Please explain what a Talent Search is...

[lamolina]

I have only heard of them on here, never in "real life." I have a bright 11 year old and wondering if this is something I should be looking in to?? Thanks.

[Crimson Wife]

Hoagies' Gifted webpage on Talent Search Programs

[lamolina]

Thank you Crimson Wife. Is there a benefit to choosing one program over another, other than geography? Right now we are out of the country so that isn't my primary concern. Or do you recommend applying to more than one?

[Crimson Wife]

Different programs use different qualifying tests. My oldest is in CTY (uses the SCAT in 2nd-6th), EPGY (using her individual IQ scores), and C-MITES (uses the EXPLORE in 3rd-6th). Some talent searches allow students from different talent search programs who meet the cutoffs to enroll in their distance learning courses on a space-available basis (CTD is like that) but we didn't end up pursuing that for budget reasons.

 

In terms of college admissions, CTY and EPGY are probably the best well-known of the talent search programs.

[lamolina]

Thanks. So, we have never done IQ testing, but when my son was in public school for 5th grade whatever testing they used there he scored at the 99th percentile. Now he is in the middle of 6th grade and I am not sure what we do next. Do I just wait for 7th grade and do testing then and apply to various programs?

And if we are out of the country are there benefits to just being enrolled even without being able to go to any classes and such?

Thanks for your help, it is difficult to learn about these kind of things while in a 3rd world country!

[MrsBanjoClown]

I have been looking at doing the CTY, but is there really a reason to do it if we won't be able to participate in any of the classes?

[Dana]

I have been looking at doing the CTY, but is there really a reason to do it if we won't be able to participate in any of the classes?

 

Not unless you just want testing results.

CTY does have some family activities you can do at different locations in the country if you're a participant. Some of those look really cool. If your kids don't panic about testing, it's also a good idea to get a feel for the SAT or ACT before scores would be recorded, so that'd be a reason to test in 7th.

[Kathy in Richmond]

Here's a link to an old post where I and others wrote about our CTY experiences.

 

My kids didn't participate in their camps or online classes since they preferred going to specialized math camps and taking online classes from AoPS, PA Homeschoolers, and EPGY instead.

 

I used to teach for CTY locally when they offered once-a-week academic year classes in Richmond. I think that the kids benefited not only by getting advanced instruction at an appropriate level and pace, but also (almost more so) by finding peers with similar talents and interests.

[Dmmetler]

I decided to wait on CTY and go for the EXPLORE because CTY didn't have anything close to me, but there are things DD could do with an EXPLORE score within a few hours. We're kind of stuck here because the regional program is Duke TIPS, which starts later than many. I figured I'd have her test earlier rather than later, because even if we don't use the scores for any reason this year, it may help me and it means that when she IS old enough to be eligible for TIPS, it won't be her first time seeing a bubble test (which will be the case this Saturday, when she takes the EXPLORE-the state test she did last year has the students mark in the test book, not on a separate answer sheet, so this is a new experience).

[Crimson Wife]

I have been looking at doing the CTY, but is there really a reason to do it if we won't be able to participate in any of the classes?

 

 

Elizabeth Wissner-Gross, the author of What High Schools Don't Tell You, claims that:

 

 

"The talent searches act as some of the earliest stamps of achievement you can help your child attain in middle and early high school, opening doors to a lot of other opportunities. When your child applies to research programs, contests, and other academic opportunities for rising 11th and 12th graders later on, any applications and interviewers specifically ask if your child ever participated in a talent search...

 

For the highest qualifiers, those who score above a 700 on the math or verbal portion of the SAT 1, the Study of Exceptional Talent (SET) offers free academic guidance throughout middle and high school, and another even more impressive stamp of achievement. Within top academic circles, it's very prestigious to be identified as a 'SET Student' and to have demonstrated your academic capabilities at an early age."

 

 

Remember that old lottery slogan, "You can't win if you don't play?" The talent searches are like that- you can't get the potential boost if you don't have your kid take the SAT.

[lamolina]

And they take it during their 7th grade year, correct? And have the scores sent to whatever program you are interested in?

[Crimson Wife]

And they take it during their 7th grade year, correct? And have the scores sent to whatever program you are interested in?

 

7th or 8th, but only 7th grade counts for the SET program (which is through CTY). A lot of students take the SAT in 7th and then the ACT in 8th to have a second chance at qualifying for high school talent search courses (since some students score better on the ACT than the SAT).

[Kathy in Richmond]

Johns Hopkins CTY has programs for 2nd through 8th graders. NUMATS, Duke TIP, & Western academic talent searches may have different age levels for eligibility, so check first if you're planning to use one of those. Most families go with the program serving their geographic area because award ceremonies take place regionally. You can see the states served primarily by CTY here.

 

If you want your child to be eligible to attend a CTY award ceremony, then you need to sign up for the testing through CTY online (an additional fee applies). I believe that your child can still be eligible for their summer or year-round program offerings or for SET if you choose to test independently. At least, that's how it worked when we went through the program; if it's changed since then, I hope that someone will correct me!

 

SET eligibility is strictly based on age, not grade level. More info here.

[snowbeltmom]

I believe that your child can still be eligible for their summer or year-round program offerings or for SET if you choose to test independently. At least, that's how it worked when we went through the program; if it's changed since then, I hope that someone will correct me!

Unless something has changed this year, that is still the case.

 

I am extremely cheap and in order to avoid the Talent Search extra testing fee (which IIRC is about $40), I signed my kids up on my own. Since they were not old enough to have an online College Board account, I simply completed the paper registration (copies were at both my local high school and our local library) and sent in the registration packet via snail mail.

 

Once I received the scores, I simply faxed a copy to CTY in order for them to participate in both the summer camps and online programs.

 

I also inquired at one point with Northwestern's CTD and I was told that not only would they accept the SAT scores, but they would also accept the results of my dd's "Baby CTY" scores if she wanted to take one of their elementary level classes.

[lamolina]

So, if we will be out of the country for most, if not all, of my son's 7th grade year, what do you all recommend?? I don't want him to miss out on this opportunity but without being able to attend any classes or on campus activities I am not sure which programs to choose.

They do offer the SAT here but I am not sure how they would feel about a 7th grader taking it!

[Kathy in Richmond]

CTY has a page for international talent search testing, so it's definitely possible. Here's the College board page concerning registration for SATs overseas. I don't think that they can turn anyone down due to age, but I'd search through the individual country info on that last link to find any additional requirements for your location.

 

The alternative would be to wait until 8th grade and go through CTY when you return to the US.

[lamolina]

Am I correct that the only benefit to taking the ACT/SAT in 7th is for SET? Otherwise he could wait until 8th when we are back in the US? Are there any other negatives to waiting until 8th?

 

(thanks Kathy, I never really considered that might be an option, I just thought I had to figure it out for 7th somehow)

[Kathy in Richmond]

To qualify for SET, you need a SAT score before the 13th birthday, regardless of official grade. Usually that would be 7th grade, but not always. There is also an allowance for kids testing a bit after their 13th birthdays, in which case they need an additional 10 points on verbal or math for each month past the birthday. My own dd tested one month late.

 

Other than that, the only difference that I can think of (CTY here) in waiting till grade 8 is that the score cutoffs for award ceremonies or CTY summer or online programs are a little higher. Most kids will go up that amount just from the extra year of learning.

 

Sounds like it might be stress-relieving in your case to wait till you return. In any case, enjoy your travels!

[kwg]

And, also, if I may ask...there is no point in applying in sixth grade? It makes sense to wait until 7th or 8th?

[lamolina]

He actually won't turn 13 until June of his 7th grade year, he sometimes has a summer birthday and sometimes not, just depending on the school district. So technically, we would be back in the US and he would still be in 7th/age 12. It would just depend on when the test is offered. I think it is given in May though right?

 

thanks again for the help Kathy!

[Kathy in Richmond]

And, also, if I may ask...there is no point in applying in sixth grade? It makes sense to wait until 7th or 8th?

 

You could test then, depending on what you're looking for. CTY uses the SCAT for grade 6, and high scores result in invitations to regional award ceremonies & eligibility for CTY courses geared to that age group. But you wouldn't be missing anything huge by waiting till grades 7/8.

 

Other talent searches may use different tests for various grade levels; you need to check out the links in post #13.

[Kathy in Richmond]

He actually won't turn 13 until June of his 7th grade year, he sometimes has a summer birthday and sometimes not, just depending on the school district. So technically, we would be back in the US and he would still be in 7th/age 12. It would just depend on when the test is offered. I think it is given in May though right?

 

thanks again for the help Kathy!

 

Yep, the SAT has both an early May and an early June testing date every year. Seems that you'd be fine to wait till you're back in the US. :001_smile:

[momsuz123]

Okay, I am so clueless about this whole talent search thing myself. What if we live in the Midwest - I didn't see any states at all close by for the CTY test, etc?

 

Thanks.

[Kathy in Richmond]

Try the NUMATS talent search for the Midwest. It serves Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, Minnesota, Ohio, Wisconsin, North Dakota and South Dakota according to the website. If that doesn't cover your area, try the others listed in post 13.

[Dana]

Okay, I am so clueless about this whole talent search thing myself. What if we live in the Midwest - I didn't see any states at all close by for the CTY test, etc?

 

Thanks.

 

You also don't have to be in the area if there are courses available... for instance, we're served by Duke's TIP, but we've also participated in Johns Hopkins CTY and Northwestern NUMATS so my son can take online courses through CTY and NUMATS.

 

I wouldn't take the tests unless you think your child will enjoy the experience - it can be challenging not knowing a good bit of material. If you weren't going to take any courses, there'd be no need to test with multiple talent searches as well.

 

They do have a lot of information on their sites too. Kathy gave those links above.

[snowbeltmom]

Okay, I am so clueless about this whole talent search thing myself. What if we live in the Midwest - I didn't see any states at all close by for the CTY test, etc?

 

Thanks.

We are also in the Midwest. My two younger kids took the CTY SCAT at a national testing center 30 minutes from our home. At one point I was considering signing my kids up for one of Northwestern's programs, and I was told that they would accept CTY's SCAT scores for their program as well.