Diet question - whole 30/paleo? UPDATE in edited OP

[Murphy101]

I seem to have hit a wall on losing weight.

 

I can't reduce my calorie intake further, IMO.

 

And I'm trying to be as active and exercise as much as I can. While it's not as consistent as I know it needs to be, it's as much as I can fit in and that's just the way it is for now.

 

So that leaves me considering just changing what I eat. I've cut out white bread and potatoes. I fell off the no s wagon into a chocolate pit over Easter and I'm detoxing from that. I'm giving up wine for a few months because I'm working on not drinking my calories, of which is only a cup of coffee in the morning and a glass or two of wine after dinner a few times a week.

 

Sigh. I don't snack on junk. I think the worst thing I might eat as far as carbs go is wheat crackers with cheese. Or Greek yogurt (I find I can skip coffee with some sanity if I have Greek yogurt or boiled eggs.)

 

Can someone explain what whole 30 or paleo would additionally require of me? Give me an idea of what typical meals would look like? I looked at the whole30 website and frankly the layout is very distracting and hard to follow. It just looks like graphics and jargon everywhere. Bullet points would be quite helpful please.

 

I want to lose at least another 15-50 pounds so being stuck for a month now is very discouraging, but I'm not seeing what else I can reasonably do to lose.

 

Tho I've resolved to call a personal in home trainer today. Maybe the cost is ridiculously out of my league, but I figure it can't hurt much to call. Maybe outside accountability with a pro would help me? I'm not looking for a quick fix, but I do need to see some progress to stay motivated.

 

UPDATE:

I take back every mean word I had about Whole30. :)

I went ahead and started it shortly after I posted this thread back on April 4.

I plan to stick with it until mothers day weekend when I will have some of that Green & Black dark chocolate bar in my nightstand and buy some Chardonnay.

 

I have lost an additional 13 pounds so far. So I broke that month long plateau!

 

But what's REALLY keeping me motivated is since I started Whole30 I have lost inches.

 

Since April 10 I've lost 3 inches in the hips and 2 in the waist!

[bobbeym]

:grouphug: No advice as I'm in the same boat, but I'm interested in hearing what others have to share.

[trinchick]

Are you eating enough? Not getting enough calories can certainly put you into a plateau.

 

 

The Whole 30 just seems too restrictive to me, but I think it would definitely help someone break through a plateau, and it's also a good choice for someone with an "all or nothing" mindset. Have you looked at this specific page about Whole 30? It's a very basic description with lots of bullets. Not confusing at all:

 

http://whole9life.co...hole30-program/

 

I've been doing the primal thing for approx 4 weeks now. The scale isn't moving much for me (lost about 5 pounds, which is great but not the huge drop others seem to get at the beginning), but I'm seeing a huge difference in how my clothes fit. My belly seems to be melting away. Typical day is eggs and a veggie for breakfast (carrot sticks or something), meat and veggies for lunch (usually leftovers from dinner the night before), and maybe steak and a couple of veggies for dinner (roasted brussels sprouts and broccoli, for example). It really is as simple as that. I'm completely satisfied and am not craving any grains or sweets at this point. I do put cream in my coffee and use butter on my veggies and to cook my eggs. If I feel like a snack, it will usually be a piece of fruit. I usually have one piece of fruit a day, mostly apples, oranges, melon. Once or twice a week, I'll have higher-carb fruit like mango, pineapple, or banana. I also have avocados as a snack - maybe two times a week. I feel better than ever. Lots of energy, sleeping great, happy. I don't feel deprived at all - even had low carb, crustless cheesecake for Easter without guilt.

 

I also read the book Wheat Belly and it was an eye opener to me. Good luck!

[Ann.without.an.e]

Whole 30 is great. It isn't an easy diet but it is worth it for how you feel.

 

No dary, no wheat, no grains (rice, corn, sorghum, etc), no sugar, no sweeteners (not even honey, molasses, maple syrup, etc), no white potatoes, no beans, no peanuts, no msg/carageenan/sufites, etc, and basically nothing processed.

[SailorMom]

I've been paleo for about a month now. I was already eating healthily, at least I thought so, and am not looking to lose weight, but I've already lost 5 lbs. All in my stomach...

First - are you doing weight/resistance training? You MUST do this! It will really help you get over that plateau.

As for the diet, it is very filling and healthy - but for me takes a lot of work. No boxed anything, no dairy, no grains (I do eat quinoa), no sugar (I eat honey, though), no soy, no grain oils, no legumes. Even things like pre-packaged sausage are out (look at those labels!). I have to cook everything from scratch and it takes time (this from someone who already cooked almost everything from scratch). I eat as much fruit as I want, I also eat a lot of nuts, raisins, and nut butters. but - again - I'm not trying to lose weight. Paleo for weight loss restricts fruit and nuts.

I think the key here is to focus on quality protein and good veggies. If you do that, you should do well :)

 

[SarahW]

To do the Whole 30 you should really get the book. It's all well-explained in there. The website is more of a keep-motivated place.

 

If you want something a bit less restrictive you could try out Mark Sisson's Primal Blueprint plan. The main difference is that Primal allows a certain amount of dairy (and red wine).

 

I think the Whole 30 could be really great if you have a sweet tooth, or carb cravings, or some sort of issue that could be caused by mild lactose intolerance or gluten intolerance or the like. After a month you can start adding in more foods and follow paleo/primal.

 

But losing inches off the waist, yes! Definitely, and I only followed Primal. My waist was always a bit more pudgy than the rest of me, and after about two months or so I dropped down to a size 4 for the first time as an adult (I was previously stuck at size 6 or 8).

[Murphy101]

Whole 30 is great. It isn't an easy diet but it is worth it for how you feel.

 

No dary, no wheat, no grains (rice, corn, sorghum, etc), no sugar, no sweeteners (not even honey, molasses, maple syrup, etc), no white potatoes, no beans, no peanuts, no msg/carageenan/sufites, etc, and basically nothing processed.

 

Ug. I don't think I can do that realistically. I can do almost no sugar. I don't use much as it is. I can and already do no white potatoes, peanuts, MSG, corn.

 

I have a tbsp of sugar and milk in my morning cup of coffee if I have any.

 

Wine, which I'm giving up.

 

The only bean we eat is black beans a couple times a week.

 

Long grain white rice (not the minute made stuff) is a staple of our diet. So is pasta. Its really nearly impossible to feed a growing family without those, but I have limited to eliminated it for ME except for about 2-3 times a month.

 

The milk in my coffee is the only milk I drink bc I don't want to drink my calories, but no dairy at all? No Greek yogurt? No hard cheeses with wheat crackers for and fruit for a lunch? Good grief. I don't think that's going to happen.

 

The only processed stuff I have is canned goods like black beans or tomato sauce used for a recipe.

 

That's why I was wondering how much stricter I'd have to be to with my food to do something like paleo or whole30. Honestly it sounds like they are too drastic for me.

 

Are you eating enough? Not getting enough calories can certainly put you into a plateau.

 

I consistently eat between 1500 and 1800 calories on average when I have some wine and pasta or rice. Days without those are closer to 1200 - 1600. That is with me feeling full and not struggling too much with cravings or hunger pangs.

 

The only times I ever go over those is if I have sweets. Not only do the sweets have tons of calories, but they make me hungrier.

 

Typical menu for me:

 

yogurt (maybe with a cup of coffee with sugar and milk) or 4 avocado Deviled eggs

 

Some avocado, tomato and cucumber slices with sea salt and pepper. Or a turkey and avocado sandwich on whole wheat flat bread. Or a green salad with feta or Gorgonzola tomatoes and fresh berries and lemon juice spritzed on top. Left overs. Or a banana in the car.

 

Chicken piccata with left over salad

Grilled Steak with baked sweet potato (minus any sweet toppings)

Lemon herb shrimp baked in the oven with roasted butternut squash salad (roasted butternuts squash, dried cherries, and walnuts)

Pot roast with carrots and onions

 

A couple times I might indulge and make something with pasta. Vodka cream sauce over penne with grilled chicken. Alfredo with spaghetti noodles. Or costa rican black beans and rice. These meals are no more than once or twice a week.

 

Again, I'm eating like that and not going over 1500-1800 calories most of the time.

 

Other than my coffee, which I'm giving up when I run out of the current bag, I only drink ginger water. (Bottled water with a lemon wedge and a slice of ginger that I keep in the frig to have on the go.)

 

I suppose I could go hard core and give up everything forever. No coffee. No pasta. No rice. No fruit. No dairy.

 

Am I really eating that awful? I *think* we eat pretty dern healthy and tasty considering my limited budget.

 

I have added hand weights and a 2 pound weight belt to my walk away the pounds routine. I can tell it makes the workout much harder, but I'm not seeing a big difference in weight.

 

Sigh.

 

This is so discouraging. Basicly to lose weight I need to ditch my life to sweat more and stop eating anything except maybe beef jerky. :'(

 

 

 

 

[SailorMom]

I get paleo/primal seem a bit tough... It is tough in many ways. I think what woke me up to what was in my diet was when I started reading all the labels. All the hidden sugar is crazy!!! And low-fat dairy is the worst (loaded with sugar). You're concern about the "whole wheat crackers with cheese" and yogurt is of course, well founded. However, primal/paleo folks think anything with grain isn't healthy - and whole grain is worse, lol. Dairy - not good!!! It's a completely different mindset from what we have been taught by society. I really suggest you read up on the science behind it.

[xixstar]

First thought - do you get enough sleep? Enough sleep is important for the body and can stall weight loss.

 

My second thought is that you calorie consumption may be too low depending on your body size and exercise. So either consider increasing calories (more fat perhaps) or test out the other binge-like theory and have a very high calorie day where you add tons more calories once a week (like all the indulgent foods in one day). Also, may be time to change what your workout routine is. If you've been doing the same thing, try something different. Bodies get used to what they're doing, changing things up can sometimes wake our bodies up.

 

While I felt that I did awesome on a primal diet, it's not sustainable for me either and instead moderation and really working to keep high-carb and gain foods limited works much better.

 

Another idea is to actually weight and check your proportions, enter them into a food tracking program. Do that for a week because a lot of times, we think we're eating x amount but measuring it reveals a different story and maybe you need more or less servings.

[Elinor Everywhere]

 

The only bean we eat is black beans a couple times a week.

 

Long grain white rice (not the minute made stuff) is a staple of our diet. So is pasta. Its really nearly impossible to feed a growing family without those, but I have limited to eliminated it for ME except for about 2-3 times a month.

 

The milk in my coffee is the only milk I drink bc I don't want to drink my calories, but no dairy at all? No Greek yogurt? No hard cheeses with wheat crackers for and fruit for a lunch? Good grief. I don't think that's going to happen.

 

The only processed stuff I have is canned goods like black beans or tomato sauce used for a recipe.

 

Some avocado, tomato and cucumber slices with sea salt and pepper. Or a turkey and avocado sandwich on whole wheat flat bread. Or a green salad with feta or Gorgonzola tomatoes and fresh berries and lemon juice spritzed on top. Left overs. Or a banana in the car.

 

A couple times I might indulge and make something with pasta. Vodka cream sauce over penne with grilled chicken. Alfredo with spaghetti noodles. Or costa rican black beans and rice. These meals are no more than once or twice a week.

 

I suppose I could go hard core and give up everything forever. No coffee. No pasta. No rice. No fruit. No dairy.

 

 

 

I've never done Whole30, but have had great success with Primal (Mark Sisson's book/site....more forgiving then Paleo). Primal allows some dairy (cream, cheese) and wine, and the occasional (or..ummm...daily in my case) square of 72% or higher dark chocolate.

 

The problems I see are what I've bolded....the grains & legumes. Eliminating grains sounds hard, but it really isn't. Have your hard cheese but skip the crackers. Eat your sandwich filling but skip the bread. Feed your family the rice/pasta but add a second veggie or a salad to your dinner instead. Skip the beans.

 

It sounds like you allow yourself only a bit of these things a few times a week, but if you add them all up it seems like you are having grains/legumes daily. A sandwich once or twice a week, pasta/rice once or twice a week, beans once or twice a week......that makes about 7 days a week of grains/legumes.

 

I'd try this: keep the coffee, keep the greek yogurt, keep the wine. Do not eat grains or legumes at all. May want to skip the sweet potato, too, for now.

 

Once you have lost the weight you desire, you can add back in sweet potatoes and the occasional serving of rice. It's not a "rest of your life thing" on those, but for the grains, I do think of it that way. When I'm at my ideal weight I allow myself a once a week "cheat day" and have my favorite cafe's turkey sandwich on ciabatta bread (to die for) or some other bad-for-me food. But when I'm trying to lose the weight, I need to be strict.

 

For me, it's not just the weight, but when I eat Primal I have a ridiculous amount of energy, I sleep more soundly, and I feel like riding my bike or hiking or kayaking or doing some form of fun exercise. When I eat grains, I feel sluggish.

[tex-bex]

It's only 30 days. You can do anything for 30 days. You may find that you like it so much you'll keep on keeping on after!

 

I eat differently after my W30 because I like it better. I dropped 15+ pounds from dropping wheat, then did a W30 and dropped 7 more. I don't eat like that all the time now, yet I have kept it all off with minimal exercise.

 

DH and I started our 2nd W30 on Monday. I already dropped 2/3 pounds, though I started AF at the same time, so it's probably a bit of both.

 

Mostly, though, I just want to stress that it is only 30 days. Not a lifetime commitment. You can do it, and I promise you'll like the results, plus how great you'll feel. :)

[trinchick]

 

 

The problems I see are what I've bolded....the grains & legumes. Eliminating grains sounds hard, but it really isn't. Have your hard cheese but skip the crackers. Eat your sandwich filling but skip the bread. Feed your family the rice/pasta but add a second veggie or a salad to your dinner instead. Skip the beans.

 

 

 

I agree that the no-grain, primal thing is easier than it seems at first. I won't deny that the first week was tough, but it's been smooth sailing once I got past the "addiction" cravings. My house is chock full of Easter candy, and for the first time in my life I haven't even been interested in eating any of it.

 

I still drink wine on the weekends, but now instead of cheese and crackers, I have cheese and apple slices. I actually like it better than the crackers. And on the nights that I feed the rest of the family pasta, I saute some shredded cabbage in butter and then put the meat sauce on top like a deconstructed cabbage roll. Cheap and easy and really delicious.

 

The other positive thing about paleo/primal is that you don't need to keep a running tally of calories or points in your head. I don't have to be thinking, "gee if I eat this yogurt now, I can't have that banana later because they're both 100 calories." I just know that if I don't have the grains/legumes/sugars and just follow my hunger/satiety cues my body will naturally regulate so that I'll keep losing.

 

Finally, I think that much of your second post, OP, is reflective of what we've been taught about "healthy whole grains" and beans and low-fat foods being the way to go. I'm not a science pro so I'll leave it to others to explain the technical bits, but from what I've been reading recently, much of that is a myth.

[Ann.without.an.e]

I agree with Rebecca, it is only 30 days. It might open your eyes. I never, ever would have thought that I had a problem with peanuts/legumes. After whole 30 I tried them and I had a horrible reaction.

 

Also, there are ways to get around the cream. I love the thick cream found in the top of non-stabilized canned coconut milk (full fat). It makes a great coffee creamer :D

[Alexigail]

Martha, Sorry in advance for the long post, but I'm dealing with many of the same issues right now and I feel for you! You said bullet points appreciated, so I did my best :)

 

I'm on day 3 of my Whole 30 right now. I think it's great for some situations (we're specifically focused on healing our guts and autoimmune issues, lactose intolerance etc) but for others it would be really discouraging and tough. You have to decide what would work for you. I will say that Paleo/primal is not usually that restrictive and it doesn't have to be an all or nothing thing.

 

Here's a list of what has helped me:

 

1. I read the book Why We Get Fat. ( http://www.amazon.co...t/dp/0307474259) This is what convinced me that what I'm eating wasn't going to help me no matter how much I restricted calories and fat. I'm not a "follow the program" kind of person, so things like Weight Watchers etc. were really frustrating to me. I like to know WHY I need to eat a certain way. This book is not hard to read but it explains how the body works and why the trendy diets don't work.

 

2. I had to make four realizations. These probably sound silly, but I had a lot of misconceptions about food and dieting that I had to get over:

 

a) Food is fuel. Period. You can either use good fuel, adequate fuel or terrible fuel. And every person, like every car, has unique needs for fuel. For me, putting sugar in my mouth is about as useful as putting sugar in a gas tank.

 

b Everything you eat tells your body to do something. The book I mentioned gives a nice rundown of this, but basically whenever I eat, I try to remember what I'm instructing my body to do. If I eat pasta or bread, I'm instructing my body to hold onto fat. If I eat good fats, I'm telling my body to let some of my stored fat go.

 

c) You can learn to like anything. Changing how you eat is hard, especially when everything you're not supposed to eat tastes so good. But take it from a serious sugar addict: When you stop eating sugar and grains, you eventually stop wanting them. Or at least WANTING them like I do. At first it feels like deprivation and there's withdrawal etc. But now I like all kinds of things that I would never have eaten before. Sometimes I even WANT them.

 

d) The goal of dieting shouldn't be weight loss. This one was really tough for me, but it's true. Being overweight is almost always a symptom rather than a problem in and of itself. If you address your HEALTH rather than your weight, you're much more likely to keep weight off in the long run. People who eat healthy will most likely lose weight if they need to. But if you're eating to lose weight, you're treating a symptom and not the cause.

 

I read a lot of paleo primal plans and the one that seemed the easiest and most forgiving is the Primal Blueprint. It allows some dairy, chocolate, and red wine. There's an 80/20 philosophy which says that if you're on the wagon 80% of the time, you're doing pretty well. There is also a lot of support online. Here's what I eat when I'm eating primal:

 

Breakfast: Eggs of some kind, usually an omelett with veggies and meat (I do eat bacon even though it's processed because, well, it's bacon!)

OR a smoothie with whole fat yogurt, whey protein powder, spinach and a ton of fruit to make it sweet

I always have coffee with breakfast, usually with whole cream or coconut milk.

 

Lunch: Salad with a protein, either meat or an egg

 

Dinner: We eat a variety of things for dinner, but the basic outline is protein + veggies, so maybe a steak or an almond crusted chicken with veggies on the side (sweet potato goes really well with steak) or we do a crock pot meal - pot roast or similar. We try to eat fish or shellfish once a week or so.

 

In addition to this, I graze a lot on beef jerky, boiled eggs, dried fruit, nuts, apples with cinnamon and almond butter, applesauce, etc.

 

Paleo isn't for everyone so you have to decide if it's right for you and for your home situation. I'm doing so much better with it this time because my husband has joined in. There is a lot of cooking and planning ahead involved. This is good for me because those are areas where I lack discipline, but it might not be so great for other people.

 

If you've tried everything and you're still not losing weight, I think it's reasonable to assume that there is something else besides food that's telling your body to hold onto weight. Some of the most common problems:

 

Sleep- you need a lot of it to lose weight. http://www.webmd.com...eep-weight-gain

 

Gut flora- This is a big one, especially if you've taken antibiotics recently. http://www.nytimes.c...-loss.html?_r=0

 

Stress- Stress can trigger a fight or flight response, which tells your body to hold onto fat.http://www.fitday.co...ersus-fact.html

 

Good Luck with it! I know how frustrating plateaus can be.

[Murphy101]

Hmmm.

 

I don't eat low fat. At all. Kerrygold butter in my coffee is my favorite thing ever. <3

 

I get that I can do anything for 30 days.

 

But then after the 30 days? Just gain it all back? I don't want to work so hard to lose this weight only to gain it back.

 

I agree that we shouldn't eat just to lose weight. Eating healthy is my goal, but I do need to lose weight.

 

I'll think about it. Maybe work on my menu a bit and see what I come up with.

 

Sleep: I never sleep. I've been an insomniaic my entire life. Most of the time I seem to have more energy than everyone I know. I have recently tried really hard to clock a full 6, but I wake up utterly exhausted. 4-5 hours of sleep in one go seems to be my ideal. Less and I'm tired, more and I'm exhausted. But I've been sleeping like this my entire life. I suppose being older sure makes it harder, but my sleep didn't interfer with losing weight before now.

 

Stress: meh. Life is one big hunt for survival. I'm eating and surviving, so I'm not too stressed. ;p

 

Gut flora: maybe I guess. I haven't had an antibiotic in nearly 2 years though. I suppose I could add a dash of ACV to my ginger water and take some olive leaf extract for a week and see if that helps improve things. Maybe going off my jet fuel coffee knocked my innards out of balance. lol

 

Three things I absolutely cannot stand: coconut, almond, or mint in any form whatsoever.

 

I can ditch the sugars fairly easily.

 

For me breads make meat tolerable. So I can eat my turkey avocado on wheat or pita bread, but I'd rather not eat the turkey at all than eat turkey without bread. I'll end up eating only the avocado, which I'm fine with I suppose. Certainly just not eating foods is one way to lose weight. :/ The only time I eat black beans is with rice, so out one is out two.

 

I can make some modifications. For example cream cheese, ham, green onion dip on cucumber slices is better than on crackers IMO. But there's cheese again.

 

I don't count calories. My Fitness Pal counts them for me. I log them in it more for the pie chart that tells me my carbs, fats, protein ratios. I'm trying to keep my carbs low and my proteins high. Also I tend to be anemic, so I can see how my iron intake is going. So I might notice my calorie "goal" is over or close to it, but I'm far more concerned with what I'm eating. It also helped me see I really wasn't eating enough.

[Danestress]

Exactly. It is only 30 days and during those 30 days you eat meat, eggs. tons of vegetables, nuts, avocados, some fruit, lots of healthy fats...... You are not going to be hungry. You just won't eat everything you love.

[pink&bluemommy]

Check out primal blueprint. Very similar to paleo but you can do dairy. Check out marks daily appe.

[pink&bluemommy]

Apple not appe.

[Murphy101]

Apple not appe.

 

I a few minutes looking for his app on my phone before I scrolled down. lol

[pink&bluemommy]

Sorry!

[xixstar]

The lack of sleep could be a major problem then, if you feel like you're doing fine overall on food. And sleep and stress both exacerbate each other too.

 

I will say that I struggled with insomnia for years and years and years. I've tried supplements, herbal stuff, medication stuff, and most recent was using amino-acid supplements to help sleep (tryptophan) and that kinda helped. But this year, I decided to commit to really working out but the only time I can do it is 5:30am before dh leaves for work. I go 6 days a week and do strength training (did 6 personal training sessions to get some workout routines and free weight instructions) three days a week and started just walking for an hour the other 3 days. I now do the couch 2 5k program on the walking days and that only takes 35 minutes versus 60 minutes walking.

 

But now, I'm am tired tired at 9:30pm and going to bed and sleeping the whole night through - oh how glorious this feels after a lifetime of insomnia. I find that if I ignore sleep signals (because I'm caught up doing something or staying up cause dh is) that throws me off but if I go to bed consistently at 9:30pm, I'm sleeping great. Oh it is such a splendid thing and my mood and overall life in general is a ton better because of it.

 

A trainer may be a great way to go. And maybe just try to add more calories in for a while to see if that helps too. Good luck finding something that helps you get where you want to be.