Out-of-town grandparents and holiday breaks for college students

[Hoggirl]

My in-laws live about three hours away. My parents have been deceased my entire married life, so the in-laws are ds's only grandparents. I get along well with mil, but I really struggle with fil. Mil has already started asking me about Thanksgiving and Christmas breaks even before ds has started his freshman year. He has a week off at Thanksgiving (though he will only be home six nights for various reasons) and returns two weeks later for his Christmas break. I have told mil that we are NOT coming to their home for Thanksgiving because I want ds to have as much time as possible with his local high school friends. I have told her they can come up here for Thanksgiving if they like. I don't know if they will do that or not. Since ds returns a mere two weeks later, I am kind of hoping they don't.

 

Because of the quarter system, ds will be home for his Christmas break a week before all of his high school friends. He also returns to college a week before they do. So as to once again maximize friend time, I have suggested that he drive down early on in his break a spend a couple of days with his grandparents. He likes this idea fine. Mil, however, wants dh and me to come as well and to coordinate with dh's sister and her family to celebrate a very early Christmas all together. This is problematic because it is during the week, because of work schedules, etc. Ds and his only cousin (sil's daughter) are they only two grandchildren. I don't want to do this. Because my parents are deceased, I have spent every. single. holiday. with dh's family. Not necessarily ON the holiday, but the expectation is that we are going to be together. I have done this in the past for ds's sake and because he is close to his grandmother. But, I need a break. However, I can't figure out how to say this without hurting mil's feelings, though she is well aware that there is no love lost between fil and me. Mil wants everyone to be together, and she does seem to be having overall issues with ds's going off to college. The grandchildren are no longer 4 and 9 years old. I think she likes to believe everyone is close, but they really aren't. My dh never talks to his sister, and ds never communicates with his cousin unless we are all at their house. It's like she is trying to create this forced Norman Rockwell family that does not exist because of all the dysfunction (that I won't go into) caused by fil.

 

Sorry. This has turned into a rant (as did my similar post on CC). I am just wondering how you all have handled "sharing" your college-aged kids during holiday breaks with grandparents and other extended family. My ds is absolutely fine with going down early in his break for a couple of days. I am fine with this as well - I am not trying to be selfish and spend every moment with ds and prevent him from spending time with his grandparents at all. It's just that *I* don't want to have to go as well. I don't understand why his visiting isn't "enough" for her.

[readwithem]

Since your ds is going off to college, this is a great time to start new traditions (hey, they have to start sometime!).  

 

It sounds like it's a good thing your ds will drive to his grandparents, as he may want to cut the trip short.   :glare: I would definitely give your ds "permission" to do so.  (I put that in quotes because, after all, he is now an adult and can make his own decisions).

 

FWIW this year may be the hardest - just like when friends went off to brick and mortar kindergarten, after everybody adjusts to the "new normal" things seem to be fine.

[katilac]

Personally, I wouldn't try to explain to m-i-l that you need a break. I would simply say that's going to be problematic because of work schedules and so on, but I will let you know. I wouldn't feel the need to give a definitive answer on the holidays in mid-July, that's for sure! 

 

I am sure they would like to see your dh as well, at the least. How does he feel about it? Does he want to go?  If he does, I'd probably make it happen. At the least, you are getting out of Thanksgiving, and you will also have Christmas at home. That's two pretty nice changes! 

 

It doesn't have to be all or nothing, either. Your dh could go with ds if you have to work  :laugh:

[Nan in Mass]

Hugs, Hoggirl

 

It's only July.  Schedule one visit for son, either there or at your house, as comfort for his grandmother, and see if you can stall on all the rest.  I suspect, judging by how I felt last summer, that your emotional bucket is full and overflowing, making it hard to contemplate anything emotionally taxing like family holidays.  And as my son put it when he had to schedule an ortho apt., your world ends at the end of the summer and making plans beyond that seems rather pointless.  You are also tired.  Just tell mil that you are having trouble thinking past the end of Aug. right now, that you think it will probably work for your son to go visit but that you'd rather wait to make any further plans.  Don't forget that your son might want to do some visiting with his new friends, either at their house or at yours.  You will want to save room in the schedule for that.  And when the time comes, you might have more emotional energy and be feeling differently about it.  I spent a lot of last summer saying, "I'm sorry but I can't deal with that right now.  I just can't seem to think past Labour Day.  Can we talk about this after the summer?"

 

Nan

[Hoggirl]

Hugs, Hoggirl

 

It's only July.

 

Nan

Ha ha! Yes, I agree it's only July, but mil actually brought up Thanksgiving in January! Before ds had a clue where he would get in/where he would be going, etc! I did nip that in the bud and say, "We are making no commitments for Thanksgiving. We have no idea where ds will be, how much time he will be off." etc. Mil had talked about Christmas, so I talked to ds about it and found out what he wanted to do - which is go early in the break. She also brought it up with ds when he visited her (without us) over 4th of July weekend.

 

As for comfort for her, I do understand that. I offered for them to come up and spend the weekend with us before dh and ds leave for the big drive out west. There is a home college football game - FIL played in college and is in the sports Hall of Honor for the university - their induction for new members is also that weekend. Mil said she had talked to fil, and he had said he didn't know if he wanted to come that weekend since they were playing a "cr@ppy, non-conference" game. I told her they could come any weekend they wanted this summer or not come at all if they did not want to. Thus far, they have not committed. This is part of the issue as well - we are supposed to let them know NOW what our plans are, but we do not receive the same consideration.

 

I also know it is going to be difficult for sil to meet up with the family when ds wants to go down because of her work. So, I feel like that is going to cause negative feelings from her. I just keep wondering and wondering when I am going to get over trying to PLEASE people and make them happy. It is an effort in futility. My head knows this, but the rest of me??? Not so much.

 

Thanks for the support. I know I am just going to have to suck it up and go.

[Hoggirl]

I too have a mil that wants everyone to come over. We only commit for dessert, as that lets us have family time (we would like to visit with college guy too), and lets the college students have time to catch up with each other. She wasnt too happy about it, but when the time came and we arrived at the home, the movie on tv was more interesting and we were ignored so we quickly had a piece of pie and moved on. It wasnt about the visit, it is more that the brain gets stuck on an idea...the completeness idea.

You are fortunate that they must live close enough to only go for a short while. At a three-hour drive it is an overnight trip for us.

 

You are so spot on with the "completeness" idea.

[katilac]

You are fortunate that they must live close enough to only go for a short while. At a three-hour drive it is an overnight trip for us.

 

You are so spot on with the "completeness" idea.

 

I'm not a fan of long car trips at all, but six hours in the car and a visit is possible. If staying there made me miserable, it's probably what I would choose. 

 

In the car at 8 am gets you there at 11 am.  Five hours for visiting has you leaving at 4 pm, which gets you home between 7 and 8 in the evening (assuming you might stop for dinner). 

 

That type of trip knackers me the next day, but at least I'm home! 

[Hoggirl]

I'm not a fan of long car trips at all, but six hours in the car and a visit is possible. If staying there made me miserable, it's probably what I would choose.

 

In the car at 8 am gets you there at 11 am. Five hours for visiting has you leaving at 4 pm, which gets you home between 7 and 8 in the evening (assuming you might stop for dinner).

 

That type of trip knackers me the next day, but at least I'm home!

I don't disagree, but they will want "more." And, in fairness, I imagine my ds will want to spend at least spend one night.

[Nan in Mass]

Ha ha! Yes, I agree it's only July, but mil actually brought up Thanksgiving in January! Before ds had a clue where he would get in/where he would be going, etc! I did nip that in the bud and say, "We are making no commitments for Thanksgiving. We have no idea where ds will be, how much time he will be off." etc. Mil had talked about Christmas, so I talked to ds about it and found out what he wanted to do - which is go early in the break. She also brought it up with ds when he visited her (without us) over 4th of July weekend.

 

As for comfort for her, I do understand that. I offered for them to come up and spend the weekend with us before dh and ds leave for the big drive out west. There is a home college football game - FIL played in college and is in the sports Hall of Honor for the university - their induction for new members is also that weekend. Mil said she had talked to fil, and he had said he didn't know if he wanted to come that weekend since they were playing a "cr@ppy, non-conference" game. I told her they could come any weekend they wanted this summer or not come at all if they did not want to. Thus far, they have not committed. This is part of the issue as well - we are supposed to let them know NOW what our plans are, but we do not receive the same consideration.

 

I also know it is going to be difficult for sil to meet up with the family when ds wants to go down because of her work. So, I feel like that is going to cause negative feelings from her. I just keep wondering and wondering when I am going to get over trying to PLEASE people and make them happy. It is an effort in futility. My head knows this, but the rest of me??? Not so much.

 

Thanks for the support. I know I am just going to have to suck it up and go.

 

Try to forget about whether it is fair or not that they want to wait until the last minute but they want you to commit ahead of time.  Old people are unreasonable like that.  Sometimes it is just a matter of not knowing whether they will be able to stay away from a bathroom long enough to make the drive.  Having concrete plans for the future helps them to feel like there is a future, but when it comes to the near future, they aren't feeling up to par and are not sure if they can manage.  The farther away the things are, the easier it is to imagine that they will feel up to them.

 

So - as far as this summer goes, you did your part by inviting them to some things and being accommodating about the dates.  If they don't feel up to coming, that is fine.  You're done, for now.  Are there reasons that you don't know about that make it hard for them to travel to you?  Or are they just rather selfish?

 

As far as the future goes, yah, you're probably going to wind up going and visiting.  You do NOT, however, have to commit to doing so during this stressful and fragile time of your life.  This is a major life event.  Our culture just doesn't do a good job of recognizing it as anything but something to laugh about, which isn't fair.  You are allowed to take the time you need to adjust, without extra family pressure.  You are allowed to mess up everyone's plans this year.  Maybe you can tell mil not to worry, you'll all still be a family even though your little one is grown up now?  Sometimes being blunt eases the situation.  You can be apologetic but firm.  You will still be able to please them later.  Just not right now. : )  It isn't as though you can commit to things infinitely far ahead.  There is a line in there somewhere beyond which it is unreasonable to commit.  That line is temporarily a bit nearer to now for you at the moment.  That is ok. 

 

Believe me, if you are born like this, the sort of things it would take to make you stop wanting to please everyone all the time are NOT the sort things you want happening to you.  Chronic pain, for instance.  Wish for something else. : )  Like that your inlaws will suddenly turn into people you can enjoy.

 

Hugs,

Nan

[Nan in Mass]

Another thought - is there something near your inlaws that you would enjoy doing?  My husband looks for disc golf courses near wherever he has to go and that gives him a way to escape for a bit and something to look forward to.  I STILL don't think you need to commit to fall/winter plans now, but offer this as something to keep in mind for the inevitable FAR in the future grin visit.

[Hoggirl]

Another thought - is there something near your inlaws that you would enjoy doing? My husband looks for disc golf courses near wherever he has to go and that gives him a way to escape for a bit and something to look forward to. I STILL don't think you need to commit to fall/winter plans now, but offer this as something to keep in mind for the inevitable FAR in the future grin visit.

Oh, sure. It's the town where my dh grew up, we have other friends who live there, there is good shopping there, etc. But choosing to leave and go do something else would not be "acceptable," especially if we are only there for a couple of days. It would probably be okay for dh and me to go out to dinner with some friends, but for me to leave by myself and go do something? Nope.

 

I truly appreciate your suggestions, Nan. As I am sure you can read between the lines, there is a very long history of issues going on here. I guess I felt like once ds graduated things would magically change. That he could just choose to visit them when he wanted, and I would be more "off the hook." It isn't unreasonable that they want us to come over Christmas break for a visit. I just don't like going. I am the one who is being selfish.

[Nan in Mass]

Ayah. Definately can read between the lines, having similar problems. (My main one... um... ended last spring. Guess that is one way of putting it, anyway.) I always feel horribly selfish and nothing from outside myself has ever done anything but reinforce that feeling. These sorts of things come with the job description of "wife and mother". But now that your son is more grownup, you are allowed to take sick days. July - October and even, to some extent, the whole next year, counts as one. It is important that you be a little selfish and take the time to adjust. You will do nobody any favours if you fall apart. Being a little selfish this year will have much less impact. : ) A little selfish is not wanting to commit until close to the event. A lot selfish is restructuring the whole relationship and telling them that you don't ever want to see them again now that you aren't needed as a driver. You can't do the second (but you can dream all you want here, where people understand), but you can certainly do the first. I think, anyway.

 

Nan

[Hoggirl]

Ayah. Definately can read between the lines, having similar problems. (My main one... um... ended last spring. Guess that is one way of putting it, anyway.) I always feel horribly selfish and nothing from outside myself has ever done anything but reinforce that feeling. These sorts of things come with the job description of "wife and mother". But now that your son is more grownup, you are allowed to take sick days. July - October and even, to some extent, the whole next year, counts as one. It is important that you be a little selfish and take the time to adjust. You will do nobody any favours if you fall apart. Being a little selfish this year will have much less impact. : ) A little selfish is not wanting to commit until close to the event. A lot selfish is restructuring the whole relationship and telling them that you don't ever want to see them again now that you aren't needed as a driver. You can't do the second (but you can dream all you want here, where people understand), but you can certainly do the first. I think, anyway.

 

Nan

Wow, Nan. You should be a therapist. Thank you for "getting it." It helps tremendously.

[katilac]

I don't disagree, but they will want "more." And, in fairness, I imagine my ds will want to spend at least spend one night.

 

Oh, I meant for ds to still go for a few days, but for YOU to possibly drive there and back. They will want more, sure, but surely a day visit is better than no visit? 

 

Decide what you are going to do and TELL them, whether it is going up for one day or going for several days but also leaving to do other things. They don't find that acceptable? Oh, well. Their disapproval will not cause the world to stop spinning. Sometimes it helps to have your responses scripted in advance; just repeat them and pass the bean dip. 

[Gwen in VA]

<hugs>

 

Does anyone else have a "list" of things NOT to do as you get older? This thread is reminding me of my STRONG desire to not be the grandparent / older parent who nags and demands and requires!

 

I appreciated your comment about your mil wanting things to look like a Normal Rockwell painting. That describes your dilemma so well! I pray that you can find a way to fulfill her Norman Rockwell ideal for a short enough time that you keep your sanity!

 

 

[katilac]

 

Does anyone else have a "list" of things NOT to do as you get older? This thread is reminding me of my STRONG desire to not be the grandparent / older parent who nags and demands and requires!

 

 

We tell our kids all the time to let us know when we're being crazy old people  :lol:

[Nan in Mass]

<hugs>

 

Does anyone else have a "list" of things NOT to do as you get older? This thread is reminding me of my STRONG desire to not be the grandparent / older parent who nags and demands and requires!

 

I appreciated your comment about your mil wanting things to look like a Normal Rockwell painting. That describes your dilemma so well! I pray that you can find a way to fulfill her Norman Rockwell ideal for a short enough time that you keep your sanity!

 

My list consists of hoping I die before I become querelous (obviously never written that word before lol), grumpy, forthright, inconvenient, unable to live where I am surrounded by water and trees and furry friends, and heartbroken because nobody wants to spend time with me.

 

Nan

[Hoggirl]

<hugs>

 

Does anyone else have a "list" of things NOT to do as you get older? This thread is reminding me of my STRONG desire to not be the grandparent / older parent who nags and demands and requires!

 

I appreciated your comment about your mil wanting things to look like a Normal Rockwell painting. That describes your dilemma so well! I pray that you can find a way to fulfill her Norman Rockwell ideal for a short enough time that you keep your sanity!

--Mind my own business and try not to give unsolicited advice! - this is going to be tough for me!

--Don't act like the phone line only works one direction - as in not saying, "We haven't heard from

you in awhile." :/

--Not make judgments about what my ds and his family do.

--Not treat ds (when he is 51 as my husband is!) as though he doesn't know how to do anything (as

my father-in-law does)

--Offer praise and not criticism.

--Not expect to be waited on.

--Ask what ds and family would like, not always make it about me.

 

As one of my friends says, "You're never useless if you can serve as a bad example." I think it is wise to take note of the things that bother us about parents/in-laws. However, it is also important to realize that what bugs us may not be what will bug our adult children. We need to be attuned and read between the lines. I hope I am able to do this, and if I am uncertain as to whether or not what I am doing is annoying that I will just ASK.

 

As to holidays - Who knows what I will like when the situation arises. However, in my mind, I would rather spend time with grandchildren when it is NOT Christmas and there are NOT all the distraction that accompany it! I want the grandchildren to be focused on me and excited that I am there and not be more excited about new toys!

[Nan in Mass]

I have good examples in my own parents. My siblings and I want to help them because they've helped us so much over the years. Still are helping, even though they are slowing down fast now. My dad forwarded an email from my grownup son before he shipped out this morning which is a pretty good example of how helping can pay off (forwarded because it contained other info that I needed). It went something like: "Sorry. I forgot and left my battery on your charger in the basement. I'll fix your front steps when I get back." The key to this relationship is that my father somehow miraculously manages to be helpful without being interfering. I guess part of the helpfulness is having resources that he is willing to share, even if it means putting up with the occasional mistake like having a battery left in his basement, but part of it is also being very skilled at offering sympathy and suggestions and know-how without being annoying. Maybe I should figure out exactly how he manages that and start practising, now that my children are out of the teen years when they were annoyed at almost anything I said so it was hard to tell which was me being stupid and which was them being teenagers.

 

You know, I think fear is at the bottom of a lot of the normal old-people problems (and probably the more extreme problems as well, but you can't do anything about those) - not so much fear of dieing, but fear of being lonely and useless and either forgotten or a burden, fear of being physically uncomfortable or embarrassing or inconvenient. Maybe if we all teach our children now to KEEP saying I love you, even when we are old and they are grownup, we won't be so scared and, hopefully, won't do quite so many stupid things that drive our children away from us rather than bringing them closer.

 

Nan

[Sebastian (a lady)]

I have good examples in my own parents. My siblings and I want to help them because they've helped us so much over the years. Still are helping, even though they are slowing down fast now. My dad forwarded an email from my grownup son before he shipped out this morning which is a pretty good example of how helping can pay off (forwarded because it contained other info that I needed). It went something like: "Sorry. I forgot and left my battery on your charger in the basement. I'll fix your front steps when I get back." The key to this relationship is that my father somehow miraculously manages to be helpful without being interfering. I guess part of the helpfulness is having resources that he is willing to share, even if it means putting up with the occasional mistake like having a battery left in his basement, but part of it is also being very skilled at offering sympathy and suggestions and know-how without being annoying. Maybe I should figure out exactly how he manages that and start practising, now that my children are out of the teen years when they were annoyed at almost anything I said so it was hard to tell which was me being stupid and which was them being teenagers.

 

You know, I think fear is at the bottom of a lot of the normal old-people problems (and probably the more extreme problems as well, but you can't do anything about those) - not so much fear of dieing, but fear of being lonely and useless and either forgotten or a burden, fear of being physically uncomfortable or embarrassing or inconvenient. Maybe if we all teach our children now to KEEP saying I love you, even when we are old and they are grownup, we won't be so scared and, hopefully, won't do quite so many stupid things that drive our children away from us rather than bringing them closer.

 

Nan

 

Nan,

 

I really long for the ability to tag posts.  There used to be something like Nan's Words of Wisdom and these comments deserve them.

[Teachin'Mine]

Nan, I liked this especially ...

 

"...the teen years when they were annoyed at almost anything I said so it was hard to tell which was me being stupid and which was them being teenagers."

 

 

Would love to have the wisdom to separate the two, or maybe it's a little of both. 

[Hoggirl]

I believe we have a workable, tentative plan. I *think* we are going to fly ds directly into the airport in the in-laws' town. We won't know that date until he receives syllabi and has his schedule for final exams. However, even if he doesn't get to fly home until the day he must be out of the dorm (a Saturday), we would be able to "do Christmas" with the in-laws and extended family the next day on Sunday. Ds had had a dental appointment scheduled early that Monday, which I moved to later in the week to give us more flexibility. Mil and Fil wouldn't be happy with only one overnight, so even if ds doesn't fly in until Saturday, we can now stay Saturday and Sunday nights. Doing it this way will save ds three hours of travel time (since we won't have to drive down and back, just back from their town), lets us check off the family Christmas box right away, (so I won't be dreading it), and puts the gathering on a weekend day (even if it has to be Sunday there won't be work schedule issues for sil and niece).

 

Still don't know if they will come for Thanksgiving, but I am much less concerned about that. Of course, they still have not chosen a weekend to come visit before ds departs. It's a means of control, I know. :/ I have started to wonder if fil is uncomortable/nervous about doing the drive. He would NEVER admit that, but he is nearly 78 years old. I have suggested to dh that perhaps he and ds should offer to go down there for the "good-bye."

 

Definitely feeling better about the Christmas plan!

[Nan in Mass]

That sounds good.  My fil fussed seemingly unnecessarily for a few years before the situation got bad enough that and the situation extreme enough (refusing to walk down the yard to be part of a wedding) that he was forced to explain that he was afraid to be more than a few feet from a bathroom.  A long series of indignities later, it turned out that he had bladder cancer and had had it for some time, misdiagnosed as something else.  Sigh.  He was difficult enough to deal with at the best of times that his family didn't pick up on it as unreasonable behaviour.  I am NOT looking forward to being old.  We have various family members who are fine to drive short distances but don't know they shouldn't be driving at night or driving on the highway or whatever.  They are afraid of losing their license so they try not to admit it.  It made for some uncomfortableness until we learned to pick up on it.  And we're only at the beginning of the learning curve of having old people in the family.  I can tell we're all going to have to learn a whole lot more before we're done.  At which point, we'll be starting to go through it all from the other perspective.  Ug ug ug.  Can you tell that I am not looking forward to this stage of my life?  No way out but through and it isn't as though I want to hurry through,  Much wierdness.  Sorry for whining.  I don't have any advice to offer.  You sound like you are doing a good job.  I hope having it settled will let you forget about it for a nice long time and concentrate on the other generation. : )  We're the filling in the sandwich and get spread thin and squished lol.

 

Nan