Greta Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 Is that any indication of the strength of their fine arts program? I know nothing about this field, but I'm exploring options for my daughter. I've been assuming that a school which offers a BA or a BFA in Studio Art probably has a stronger program than one which only offers a BA. Is my assumption valid? How does one go about finding schools with good art programs? Also, if you happen to know of schools with good fine arts programs in the western US (especially if they participate in WUE) that information would be most appreciated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapiti Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 Listening in. I'm not sure that's the case at all, that a BFA program would likely be superior program to a BA, though it's quite confusing, actually. My very rough understanding from a friend with a BFA from a university is that it simply depends on the school. I have an interested kiddo but I'm strongly encouraging a university rather than an art school; beyond that I don't have a clue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 Listening in. I'm not sure that's the case at all, that a BFA program would likely be superior program to a BA, though it's quite confusing, actually. My very rough understanding from a friend with a BFA from a university is that it simply depends on the school. I have an interested kiddo but I'm strongly encouraging a university rather than an art school; beyond that I don't have a clue. Same here! I read that 80% of students change their major. So that pretty much put an end to the idea of an art school for me. Sure, it's possible she'll be in that 20% that sticks with their original plan. But in case she isn't, I'd rather send her to a school where she can change her major without having to change schools. Beyond that, I just don't know! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 :bigear: I'm curious, too. I've been comparing Southern Oregon U's BFA Creative Writing program to other BA Creative Writing programs this morning. Ds met their creative writing professor at a college fair and really liked the program. It's very different from our local BA English: with Creative Writing program which is much more lit heavy. It looks like they have a BA and BFA in studio art. The only difference I could see is the foreign language requirement for BA. https://inside.sou.edu/assets/art/docs/2013-AAH-AdvisingSheet-BFA.pdf https://inside.sou.edu/assets/art/docs/2013-AAH-AdvisingSheet-BA.pdf Thanks! I haven't looked at Southern Oregon Uni yet, so I will do so. Fortunately, it is on the list of WUE schools. When our local uni started offering the BFA as well as the BA in studio art, the depth of classes increased tremendously. The BFA kids get far more time with their profs, and from the exhibitions I've seen, the BFA kids produce far better work. Wow, that's really interesting. Good to know! Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 I've been looking into it further at SOU and you have to be accepted into the BFA program. https://inside.sou.edu/assets/art/BFA_Application_2014.pdf That seems to be the way it works with the other BFA programs I've looked into as well: you apply in your sophomore or junior year, and not everyone gets accepted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daria Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 My kid is interested in tech theater, which may be somewhat different, but at the schools we've looked at the BFA curriculum is much richer and complex than the BA with far more choices and more specific electives. However, I've also heard that at schools where there are both BA's and BFA's the BA students can find it challenging to get professor time, and design jobs on shows, because the professors favor the BFA students who spend more time with them. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 (edited) I haven't looked at this in a lot of detail, but I would expect a BFA to be more in-depth than a BA. Dd's more in the other direction - she wants to do graphic or multimedia design, but she doesn't want a lot of intensity or 'fine arts' focus, she's thinking more practical applications like making brochures or doing web design, and would prefer creating art on the computer. We compared two in-state schools with a graphic design major, and the one with a BFA definitely looked more intense - she's planning on going for the BA (she also wants to double-major in marketing and maybe minor in advertising - so, more broad than deep...) Edited November 1, 2016 by Matryoshka 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 My kid is interested in tech theater, which may be somewhat different, but at the schools we've looked at the BFA curriculum is much richer and complex than the BA with far more choices and more specific electives. However, I've also heard that at schools where there are both BA's and BFA's the BA students can find it challenging to get professor time, and design jobs on shows, because the professors favor the BFA students who spend more time with them. I hadn't considered that possibility! Gotcha. I have been having a difficult time finding out more about the Creative Writing BFA ds is interested in. It recently moved from the English dept to the Arts dept when they went BFA only. I finally found this that explains how to declare Creative Writing as a major. I've been researching all morning and I think my head is going to explode. I know the feeling!!! I haven't looked at this in a lot of detail, but I would expect a BFA to be more in-depth than a BA. Dd's more in the other direction - she wants to do graphic or multimedia design, but she doesn't want a lot of intensity or 'fine arts' focus, she's thinking more practical applications like making brochures or doing web design, and would prefer creating art on the computer. We compared two in-state schools with a graphic design major, and the one with a BFA definitely looked more intense - she's planning on going for the BA (she also wants to double-major in marketing and maybe minor in advertising - so, more broad than deep...) What a great plan! I think a double major is probably a wise choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwen in VA Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 How committed is your kid to going into fine arts? A B.A. will require more gen eds than a BFA and will require the student to spent much less time really focusing on the art side of things. My performer-daughter spent her freshman at a LAC and she resented all of the time her gen eds took away from her focus on music. She transferred to a conservatory and is much happier. She can focus on music, which is where her heart is! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 How committed is your kid to going into fine arts? A B.A. will require more gen eds than a BFA and will require the student to spent much less time really focusing on the art side of things. My performer-daughter spent her freshman at a LAC and she resented all of the time her gen eds took away from her focus on music. She transferred to a conservatory and is much happier. She can focus on music, which is where her heart is! She's quite committed to having a career in the arts, though she's not as clear yet on exactly what form she wants that to take. Lately she has been leaning toward animation, but illustration is also a big contender. And for those careers, I have no idea of a BA or BFA is a better fit. Any thoughts? I'm glad your dd found the right fit for her! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapiti Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 In my house, illustration is so last year LOL. Now we're into a different angle entirely. The problem we have is understanding the possibilities. I think that a double major incorporating different strengths may provide the best preparation for a unique career that combines them, probably in a way that's hard to envision at this early point in time. It's been a while since I did some reading of opinions on this, but I have the vague recollection that the BFA might be harder to double major with just from a time/energy perspective. So perhaps the BA would be the way to go for a double major, though I get really confused when we start talking about who needs or does not need a MFA. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 In my house, illustration is so last year LOL. Now we're into a different angle entirely. :D I understand! She seems to be leaning more toward animation now, but illustration was it until recently. Before that it was graphic design. Before that it was painting. But I will say this: art in some form or another has been the thing since she was about 6 years old. The details may change, but that general idea has always been the same. The problem we have is understanding the possibilities. Yes, I'm struggling with that myself! I think that a double major incorporating different strengths may provide the best preparation for a unique career that combines them, probably in a way that's hard to envision at this early point in time. I've wondered about this too. I've read that double majors are great because potential employers want to see a broad range of skills. Makes sense. I've mentioned to her the possibility of combining an art degree and a computer science degree, since there's a lot of interesting stuff happening where art and computers meet. But I'm not sure if that's really the best path for her. I guess only she can decide that. It's been a while since I did some reading of opinions on this, but I have the vague recollection that the BFA might be harder to double major with just from a time/energy perspective. So perhaps the BA would be the way to go for a double major, though I get really confused when we start talking about who needs or does not need a MFA. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense that if you're going to double major, you'd probably only have time for the BA and not the BFA! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurel-in-CA Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 My dd went to an art school (lcad) specifically because she didn't want to spend too much time on gen. Ed. She wanted to get to the ART asap. Her school had majors in grAphic design, illustration, animation, game design as well as studio art. I suggest touring at least a college with an art dept. AND a couple of art colleges. Go to national portfolio day with her work and talk to as many school reps as you can. Ask them about majors. Very enlightening. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wapiti Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 (edited) I've wondered about this too. I've read that double majors are great because potential employers want to see a broad range of skills. Makes sense. I've mentioned to her the possibility of combining an art degree and a computer science degree, since there's a lot of interesting stuff happening where art and computers meet. But I'm not sure if that's really the best path for her. I guess only she can decide that. BTDT. and still there. Kiddo says she is not into CS. Math is a strength that she seems to enjoy, though how much is another question. Loves all things art creative. (ETA, does not seem to care for art history. I'm not sure about "other people's art.") Photography is the latest love, a bigger passion than the prior ones. We'll see what happens next when she takes an oil painting class in the spring. How to wrap it all up into a package is anyone's guess - it's hard to predict what sorts of cool jobs may be possible and even harder to imagine what a career progression might look like. All we can see from here are simple boxes like "photographer" that don't require a degree as much as loads of time working with the craft. And photo editing in lightroom seems to involve loads of time... Edited November 1, 2016 by wapiti 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 My dd went to an art school (lcad) specifically because she didn't want to spend too much time on gen. Ed. She wanted to get to the ART asap. Her school had majors in grAphic design, illustration, animation, game design as well as studio art. I suggest touring at least a college with an art dept. AND a couple of art colleges. Go to national portfolio day with her work and talk to as many school reps as you can. Ask them about majors. Very enlightening. Feeling dumb: I'd never even heard of National Portfolio Day before. Thanks for educating me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanetC Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 My dd went to an art school (lcad) specifically because she didn't want to spend too much time on gen. Ed. She wanted to get to the ART asap. Her school had majors in grAphic design, illustration, animation, game design as well as studio art. Yep. DDs friend who is doing a BFA at an art school is very focused on art and glad to be done forever with history and foreign language and so on. By contrast, my DD getting a BA at a liberal arts college is looked at the entire course catalog like a kid in a candy store. "Cultural linguistics... I wonder what that's about..." Art school is a place to focus on art, while college is a place to get a broader education, too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurel-in-CA Posted November 1, 2016 Share Posted November 1, 2016 Yep. DDs friend who is doing a BFA at an art school is very focused on art and glad to be done forever with history and foreign language and so on. By contrast, my DD getting a BA at a liberal arts college is looked at the entire course catalog like a kid in a candy store. "Cultural linguistics... I wonder what that's about..." Art school is a place to focus on art, while college is a place to get a broader education, too. Oldest dd's science class @ art school was......environmental science in the preserve that adjoins the college in Laguna Canyon...observe the species and do a presentation on one of them, its habitat, how to preserve/protect habitat & species while keeping preserve accessible for hikers. So it pulled a lot of visual art into the science class, along with some social policy issues. Sooooooo much better for her than a straight science class would've been. English involved lots of watching drama and analysing visual impact, whys and hows of set design, photo angles, etc. -- as well as some pretty solid classic plays. History classes included art and how it expressed that period in history. Having a good portfolio means more to an art school than getting good grades. But even art schools have their own special points of view. We talked w/one school in OR that had a very hands-on arts and crafts focus, another that was primarily animation, some offer industrial design. DD's school assigned her 60 drawings/week in her life drawing class but her teacher was always saying, "Oh, at Pasadena (apparently the gold standard art school in CA) it's over 100 a week....and that's just one class." Pasadena tuition was twice that of LCAD. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 1, 2016 Author Share Posted November 1, 2016 My dd is, of course, still in high school and she's already tired of ALL non-art classes! Sounds like she would love an art school. Now the question is if we can afford one! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 2, 2016 Author Share Posted November 2, 2016 I had my dd read the replies here, and we also looked at one college's required course list for BA vs. BFA. She's pretty thoroughly convinced that BFA is the direction she wants to go. Thank you all so much for the help! I'm sure she would love an art school more than a uni, but I'm not sure we can afford one. If anyone happens to know of some art schools that are more affordable, or more generous with scholarships, I would be grateful if you could share your knowledge with me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalmia Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 (edited) The difference between an art school and a university offering a degree in art B.A. or B.F.A. according to the schools we have toured seems to be that in a university the student will be taking about 50% of their coursework in art. In an art school it is generally 75%. Maine School of Art (MECA) has a merit scholarship program for between $8000 and $18000 a year for all four years that is based on academic performance in high school. Of course, the total bill is around $40,000. The University of Southern Maine has an accredited BFA and just opened a game design program which includes animation and it is not super expensive as universities go. MCAD in Minneapolis has a strong animation, graphic design, comics, game side to it. It is pretty expensive. Savannah College of Art and Design is supposed to be a leader in the animation/design area. Some of best animation and design schools are probably in Florida or California, but my child is not interested in going to either of those states so we haven't checked them out. You may also want to see if the schools your child is interested in (art school or university with an art department) is accredited. Also watch out for for profit art schools. A lot of the "Art Institutes" are for profit schools. http://www.allartschools.com/art-school-accreditation/ Edited November 2, 2016 by Kalmia 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 2, 2016 Author Share Posted November 2, 2016 The difference between an art school and a university offering a degree in art B.A. or B.F.A. according to the schools we have toured seems to be that in a university the student will be taking about 50% of their coursework in art. In an art school it is generally 75%. Maine School of Art (MECA) has a merit scholarship program for between $8000 and $18000 a year for all four years that is based on academic performance in high school. Of course, the total bill is around $40,000. The University of Southern Maine has just opened a game design program which includes game animation. MCAD in Minneapolis has a strong animation, graphic design, comics, game side to it. Savannah College of Art and Design is supposed to be a leader in the animation/design area. Some of best animation and design schools are probably in Florida or California, but my child is not interested in going to either of those states so we haven't checked them out. You may also want to see if the schools your child is interested in (art school or university with an art department) is accredited. Also watch out for for profit art schools. A lot of the "Art Institutes" are for profit schools. http://www.allartschools.com/art-school-accreditation/ Re: the bolded. Yes, we're avoiding those for sure! Thank you very much for this other info, and for the link! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalmia Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 Oh, the former President of the Maine College of Art just became the president of the Pacific Northwest College of Art, maybe there are or will be similar merit aid programs there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matryoshka Posted November 2, 2016 Share Posted November 2, 2016 (edited) I had my dd read the replies here, and we also looked at one college's required course list for BA vs. BFA. She's pretty thoroughly convinced that BFA is the direction she wants to go. Thank you all so much for the help! I'm sure she would love an art school more than a uni, but I'm not sure we can afford one. If anyone happens to know of some art schools that are more affordable, or more generous with scholarships, I would be grateful if you could share your knowledge with me! Does your state have a public art school? Our state has Mass Art (Massachusetts College or Art and Design) - it's a public school, so has in-state and out-of-state tuition. In-state tuition/fees (not including room/board) is $12.2K; out-of-state tuition/fees is $32.8K, so if you're in-state, it's a big discount. ETA: Mass Art does say it has merit scholarships, but of course adds that they are competitive. Edited November 2, 2016 by Matryoshka 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greta Posted November 2, 2016 Author Share Posted November 2, 2016 Does your state have a public art school? Our state has Mass Art (Massachusetts College or Art and Design) - it's a public school, so has in-state and out-of-state tuition. In-state tuition/fees (not including room/board) is $12.2K; out-of-state tuition/fees is $32.8K, so if you're in-state, it's a big discount. ETA: Mass Art does say it has merit scholarships, but of course adds that they are competitive. I have looked at Mass Art with envy!!! I really wish our state had something like that - or that we could move! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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