Ways to improve processing speed? (15yo)

[rbk mama]

So DS is officially 2e, which we've suspected for a long time, but now he's been tested.  He has a nearly 70 point difference between visual/spacial reasoning and processing speed (99.7 and 30).  He is dyslexic and 15 yo.

 

I'm seeing a lot of information on how to accommodate a slower processing speed, but not much on how to actually improve processing speed.  Some software brain games claim to do this, but the evidence is shaky (maybe these are just too new to tell yet?)  BrainHQ, Lumosity...  Anyone try these?

 

Any other ideas out there for how to improve processing speed?

[PeterPan]

Anecdotally, meds if they diagnosed ADHD.  

 

The only thing *I've* seen mentioned on the boards that came with data to back them up (like before and after numbers) were people doing Interactive Metronome.  We've had two people go from single digits processing speed to 30s.  As you're finding, as sucky low as your ds' is (like my dd's), it goes much lower.  So for those people, it was this ASTONISHING, earth-shattering bump.  

 

I can't promise you that bump, but I can say that doing metronome work, combined with midline, combined with working memory exercises, WAS incredibly, incredibly pivotal for my dd.  Heathermomster has posted some explanations on how to do it for free, and it's DEFINITELY worth 15 minutes of your lives for a few weeks to try.  You never know, and the price is FREE.  

 

The only software with any research behind it is Cogmed, and basically it's a use it/lose it kinda thing.  They're trying to improve working memory (which you can do with him yourself for free), and as soon as you stop using it you'll lose what you gained.  Cogmed is wicked expensive too, like $1500 around here.

 

We got some bumps in EF with VT.  (vision therapy)  I'm not saying dyslexia is vision, but if he happens to also have some vision problems (which some dyslexics will), then it can be a side benefit.

 

How is he with tech?  How is he with organization?  

 

If you just got your results, I wouldn't do anything super-expensive right now.  There are too many emotions, too much wanting to spend anything to fix things.  The metronome work is free and it will give you something to do while you research and weigh your options.  You'll find in your site searching that I used the Cusimano workbook for working memory.  It's not expensive.

 

Can he type?  When is the time it most shows up?  Honestly, for dd, we've moved on.  I couldn't find a way to fix it, so we use all the tools we DO have, accommodate, move on.  But I get that it sucks.  It really sucks.  

Edited October 29, 2016 by OhElizabeth

[geodob]

RBK, the 3 Processing Speed Index tests, are basically visual-motor tests.

So that to 'improve his processing speed'?

It is to improve his visual-motor speed.

 

Though what could be helpful, is to have a look at the 3 Processing Speed tests, and understand what they are actually testing?

Here's a link to the WISC-IV subtests.  Where the ones to look at are: 'Coding, Symbol Search and Cancellation'.

Also have a look at his scores on each them?

 

http://www.thinktonight.com/WISC_IV_subtests_s/331.htm

 

With the images for each test, you can right click on them, and save them as photo images. 

Then you can open them, and see them more clearly.

 

If you understand each of the tests, you could develop your own exercises.

[rbk mama]

Thanks OhElizabeth!  I will search out Heathermonster's posts about Interactive Metronome.  I read information on their site about it, and it sounds interesting.  What types of midline exercises did you find most useful?

 

DS's working memory was 79 - not too bad, but not in line with his other strengths - visual/spacial reasoning and fluid reasoning.  His typing is just OK - needs to work on that (not sure what else you meant by tech?)  And he needs help with organization. 

 

 

Thanks geodob for that interesting link!  I was thrown off a bit by the purpose of that info -- do people actually prepare their children to take these tests?  Anyway, I appreciated the specific games/products they list for specifically working on processing speed and other areas tested.  Thank you!

[PeterPan]

Fwiw, my dd's psych eval and low processing speed scores were *after* her VT, where they worked on (and noticeably improved) her visual processing speed.  But I have no clue how they test or what her scores would have been pre-VT.

 

Heathermomster's instructions include some crossing the midline.  Think your nose, a line of symmetry down your middle.  ANYTHING where one side crosses that line is crossing the midline.  When you do this, your brain tries to make the connections between ITS two sides, which is the real magic.  So the theory is low connectivity across there results in poor communication across sides resulting in glitches in things that use both sides of the brain.  So when you have a complex task, you need the parts to work together.  But I'm not an expert on this.

 

Really, my theory with my dd was to do things in our therapy time that REPLICATED the brain processes and motor planning processes I needed to occur in her glitched areas.  For instance, she was having a lot of trouble with writing.  So I wanted her to be able to motor plan AND use language AND organize AND have enough working memory to hold all that AND handle distractions.  That's how complex writing is, and that's what I could make happen with Heathermomster's metronome exercises the way I did them.  My posts will be in with hers, so just site search.   :)

 

You really can just make it up.  You can cross a basketball, bouncing from right hand to left and back.  That's a common, normal exercise, but do that to a metronome to step it up.  Or tap the opposite leg.  ANYTHING you make up will do.  Be age-appropriate and fit their interests.

 

Remember, if you can't improve one area, you can improve ANOTHER area to compensate.  So say you can't improve his processing speed much.  Fine, but you could improve his typing or his working memory, and improving the other things would help him compensate and function better.  Don't get stuck on what you *can't* improve.  Focus on what you can.  

 

For typing, I had to move my dd to Dvorak and I had to pay her.  That would be a huge one to work on, seems to me.  You could improve all his output just by improving his typing.  I paid my dd, and I paid her heavily.  This was a few years ago (5?), and I gave her $1 per wpm (word per minute) total for any month in which she increased by at least 5.  Now, with inflation and given your ds' age, I'd pay $2 or even $3 per wpm, kwim?  Like really, really incentivize this.  This is a BIG DEAL.  And if it's not working, figure out why.  Table height, needs OT, is pecking, needs a change, whatever it's going to take.

 

Yes, for organization, you're looking at Inspiration software, that kind of thing.  Don Potts (if the name is right) has great stuff.

 

By tech, I mean like an ipad, laptop, smartphone, etc.  They sound like luxuries, but for kids with EF issues and SN they really can be game changers, necessities. 

Edited October 30, 2016 by OhElizabeth

[PeterPan]

That 79 is percentage, not digits. You might look it up to see. 

[shinyhappypeople]

Anecdotally, meds if they diagnosed ADHD.  

 

The only thing *I've* seen mentioned on the boards that came with data to back them up (like before and after numbers) were people doing Interactive Metronome.  We've had two people go from single digits processing speed to 30s.  As you're finding, as sucky low as your ds' is (like my dd's), it goes much lower.  So for those people, it was this ASTONISHING, earth-shattering bump.  

 

 

OhElizabeth,

 

Does the processing speed of "30s" refer to percentile or the score?  So, DD's score was low 60s, her percentile was 1%.  I'm wondering if some of these things might help her.  And, if it's percentile, holy cow bringing it up to the 30% would be a game changer.

 

OP: I found this video (and the book they wrote) really helpful: Webinar - Processing Speed 101

[rbk mama]

OhElizabeth - thanks for clarifying!  I hadn't really thought about the tech options you mentioned.  He has a laptop and uses an ipad for his biology ibook, but that's it.  And really on the laptop he just uses Word and a teeny bit of excel.  I haven't explored organizational tools for him - probably because I am not tech-savvy myself with that stuff.  Was just talking with a friend about how I need to use Google calendar to get more organized as our schedule is nuts this year.  I am very low-tech.

 

And I had not thought about how hugely important typing is for him, and that I need to make that more of a big deal for him to improve.  Maybe lessen some of his academic load to make room for that.  I love your idea of a big incentive!

 

I've been thinking about the IM and midline exercises and how to make that happen without him feeling self-conscious - there are three other kids in the house.  One is older and would be supportive, but the younger two just being around would make this DS not want to do it.  I need to think of how to help him over that.  I like the basketball idea because that's good for his basketball handling skills anyway.

 

 

[rbk mama]

That 79 is percentage, not digits. You might look it up to see. 

 

 

OhElizabeth,

 

Does the processing speed of "30s" refer to percentile or the score?  So, DD's score was low 60s, her percentile was 1%.  I'm wondering if some of these things might help her.  And, if it's percentile, holy cow bringing it up to the 30% would be a game changer.

 

OP: I found this video (and the book they wrote) really helpful: Webinar - Processing Speed 101

 

The numbers I mentioned are percentiles (from the WISC-5) - sorry, I am very new to this whole area and maybe that's not the way you're supposed to speak of them.  I know that 30th percentile doesn't sound horrible, but what is significant is the huge difference between that number and his scores on visual/spAcial reasoning and fluid reasoning. 

 

 

Thanks for the video link - that is helpful in understand what processing speed is.  Their conclusions were to:  Accept, Accommodate, and Advocate.  And maybe that's that.  But I want to explore ways to possibly improve processing speed at the same time as we're accommodating.  I like OhElizabeth's ideas in that last post.

[PeterPan]

I think your triple As are where you're headed, unfortunately, but you can *compensate* by making other things stronger.  You mentioned siblings.  They can be good for distraction, but I agree compliance is huge.  Motivators can help.  Starting *without* the siblings around would be good.  If a task is going to be hard, you want to remove a lot of variables.  

 

I think I would just be truthful.  Tell him what you're wanting to do, why, and for how long.  Make some kind of rational deal, like 15 minutes a day for 3 weeks, see if it seems to be making progress, evaluate, and continue or drop.

[Incognito]

You mentioned dyslexia.  It is expensive, but Fast ForWord was a program we were recommended that targets phonological processing and does "brain training".  

It was amazing how much my child's ability to handle information at a quicker pace changed (before, my child never had enough time to respond to people before they'd reiterate to try to help my child hear what they'd said, but then my child had to process THAT re-wording and anyways, talking with people outside the family was almost torturous.  After, my child could respond and have a back and forth conversation with people.  Mind blowing).  BUT, FFW is mind numbing.  So, that may be a hard sell with a teen.  And it is pricey.  

 

FWIW, we have also done CogMed, after FFW.  It was an interesting program, mostly targeting building working memory (at least for my child, I suppose it adjusts to the needs of the user?).  We didn't see much of a difference, although there was possibly an improvement in holding words in their head for dictation.

 

Also, FWIW, we had a vision therapist give us some stuff to do that must have been metronome type work, but my child could not do it.  Just couldn't.  Really, no matter how slow we went.  I ended up having my child start playing an instrument, and that provided a non-stigmatizing therapy-like work on that sort of stuff.  It has made a difference if I look back over the years we've been doing it, but it has not been the quick miracle-type change that FFW was for us.  Oh, we did have other exercises from the vision therapist which included crossing the midline and dpbq distinguishing stuff which we could and did do, and it did seem to bring a little improvement in some things.

 

Regarding technology, I am right with you on the lack of tech-savvy-ness, but am seeing as my 2e child with a similar profile to yours is aging, I am going to have to find a way to learn more to open doors for them.  There are a LOT of tools out there that seem really great.  Understood is a website that posts a fair bit of informative stuff about LDs and different technologies that support people with them (and it posts other informative things too about LDs, but the tech I find especially eye opening).

 

 

Edited October 30, 2016 by Incognito

[PeterPan]

Incognito, how did you get FFW? 

[PeterPan]

 

Also, FWIW, we had a vision therapist give us some stuff to do that must have been metronome type work, but my child could not do it.  Just couldn't.  Really, no matter how slow we went.  I ended up having my child start playing an instrument, and that provided a non-stigmatizing therapy-like work on that sort of stuff.  It has made a difference if I look back over the years we've been doing it, but it has not been the quick miracle-type change that FFW was for us.  

 

My ds' starting point was very low like this.  He could not even do a single clap but would go right into hyper-clap.  Working on it with him at that level we saw overall changes in timing and motor planning.  So in his swim class, teachers started commenting that his motor planning was going better.  In gymnastics, I noticed his ability to jump on the running trampoline seemed more in-sync.  He had seemed just very out of kilter, not able to time and jump fluidly like the other kids.  

 

My dd's bump was with EF and ability to pull things together, but as you say her starting point was much, much higher.  She was doing complex work with me, and it improved her ability to handle the complexity of writing.  But yes, her starting point was MUCH higher than ds'.

 

Here's an article that explains (for the op) some of the ins and outs of FFW that I didn't know.  I had usually heard it mentioned for APD.  It seems to hit a number of areas.  Some of the studies seem odd, like ones comparing it with LIPS and Earobics and hoping any of those would bump reading in and of themselves.  Or there was a studied that complained that OG seemed to bump reading more than FFW.  Well duh... But it looks like they're marketing an elementary language product and an upper grade literacy version.  How old were Incognito's dc and which level did they use?  Are they different?  

 

Why was FFW boring?  Usually computer software attempts to be fun.

[Heathermomster]

OP, you can't bump processing speed.

 

My DS uses BrainHq by direction from his CBT, and the program is used to to help teach DS goal directed persistence and independent goal setting. The exercises area hard and the CBT sees value in DS performing difficult and boring tasks.

[PeterPan]

OP, you can't bump processing speed.

 

My DS uses BrainHq by direction from his CBT, and the program is used to to help teach DS goal directed persistence and independent goal setting. The exercises area hard and the CBT sees value in DS performing difficult and boring tasks.

 

:D  I love it when people say it straight.  And the research shows FFW is only helping people who actually have speech/language issues.  If that's not what you need to work on, still no help.  And the data seems to be showing that there's not a difference in outcome with doing an equivalent amount of time in direct speech therapy, etc. And, when you think about it, our kids need to process MORE than auditory inputs. The hardest thing for dd is her own thoughts!  So math, foreign languages, anything that just requires raw brain CPU, is just really slow for her.  

 

Your ds sounds like a trooper for doing the exercises.  How does he feel about them?  Has he seen any improvement to keep him motivated?  

 

You know there are studies and articles about handwriting being the old-fashioned cognitive therapy.  Same idea, boring, required, tedious, blah blah.  Just isn't a workable option for kids with some disabilities, but it sort of makes sense to me in general.  

[PeterPan]

https://etd.ohiolink.edu/rws_etd/document/get/dayton1375393381/inline

 

There's a link, but there have been quite a few studies on FFW.  This article boils it down to the idea that the populations that had speech/language issues were benefiting but that applying it to say a school as a whole did *not* give the same bumps.  

 

And I'm not saying I'm down on FFW.  If I had access to it affordably, I'd try it in a heartbeat.  But they're secretive, terribly $$ (like Cogmed), etc., and the data isn't completely supporting it as the only way.  I got similar bumps doing LIPS and the GPP from Super Duper.  And that's what some of the data is showing, that other therapies, done in equivalent amounts, got similar results.  The bummer seems to be the non-specificity of the tools, that it's really expensive to run precise tools to show what actually changed, so they don't.  They just run these vague tools (did reading improve).  

Edited October 30, 2016 by OhElizabeth

[Pawz4me]

OP, you can't bump processing speed.

 

My DS uses BrainHq by direction from his CBT, and the program is used to to help teach DS goal directed persistence and independent goal setting. The exercises area hard and the CBT sees value in DS performing difficult and boring tasks.

 

Did you mean to say can't? Or should that be can? I'm confused in light of your next paragraph. Is what your DS does with BrainHq supposed to help directly with processing speed?

[PeterPan]

Nope, she means can't.  Because, in general, that's the answer.  Like you might bump visual processing speed with VT, improve how they process sounds/language, etc., sure.  But that overall, CPU thing is, from everything I've seen, not budging.  It's why the op's psych said to accept and accommodate.  I'm not a psych or an expert, but just saying that's what I've seen.  But, you know, I'm all for people doing things that they say can't be done!  :)  But I do think it's helpful to split hairs and figure out exactly what the therapies are improving and not just have it be a vague thing, like be really precise so the person can say yes the data supports that it will improve the precise thing my dc is dealing with.

 

The CBT and software is for EF, for attention, for strategies, not for processing speed.  

 

Just as a total rabbit trail, the ability to handle things that are boring is chemical in the brain.  It's part of what is low with ADHD and why they crave novelty.  So if it's chemistry, not wiring, I wonder (just rambling here) if it's something that could regress or that only holds as you use it?

[PeterPan]

We've talked about this on LC before, but there's data/research showing video games improve processing speed.  Some of us have *intentionally* increased video game use in our kids to see if it would help.  And you'll find that kids with low processing speed aren't necessarily drawn to the games.  Op, will your dc play video games?  Wii, PS3, etc., does he like them?  Temple Run or racing apps, likes?  

 

And then, when using that blanket term "processing speed" you start to see the breakdown.  Maybe you improve one kind of processing, an aspect, but did it improve function overall for the task you were trying to improve?  Tasks are COMPLEX, so lots of things have to come together.  Maybe my dd's writing improved because I had her playing a lot of WII at the same time as we were doing metronome work, hehe.  We weren't doing just one thing.  

 

I mean, it's sort of obvious that playing video games and getting faster at them will improve only the things that are using that wiring.  I think if it's hard for a kid, they should do it more!  Like if Wii is hard for them, get them a Wii and do it for school, absolutely.  But does the data show that's going to improve his ability to process math?  Dunno.

[shinyhappypeople]

OP: In the adult world, slow processing speed isn't that big of a deal.   As long as my daughter chooses a profession that doesn't require super-quick thinking on her feet, she'll be fine.  Perhaps the best thing you can do for your son now is to make sure that accommodations are in place (e.g. extra time on tests) so he can truly show what he knows in school, and take his slower processing speed into account for college and career planning. So ER doc?  Probably not.  Medical researcher?  Yes. 

 

Creative fields appeal to my DD (cosmetology, special effects make up, mural art) and her processing speed doesn't get in the way of her work at all.  In fact, "slow, thoughtful, and careful" are actually benefits not deficits in these jobs.  

 

Another thing I've found helpful:  reframing  how I think of slow processing speed.  It's not necessary to label this cognitive style (and that's all it is, a cognitive style, a way of thinking) in terms of good or bad.  It just is what it is.  My daughter has brown eyes, is good at dancing, has a sophisticated sense of humor and works (and thinks)  in a slow, thoughtful, careful manner.  There are some things she can't do (or simply don't appeal) because of her processing speed, but we all have limitations.  Welcome to Planet Reality.

 

Anyway, the above is what has helped me come to terms with DD's glacially slow processing speed.   It could be so much worse.  She could be a humorless jerk.  Now, that would be hard to deal with.

[PeterPan]

Just to pick up what Shiny is saying, Dyslexic Advantage goes into some of the newer studies on brain structures that are behind the slower processing.  As she's saying, sometimes slower actually means making more connections, being more creative, etc.  The distance between the mini-columns is REALLY long on some of these kids, making them wicked slow.  Even if your label is not dyslexic, the book is worth reading.

[rbk mama]

I hear what you are saying, and that's been what I've found in my small amount of research - that in general, slower processing speed needs to be accepted and accomodated, and there's not much you can do to change it.  Maybe I haven't gotten to that first part fully - acceptance.  Not because of any test result, but because the reality is so frustrating for my kid.  It's also hard to believe with our brains' elasticity that there's nothing you can do.

 

Interesting thought about video games - DS enjoys video games, all different kinds.  It makes sense that kids with lower processing speed would not be drawn to these, but he likes them.  ?? I'm going to ask him more specifics about the games he likes and those he doesn't - I'm curious.

 

We still have a few more follow-up meetings with the neuropsych so we can get his opinion on what we can do in addition to accommodation.  He isn't the one who mentioned the 3A's - that was from the video linked by shinyhappy.

 

I love that book Dyslexic Advantage!  When you have a dyslexic kid, that book gives you goosebumps. O/T, but that book makes me wonder if a majority of dyslexic people are 2e?

 

 

 

 

[Heathermomster]

Did you mean to say can't? Or should that be can? I'm confused in light of your next paragraph. Is what your DS does with BrainHq supposed to help directly with processing speed?

I mean cannot ie can't. The CBT felt that there might be a bump with working memory but not processing speed.

 

I address BrainHQ because my DS actually uses it by direction of the CBT and has done so since May for EF issues like directed persistence and goal setting.

 

BrainHQ provides data to support processing speed improvement for stroke victims and the elderly.

Edited October 31, 2016 by Heathermomster

[Heathermomster]

:D I love it when people say it straight. And the research shows FFW is only helping people who actually have speech/language issues. If that's not what you need to work on, still no help. And the data seems to be showing that there's not a difference in outcome with doing an equivalent amount of time in direct speech therapy, etc. And, when you think about it, our kids need to process MORE than auditory inputs. The hardest thing for dd is her own thoughts! So math, foreign languages, anything that just requires raw brain CPU, is just really slow for her.

 

Your ds sounds like a trooper for doing the exercises. How does he feel about them? Has he seen any improvement to keep him motivated?

 

You know there are studies and articles about handwriting being the old-fashioned cognitive therapy. Same idea, boring, required, tedious, blah blah. Just isn't a workable option for kids with some disabilities, but it sort of makes sense to me in general.

Koopa has shifted from daily 30 min BrainHQ exercises down to 20 minutes at 3 times per week.

 

I asked DS what he thought about the exercises, and he tells me they are challenging but not killer hard. I think they are boring, but he just does them. I'm tired of paying for it and will be glad when it ends. He actually has seen improvement within the BrainHQ sw that helps keep him motivated; however, being able to practice and play 8 man tackle football are his true motivations. If his work is not completed, he does not play. It really is that simple.

 

My son's processing speed issues are totally rooted in motor. If he has improved with academics as a result of any therapies, I cannot tell because the stinker is so blasted smart to begin with and compensates very well. This school year, his difficulties are with academic essay organization.

Edited October 31, 2016 by Heathermomster

[PeterPan]

Fwiw, it's not like the whole question of bumping processing speed with software is without data.  Cogmed puts their data on their website as studies come out.  If it was a simple thing, they'd be doing it.

 

I think that's fascinating that he enjoys the video games so much!  Were they hard at first and then improved?  Have they always been easy?  Are they games he shies away from?  It's a pretty complex thing too, because you have vision, distractions, focus, VMI (visual motor integration).  My ds never really struggled the way my dd did.  You expect that with gender, but I think it's brain differences too.

 

I think the plasticity issue comes into play with WIRING.  Absolutely you can make more wiring.  But if it's structural, you're not gonna grow more mini-columns, kwim? (says the woman who is not a brain scientist)

Edited October 30, 2016 by OhElizabeth

[shinyhappypeople]

I hear what you are saying, and that's been what I've found in my small amount of research - that in general, slower processing speed needs to be accepted and accomodated, and there's not much you can do to change it.  Maybe I haven't gotten to that first part fully - acceptance.  Not because of any test result, but because the reality is so frustrating for my kid.  It's also hard to believe with our brains' elasticity that there's nothing you can do.

 

Yup, your first job is acceptance.  Start there and stay as long as you need.  Your son has processing speed that's a little slow.  I know it's hard, especially as a mom.   To just give up and go "this ain't changing, accept it," felt almost sacrilegious to the Mama Bear in me.  We want to *fix* whatever appears to be wrong with our kids, you know? 

 

But what if nothing is wrong with your son?  What if his cognitive style is a completely normal variation, just like being double jointed or excelling at sports or...?  

 

I have found it helpful to deschool myself from the public school mindset.  That mindset is so focused on standardizing our kids, worshiping at the altar of sameness, grading them like they're sides of beef or something, that any variation to the left of the bell curve is seen as disastrous. It's not a disaster, it's not a disability, it's just a difference.  

 

It's not always a walk in the park.  Sometimes my daughters processing speed leaves me doing this in slo-mo  :banghead:  whenever I need her to get a move on and get out the door to be somewhere on time.  When we're running late (again) and she's in the bathroom finishing getting ready, I have literally leaned against the hallway outside the bathroom, taken deep cleansing breaths and whispered - in absolute sincerity - the Serenity Prayer.  Me losing my temper or haranguing her makes this worse (learned from experience).  I have to use my super-calm Mr. Rogers voice and remind her that everything is fine, being a few minutes late isn't the end of the world, and just complete one step at a time... and yeah, maybe put your shoes on in the car.

 

:grouphug: 

[PeterPan]

Maybe I haven't gotten to that first part fully - acceptance.  Not because of any test result, but because the reality is so frustrating for my kid.  It's also hard to believe with our brains' elasticity that there's nothing you can do.

 

You might have a sit-down with him and see when it's most problematic for him and think through all the factors in those situations and what you could improve.  My dd has an unusual amount of freedom for her age.  I don't know how much freedom you give your ds and how much he wants, but I'm just saying my dd is on the unusual end of that.  (Like she has a credit card, buys the groceries, drove herself out of state for a couple months, etc.)  I find that the more you empower your kids and give them freedom and flexibility, the more they can problem solve this stuff.  My dd might have a low processing speed, but she finds her own ways to compensate.  

 

It would suck if he's frustrated by the speed issue because he's STUCK in situations that could CHANGE.  That's the global level stuff Shiny is talking about.  I'm all for improving working memory, etc., sure.  But there is a point where my dd just got really happy with herself when she had freedom to do things her own way.  We ALL have funky weak points, and as adults we self-select things that work for us.  Youth/school sucks because people are choosing for you.  

 

You may be able to shift your dynamic as he matures and as you empower him with choices over the next couple years.

 

For example, Shiny mentioned waiting.  I don't wait for my dd.  If she's late, no biggee, drive yourself.  And there are consequences to that (paying for gas, etc.).  I'm just saying there ARE ways around that.  Give them some freedom to fail or be individual or try things a different way or DROP things.  So much is not really necessary.  We have a lot more flex than our anxiety lets us think.

Edited October 31, 2016 by OhElizabeth

[Heathermomster]

OhElizabeth - thanks for clarifying!  I hadn't really thought about the tech options you mentioned.  He has a laptop and uses an ipad for his biology ibook, but that's it.  And really on the laptop he just uses Word and a teeny bit of excel.  I haven't explored organizational tools for him - probably because I am not tech-savvy myself with that stuff.  Was just talking with a friend about how I need to use Google calendar to get more organized as our schedule is nuts this year.  I am very low-tech.

 

And I had not thought about how hugely important typing is for him, and that I need to make that more of a big deal for him to improve.  Maybe lessen some of his academic load to make room for that.  I love your idea of a big incentive!

 

I've been thinking about the IM and midline exercises and how to make that happen without him feeling self-conscious - there are three other kids in the house.  One is older and would be supportive, but the younger two just being around would make this DS not want to do it.  I need to think of how to help him over that.  I like the basketball idea because that's good for his basketball handling skills anyway.

I wanted to comment on tech since you have the iPad and it can be awesome for these kiddos.  DS uses an app called VoiceDream and reads/listens to all but one of his school books using BookShare.  BookShare is a free service for individuals with print disability.  With the VoiceDream app, DS changes the reading speed, pitch, and voice for books.    

 

We have explored using tech for organization and found that a basic academic organizer works best.  We tried to make electronic organizers work but couldn't.  My son must keep his written assignments in front of him as he works.  DS will set timers on his phone to remind himself when very specific things must be done; however, pen and paper work best for us.  DS sits down with me to go over work assignments, and then the planner sits open and nearby for him to see his schedule.  DS checks off little boxes as his work is completed.  Prepping son's backpack to leave the house the next day for outside classes and appointments are built into the schedule.  Wake-up times are covered with the organizer as well so that we are not hurried or late in the morning.  

 

For midline exercises, DS used an elliptical and weights.  He currently plays football and does agility type exercises at practice.  The midline exercises benefit everyone, so maybe incorporate the entire family.  

[PeterPan]

I so agree with Heather.  If you're not techy yourself, my advice is get out of the way.  Give the tech to your kid and let HIM figure out how he can use it.  Or, if he's not a pro-active person and needs a little help, then talk it through.  Like hey, I've heard you can use the Cloud to sync stuff... Would that be something that could help you?  Screen shots, would those help you?  Calendars that sync to all devices, alarms, timers, would those help you?

 

We too use extensive alarms, and they'll sync across your devices with the Cloud.  Your files will sync.  You can set up Evernote on the devices and have things sync across devices.  We use Dropbox a lot.  

 

I hate to make it sound like I'm bragging, but the tech has been so helpful.  Heather's ds is using paper.  My dd keeps a big Pages (like Word) file on her imac that has all the assignments for the week typed out.  It's really nifty!  I didn't teach her that.  She just figured it out herself.  Every class, typed out like some kind of tree or outline.  And on a mac you can swipe and have limitless desktop surfaces, so she just puts that file on a surface, looks at it, then swipes to go back to where she's working.  

 

The biggest thing is the Cloud and thinking through what could help him to have stuff synced to ALL devices.  If the ipad isn't his, like with him at all times, it's not really getting used by him to the max, kwim?  Cell phone/smart phone, does he have one?  Iwatch?  You realize these are the greatest devices known to mankind for EF issues?  And then things sync to all the devices, so the alarms are on your phone AND your ipad AND your laptop AND...  So no matter where you are, it's reminding you, keeping you on-track, ubiquitous, always there.

 

Apple has their own calendars system, sorta like the Google calendars gig, that syncs across all devices.  Yes, yes you should be getting him access to this stuff!  Ours are color-coordinated, so each person has their own colors of calendars, and within that they have breakdowns.  So dd has a school calendar, a personal calendar, a social calendar, etc. And then you can select the calendars that you want to appear on a given device and which ones you don't.  I have a similar list of calendars.  So that way someone can have their personal calendar items that don't appear on everyone's devices.  

 

My dd uses screenshots in her online classes, because she can capture assignments exactly as they were given, rather than typing them and having errors.

 

[MysteryJen]

Yup, your first job is acceptance.  Start there and stay as long as you need.  Your son has processing speed that's a little slow.  I know it's hard, especially as a mom.   To just give up and go "this ain't changing, accept it," felt almost sacrilegious to the Mama Bear in me.  We want to *fix* whatever appears to be wrong with our kids, you know? 

 

But what if nothing is wrong with your son?  What if his cognitive style is a completely normal variation, just like being double jointed or excelling at sports or...?  

 

I have found it helpful to deschool myself from the public school mindset.  That mindset is so focused on standardizing our kids, worshiping at the altar of sameness, grading them like they're sides of beef or something, that any variation to the left of the bell curve is seen as disastrous. It's not a disaster, it's not a disability, it's just a difference.  

 

It's not always a walk in the park.  Sometimes my daughters processing speed leaves me doing this in slo-mo  :banghead:  whenever I need her to get a move on and get out the door to be somewhere on time.  When we're running late (again) and she's in the bathroom finishing getting ready, I have literally leaned against the hallway outside the bathroom, taken deep cleansing breaths and whispered - in absolute sincerity - the Serenity Prayer.  Me losing my temper or haranguing her makes this worse (learned from experience).  I have to use my super-calm Mr. Rogers voice and remind her that everything is fine, being a few minutes late isn't the end of the world, and just complete one step at a time... and yeah, maybe put your shoes on in the car.

 

:grouphug: 

 

Great post. The bolded is so important to remember. The only place that slow processing speed hurts dd2 is at school. She is a competitve swimmer and we have never had any problems. In fact, most of her teammates are not sure they believe she has any learning disabilities.

We have told her when she gets discouraged, that in the real world, as opposed to the "school" world, she will be fine. Her speed will be her speed and making careful thought-out decisions will be valued. The next 8 years (ps high school and collegiate swimming) will be the hardest years of her life, as she tries to be like everyone else and is judged on a very narrow scale.

We live by lists and building lots of margin into the schedule. I double the amount of time we need to get anywhere because being rushed results in forgetting and feeling bad about why she can't do things faster and being early is never, ever a problem. She sets timers and has post-it lists all over her room and sticks to a very rigid routine of "everything has a place."

 

Acceptance is the hardest thing. I cried when I got her results from the eval. Because everything was going to be harder for her and there was nothing to do to fix it. But it is what it is, and it is a problem in ps. But not everywhere else. Everywhere else, it is just who she is.

[rbk mama]

Thank you for this real life perspective!  It's so true - school requires a certain mold that is just not required everywhere else.  I needed that.  :-)

 

And OhElizabeth - that isn't being braggy - those details of how you use tech are SO helpful.  I am horrible at organizational stuff and need to learn that myself.  I'm sure I'm not the only one helped by hearing these details.  I like the idea of him figuring out and deciding how he wants to use stuff.  I think we'll both need to spend time exploring these options.  He will definitely need assistance at first. 

[PeterPan]

Did anyone recommend Smart But Scattered?  There are a bunch of books in that vein, if you go to amazon and look.  Your library can get them for you.  They're kind of getting out of date, but take the IDEAS from them and ask how you can push them EVEN FARTHER using tech.

 

[Incognito]

My ds' starting point was very low like this.  He could not even do a single clap but would go right into hyper-clap.  Working on it with him at that level we saw overall changes in timing and motor planning.  So in his swim class, teachers started commenting that his motor planning was going better.  In gymnastics, I noticed his ability to jump on the running trampoline seemed more in-sync.  He had seemed just very out of kilter, not able to time and jump fluidly like the other kids.  

 

My dd's bump was with EF and ability to pull things together, but as you say her starting point was much, much higher.  She was doing complex work with me, and it improved her ability to handle the complexity of writing.  But yes, her starting point was MUCH higher than ds'.

 

Here's an article that explains (for the op) some of the ins and outs of FFW that I didn't know.  I had usually heard it mentioned for APD.  It seems to hit a number of areas.  Some of the studies seem odd, like ones comparing it with LIPS and Earobics and hoping any of those would bump reading in and of themselves.  Or there was a studied that complained that OG seemed to bump reading more than FFW.  Well duh... But it looks like they're marketing an elementary language product and an upper grade literacy version.  How old were Incognito's dc and which level did they use?  Are they different?  

 

Why was FFW boring?  Usually computer software attempts to be fun.

 

I don't see the article.

 

My child was 8, possibly 9 when they used it.  I will admit I don't recall exactly.  I think finished that school year at 9yo.  There are a couple of versions - the older version is targeted to be a little less juvenille for teens/adults.  It is less juvenille, but it is still tedious, mindnumbingly boring games.

About the boring-ness - well, my child was okay with it because they hadn't played many video games yet and they are generally a good sport (and I explained why we were doing it).  Some of the games were "fun", but really, how many different ways can you play sound discrimination and pitch discrimination games?  So for instance, there'd be a repeating sound "buh".  When it would switch to "duh" my child had to click something.  Then a cute little ball would fly into the basket if it was right.  If not, it'd make a "zoop" sound and you'd try again.  As you got more right you'd go up levels and get points.  After 5 minutes you'd be done with that game and do a different one where two pitches would play.  You'd have to indicate if the second pitch was higher or lower than the first.  Then you'd get points and some on-screen animation would happen.  Or there was a memory game with sounds (so when you flip the "card" it made a certain sound, and you'd look for the match).  That one was more "fun", but it also had more visual cues (I *think it had the words or sounds written out, I don't recall), and was way easier for my child because of that, so it was completed sooner.  It alternated months with literacy practice.  That would have games involving reading sentences and finding the picture that matches what it says, matching the audio of a word with the written word, finding definitions, spelling, I don't recall it all.  The phonological processing part of the games really seemed to make a huge difference for my child.  The literacy stuff was good, but wasn't anything I found to be particularly unique.  Well, I suppose it was unique in that it was very intentional, incremental, remembered what the child had learned so it was very attuned to the right level of challenege, and it rotated through games in 5-10 minute increments so it didn't get too boring.  

 

Hope that gives you an idea of it.  I am pretty sure you can just ask to see a sample of it.  I know I was able to play with a sample on the scientific learning website before we did it, however that was a number of years ago and I don't see the samples in the same place now when I look for them.

 

Oh, and as far as the "coach" thing goes, I think it is so expensive because they make sure each person doing it is supervised by someone who knows how it works (a coach), so they make sure the games are working right, the child is being challenged but not totally stuck, and the teacher/parent knows how to make sure it is being done properly.  I can see why they would want that, because it makes sure the product is being used effectively, but I am sure it drives the price up a lot.

 

ETA: You asked where I got it paid for.  We are enrolled under an umbrella school that offers it.  It cost some of our funding $$ (so some of what we are allowed to choose curriculum for), and the school paid some of it out of their learning disabilities allotment from the government.  

Edited October 31, 2016 by Incognito

[MistyMountain]

One of the factors that affects processing speed scores is motor skills and that can be helped with OT. It certainly can at least lead to more functionality. Kids with slow processing speed often need more work to get things to automacity but they can eventually get there with a lot of targeted practice. I think you can also just develop good number sense or decoding skills and that can help with fluency in those areas even with slower processing. It is good too that some people had bumps with IM.

 

One of the possible causes of slow processing speed is a bigger distance between synapses in the brain or I guess the mini columns thing may explain it even better. I want to look into it more. That aspect is something that really cannot be helped but it is good that it does have some advantages too. I do not think you can really speed up certain things. They will improve over time but so do their age cohorts. One difficulty that is very common is that multi tasking tends to be very difficult so picking things that do not require a lot of that is helpful.

 

There is not much out there about this but the book Bright Kids Who Cannot Keep Up was good.