of my time to HAVE to be there to do the lesson. If I had it to do over, I might have switched over to R & S for 3rd. But, it was a good strong program. I ended up starting him on the R&S 6th grade book in 5th based on what I read here, and that turned out to work fine. Can't complain about a program that prepared him that well. WWE was often quite challenging once we got into dictation. I found I had to lower my expectations from what the book said as far as how quickly he ought to be able to commit the sentences to memory. Also I would like to have seen a little more instruction on how a paragraph should be structured. There was a little bit of that, but not a whole lot. Now he's in WWS and all of that is there. WWS is a challenging program and it covers a lot of material that I either didn't learn until high school or didn't learn at all. But ds is doing fine with it. It isn't easy by any stretch, he has to work at it, but it isn't beyond his abilities. And I attribute a lot of that to the preparation that he received in WWE. WWE does a whole lot more than it feels like. You just have to be patient to see the outcomes. I think it is very important to read the intro to the instructor guide to understand what you are doing and what you hope to accomplish long term.

Thinking about taking three years to go through the four books with my youngest. Is there already a schedule somewhere for this? Thanks!

Thanks everyone! Some of these suggestions look very promising. I've got them all on my library reading list now. Some of these have already been rejected, but since they only got half a glance I think I'll check them out again. I think I'll try the read aloud idea. During the school year our read alouds are more formal literature slightly above his own personal reading level. But we're finishing up this week. So maybe for our summer break I'll keep up the read aloud practice but with more "fun" books.

He'd rather just read his four favorite series over and over. And over and over. I get that - I read my favorites over and over again too. But he needs to find new favorites. Grow. Expand his horizons. All of that. I really like Amazon's "people who liked this also liked..." feature for myself. I've found so many great new authors that way. But no such luck with ds. I find stuff that looks like something he would like, get it from the library, and then he takes one look at the cover and says, "No way!". Sometimes I force him to at least read the first chapter before giving up. Still can't find anything to hook him. Here're his favorites: Left Behind Young Trib Force Series Mysterious Benedict Society series Peter and the Starcatchers series Kingdom Keepers series Hardy Boys If you know of any books that someone who liked these books would like, please suggest! Thanks!

In the middle of Julius Caesar with my 6th grader. We read through a scene using Oxford School Shakespeare which has useful explanatory notes in the margins, and then listen to Arkangel Shakespeare's audio dramatization of the scene. That's working so far. And I think ds is liking it. He went in with such a bad attitude I don't know if he'll ever admit to it, but he is sure acting like he is into it. Quite coincidentally, WWS had a lesson on using quotations and footnotes, and Julius Caesar just happened to be the subject. So he ended up learning all about Julius Caesar's history just as we were getting started. Couldn't have planned it better if I had tried!

After reading all the advice here, we went from FLL4 to R&S 6. I think this was a good choice. We ended up taking two years to go through it, because with all of ds's other subjects I didn't want to devote more than two days a week to it. I want to have grammar completely covered by the end of 8th, but I don't want to increase the time he is putting into it. Ds has an intuitive understanding of grammar, so I think it is unnecessary to spend a lot of time on it, but I still think it is important to have a formal study of it. I thought about switching to an easier curriculum that would still cover all the necessary topics but would take very little time to complete. Ds firmly expressed the desire to stick with R&S. He says his mind wanders too much when the work is too easy because it is more boring. The best solution I can think of is to skip R&S 7 and move right to R&S 8 and take two years to cover it. Is there anything in 7 that isn't also covered in 8? Does 8 assume too much prior knowledge of concepts introduced in 7 to make this impossible? We would be skipping the writing assignments as we are also doing WWS. Thanks in advance for your input!

Seconding the History Lives series. My son really likes them.

I'm also interested to see if anyone has used Biblical Hebrew: A Homeschool Primer. I'm planning to buy it for my son next year. I haven't seen many reviews on it but it looks closest to the type of thing we're looking for. He wants to read the Bible, so a conversational Hebrew program wouldn't fit the bill quite like a program that is specifically geared towards the Bible. Most of the other programs I looked at appeared to be conversational.

My son is interested in learning programming. My brother, an EE, told me to download Microsoft Visual Studio and then find an online tutorial for C++. Wondering if anyone has had experience with a tutorial or book that is user-friendly for kids (son is 11). I don't have time to work with him on it, so he needs to be able to figure it out on his own. Thank you!

An evolutionary, secular, humanistic viewpoint dominates most every mainstream curriculum, book, media, you name it. You'd have to build a pretty big bubble around your home in order to shield your kids from learning this worldview. Not so with Christianity. People have their own presuppositions about what Christians believe, especially as it pertains to creationism, but if you are truly seeking to understand this belief system, then you have to go beyond that and be intentional about studying what the tenets of faith are and the scientific evidence for biblical creation. I would encourage you to continue with the Christian materials that you have as well as Awana, and also to get some books or videos to find out what the actual scientific evidence is that creationists believe support their viewpoint. Then use it as an opportunity to have a family discussion while you critically evaluate what you see and decide if the evidence is valid. This would fit well for students who are in the logic stage and are learning how to identify fallacies, etc.

We just started DM7A last week. It looks like we need to complete two lessons per week to finish in a semester. We do math four days per week, so I have him read through the instructions, do the Try It! problems, and then do the basic practice problems on one day. Then the next day he finishes the rest of the problems. It is taking him 2-3 hours per day to do this. He says he understands the material. He even likes it. He says he is not wasting time daydreaming. I think he mind works a little slow making basic computations, but assuming that that's normal for a student his age... I'm just wondering how others are handling DM7A. Does your student take this long? Are you stretching the book out longer than a semester to complete? Are you not making your student do all of the problems? If I let him skip the Brainworks problems, will he still be a successful student later on? Am I wrong in thinking that an 11yo/6th-grader shouldn't need to spend this many hours on math every day?

Wow, so glad I saw this thread. We just started my ds11 on DM 7A this week and so far he has taken an ETERNITY to do each lesson. The material is not too hard for him. He assures me he understands it perfectly; he even enjoys it. He insists he is not daydreaming. Finally today I sat down with his homework and studied his problems to see where he might be spinning his wheels and what I think I've figured out is that he still doesn't know his math facts well enough to come to solutions quickly. After all the drilling, the flashcards, the time tests, the tears, the anguish... when I thought he had finally mastered them... he KNOWS them, it just takes him longer than instantly to pull the answer out of his head (like he had actually written out 54/6 as a "long division" problem in the margin...). It's a relief to know he's just keeping up with his peer group! The exercise thing makes a lot of sense. He is very sedentary and is in desperate need of more exercise. I'll need to put effort into seeing that he does more of it.

We struggled with history all the way through, but when we hit SOTW 4, that was the worst. It wasn't so much the quantity that got to us as how much he struggled to recall the details in the review questions, and I was sitting there getting frustrated thinking about how I couldn't have answered the questions either. And that was after listening several times through the chapter in the car and then reading it. And finally I realized that I really didn't care if he learned all of this stuff. I thought that I would care about expanding beyond the standard material covered in western history, but when it came down to struggling over it, I realized that I didn't. All that is to say that the way we managed SOTW4 was that I just skipped over chapters that I felt were unimportant. Can you be a functioning member of society without knowing about this event? Well I had for 38 years so... skip! Doing this gave us the extra time needed to add depth with other books from the library... which is supposed to be the whole point of the classical model, right? There's always time to go back over the missed topics in logic or rhetoric stages. Maybe we never will but... sometimes you have to tell yourself that or drive your kid crazy trying to cram a whole college-level education into grammar stage...

I found the requirements for WWE to be unrealistic for my child. There is just no way he could completely memorize the whole dictation with two reads and then write it. I repeated it and had him say it with me as many times as necessary in order for him to get it down. I also wrote down some of the words I thought might be a challenge for him to spell on a whiteboard, and that also helped serve as a memory prompt as he wrote. If he forgot in the middle of writing it what the rest was, I had him recite it out loud from the beginning. You'd be surprised how often they actually remember the whole passage this way. If he couldn't, I'd read the whole thing to him. As others have said, the important thing is that you are not feeding them one word at a time as they write. The point is that they are supposed to be able to hold a complete thought in their head as they write. Eventually it will be their own complete thoughts they have to get down on paper. And now that I think about it, ds has got that one down. In WWS, I'm struggling to keep him from skipping the preparatory steps and jumping straight to the final summary/description/whatever he is supposed to write. He trusts too much on the ability to work all of his thoughts out in his head. So I guess all of my allowances in WWE 3/4 didn't hold him back in that regard.

After reading SWB's recommendation to delay WWS until 6th grade, I started out 5th grade using PHP's Creative Writer. I thought it would be a fun break from the drudgery of "academic" writing. Ds really liked it, but we only used it for a few months before I dropped it. It felt like I was trying to do too much and he was getting bogged down with all the assignments he had. Fifth grade was the first year I was having him hand write all of his narrations/summaries/notes himself rather than me taking dictation from him. So actually, he ended up getting a lot of writing practice just with science, geography, and writing summaries of his literature readings. This year we're back to WWS, and he is doing just fine. I don't think it hurt to take a year off from formal writing, and it probably was a benefit to him as well since WWS is challenging and I need him to be independent so I can focus on younger dd.

History has always been a struggle for us, and this is what I decided to do for logic stage. It's working well for us so far. We're using DK History of the World as our spine and then using All Through the Ages as a book list for supplemental reading. Ds has to read the chapter in DK and take notes. Then he reads supplemental books of his choice and takes notes on the nonfiction and summarizes the fiction. And that's it. Maybe we'll worry about analysis and fact memorization in high school. For now I'm just happy when he smiles and tells me he likes the book he's reading.

So after long deliberation, I finally decided that when we finish SM6B in a couple months, that we'll stick with Singapore and do the Dimensions series. If I understand correctly, the answers to most, but not all, of the problems are in the back of the textbook. If I want all the answers, I have to buy the teacher's guide. I'm a little irritated that I'll have to spend $60/year just for a few answers. I'm hoping that somebody out there knows of some secret place I can go to get an answer key for those few questions without having to buy the whole guide. OR, perhaps I'm underestimating my need for the full solutions. I was an A student in math, and while it's been a long time and I've forgotten most everything, I'm still banking on my ability to pick it back up quickly enough that we can get by with just an answer key. But if anyone wants to explain the benefits of owning the teacher guide to help me feel better about the purchase, I will welcome that too! I have used only the text, workbook, and answer key for the primary level. I'm also wondering if anyone knows exactly what essential geometry topics we won't have covered by the end of 8B. I expect we'll finish 8B halfway through 8th grade, and my plan is that we'll finish out 8th covering whatever needs to be covered in order to say that we did Algebra I and Geometry. And what's the best resource to do that with without buying a $100 geometry textbook?

If I finish up Singapore 6 A & B by the end of fall semester and then did Dimensions 7A for the spring semester, would that constitute all necessary pre-algebra topics? Could we go to another Algebra I program from there? I actually really like the looks of NEM and Dimensions. I think integrating geometry in with the algebra and trig topics instead of taking a year off of algebra to forget everything is brilliant. If they hadn't cut the last two years of NEM I'd have already made up my mind on what to do next. I'm still a little unclear on what level a student is on at the end of year 8. My understanding is that a student will have the equivalent of algebra I plus some additional topics from geometry and algebra II, but not enough to have completed the full courses. So those would have to be repeated. I'm not sure whether the time spent in those topics in Dimensions would be beneficial for the full course later, or whether the repetition is unnecessary. I'd like to know what others' experiences with that have been.

Hmmm... you're probably right, but since I already bought Singapore 6, I was hoping to salvage it by just supplementing. I'll have to give it more thought. I haven't totally ruled out AoPS. I'm just not sure whether or not I like the style. I'm concerned it could produce more tears than necessary. My son is pretty bright and he is gradually liking math more and more. So I could see him taking to it well. But the whole method of trying to get the student to figure out the problems before actually giving them the lesson on it... I just don't know. I do like how it appears to be written to the student and could be done independently. That is a huge plus. And that they do have preview pages, so it wouldn't be a blind decision like most of the other options out there. I will probably have my son read through the sample lessons and see what he thinks before making a final decision.

We've been using Singapore math quite happily, so I really didn't even consider whether we should do anything other than 6A and B this year. We're about 7 weeks in and since I'm ridiculously compulsive about planning for the next year in advance, I've started reading up on pre-algebra and algebra texts. So I'm only just now figuring out that Singapore 6 is largely review. I put the question to my son and he affirmed that it is all review and very easy. So we're going to start moving through the book at a quicker pace and I expect to finish up early spring. Now I've got to figure out what to do to finish out the year. I've narrowed down my options to Jacobs or Foerster. It's very difficulty to make a decision when there aren't any sample pages online that I can find, but based on reviews it seems like those would be the best. From what I've gathered, there isn't enough in Singapore to go straight into an Algebra I course, but that Jacobs has a good bit of review at the beginning that would make it possible. It also sounds like it might be friendlier towards a younger student (he will be 11 when he's ready). It sounds like the Foerster format is more straightforward and this might be a better fit for us, and the text is also a good bit less expensive (also a big consideration). I see that some people have done some Keys to Algebra books to fill in the gaps between Singapore and Algebra, but I haven't been able to figure out which books are necessary. Advice on that would be appreciated. I'd also like input on the feasibility of doing Foerster as a young 7th grader. Any other suggestions on how to cap Singapore 6 before entering Algebra I are welcome. In my own personal experience, I thought Algebra I was a complete bore as it was all review from pre-Algebra and I didn't learn a single new thing. So I wasn't planning on having my son do pre-Algebra unless I determine it is really necessary.I was also a fairly strong math student, and while I've forgotten how to do higher level math, I'm counting on my ability to pick it back up along the way. So I'm not planning on investing in a more expensive DVD course. Thanks in advance for your suggestions and input!

I own the second edition so these may be things you already addressed in the third: For kindergarten, I followed your advice that a math curriculum wasn't needed. I think that would work for someone who isn't as regimented as I am. I like to systematically make sure I'm checking all the boxes so to speak. I ended up buying a book halfway through the year and I think it was much more helpful than just trying to freestyle it. For math, Saxon is your curriculum of choice and you gave a lot of information on it. I believe Singapore was mentioned in the list of resources but not a lot of information was given. I settled on Miquon and then decided after a couple of years that my son really needed a mastery based program and we have been very happy with Singapore. I think an expanded explanation of Singapore and a comparison of the styles of the two big curriculums would be helpful to parents trying to figure out which one is best. I have been using almost all of your recommendations in WTM and just about everything PHP publishes and it has all been great so far! Going into sixth grade this fall, I did end up rejecting your recommendation for pre-logic because it seemed too teacher intensive. My daughter is starting first grade and I really needed to find as much that my son could do independently as possible. I settled on Bluedorn. Along that line of thought, it would be very helpful to have information on how to juggle two or more kids. I agree with the previous suggestion to put all of your lectures into a book. I am just more of a book person - it's more efficient to read than listen. Would definitely buy it! I also agree with previous suggestion to give more guidance on high school. We still have a few years to go but we'll be looking for that information before we know it.

We did SOTW 4 last year. The outlines are pretty simple and my son actually found them easier to do than the review questions and narrations. He also did the write from the outline exercises without problem (just complaining of the quantity of writing he had to do).

My son did WWE1 in 1st grade. I did not use a separate handwriting curriculum. My son complained of his hand hurting a lot, which I think is supposed to be typical of boys. Anyway, I find that I tend to do too much when left to my own judgment. The copywork in WWE1 was much less than what I would have given him on my own, so it actually worked out quite well. I also feel that WWE did a good job of preparing him for the narration skills he needed for SOTW. For that reason, I would not advise delaying it to the next year.