Algebra Recommendations

[Tumbatoo]

DS is reviewing Pre-Algebra concepts using Math Mammoth. He also gone through most of AoPS Pre-Algebra. He finally decided he would like an Algebra that is between them. Something that is not so straightforward as Math Mammoth, but not so discovery as AoPS. What am I looking for? Thanks!

[Farrar]

Maybe Jacob's?

[sbgrace]

We're enjoying Arbor Algebra. It's based from Jacobs I believe.

[Paige]

I like Dolciani's. It's straight forward, not too hard, not too easy...I think it introduces some harder things early (like factoring) but I've grown to like that. It gives the student lots of time to practice before the end of the year. 

 

I also like it because I'm using the same textbook I used, so it's familiar to me. 

 

 

[Tumbatoo]

We're enjoying Arbor Algebra. It's based from Jacobs I believe.

Would all three books equal Algebra 1?

[Tumbatoo]

Maybe Jacob's?

I've been thinking Jacob's. But, it looks very easy. Maybe it's just the review? This is my first venture into teaching Algebra.

Edited December 17, 2016 by Tumbatoo

[Tumbatoo]

I like Dolciani's. It's straight forward, not too hard, not too easy...I think it introduces some harder things early (like factoring) but I've grown to like that. It gives the student lots of time to practice before the end of the year.

 

I also like it because I'm using the same textbook I used, so it's familiar to me.

Hmmm I'll have to look at this one again. I'm a little concerned it may not have enough explanation if we get stuck.

[Farrar]

I wrote you a nice comparison and the internet ate it. Drat! I'll try again.

 

I have one kid in Dolciani's Pre-A (and I've got the algebra book and it's super similar) and one kid in Jacob's Algebra.

 

I don't think the Jacob's is too easy by any stretch. It is... how can I put it? Gentle or inviting might be the right word? In the way it introduces things. It is very discovery based in many ways, but in a more this topic is for anyone sort of way than AoPS. There's more of a sense of wow and fun discovery with it than the pushing toward the deepest levels of understanding of AoPS. Sometimes I feel like AoPS is hard for the sake of being hard - which is great for some kids, but Jacob's is more like, this is easy, you can get it, while still challenging kids and having this discovery aspect to it. I like that there's the Set IV problems, which are always really tricky or brain teasers or outside the box in some way. I like that there's a super easy set - Set I - and that there's the other two sets that are more standard. The teacher materials are incredibly good and in depth.

 

Dolciani is very straightforward. It reminds me of Math Mammoth in some ways - the focus on word problems, the explicit teaching of strategies, the examples being the primary method of teaching, the long problem sets that demonstrate each skill very carefully. I like that there's the classroom exercises that teach, then the Set A that are easy, Set B that are medium, Set C that are genuinely pretty challenging. And the word problems. Really, there's no better ones. I think there's plenty of explanation - it's just not wordy. Totally the opposite of Jacob's in that way. I think the teacher book is super easy to use - one of my biggest complaints about the Jacob's teacher materials is that they're not super approachable. It's like homework for me to really read and implement them and thus I don't all the time. The Dolciani teacher books are so each to grab and check work, add problems orally from the margins if the kid isn't getting it, refer to the teaching strategies if I need ideas, etc. I can easily use the teacher materials on the fly more, which is a big benefit for me and how I tend to teach. I like that it has the brain teasers in the teacher book for each chapter (though, actually, I'm not 100% sure the Algebra program has them too, though I think it does...). 

 

There are other programs too, of course. I also know the Arbor books, but I have a hunch that they're not what you're looking for. If you want something that's a little more AoPS leaning but not relentlessly challenging, I'd say of these two, Jacob's. If you want something that's like Math Mammoth but a little more grown up and slightly more challenge leaning, especially with word problems, I'd say Dolciani.

 

 

[wapiti]

 If you want something that's a little more AoPS leaning but not relentlessly challenging, I'd say of these two, Jacob's. If you want something that's like Math Mammoth but a little more grown up and slightly more challenge leaning, especially with word problems, I'd say Dolciani.

 

This.  I typed up something similar but the internet went out earlier and I lost it.  Jacobs has some guided discovery in the set 2 problems but so gentle the student might not even realize it's there.  The first half might seem slow and boring after AoPS Prealgebra, in which case I'd just speed it up, compact it, until you get to the second half.  But it's excellent.

 

If you prefer straightforward and want a tad more challenge than MM, then also look at Foerster.  Like Dolciani, it also has great word problems.

[deerforest]

I agree with Farrar, and I struggled a lot to find a program after BA that was conceptually strong yet not discovery based. I used a bit of everything for pre-algebra, but probably more Dolciani than anything else.

 

We are using Foerster's now for algebra 1, and we are happier with it than the mix we had in pre-algebra.

[Paige]

 I think the teacher book is super easy to use - one of my biggest complaints about the Jacob's teacher materials is that they're not super approachable. It's like homework for me to really read and implement them and thus I don't all the time. The Dolciani teacher books are so each to grab and check work, add problems orally from the margins if the kid isn't getting it, refer to the teaching strategies if I need ideas, etc. I can easily use the teacher materials on the fly more, which is a big benefit for me and how I tend to teach. I like that it has the brain teasers in the teacher book for each chapter (though, actually, I'm not 100% sure the Algebra program has them too, though I think it does...). 

 

 

 

I didn't even know Dolciani had teacher guides! I feel like I missed out. I used the answer key, and there's some explanation in there, but not for every problem. If you can find a teacher's guide, it would probably be really easy to use the book.

 

Algebra 1 is not too hard if you have gone on to higher maths yourself. Even if it's been 20yrs, you probably know more than you think; especially after having gone through MM and AOPS. I remember finding Algebra challenging and scary as a student, but I think a lot of that was the hype around the word and I had a pretty poor classroom experience. When I went back to it with DS, I was surprised. Really? There's nothing more to it? It was easy to teach because it all came back to me and it's pretty intuitive.

[Farrar]

I didn't even know Dolciani had teacher guides! I feel like I missed out. I used the answer key, and there's some explanation in there, but not for every problem. If you can find a teacher's guide, it would probably be really easy to use the book.

 

Algebra 1 is not too hard if you have gone on to higher maths yourself. Even if it's been 20yrs, you probably know more than you think; especially after having gone through MM and AOPS. I remember finding Algebra challenging and scary as a student, but I think a lot of that was the hype around the word and I had a pretty poor classroom experience. When I went back to it with DS, I was surprised. Really? There's nothing more to it? It was easy to teach because it all came back to me and it's pretty intuitive.

 

The teacher manual for Mathematics: A Human Endeavor can be hard to come by, but the ones for Algebra and Geometry are both pretty available. They're thinish and paperback and really filled with a lot of deep thinking. Which, no surprise from a Harold Jacobs text. I would compare them a little to having something like the First Grade Diary for Miquon. I mean, it also includes the answers in the back and miniature images of the overhead transparencies, which I guess were a big part of the teaching back in the day, But they're surprisingly in depth for teacher materials without being directly prescriptive. It's both a good and bad thing... I don't have the solutions guide, but I understand it has a little more about getting the solutions than the answer key in this one.

 

I totally agree about teaching algebra. I'm pretty sure I'll cap out after geometry, but I've been pleasantly surprised at how easy algebra I is after all these years.

[Tumbatoo]

I wrote you a nice comparison and the internet ate it. Drat! I'll try again.

 

I have one kid in Dolciani's Pre-A (and I've got the algebra book and it's super similar) and one kid in Jacob's Algebra.

 

I don't think the Jacob's is too easy by any stretch. It is... how can I put it? Gentle or inviting might be the right word? In the way it introduces things. It is very discovery based in many ways, but in a more this topic is for anyone sort of way than AoPS. There's more of a sense of wow and fun discovery with it than the pushing toward the deepest levels of understanding of AoPS. Sometimes I feel like AoPS is hard for the sake of being hard - which is great for some kids, but Jacob's is more like, this is easy, you can get it, while still challenging kids and having this discovery aspect to it. I like that there's the Set IV problems, which are always really tricky or brain teasers or outside the box in some way. I like that there's a super easy set - Set I - and that there's the other two sets that are more standard. The teacher materials are incredibly good and in depth.

 

Dolciani is very straightforward. It reminds me of Math Mammoth in some ways - the focus on word problems, the explicit teaching of strategies, the examples being the primary method of teaching, the long problem sets that demonstrate each skill very carefully. I like that there's the classroom exercises that teach, then the Set A that are easy, Set B that are medium, Set C that are genuinely pretty challenging. And the word problems. Really, there's no better ones. I think there's plenty of explanation - it's just not wordy. Totally the opposite of Jacob's in that way. I think the teacher book is super easy to use - one of my biggest complaints about the Jacob's teacher materials is that they're not super approachable. It's like homework for me to really read and implement them and thus I don't all the time. The Dolciani teacher books are so each to grab and check work, add problems orally from the margins if the kid isn't getting it, refer to the teaching strategies if I need ideas, etc. I can easily use the teacher materials on the fly more, which is a big benefit for me and how I tend to teach. I like that it has the brain teasers in the teacher book for each chapter (though, actually, I'm not 100% sure the Algebra program has them too, though I think it does...).

 

There are other programs too, of course. I also know the Arbor books, but I have a hunch that they're not what you're looking for. If you want something that's a little more AoPS leaning but not relentlessly challenging, I'd say of these two, Jacob's. If you want something that's like Math Mammoth but a little more grown up and slightly more challenge leaning, especially with word problems, I'd say Dolciani.

This helps a lot, thanks!

[Janeway]

I've been thinking Jacob's. But, it looks very easy. Maybe it's just the review? This is my first venture into teaching Algebra.

Jacobs is not easy. It is very thorough and covers everything that Foersters covers. It just explains things so well that it makes algebra more enjoyable.