NCAA DIV I Transcripts for Women's Ice Hockey

[mypreach]

My daughter is an ice hockey goalie and plays for the washington Pride.  She is in 8th grade and is our only child.  I have never navigated preparing a transcript for college let alone one that meets the NCAA Div. I standards.  Is there anyone who has done this? I have felt confident homeschooling our daughter up to this point but am now fretting that I will not do something correctly and it will cost her going to a college she wants to or missing out on a scholarship.  My daughter attends Classical Cottage School and I'm unsure how to even translate some of those classes to what is recognizable to colleges.  For instance Omnibus, some say just call this Honors English 9.  Others say pull the literature piece out and call it English 9 (not honors) and then categorize the literature part into American Literature, etc...  Is there a benefit to separating it out like this?  For NCAA Div. I you are also required to write descriptions for all core classes taken in H.S.  I'm just feeling overwhelmed.  I've already made one error.  This year my daughter wanted to take an AP Computer Science Class.  I checked with HSLDA and they said no problem and that it would look great on her transcript.  In Dec. while I was searching for other AP classes for her to take I came across a link on the HSLDA website that took me to the college board site where I found out that any AP class taken prior to the 9th grade cannot be listed on a transcript as an AP class, UGH!!!  I was further told that once the AP test score is released, it will be wiped off of her record as they only keep H.S. scores.  I do not want to make any other errors like this so I am now second guessing my ability to homeschool through H.S.  HELP!!!!

#NCAA  #HighSchoolTranscript

 

[GoodGrief]

We all make errors! :-) Hopefully she enjoyed the Comp Sci class? Even if she can't utilize it for high school credit, there's still value in the course.

 

Are you planning a traditional four year course of high school, or having her graduate early? You can write descriptions as you go along. You will do just fine!

 

Like your daughter, my daughter also did high school level work in middle school. Don't worry too much about her getting credit for that work (again, assuming you are still planning four years of high school), particularly for courses such as English. If she is doing appropriately advanced work in high school, people reviewing her transcript will assume that her middle school program was advanced as well. One course I did bring up from middle school was Alg 2, because there has been a program or two that was adamant about seeing an algebra credit, and she was already in precalc by 9th grade.

 

As far as splitting up courses, I'm not familiar with Omnibus, but I think you can divide it any way you like, assuming the semester hours were there. I would caution you against getting too creative with course titles when dealing with an entity like the NCAA. Keep things simple. They are trying to compare apples to apples.

 

I did the NCAA thing with my current senior. I guess it's gone fine, though she is obviously not in college or playing her sports quite yet.

Edited January 20, 2016 by Gr8lander

[hopskipjump]

 

Are you planning a traditional four year course of high school, or having her graduate early? You can write descriptions as you go along. You will do just fine!

 

If she is doing appropriately advanced work in high school, people reviewing her transcript will assume that her middle school program was advanced as well. One course I did bring up from middle school was Alg 2, because there has been a program or two that was adamant about seeing an algebra credit, and she was already in precalc by 9th grade.

 

I would caution you against getting too creative with course titles when dealing with an entity like the NCAA. Keep things simple. They are trying to compare apples to apples.

 

I did the NCAA thing with my current senior. I guess it's gone fine, though she is obviously not in college or playing her sports quite yet.

 

Agreeing with all of the above. Keep the course titles simple for the NCAA. Fancy-schmancy course names and dividing things up too much (ie. "English 9" and "American Literature" as two English-related courses) could complicate things. Our courses for English were titled "English I: American Literature" or something similar to that, and just one English credit per year, even during the years where dd spent waaaaaaay more hours-than-required for the course.

 

Write the course descriptions as you go along. I didn't. :bored: And it made for a long few weeks while I dug through paperwork and tried to remember what on earth dd did for English in 9th grade, lol!

 

After I got over the panic and hit "send" to send all the info to NCAA - the hardest part was waiting to find out if it was approved or not! (You don't find out until a college requests the file). Those were a long couple of weeks (I didn't send in the paperwork until the beginning of dd's senior year, so she was already lining up official visits by that point).

Edited January 21, 2016 by hopskipjump

[Lori D.]

Welcome!

 

There are a number of people on this board who have home schooled through high school and their students have gone on to play Division 1 sports in college and earn scholarships. Here are a few past threads to get you started -- they are linked in post #1 and post #5, along with other threads on the NCAA, in the big pinned thread at the top of the high school board: "Transcripts, Credits, GPA, Accreditation, NCAA… past threads linked here!"

 

NCAA help -- posts by Tara the Liberator will be of special interest, as her son plays ice hockey and is considering NCAA play

NCAA homeschool requirements

A high school athlete's journey

NCAA follow up (to "A high school athlete's journey")

Navigating NCAA and planning high school - help, please!

NCAA rejects K12 courses

 

 

From what I have gathered from the posts these homeschoolers have shared about their journey to NCAA play is that there are two hurdles you will have to clear:

 

1. maintain your student's eligibility

This means specific credits are required. And the curriculum (i.e., Omnibus) AND course providers (i.e., Classical Cottage School) used for completing those specific credits must be on the NCAA's approved list, or need to be evaluated by the NCAA to determine if they are acceptable for eligibility or not. Here is the NCAA's webpage on requirements for homeschoolers to get you started. From what I have gathered from other threads, it's best to WAIT to pay for the eligibility center until 11th grade. That way you are not paying the annual fee for early years of high school when plans might change or student interest wane, but it gives you just enough time to re-adjust what you are using to accomplish the 16 required core credits (in case some of your curriculum or course provider are not approved and you need any changes or need to "re-do" any credits). A number of the threads above discuss the process of filling out the NCAA required credit worksheets, and what curriculum and course providers are accepted or rejected.

 

2. marketing your athlete

Need to "get eyes" of coaches and colleges on your athlete for college recruiting, and scholarships. The thread above ("A high school athlete's journey") has more on this.

 

BEST of luck in your homeschooling and sports journeys! Warmest regards, Lori D.

[mypreach]

We all make errors! :-) Hopefully she enjoyed the Comp Sci class? Even if she can't utilize it for high school credit, there's still value in the course.

 

Are you planning a traditional four year course of high school, or having her graduate early? You can write descriptions as you go along. You will do just fine!

 

Like your daughter, my daughter also did high school level work in middle school. Don't worry too much about her getting credit for that work (again, assuming you are still planning four years of high school), particularly for courses such as English. If she is doing appropriately advanced work in high school, people reviewing her transcript will assume that her middle school program was advanced as well. One course I did bring up from middle school was Alg 2, because there has been a program or two that was adamant about seeing an algebra credit, and she was already in precalc by 9th grade.

 

As far as splitting up courses, I'm not familiar with Omnibus, but I think you can divide it any way you like, assuming the semester hours were there. I would caution you against getting too creative with course titles when dealing with an entity like the NCAA. Keep things simple. They are trying to compare apples to apples.

 

I did the NCAA thing with my current senior. I guess it's gone fine, though she is obviously not in college or playing her sports quite yet.

Thank you!  I appreciate your support and advice.  My daughter will be doing a 4 year high school plan so I know we will have time to add AP courses.  She wanted to take the AP Computer Science class and even though we cannot show it on her transcript I pray that how well she has done in this class will give her the confidence to try another AP class.

 

Thanks for letting me know about the math.  She actually did Algebra I in 7th and is doing Algebra II this year in 8th so she will be taking Geometry in 9th grade.  I plan on having her take the SAT I test at the end of 9th grade and then the SAT II at the end of 10th as she will have done the pre calculus/trigonometry course by then.

 

Best of luck to you and your daughter as you navigate the NCAA requirements.  I am confused on the college credit part.  Someone told me that AP classes count towards college credit but dual enrollment will not, they will just count towards reaching the required H.S. core classes.  I was told my daughter couldn't reach 12 college credits because if she did, she will then be counted as a college student.  I can't find anything on the NCAA website to clearly explain that.  When I called the homeschool line they just directed me to the NCAA Manual.  If you have any insight on this, I'd love to hear it!

 

Thanks again!

[mypreach]

Agreeing with all of the above. Keep the course titles simple for the NCAA. Fancy-schmancy course names and dividing things up too much (ie. "English 9" and "American Literature" as two English-related courses) could complicate things. Our courses for English were titled "English I: American Literature" or something similar to that, and just one English credit per year, even during the years where dd spent waaaaaaay more hours-than-required for the course.

 

Write the course descriptions as you go along. I didn't. :bored: And it made for a long few weeks while I dug through paperwork and tried to remember what on earth dd did for English in 9th grade, lol!

 

After I got over the panic and hit "send" to send all the info to NCAA - the hardest part was waiting to find out if it was approved or not! (You don't find out until a college requests the file). Those were a long couple of weeks (I didn't send in the paperwork until the beginning of dd's senior year, so she was already lining up official visits by that point).

Thank you for your input, I really appreciate it.  That's what I keep hearing is keep the subject titles simple and universal.

 

Do you have any insight on AP classes or dual enrollment classes and how they count towards college credit? I didn't think they did but I've heard from another parent that they do and once you hit 12 credits the NCAA considers you a college student????  Not sure I understand that.  I tried to call the homeschool line at the NCAA but all they did was direct me to the NCAA Manual.

 

Thanks again!

[mypreach]

Welcome!

 

There are a number of people on this board who have home schooled through high school and their students have gone on to play Division 1 sports in college and earn scholarships. Here are a few past threads to get you started -- they are linked in post #1 and post #5, along with other threads on the NCAA, in the big pinned thread at the top of the high school board: "Transcripts, Credits, GPA, Accreditation, NCAA… past threads linked here!"

 

NCAA help -- posts by Tara the Liberator will be of special interest, as her son plays ice hockey and is considering NCAA play

NCAA homeschool requirements

A high school athlete's journey

NCAA follow up (to "A high school athlete's journey")

Navigating NCAA and planning high school - help, please!

NCAA rejects K12 courses

 

 

From what I have gathered from the posts these homeschoolers have shared about their journey to NCAA play is that there are two hurdles you will have to clear:

 

1. maintain your student's eligibility

This means specific credits are required. And the curriculum (i.e., Omnibus) AND course providers (i.e., Classical Cottage School) used for completing those specific credits must be on the NCAA's approved list, or need to be evaluated by the NCAA to determine if they are acceptable for eligibility or not. Here is the NCAA's webpage on requirements for homeschoolers to get you started. From what I have gathered from other threads, it's best to WAIT to pay for the eligibility center until 11th grade. That way you are not paying the annual fee for early years of high school when plans might change or student interest wane, but it gives you just enough time to re-adjust what you are using to accomplish the 16 required core credits (in case some of your curriculum or course provider are not approved and you need any changes or need to "re-do" any credits). A number of the threads above discuss the process of filling out the NCAA required credit worksheets, and what curriculum and course providers are accepted or rejected.

 

2. marketing your athlete

Need to "get eyes" of coaches and colleges on your athlete for college recruiting, and scholarships. The thread above ("A high school athlete's journey") has more on this.

 

BEST of luck in your homeschooling and sports journeys! Warmest regards, Lori D.

Wow!  Thanks for sending me those threads, I will check them out! I really appreciate your hunting them down for me.  

 

As you may have guessed, I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed. I haven't felt like this since our first year of homeschool and that was a long time ago!

[Lori D.]

I am confused on the college credit part.  Someone told me that AP classes count towards college credit but dual enrollment will not, they will just count towards reaching the required H.S. core classes.  I was told my daughter couldn't reach 12 college credits because if she did, she will then be counted as a college student.  I can't find anything on the NCAA website to clearly explain that.  When I called the homeschool line they just directed me to the NCAA Manual.  If you have any insight on this, I'd love to hear it!

 

Here's another thread that might help: "NCAA and dual enrollment". HOWEVER, that thread is over 2 years old, AND, to be absolutely sure of what will be accepted for YOUR student, you absolutely need to speak directly to a knowledgeable person WITH NCAA and find out specific answers to your questions. Time to call them back and tell them what you just said in your post:

 

 "I couldn't find anything on your website to clearly explain this, and when I called the homeschool line, I was directed to the NCAA Manual, but I could not find the answer there either. Could you please direct me to the page number of the manual, or to the website page that specifically answers this question? Or can you direct my call to the person who oversees NCAA homeschool questions? Thank you so much!"

[GoodGrief]

 

 

Thanks for letting me know about the math.  She actually did Algebra I in 7th and is doing Algebra II this year in 8th so she will be taking Geometry in 9th grade.  I plan on having her take the SAT I test at the end of 9th grade and then the SAT II at the end of 10th as she will have done the pre calculus/trigonometry course by then.

 

 

I agree with the advice that Lori D gave about calling the NCAA again directly about the AP and dual enrollment question.

 

My unsolicited opinion on the SAT...I wouldn't worry about that quite yet in 9th grade. If possible, have her do the PSAT in 9th, 10th, 11th grades, then the SAT in 11th grade. The PSATs will give you an idea of what areas may need review, then she can do some extra prep for the junior year PSAT and SAT simultaneously (I would not bother with prep in the earlier grades for PSAT). I do agree with your timing on the Math 2 SAT subject test, and you may want to figure out one or two more SAT subject tests that she would like to take, dependent on her areas of interest, and time them for shortly after completion of the relevant course (ideally by the end of junior year, as it is quite stressful to test in senior year with applications occurring.)

 

Edited January 22, 2016 by Gr8lander

[hopskipjump]

 

 

may want to figure out one or two more SAT subject tests that she would like to take, dependent on her areas of interest, and time them for shortly after completion of the relevant course (ideally by the end of junior year, as it is quite stressful to test in senior year with applications occurring.)

 

 

 

:iagree:  Amen about the stressful testing during senior year! Due to several factors, dd had only taken the PSAT in 10th and again in 11th. Scheduling conflicts caused her to not be able to test until April of her junior year - and again in September and October of her senior year. Those fall-of-senior-year tests were HARD!! And we had to send in test scores multiple times.

DD2 has already been notified that she's going to test, test, TEST during her JUNIOR year. We are not doing that again.

 

 

Here's another thread that might help: "NCAA and dual enrollment". HOWEVER, that thread is over 2 years old, AND, to be absolutely sure of what will be accepted for YOUR student, you absolutely need to speak directly to a knowledgeable person WITH NCAA and find out specific answers to your questions. Time to call them back and tell them what you just said in your post:

 

 "I couldn't find anything on your website to clearly explain this, and when I called the homeschool line, I was directed to the NCAA Manual, but I could not find the answer there either. Could you please direct me to the page number of the manual, or to the website page that specifically answers this question? Or can you direct my call to the person who oversees NCAA homeschool questions? Thank you so much!"

 

Cannot over-emphasize the bolded enough. The NCAA actually has a pretty helpful homeschooling webpage now (they did not have it when I started the process, but received a lot of help from a mom here who helped guide me). The NCAA is known for "changing the rules" mid-stream, so even if you find the answers you seek NOW... KEEP UP TO DATE on the NCAA changes so you can adjust accordingly! Two sisters in my dds sport found out right before their senior year that the online school they had been using for 2 or 3 years was no longer NCAA-approved. :huh: That meant the NCAA would. not. accept. three. years-worth. of. their. core. courses. :ohmy: There was some mad scrambling.

 

I would also advise to NOT send in your paperwork until the fall of senior year. The NCAA does NOT check it as it comes in... and once you've send in a partial transcript, it becomes concrete. You cannot adjust or add-to as you learn of significance of certain factors. The colleges can see that transcript (iirc) and if it doesn't match up with the one you have to send them (each college interested in your DD will need a transcript AND a screen-shot of your dds test scores sent to them before an official visit can happen) - so you want to make sure the transcripts are all identical so there aren't any questions.

 

 

Thank you for your input, I really appreciate it.  That's what I keep hearing is keep the subject titles simple and universal.

 

Do you have any insight on AP classes or dual enrollment classes and how they count towards college credit? I didn't think they did but I've heard from another parent that they do and once you hit 12 credits the NCAA considers you a college student????  Not sure I understand that.  I tried to call the homeschool line at the NCAA but all they did was direct me to the NCAA Manual.

 

Thanks again!

 

My dd didn't take early AP classes (her first was jr year) and couldn't fit dual enrollment into her insane schedule, so I can't help with that, sorry.  BUT - CARRY that NCAA manual around with you - by the end of the process, I knew it practically back-to-front by memory. Whenever I called the NCAA people, I could quote from the thing like a Bible.

 

Good luck to your dd (and to you!!) :patriot:  A friend advised me that the NCAA people really ARE there to help you through the process, which I agree with - they were always very helpful and friendly... What I found, in reality, though, was that most of them had zero real understanding of how VAST the homeschooling community IS and how different we all do what we do. So, their answers often tried to force me into a "box" that honestly did not adequately represent dd's homeschooling experience. I learned to be a lot less fastidious, and answered questions in as broad a brush as they asked them.

 

ETA: We did include two of dds 8th grade classes with the NCAA paperwork. Algebra I was one, and I can't remember the other. She had over-the-required-number of core courses, so I can't remember if they included the Algebra I class into the tally or not!

Edited January 23, 2016 by hopskipjump

[Jennifer from Delaware]

I use Abeka. We don't use the videos,though. If I list myself as teacher of record, will the ncaa approve my son for div.1 sports?

[Corraleno]

 

My daughter attends Classical Cottage School and I'm unsure how to even translate some of those classes to what is recognizable to colleges.  

 

If this is an unaccredited private school and you are legally a homeschooler, you will want to list yourself as the "teacher of record" for any courses that you are submitting NCAA Worksheets for. The actual teacher can be listed as an additional teacher. You want to make it clear that YOU provided the grade.

 

 

For instance Omnibus, some say just call this Honors English 9.  Others say pull the literature piece out and call it English 9 (not honors) and then categorize the literature part into American Literature, etc...  Is there a benefit to separating it out like this?  

 

You definitely want to use generic titles for the NCAA core courses — they have a list of acceptable courses for each subject, so you don't want to vary from that too much. For English classes, they accept the usual courses such as American Literature, British Literature, and World Literature, but not something like Literature of the Ancient World or Epic Hero in World Literature. So stick with something on the list or just go with English 1/2/3/4 or 9/10/11/12. 

 

There is no advantage to having 2 English credits every year, because (1) they will only count a total of four,  (2) it looks like padding to have 2 per year, and (3) they won't accept odd titles anyway so you're better off just including everything done in one academic year as "English 9" or whatever.

 

 

I was further told that once the AP test score is released, it will be wiped off of her record as they only keep H.S. scores.  

 

We're not doing APs, so I don't have personal experience, but I've seen this issue come up many times on various homeschooling lists, and I believe you can simply ask the College Board to retain the scores. I don't think they actually delete them anyway, just archive them.

 

 

I am confused on the college credit part.  Someone told me that AP classes count towards college credit but dual enrollment will not, they will just count towards reaching the required H.S. core classes.  I was told my daughter couldn't reach 12 college credits because if she did, she will then be counted as a college student.  I can't find anything on the NCAA website to clearly explain that.  When I called the homeschool line they just directed me to the NCAA Manual.  If you have any insight on this, I'd love to hear it!

 

I suspect that the person you spoke with was confusing two different things. Once a student enrolls as a full-time college student, he or she has 5 years of eligibility, during which he/she can compete for 4 of the 5 years. "This 5 year clock begins when the student-athlete initially registers in a regular term of an academic year for a minimum full- time program of studies—12 credit hours— AND attends his or her first day of classes for that term or competes for the institution." The "12 credit hours" applies to a student who has graduated from high school and is enrolled full time in college, not to a high school student taking dual enrollment classes.

 

ETA: As for colleges not accepting DE credits, that varies widely and you will need to check with individual colleges to see what their specific policy is. Some of the most selective schools will not accept either AP or DE, some only accept AP, some (most state uni's for example) will accept both (and some even accept CLEP and other CBE type programs), and other colleges are somewhere in between, although the amount of credit and how it's counted will also vary. Some colleges will only count DE courses that were taken on a college campus and not courses taught at a HS even if they're taught by the same prof using the same text. Some will only count DE courses if they were not used to meet basic HS graduation requirements — e.g. if your state requires 3 social studies classes and a homeschool student does one SS class at home and takes 3 at CC, they may refuse to grant transfer credit the first 2 DE courses on the grounds that those were already "credited" towards the HS diploma, but they would give credit for the 3rd DE course since that is in excess of graduation requirements.

 

As always, check with the individual colleges, and keep checking with NCAA on a regular basis, because they do change the rules without notice.

 

  

 

Edited February 24, 2016 by Corraleno

[OnMyOwn]

As far as the AP course prior to 9th -- Is your dd taking the AP Exam? If so, maybe you can't call it an AP course, but I'm thinking you can call it Computer Science with AP Exam. Lots of people do that even in high school. Also, my understanding is that you have "x" number of days (not long) after taking the exam to let the college board know that you do not want the AP exam score wiped off of your dd's record. The default is that they wipe it off, but I believe you can tell them you don't want to do that. I've heard recommendations to do it both verbally on the phone and in writing.

[mypreach]

I will run your suggestion of labeling the class as Computer Science A with AP Exam on her transcript by HSLDA.  That's an excellent idea!  She will be taking the AP Exam in May.  I called the College Board and they told me that I will need to call them every year by May to remind them not to remove the 8th grade AP score, otherwise they will and a college will not be able to access it and a college will not accept it from me.  Thank you for your suggestions!

[OnMyOwn]

I will run your suggestion of labeling the class as Computer Science A with AP Exam on her transcript by HSLDA. That's an excellent idea! She will be taking the AP Exam in May. I called the College Board and they told me that I will need to call them every year by May to remind them not to remove the 8th grade AP score, otherwise they will and a college will not be able to access it and a college will not accept it from me. Thank you for your suggestions!

You are welcome! But, wow. That's kind of annoying that you have to call every year.

[snowbeltmom]

 

In Dec. while I was searching for other AP classes for her to take I came across a link on the HSLDA website that took me to the college board site where I found out that any AP class taken prior to the 9th grade cannot be listed on a transcript as an AP class, UGH!!!  I was further told that once the AP test score is released, it will be wiped off of her record as they only keep H.S. scores.  I do not want to make any other errors like this so I am now second guessing my ability to homeschool through H.S.  HELP!!!!

#NCAA  #HighSchoolTranscript

 

 

My son took an AP class in 8th grade.  I listed the class on his official transcript as what it was...an AP class. 

 

The College Board did not erase that AP score from his record.  Now, the College Board will purge SAT and SAT II scores from exams taken prior to high school unless you send in a written request to the College Board that those scores be retained.  Maybe the individual who told you that AP scores are erased confused AP scores and SAT scores.

 

Good luck planning the high school years!

 

 

[mypreach]

Here is the link to what the College Board had me reference as to why I am not permitted to label the class as an AP class when taken prior to the 9th grade.

 

http://apcentral.collegeboard.com/apc/public/repository/Appropriate-Grade-Levels-for-AP-Courses.pdf

 

 

[snowbeltmom]

Here is the link to what the College Board had me reference as to why I am not permitted to label the class as an AP class when taken prior to the 9th grade.

 

http://apcentral.collegeboard.com/apc/public/repository/Appropriate-Grade-Levels-for-AP-Courses.pdf

 

Yeah, I was aware of that "rule" from the College Board, but chose to ignore it as I think it is silly.  The purpose of the transcript is to communicate to the admissions officers the student 's educational background.  I wanted to communicate to the admissions folks that the class my son took was an official AP class.  Frankly, I could not care less whether what I did is permitted by the College Board.  :001_smile:  

 

 

[TN Mama]

 

 

My dd didn't take early AP classes (her first was jr year) and couldn't fit dual enrollment into her insane schedule, so I can't help with that, sorry.  BUT - CARRY that NCAA manual around with you - by the end of the process, I knew it practically back-to-front by memory. Whenever I called the NCAA people, I could quote from the thing like a Bible.

 

 

 

What is the NCAA manual? 

 

This thread has been very helpful! Thank you!

[hopskipjump]

What is the NCAA manual? 

 

This thread has been very helpful! Thank you!

 

There is a homeschool/NCAA pdf file somewhere on their website that lists the information needed. I printed it out booklet-style and literally carried it everywhere for a while so I could read, re-read, and comprehend before we sent in dds transcript & class descriptions to them. I didn't save the link and threw the manual away once dd was approved (buh-bye!), so unfortunately, I can't link you to it directly. :)

[Jennifer from Delaware]

I use the Abeka book tradition (non video) program. I just buy the books and teach my son myself. Will the NCAA approve all four years of h.s. or should I enroll in Abeka Academy accredited and give the NCAA the transcript from the academy?