Striking a Compromise: Independent vs. Classical

[BlsdMama]

I have nine dc and the tenth will be here this Spring.

 

I have to find a way to strike a compromise between what I *want* to do and what I am *able* to do when it comes to a balance of time.

 

My children are grouped according to age and ability so we tandem teach a few.

 

My groups:

 

11th grade DD

8th grade DS

3rd & 5th grade DDs

K-2 (Teaching at a beginning 1st grade level) for three kiddos

 

 

11th grade DD & 8th grade DS do science together and Elegant Essay. DD and DS both each do separate writing programs as well. Other than writing they are completely independent. I am very happy with the education they've received and are receiving with the exception of DS' spelling skills. No help needed.

 

3rd & 5th - 3rd grader is an exceptionally strong reader and would stop reading only to sleep if given a choice. (Hey~ You can read while eating.) :D 5th grader is an average reader. Both cheerfully do whatever is assigned. The 3rd grader is a natural speller. The 5th grader is the polar opposite. They are doing SOTW, MOH, and various lit and history books as we have planned in our school year. THIS I am happy about. They are using Rod & Staff Grammar

 

What is not getting done:

Writing on a regular basis which I want to move in tandem with what they are writing and reading about.

Spelling (AAS for the 5th grader)

Science - Other than reading about scientists and nature in a mostly random, sometimes planned, sporadic pattern. Sigh.

Memory Work - This REALLY bothers me. :(

 

K-2 - These three are 4.5, 6, and 7. They can read small words that are phonetically correct. We read aloud (SOTW and MOH) and various books. They do Explode the Code, copywork (not daily), and Parent's Guide to Teaching Reading not daily, but several times per week.

 

What is not getting done:

I'd like to start AAS 1 with them.

Consistent copywork

Memory Work (Again, this REALLY bothers me.)

 

 

What I need help with:

 

Please help me cheat. I've held to my high ideals of pulling out copywork from literature that we're currently reading, doing narrations, making up my own memory work, assigning our own readings and pulling in literature. This is great IF I had the time. But, now, what's happening is that I don't have time. So, what isn't getting done? The things I find MOST important - dictation, copy work, narration, memory work.

 

I am finding this incredibly disappointing.

 

I need something that makes it easy. I need structured curriculum for these things.

 

I think Memory Work is the MOST important. I'll take flashcards or SOMETHING. But they have to be something I can purchase and they come, all happy, ready made for me to use. We're studying medieval.

 

And, I admit, I sure wouldn't mind a science curriculum for my 3rd & 5th grader to do together that takes ZERO mommy time. I know it's not ideal, but frankly it's this or nothing. Would it be wrong to admit that I don't even care if they retain or learn a single thing from it?

[Upward Journey]

We're using the same history & grammar plan :)

 

For memory work we use the Veritas Press cards. I bought plastic sleeves and a small notebook and we go through them together as a group. I also bought the Classical Conversation guide book (we're not in CC) and use that.

 

For copywork/narration we use the sentences in the SOTW activity guide. My youngest, who has issues w/ fine motor control, only copies a sentence, he does not do dictation at this point.

 

R&S spelling has been incredibly easy to implement. Before this I was very inconsistent.

 

We are going to start IEW's medieval history based writing course (grade 5 & 7). It looks very easy to teach, and not time intensive, but I can't vouch for that, as we haven't started it yet ;)

[Roxy Roller]

I just wanted to offer a :grouphug:! It sounds like you have done an awesome job so far! I don't have as many kids as you do, but I know how it feels to be stretched thin between what you 'want' to do and what actually gets completed.

[SonshineLearner]

Hey Kelly :) Would you maybe be interested in seeing if there's any Memory Work that would be fun to do together? Nathan would like to do some Chemistry Experiments with someone. (simple :)) I have no serious curriculum in mind, but I'd be interested in doing some fun things... Just a thought :)

Seriously, on the other stuff... I'll be happy if Nathan learns as much as your oldest two!! :) The others... will probably be just as educated! :)

[coralloyd]

Well, how you would feel about combining copywork, dictation, and spelling? It would make life a lot easier for you. I use Spelling Wisdom for this. http://simplycharlottemason.com/books/spelling-wisdom/

My 3rd & 5th grader copy a passage for 2 or 3 days. We discuss the words that they don't know how to spell, what rules they follow, etc... On the 3rd or 4th day I dictate it to them. My 3rd grader is at the beginning of book 1 and my 5th grader is near the end.

 

What exactly do you want to memorize for memory work? The Living Memory book is chocked full of things. http://www.lulu.com/us/en/shop/andrew-a-campbell/living-memory/paperback/product-4080865.html I use this along with SCM memory system http://simplycharlottemason.com/timesavers/memorysys/. I put our memory work in a big three ring binder instead of 3x5 cards. This way I can pick something from Living Memory, look it up online, print it out, slip in page protector, and place in our binder. I like printing what I need, not writing it all out. If that sounds like too much, just use LM as is. This still might be too much for you though.

 

For science, if I wanted my kids to do it all on their own I would go with SL. Since it is basically, read this, do this. It comes with everything they would need to do the experiments, plus videos that show the experiment (they could just watch them if you don't want the mess).

[BlsdMama]

Thank you for the hugs! :grouphug:

 

I am a little frustrated at having one plan in mind and then execution always falling a little short.

 

Carrie,

 

I'd love to do something like that, but honestly, I cannot see anyway in which I could commit to it because I cannot do memory work with Tim. (And committing to another person when I am falling short of where I really WANT to be when I am just staying at home with my own kiddos would be harder for me.)

 

Right now we are deciding whether or not to do Awanas because of poor Tim. DH would like to see all the kids doing it, but Tim is so weak in memory that I can't see it being anything except a torture device for him. I was just going to kind of let him go through the motions and then only call for memory work as a group or individually without him being present, but if we do it with someone else, especially a boy his age, I think it would be uncomfortable for him. :( He doesn't yet know how far he is falling short of other kids his age and I'd like to keep him in the dark on that one for as long as possible.

 

I have really thought about the Veritas cards and I've thought about CC materials.

 

Does anyone want to explain to me how they are different? What I might like over another? What CC materials have to offer to someone NOT using them in a group? I'm all ears.

 

:bigear:

[staceyobu]

I'm not sure that I would look into adding AAS if I were you. I've never used it, but everything I've heard about it is that it is parent intensive (which is one reason we don't use it... and I only have 4 kids!).

 

You could buy the CC timeline cards and memorize them in order. Maybe someone else knows if the song for it is on the audio cds? You can also buy the cd and have everyone listen to the history songs. That would make memory work very easy and everyone could do it.

 

How about your 3rd and 5th grader reading through an apologia text? You could even skip the experiments. My 2nd grader could probably read through one by herself now, and she seems to enjoy it for the most part.

[campmom]

The thing that I would say would be really good about the cc materials for you is that you can buy the cd and play it daily for your dc to listen to that way they would learn the memory work without much work from you. It is really easy to have them memorize a lot of facts using this.There are other support materials also. You could also do poetry memory work the same way with the poetry cd from IEW. For a quick and easy way to get your dc doing copywork, narration and dictation order one of the WWE workbooks, its open and go and the work is already done for you. You can copy the student pages for your family so that will save some money. You can really study the samples of the different levels at amazon to see which one you would need to start in. I really wanted to do my own but decided this year to give myself a break and do the WWE workbook. It came in one day and we started the next, easy peasy. I have the IEW poetry cd on the way.

[GSOchristie]

I am doing CC as a group, but you could completely do the memory work on your own. We have each week: a history sentence, about 7 timeline events, a science sentence, Latin, English grammar, and math. We bought the CD resources and use them all the time. I downloaded them to my iPhone so we do it at home and in the car, at the park, wherever. I'm not sure why your son is weak in the memorizing department, but my three year old can almost say all of the memory work verbatim, from listening to the CD's. They have songs, chants, etc, for much of it. Each week's work is grouped together on one CD and we listen to it on repeat while they are playing. My five year old has memorized the timeline up through the Middle Ages from listening to the song. They also have a foundations guide that has all the memory work for all three cycles. It was around $60 and the three cd's were $35.

[Plateau Mama]

How about your 3rd and 5th grader reading through an apologia text? You could even skip the experiments. My 2nd grader could probably read through one by herself now, and she seems to enjoy it for the most part.

 

I was going to suggest Apologia as well. This is our second year. My 5th grader does it all by himself, including the Lapbook by A Journey Through Learning. He loves it. I do help him with experiments, but we don't do them all, only the ones that interest him. Usually he does them all by himself, I'm just in the room to supervise as he likes to try additional things. (and doesn't always use good judgement ;-) )

[SonshineLearner]

Hey Kelly :) No problem, I had thought of it and then felt bad that Tim might feel bad, but then when I saw your post... :) As far as doing all the CC work, it'd be easy to do it at home. You just have to do one week... each week :).... It's all separated out in the book. The current one is what I'd want... for less chance of mistakes, etc. :) I wouldn't do their geography, and I like Shurley English for English... Ok.. so I'm a "tweaker" :)

[TengoFive]

I haven't read through all the replies, but I'll throw my 2 cents in anyway. I had to drop AAS. There just wasn't time in the day to make it work. I have 3 natural spellers and 1 horrible, horrible speller. We tried AAS, but it just didn't get done. So we switched to Sequential Spelling DVDs for him, and I'm so happy we did.

 

I'm a lot like you. I'm a perfectionist and have this idea in my head of what would be the perfect schooling. However, the reality is with this many kids I just can't do it all. I'm having to pare down and limit the teacher intensive subjects. I'm trying to make sure the things I choose to be teacher intensive are worth the time spent doing them or if that time could be better spent on another subject.

 

I adore Writing With Ease workbooks. No, they don't always tie in to what we're doing in school, but they get done. They've also hooked the kids on a few books they wouldn't have otherwise been interested in.

 

For Memory Work, I get anything I can on audio and make a weekly playlist. We review it in the car as a family. I love having a captive audience LOL.

[BlsdMama]

I'm not sure that I would look into adding AAS if I were you. I've never used it, but everything I've heard about it is that it is parent intensive (which is one reason we don't use it... and I only have 4 kids!).

 

You could buy the CC timeline cards and memorize them in order. Maybe someone else knows if the song for it is on the audio cds? You can also buy the cd and have everyone listen to the history songs. That would make memory work very easy and everyone could do it.

 

How about your 3rd and 5th grader reading through an apologia text? You could even skip the experiments. My 2nd grader could probably read through one by herself now, and she seems to enjoy it for the most part.

 

LOL, I OWN AAS. I just haven't APPLIED AAS. :glare:

 

I bought Apologia and all the lapbooks for the kids from 5th to K. However, at the beginning of the school year it became apparent it wasn't going to get done, so I got rid of it rather than look at it.

 

Maybe I should just focus on the 3rd and 5th grader for the most part and STOP trying to fold in my K-2s into their plans.

 

Come to think of it, with that little realization, that might be my problem. The things they do without the littles (grammar, history readings, assigned lit reading, math for Liz) get done with no problem at all. The stuff I attempt to fold them all into doesn't get done. Hmmmmm....

[BlsdMama]

Hey Kelly :) No problem, I had thought of it and then felt bad that Tim might feel bad, but then when I saw your post... :) As far as doing all the CC work, it'd be easy to do it at home. You just have to do one week... each week :).... It's all separated out in the book. The current one is what I'd want... for less chance of mistakes, etc. :) I wouldn't do their geography, and I like Shurley English for English... Ok.. so I'm a "tweaker" :)

 

Carrie,

 

I admit, Shurley is attractive just because of the jingles. The girls learned some in co-op and they loved them, lol. I LIKE Rod & Staff - a lot, actually. How teacher intensive is Shurley?

 

Don't feel bad, lol. We are still learning Tim's limitations and maybe they won't always exist? I think we're having an evaluation done this Spring to see if it's "just" dyslexia or if there is something more that we need to be aware of so we can work with him on a more personal level where he is at instead of where we'd LIKE him to be, kwim?

 

 

 

So, ya'all have been incredibly helpful!

 

Let me ask:

 

My 5th grader is just a cheerful little thing. She'll do anything I ask her to do and she wouldn't mind a BIT if I just absolutely PILED on work, lol. However, she likes everything to be VERY laid out, she isn't really a "formulate my own plan" type of a girl.

 

So...

 

If I just did

 

Apologia Science with lapbooking (*just* Becca & Liz)

 

Continue on R&S Grammar

 

AAS (my one teacher intensive and I feel this *is* necessary)

 

WWE instead of doing my own IEW program or trying to get Liz to do Medieval - Add in the workbook for low teacher involvement?

 

Continue on Ana's history/lit program because she has that all laid out for me.

 

Add in CC or Veritas cards (or both?) for memory work

 

And then I think I'll just sit down and do the CM method for Bible and just spend a weekend getting that organized.

 

I'm also thinking I *LOVE* StartWrite but I might find Character Italics workbooks just EASIER for right now rather than making all my own. That's actually adding more time than I thought. :(

 

Any other suggestions?

I just need to feel organized. I had a plan, but unfortunately it all worked around me laying out everything each day or each week.