504 for high school / later teen?

[Pen]

My son has been without an IEP or 504 for awhile and did okay in public school for a couple of years without. But not so well this past quarter. 

. School has raised possibly getting him a 504. Since they raised it, I expect they will be willing.  But I doubt my son will be cooperative with that idea. And his age is almost 18yo (Feb bday) in a state where teens have relative autonomy over medical visits etc younger than that.  Reasons for a 504 potentially could be ADHD or PTSD or anxiety.  Not sure what accommodations he might get.  

Thoughts? 

[Lecka]

I think I would ask for more information about it, talk to him, and then see what he thinks.  If he doesn’t want to do it right now, maybe he would want to do it later.  
 

I think it would be worth waiting to see if he comes around.  
 

If he doesn’t want to do it I think it would be pretty rough.

But I would try to get the information and bring up in context “maybe it would be helpful for this situation,” when times come up it would be helpful.

I would also see if anyone at school might be better to talk to him about it, if that would be an advantage.  They might need your permission to bring it up to him.  

[PeterPan]

I don't know. We finally did medications for anxiety and they're AMAZING. So maybe medications *and* the 504. It's not like the 504 is services. It's just accommodations, the type of stuff my dd is using in college. Is he wanting to go on? Having that document would be helpful and getting it done BEFORE he moves on potentially could save you a scad of money. If he's going on and going to need paper trail, now, on the state's dime, is the way to do it.

[Lecka]

I agree.  

But if he doesn't want to do it, it is not that smooth.

I waited for about a year on something for my older son, and it ended up working out with him having buy-in. 

I don't know if you can wait around for him to realize he needs it (or show he doesn't need it).  I did not really have a choice as while he was actively opposed he would have sabotaged it and he would have been mad at me, too.  

I would definitely want it to happen!  

I would reach out at school, maybe, say you are interested but concerned about his buy-in, and see what they say.  They might have some idea since they work with this age group and they are familiar with him at school.  

[Pen]

10 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

I don't know. We finally did medications for anxiety and they're AMAZING. So maybe medications *and* the 504. It's not like the 504 is services. It's just accommodations, the type of stuff my dd is using in college. Is he wanting to go on? Having that document would be helpful and getting it done BEFORE he moves on potentially could save you a scad of money. If he's going on and going to need paper trail, now, on the state's dime, is the way to do it.

 

Go on to college do you mean?  I don’t think he does want to.  He hates school or at least the school part of it (he likes social aspects, mostly). 

He presumptively wants to go on to something.  

He had been interested in military (and has excellent Asvab scores if he wants to do that, assuming he graduates high school ), then realtor, now maybe a trade.  I think a trade (and also realtor—either or both together) would suit him well.  Better than military, I think. 

At issue right now is successfully graduating from high school.  As all of trade, realtor, military need a high school diploma minimum.   He tends to have 100% when work is turned in, but lots of zeros when it isn’t.   (100% and 0% average to 50% which is an F.) 

 

[Lecka]

That is rough. 

Do you think he might go to summer school?  Do you know how that works?  I am not totally sure here how many classes you can make up in the summer, it might be two?  
 

A lot of my son’s friends have failed classes and gone to summer school, and I have heard them say they want to do better so they don’t have to go back to summer school.  
 

I would bring that up, but I know my son wouldn’t want to go to summer school, but he would go (he is younger).  

[Pen]

 

3 hours ago, Lecka said:

I would reach out at school, maybe, say you are interested but concerned about his buy-in, and see what they say.  They might have some idea since they work with this age group and they are familiar with him at school.  

 

I’m in that process now!

He’s been given an extra chance to turn in work for one class till tomorrow morning, by a teacher who called me at home today (!!!) to say he is only a few points off from passing if he’d just turn in a few assignments even partly done she can pass him, as he’d have enough points, and she’d Like to pass him.  She thinks he probably has some partly done pages somewhere in his backpack or on the computer. Or he could get 12 points worth of assignments in and have a C even, she says. 

Clearly there’s either a psychological block, or that failing has become a way to get attention.  

Or something.  

 

[Storygirl]

It is tricky, because students can refuse to use 504 accommodations (or IEP accommodations, for that matter). So there does need to be some buy-in on his part.

The big thing that perhaps he would agree to is having extra time to complete assignments. The benefit would be that if he misses a due date and would normally get a zero, he has the chance to turn the assignment in the next day (or whenever the extended time would allow). That could cut down on the number of 0s significantly.

He would still need to turn things in, though. If the problem is that he really does not care and refuses to do the work, having extra time wouldn't help. If the problem is that he is forgetting to do the work and forgetting to turn it in, that accommodation should help.

And it wouldn't make him stick out among his classmates in any way. None of them would have to know that he was allowed to turn in work late but still get credit. Sometimes kids don't want accommodations, because they don't want to be different, but it wouldn't matter in this case.

[Pen]

1 hour ago, Lecka said:

That is rough. 

Do you think he might go to summer school?  Do you know how that works?  I am not totally sure here how many classes you can make up in the summer, it might be two?  
 

 

I’m not sure what summer school options there are here.  Well, none at all in our rural area. It’s all closed for summer.

 But he might be able to do something online or in city.    Maybe a Brave writer online class he did could help retrospectively.    ? I really don’t know.  

He may need to do credit recovery for an additional semester     Or maybe a 504 can give extra time to graduate like an IEP? 

Maybe I should not try to cross that bridge till it comes.

 

I think a job would be a good thing for him this summer.  Maybe more important than academic credits. 

 

[Lecka]

Ask at the school.  I think it would be good to be in contact with them.  
 

I think it would be good to know what the consequences would be if he does fail a class or classes.  Then your son can know.  He needs to know what he is looking at if he doesn’t get him homework turned in.  
 

If the 504 is going to help with getting his homework turned in in some way — maybe he would be more open to that if he knows what the consequence will be if he doesn’t do it.  
 

 

[Pen]

12 minutes ago, Storygirl said:

It is tricky, because students can refuse to use 504 accommodations (or IEP accommodations, for that matter). So there does need to be some buy-in on his part.

The big thing that perhaps he would agree to is having extra time to complete assignments. The benefit would be that if he misses a due date and would normally get a zero, he has the chance to turn the assignment in the next day (or whenever the extended time would allow). That could cut down on the number of 0s significantly.

He would still need to turn things in, though. If the problem is that he really does not care and refuses to do the work, having extra time wouldn't help. If the problem is that he is forgetting to do the work and forgetting to turn it in, that accommodation should help.

And it wouldn't make him stick out among his classmates in any way. None of them would have to know that he was allowed to turn in work late but still get credit. Sometimes kids don't want accommodations, because they don't want to be different, but it wouldn't matter in this case.

 

Looks like he’s essentially getting a super accommodation of being allowed to turn things in very very late this weekend.  But I cannot tell that he is actually doing anything. 

[Lecka]

I hope tomorrow will go well for him.  Sometimes kids do make poor decisions, but it can be a learning experience.  I hope he will turn in some work, though!

It sounds like he is close enough maybe he could get some done at school tomorrow.  

[Pen]

Basically he’s in PS because he got into a homeschool refusal to cooperate mode.  I think I need to remember that I wanted out of the bad dynamics that was causing with me being his teacher.  

I May need to let him deal with some of this on his own .  It is His refusal to cooperate and will be his consequences, whatever they are.   I’d like to spare him that.  But very likely I cannot. 

 

30 minutes ago, Lecka said:

I think it would be good to know what the consequences would be if he does fail a class or classes.  Then your son can know.  He needs to know what he is looking at if he doesn’t get him homework turned in.  

 

I think he can do credit recovery after his class graduation.  

He already did fail one class semester of one important class, (and also managed to fail a study hall (!) but that’s not a graduation requirement so we learned not to have him sign up for Study Hall).  PE every year, yes, big help.  Study Hall, no. 

Result is having to make up that 0.5 credit for the important class. There are two or three extra 1.0 credit slots potentially available without having to do credit recovery beyond regular time to graduate.  

I have to recheck the state credit requirements.  I think it’s 24 total, with 7 class periods per year, so they can take 6 credit classes each year and one study hall, or 7 classes all or most years, and then have fewer in senior year to give college visit or work or internship or DE  time.  Or space to make up a couple of  F’s... 

If they’re in required courses like US history and English the timing can be tough.  

 

[PeterPan]

2 hours ago, Pen said:

Clearly there’s either a psychological block, or that failing has become a way to get attention.  

Anxiety kind of shuts down everything too.

Anxiety in our state is a tier 3 diagnosis, higher funding than SLDs and all sorts of things. 

[Lecka]

I hope he will turn in some work today!