Sign Language Anyone?

[Jan Lyn]

Hello,

 

Just wondering if any of you are learning sign in your home. We were focusing on it for quite a few years and then stopped due to an adoption of a hearing impaired child that fell through for various personal reasons...then I became ill as well with autoimmune disease.

 

At any rate, I think we are gathering up our strength to get back to it. Am wondering who here might sign and if you do ASL or SEE and what books and materials you may use. I am fresh out as I sold mine all except for a dictionary as I didn't think I could ever sign again. Now I am considering what approach to use as my daughters seem to want it back in their life again.

 

I just made an entry in my new blog of a woman who is doing the most graceful, beautiful sign to a song if you would like to take a look I wrote and placed the link there. She seems very fluent and uses good expression as well.

 

Any suggestions on materials appreciated!

[Ferdie]

My dd uses a website called aslpro.com to learn sign language for her co-op class. The teacher gives them a list of words to learn each week and my dd looks them up on the dictionary section of the website.

 

Last week they had two deaf visitors come to their class and ask them questions in sign language. She was so excited.

[Rosie_0801]

I'm not terribly familiar with ASL materials, but the best I've seen (judging by the blurb) are the Bravo! ASL series; they actually teach grammatical features. Most programs don't seem to, as far as I can tell; and I'm sure you're aware there is way more to signed languages than vocab.

There is a shift away from manually coded English, so SEE probably isn't worth spending too much time on. If it's anything like the Signed English still sometimes used over here, it's so BORING to look at!

Good luck getting it going again,

:)

Rosie

[laughing lioness]

I'm not sure I'll be answering many of your questions but I have some thoughts. My kids and I learned sign language for a couple of years with the hope of doing it for years before that. My older 2 kids really took off with it when they became invovled in a deaf Bible Study. My oldest is fluent and my 18 yo is conversant. Sign has lots of slang, dialectical differences and doesn't really follow the books very well, so if you can hook up with an interpreter or a deaf person who signs, I believe that that is the way to go. We used ASL. My oldest has been in Europe a lot and they don't use ASL there, but she knows enough to be able to communicate anyway.

If your main goal is to do interpretive movement with the signing than learning the "language" won't be as important - kwim. Just translate the song, verse or whatever and be sure to give it dramatic flair. I've seen some interpretations that are incredibly powerful.

Edited October 13, 2008 by laughing lioness
spelling

[latinteach]

We like the Signing Time DVDs by Rachel Coleman.

[mommyof4DB]

We use the Signing Time movies to teach Sign Language. Their website has lots of great materials. www.signingtime.com Their videos are fun and easy to watch. My kids learn new things every time they watch them. Rachel, the instructor, uses colored tape on her fingers and explains how to make each sign, as well as showing several children using the signs. They also sing and sign songs using the signs they just taught, so kids can pick up new signs as well. I like that it isn't formal, and it doesn't feel like "school". It also gives me half-an-hour to shower, or cook, or check email or whatever. They are so engrossed, they just sit on the couch and sign right along with the movie!

[Jan Lyn]

Thanks so much for the comments and suggestions. I will check them out further. Lisa, if you don't mind the question, what if not ASL is commonly used over in Europe? I am very interested.

 

Blessings to All!

[dtsmamtj]

We have done several different things: Signing Times; Signs for His Glory (both volumes); various books/booklets; Everyday Signs (I think that is the name of the DVD); and now are doing an online course at www.lifeprint.com. We have always used ASL. All of us can sign a variety of things, but my oldest daughter is the one who is pursuing this heavily so far. HTH

 

 

T

[laughing lioness]

From what I gather there is no standardized sign language and deafness is considered a curse-it's a real shame issue. She's not home (college) but I'll email her tonight and see if she has anything to add.

[lwilliams1922]

http://www.lifeprint.com./asl101/lessons/lessons.htm

[Veritaserum]

I took a few ASL courses in college that also covered Deaf history and culture. Signed languages are similar to other languages in that they develop in pockets with their own rules and forms. American Sign Language is more closely related to French Sign Language due to the immigration of a French Deaf teacher to America (Laurent Clerc).

 

When the Mind Hears is an excellent history.

 

British Sign Language (which I believe is also used in Australia) has an entirely different form. I learned a bit of that, too.

 

Back on topic, we use the Signing Time videos. I wouldn't waste time on Signed Exact English, since the only people who use that would likely also be trained in oral speech. SEE is seen as something of an affront to some Deaf people, too, since some view it as an effort to force their visual language to comply with our audible one. It's also unbearably cumbersome. ASL flows much more readily since it is a naturally evolved language rather than an artificial one.

[Jan Lyn]

Thanks again. All of you are such a treasure trove of information. I am very interested in reading the book When the Mind Hears. Also, we have done most of the Signing Time cds and they are getting a bit young, but the websites are fabulous resources. I had no idea so much was available online and we also are having some fun this week going on youtube as there are quite a few songs and videos there. Just trying to keep things a bit light for now and see how it goes. My girls have been through a lot, but they do not want to loose their signing ability as well.

 

Yes, I did SEE in college, but we were doing ASL more here in preparation when at that point. I can see why deaf reject SEE and ASL is really a true language unto it's own. Also, the expression they use is so much more evident. I think it is beautiful, not to be ashamed of, but the world certainly has it's harsh ways at times. All things being equal is my thought........and that includes people. :)

 

Thanks again for the discussion!

[Rosie_0801]

Thanks so much for the comments and suggestions. I will check them out further. Lisa, if you don't mind the question, what if not ASL is commonly used over in Europe? I am very interested.

 

 

ASL means "American Signed Language" so it's not much of a surprise that they don't use it in Europe! ASL is descended from French Sign Language, so there are a lot of similarities, despite the differences in regional language development. Britain use BSL (British Sign Language,) which NZ Sign Language, Auslan and I think parts of the official India Sign Language are descended from. I don't know much about other European Signed languages, other than they exist.

 

FYI, We don't use BSL here in Australia, but our languages share about 70% of vocab. We use a lot more fingerspelling than they do, and have a fair amount of borrowing from ASL. Syntax is fairly uniform over signed languages, since they are all visual languages; shape and locations of what you are talking about are more important than they are in spoken languages.

 

Cheers,

Rosie

[Jan Lyn]

Hello Rosie,

 

Yes, of course....we are most curious what is used in England and if that system was a huge variation from ASL, so you answered my question in part with BSL. Hmmmm....wondering, perhaps I can do a search on that and find out further.

 

Languages are very interesting to me, so it was great to hear about the sharing of 70%. Fingerspelling is so very easy for us to do and quickly, but boy do we have a difficult time "reading" it from other people. Practice, I guess!

 

Thanks!

[Rosie_0801]

Hello Rosie,

 

Yes, of course....we are most curious what is used in England and if that system was a huge variation from ASL, so you answered my question in part with BSL. Hmmmm....wondering, perhaps I can do a search on that and find out further.

 

Languages are very interesting to me, so it was great to hear about the sharing of 70%. Fingerspelling is so very easy for us to do and quickly, but boy do we have a difficult time "reading" it from other people. Practice, I guess!

Thanks!

 

What did you want to know about BSL? Apart from any borrowings (and I would assume BSL does borrow from ASL, don't know where ASL borrows from) the languages are completely different. Our fingerspelling is two handed, for starters. I'm afraid I have to say that ASL looks a bit ugly to us! Weird that a language can look uglier than another, but it's possible. I don't know any fluent users of ASL, so I don't know their opinion of us :D Um, British based signed languages don't initalise anywhere near as much as ASL does. To us, ASL seems really heavy on English. Our (Auslan) level of fingerspelling usage makes us seem really heavy on English to the Brits, too. Cultural differences... We use different handshapes for classifiers. For us, a vehicle is classified using a flat hand, whereas in America, I believe, it is what we call the "8" handshape- thumb, forefinger and middle finger stuck out, and the rest tucked in.

So, you could argue that ASL is a dialect of French Sign, and Auslan and NZ sign are dialects of BSL. ASL and BSL are two completely different, non-related languages, and would only be intelligible (by fluent signers who are used to thinking visually, and aren't trapped by seeing only vocab signs) by using any borrowed signs, limiting the vocab signs in favour of classifiers and mime, and if we used the ASL fingerspelling. Not that I know, but it seems more likely for everyone else to know the ASL alphabet than for ASL users to know the British alphabet. Ireland, by the way, uses a one handed fingerspelling system too, with about 6 letters different to ASL, I think it was.

 

Yep, fingerspelling is alllllllllll about practise! Don't feel bad. It commonly takes a few years to become fluent. A simple thing that isn't really that simple. That's for our two handed system. I would imagine it would take longer with the one handed system, since the movements are smaller.

:)

Rosie

[laughing lioness]

My oldest is fluent in ASL and is conversant in Romanian and Hungarian. This is what she had to say about eastern Europe and input from her deaf Indian Friend:

 

"No, they have a different sign language in Europe. It is similar but still different. I know there is a deaf school somewhere in or near Oradea and I saw some people signing. I tried talking with some deaf ladies once in ASL in Romania and I wasn't sure if they could understand me or not. It was similar I think we got the jist of it but different enough that we were confused. Part of the problem was I asked them 'do you know ASL" and I spelled ASL.

I know they had some kind of sign classes for hearing people in Romania/Hungary because I would see students walk down the street talking and laughing together, obviously hearing kids, and practicing the alphabet. The letter 'D' looks something like a sideways 'live long and prosper' done with two hands. Or two of our 'd's' put together with your hands pointed down or sideways. I know their alphabet is different than ours. But I think they understood "you understand..?" Not sure.

 

A knows 2 or 3 different Sign Languages. He knows the official sign language of India I think (which again is different from European or American ASL I think) Street Sign Language, and ASL. Then he and his mom use their own special way of communication.

[Lovedtodeath]

We are finding ASL fingerspelling very difficult... DD will not do some signs as it hurts her fingers, and I would have to agree. Are we doing something wrong?

[Jan Lyn]

Many thanks Rosie and Lisa....you answered many of my questions and helped my curiousity for sure. Our family is just very inquisitive in this due to our adoption that fell through and we are interested in differences with BSL because a family from the UK is fostering our would be child. I was also told today by a professor today that the UK uses 2 forms as he had the experience of having a few interpretors in his lectures.

 

Yes, the fingerspelling seems so easy, but is hard to read in others. I can't imagine using both hands as that sounds much more complicated to me. My daughters have never complained about fingerspelling hurting, I know it can for me, but that's due to whether or not I am in a flare-up period of time. So interesting, Rosie that the "look" of ASL is so different to you, but I guess just like other spoken languages, there are some that sound easier to the ear, so must be true to the eye. All intriguing!

 

By the way, my daughters are so happy to be able to try this again. Are any of you counting on it as a language credits in highschool or just really electives and then must take another language? When my son entered PS here, it did not count and so he took 2 years of Spanish, which he hated. I understand, however, some colleges seem to accept it. So it sounds a bit contradictory.

[Rosie_0801]

We are finding ASL fingerspelling very difficult... DD will not do some signs as it hurts her fingers, and I would have to agree. Are we doing something wrong?

 

Yeah, you're trying too hard. You sign as well as you can without hurting yourself. Remember, deaf people get arthritis and such things the same as hearing people do, and modify their signing accordingly. I'm so brilliant I can stutter in English and Auslan ;)

Being in Australia, we don't do "credits" for high school, so I'm not the person to ask over that :) We don't actually study Auslan, we just use it. Dh and I are already fluent. If the kids want to go into any Auslan using profession (which is unlikely, I would think, we certainly won't encourage it) they'll have to do tertiary study anyway. That'll fill any gaps. If they have the interest we can teach Auslan linguistics, but there's no reason for us to do it unless they ask.

:)

Rosie

 

Edit: Here's a link to cruise through if you're still curious ;) http://edf3.gallaudet.edu/diversity/BGG/Sign%20Language%20Around%20the%20World/Index.html There are many sign languages used in Europe. There's no one European signed language, which isn't surprising. I remember seeing a book showing the Polish fingerspelling alphabet. Urgh. A language with three different types of Z gives me a headache at the best of times! There is an "International Sign Language" it's artificial like Esperanto, but used more. It's not a full language, more of a series of keywords. Most of the signs are more iconic than in a proper sign language. Very iconic, some of the signs! One has to think like a deafie, not modest hearing person... Useful for exchanging basic info like "where are you from?" No use at all for discussing philosophy :)

Edited October 16, 2008 by Rosie_0801