Latin for the New Millenium 3

[OnMyOwn]

If we did this at home, would this prepare my dd for her AP year of Latin? Could we do it at home without me knowing Latin if I had the teacher guide? I'm looking at all our options for Latin readings that will prepare my dd for AP Latin?

[yvonne]

I think Kathy in Richmond's daughter prepared for AP Latin on her own. Hopefully, she'll stop in here. If not, you might try pm'ing her about what they used.

[EKS]

If we did this at home, would this prepare my dd for her AP year of Latin? Could we do it at home without me knowing Latin if I had the teacher guide? I'm looking at all our options for Latin readings that will prepare my dd for AP Latin?

 

On teaching Latin without knowing Latin:  It is not enough to have an answer key.  Language is more fluid than that.  There will be instances, especially as the student advances, where what the student has written is absolutely correct, but it is not what the answer is in the key.  Also, there are different levels of mistakes (this is not just my opinion, but is shared by my son's German tutor who taught for years at the college level).  Some errors are due to not knowing a particular word or getting a gender or plural wrong.  Others are more conceptual, like using the nominative case for all nouns.  Conceptual errors should generally be marked down more than memorization errors.  But if all you have is an answer key, you won't know what's what, and so your grading isn't reflecting any real knowledge about your student's abilities.

 

All of this is to say that unless your daughter is a foreign language whiz, I think that having her learn Latin this way is going to be heavy going.  

[OnMyOwn]

I think Kathy in Richmond's daughter prepared for AP Latin on her own. Hopefully, she'll stop in here. If not, you might try pm'ing her about what they used.

Thanks, Yvonne. I did speak with Kathy about this awhile ago. At that point, I was thinking of having my dd work with a tutor and continue with the Orberg materials, but I think that may be to $$ for us at this point. I was looking through Latin threads again today and saw an old discussion about using the Bolchazy readers or LNM 3 for a year of Latin reading and started to wonder if we could do that at home ourselves. I know I can dig up the readers Kathy used somewhere on the boards, but I don't think she used LNM. Also, I know Kathy learned Latin alongside her children, whereas I jumped ship at about chapter 12 of LL.

[OnMyOwn]

On teaching Latin without knowing Latin: It is not enough to have an answer key. Language is more fluid than that. There will be instances, especially as the student advances, where what the student has written is absolutely correct, but it is not what the answer is in the key. Also, there are different levels of mistakes (this is not just my opinion, but is shared by my son's German tutor who taught for years at the college level). Some errors are due to not knowing a particular word or getting a gender or plural wrong. Others are more conceptual, like using the nominative case for all nouns. Conceptual errors should generally be marked down more than memorization errors. But if all you have is an answer key, you won't know what's what, and so your grading isn't reflecting any real knowledge about your student's abilities.

 

All of this is to say that unless your daughter is a foreign language whiz, I think that having her learn Latin this way is going to be heavy going.

Yes, good points and I suspect you are right about it being a difficult way to go. I know I've read of others using the Bolchazy materials (Kathy being one) at home, but I don't know if everyone who has done that has known Latin themselves. It wouldn't surprise me if they all have, but if there's someone out there who didn't know Latin, hopefully they will post on this thread. Thanks!

[Kathy in Richmond]

Just saw this thread.

 

Yes, I learned Latin alongside my kids at home, which was the only way to really help them or check over their translations. Latin can often be expressed in many different but semi-equivalent ways. The TM may just have one possible translation, and the teacher/parent couldn't help with alternatives if they didn't know the language.

 

I do think that there are some kids who could go through it Latin 3 level alone with the Bolchazy materials as long as they had access to the TMs & were the kind of student who honestly & diligently checks & evaluates their work. You know your student best.

 

Here's a link to an old post of mine (see post # 8 in that thread) where I listed the materials we used for Latin 3 and up.

 

We never used Latin for a New Millenium because it wasn't out yet when we were at that level. I'm very intrigued by it, though. The older Artes Latinae program by the same publisher (Bolchazy) was my absolute favorite (and I've tried 'em all :tongue_smilie: )

 

Hopefully someone else whose child attempted Latin on their own will contribute their experiences.

[OnMyOwn]

Just saw this thread.

 

Yes, I learned Latin alongside my kids at home, which was the only way to really help them or check over their translations. Latin can often be expressed in many different but semi-equivalent ways. The TM may just have one possible translation, and the teacher/parent couldn't help with alternatives if they didn't know the language.

 

I do think that there are some kids who could go through it Latin 3 level alone with the Bolchazy materials as long as they had access to the TMs & were the kind of student who honestly & diligently checks & evaluates their work. You know your student best.

 

Here's a link to an old post of mine (see post # 8 in that thread) where I listed the materials we used for Latin 3 and up.

 

We never used Latin for a New Millenium because it wasn't out yet when we were at that level. I'm very intrigued by it, though. The older Artes Latinae program by the same publisher (Bolchazy) was my absolute favorite (and I've tried 'em all :tongue_smilie: )

 

Hopefully someone else whose child attempted Latin on their own will contribute their experiences.

Thanks, Kathy. I do wonder if my dd would be okay doing this. The LNM book is so beautiful from what I have seen of samples. I know that would appeal to her. I am looking into a number of options right now, but I may order the LNM book and look it over with her. We could access a tutor some as well. I just can't afford to do that on a regular basis throughout the year.

[crazyforlatin]

LNM is beautiful - I have book 1.

 

Beth Harvey uses them to teach her Latin classes. I've emailed her several times and she's very responsive. Latin 3 uses the rest of LNM 2 and all of LNM 3. She will offer AP next year.

 

http://www.harveycenter.org/list-of-courses/

[Penguin]

My son has been using the LNM series with the Harvey Center. He is in Level 2 now.

I have been really happy with the textbook series. The Level III book looks really good :)

 

I don't think it would be any harder to self-teach with LNM than any other text, but if you are open to outsourcing you could contact Beth Harvey. The Latin III class will use LNM III.

Edited February 11, 2016 by Penguin

[OnMyOwn]

LNM is beautiful - I have book 1.

 

Beth Harvey uses them to teach her Latin classes. I've emailed her several times and she's very responsive. Latin 3 uses the rest of LNM 2 and all of LNM 3. She will offer AP next year.

 

http://www.harveycenter.org/list-of-courses/

Another interesting option. Do you know if LNM 3 will be followed by the AP class? Or will there be another year in between?

[OnMyOwn]

My son has been using the LNM series with the Harvey Center. He is in Level 2 now.

I have been really happy with the textbook series. The Level III book looks really good :)

 

I don't think it would be any harder to self-teach with LNM than any other text, but if you are open to outsourcing you could contact Beth Harvey. The Latin III class will use LNM III.

Can you tell me a bit more about these classes? How many students tend to be in the class? How many hours of homework are there a week? Thank you!

[Penguin]

Another interesting option. Do you know if LNM 3 will be followed by the AP class? Or will there be another year in between?

 

As I understand it, Latin III will be followed by and AP level class but that it will not be College Board certified as AP. But I will email Beth Harvey a link to this thread. She posts here sometimes - maybe she will answer your question.

[Penguin]

Can you tell me a bit more about these classes? How many students tend to be in the class? How many hours of homework are there a week? Thank you!

Classes are small. I forget how many were in the Latin I class. Six, maybe. Latin II was split into two groups. We took the Intensive Track which only ended up with two students. I don't know the projection for Latin III, but you could count on a small class.

 

My son averages an hour per day on Latin. No class is perfect, but I credit Magistra Beth as the reason he loves Latin.

[skimomma]

Lurking over here....

 

Anyone know how difficult it would be to move into the Harvey Center classes from Lukeion (or other Wheelocks based Latin)?  I have a child finishing Lukeion Latin 2 that might benefit from a repeat of Latin 2 from a different provider or perhaps moving to Latin 3.

[OnMyOwn]

Lurking over here....

 

Anyone know how difficult it would be to move into the Harvey Center classes from Lukeion (or other Wheelocks based Latin)? I have a child finishing Lukeion Latin 2 that might benefit from a repeat of Latin 2 from a different provider or perhaps moving to Latin 3.

I think the Harvey Center used to use Wheelock's for their classes until this last year or two, so they should be very helpful and know exactly where your dd should place.

[Beth in Mint Hill]

Hi there,

I heard that there were some questions about our Latin program at the Harvey Center. So I thought that I'd try to answer them, and I should let you know we have an Open House coming up soon, so you could ask any other questions you have then. All 3 of us Latin tutors plan to be there.

 

Skimomma--Yes, I believe that someone could easily switch to our Latin III course after two years of Lukeion - assuming that they finish most of the 40 chapters of Wheelock's in that two year time.

 

I studied Wheelock's with Dale Grote at UNCC, way back in the 90s and really love this text; for many years I taught using Wheelock's before switching to LNM. We are really enjoying using the Latin for the New Millennium textbooks now. I like the way they have many easy practice exercises to prepare the student for translating, and the students love the beautiful illustrations and the very interesting discussions of Roman history. The books are so engaging!

 

OnMyOwn, about studying three years of Latin on your own..... After the first year I think that it would get very tough for a student to master the material without a tutor. After you get past the elementary grammar concepts and begin learning the subjunctive mood and reading unadapted Latin, you need lots of help! 

 

Our Latin IV is a course in reading Vergil, and it does prepare a student for taking the AP exam; but for many reasons we have decided not to offer any "official AP courses."  Dr. Grote could best answer your questions about this, and he plans to be at our online open house. :)  

 

Edited February 22, 2016 by Beth in Mint Hill