C_l_e_0..Q_c Posted August 4, 2011 Share Posted August 4, 2011 And *this* is why French kids do a total of 12 years of grammar in school... Interrogation demain matin... sur le pluriel des jours de la semaine. Se put-il que déjà vous le sûtes ? Le pluriel des jours de la semaine ? Doit-on mettre la marque du pluriel aux jours de la semaine ? Tout bon commerçant s'est un jour posé cette question très légitime. Eh bien oui! Lundi, mardi etc. sont des noms communs soumis aux mêmes règles d'accord que les autres noms communs. On écrit : tous les lundis et tous les dimanches . Sauf que, vous vous doutez bien que ça ne peut pas être aussi simple... Lorsque ce même jour est suivi par une description de temps, la semaine par exemple, il faut compter le nombre de ces jours dans cet intervalle de temps. Dans une semaine, il n'y a qu'un seul lundi et on écrit donc : tous les lundi de chaque semaine. Vous suivez toujours ? Donc si on passe au mois, il y a cette fois plusieurs jours qui sont un lundi dans un mois et on écrit donc : La réunion a lieu les premier et troisième lundis de chaque mois. Au passage, vous remarquerez que premier et troisième sont au singulier puisqu'il n'y a qu'un premier et un troisième dans un mois. Mais les deux ensemble sont un pluriel. C'est dans ce même ordre d'idée qu'on écrit : tous les dimanches matin et tous les mardi soir de chaque semaine. Dans le premier cas, matin est au singulier car il n'y a qu'un seul matin dans une journée par contre il y a plusieurs dimanches. Dans le deuxième cas, il n'y a qu'un seul mardi dans la semaine d'où le singulier et il n'y a toujours qu'un seul soir dans un mardi. Vous faillites ne point lire ces subtilités de la langue française. Ce jour vous le pûtes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted August 4, 2011 Share Posted August 4, 2011 But the logic of it is splendid! Intricate, but splendid! Laura Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted August 4, 2011 Share Posted August 4, 2011 Профессионал онлайн Элита киллеров онлайн Восстание планеты обезьян онлайн Погоня онлайн Ларри Краун онлайн Мой парень из зоопарка онлайн Очень плохая училка онлайн Секс по дружбе онлайн Монте-Карло онлайн Пингвины мистера Поппера онлайн Laura Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C_l_e_0..Q_c Posted August 4, 2011 Author Share Posted August 4, 2011 Laura, there's no need to quote the spam and keep it forever ;-) I might report you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enviromommy Posted August 5, 2011 Share Posted August 5, 2011 This is why I adore the French language. Now here's my question: why is a last name singular in French even when referring to all the members of the family? Ex: "Les Dupont sont en vacances cette semaine." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C_l_e_0..Q_c Posted August 5, 2011 Author Share Posted August 5, 2011 This is why I adore the French language. Now here's my question: why is a last name singular in French even when referring to all the members of the family? Ex: "Les Dupont sont en vacances cette semaine." Because it's a proper name, and proper names do not get the plural form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joan in GE Posted August 6, 2011 Share Posted August 6, 2011 And *this* is why French kids do a total of 12 years of grammar in school... But are you counting time in kindergarten? Or are things different in Quebec? I don't see French grammar books past 3e here, eg my ds1 didn't have one for his last two years of French classes at the international school where he was studying French as the langue maternelle...there might be a little grammar included in the writing books from second and terminale but not that much. Are grammar books for the last two years common in Quebec? Or are they for people more in the latin/literature stream for example? Ds1 was in the science stream... Joan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C_l_e_0..Q_c Posted August 6, 2011 Author Share Posted August 6, 2011 Are grammar books for the last two years common in Quebec? Grammar is not a separate subject, it's integrated within the rest of French. We don't have a distinction between writing, spelling, grammar, literature. It's all French, all the time. So yes, the kids will be studying grammar till their last year of high school and even beyond (I still had grammar in engineering university!) It's just not a dedicated timeslot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monica_in_Switzerland Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 I showed this to my native speaking husband and he said he was having frightening flashbacks... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joan in GE Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 the kids will be studying grammar till their last year of high school and even beyond (I still had grammar in engineering university!)It's just not a dedicated timeslot. I think this is somewhat dependent on the country or the school or the program then.... My ds2 did his studies in French as well. It was a little harder to keep track of what he was doing since they didn't use as many books as at the International School - he was in a Swiss private school. But I just asked him if they were studying grammar in the last two years of high school in French and he said "no"...they did some vocabulary if it was related to the literature...occasionally something grammatical came up in writing... But I think this happens in English too. Maybe there aren't as many spelling exceptions as in French, but grammar occasionally comes up and of course vocab is part of SATs. Anyway, ds2 just finished his bachelors in engineering here (all in French) and did not even have a single course of French, let alone grammar. But I agree that French is more complicated with the tenses, accord, and spelling exceptions, etc. just not that everyone is studying it continually... The French grammar teacher I just had for a summer university course gave an anecdote that he had to prepare a French test for policemen here...He gave a simple "dictee" with what he said was an "easy" grading scale...Out of 78 policemen, only 4 of them passed!!! Joan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 Yes French grammar is not fun :) I thought I would entertain you. This is a blog entry of an American living in Morocco where kids learn half a day in French and half a day in Arabic (both foreign languages to them, since Moroccan Arabic is very different). Imagine sitting in those schools. http://moroccomama.wordpress.com/2010/03/21/could-you-be-a-moroccan-2nd-grader/ I want this French textbook :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixie Posted August 17, 2011 Share Posted August 17, 2011 I think this is somewhat dependent on the country or the school or the program then.... My ds2 did his studies in French as well. It was a little harder to keep track of what he was doing since they didn't use as many books as at the International School - he was in a Swiss private school. But I just asked him if they were studying grammar in the last two years of high school in French and he said "no"...they did some vocabulary if it was related to the literature...occasionally something grammatical came up in writing... But I think this happens in English too. Maybe there aren't as many spelling exceptions as in French, but grammar occasionally comes up and of course vocab is part of SATs. Anyway, ds2 just finished his bachelors in engineering here (all in French) and did not even have a single course of French, let alone grammar. But I agree that French is more complicated with the tenses, accord, and spelling exceptions, etc. just not that everyone is studying it continually... The French grammar teacher I just had for a summer university course gave an anecdote that he had to prepare a French test for policemen here...He gave a simple "dictee" with what he said was an "easy" grading scale...Out of 78 policemen, only 4 of them passed!!! Joan In France I don't remember any grammar past 9th grade. In the lycee it was mostly litterature study and writing in 10th and 11th. The baccalaureat exam for French is at the end of 11th grade so in 12th we had no French class, we had philosophy instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeslieAnneLevine Posted September 12, 2011 Share Posted September 12, 2011 (edited) I am probably missing something here, not being a native French speaker, but I would just say "le lundi". FERME LE LUNDI or Mon fils joue au foot le lundi. Also, regarding the name of a family: in French the plural form of the (les) makes it clear, so French can have such rules about not pluralizing proper names. In English we need that S! Edited September 12, 2011 by LeslieAnneLevine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mspen1018 Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 I took two semesters of French (bilingual German/English and had Persian neighbors and their son and I were best friends so I am fluent in Farsi so I go the distance)... I took a few semesters of Spanish and that was boring so I went to French... I had a hard line professor and because on Midterms I had the highest grade in the class even though I was a first time student, she made me do my presentation on the laws, history and classification of french wines and there were so many past tenses it was crazy, some of the verbs were the same and German was easy but when I wrote 2394 (zweitausenddreihundertvierundneunzig) the whole class was intimidated. They spent years in French and two were from France and because she was Quebecois they laughed at her but she'd teach differences and change her accent but even though I picked it up, I have a French Conjugator app and there are tons tenses under the ton I was taught in class... French is harder than hell... Spanish as an adult was laughable... I had to refer to sites that were in German and had German to French translation because I couldn't follow English to French... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 I started teaching my kids French and yes, I am now realizing how much more complex this all is than I remembered. On a good side, I think French has very clear rules. Of course all the memorization of irregular verbs in multiple tenses isn't fun, but it's doable. What I am finding difficult is explaining to my kids concepts that clearly don't exist (or exist to a lesser extent) in their native language (English). It's soooo simple to conjugate verbs in English. Going from it to French (group 1, group 2....) seems nuts to them. I hope it all works out in the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joan in GE Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 What I am finding difficult is explaining to my kids concepts that clearly don't exist (or exist to a lesser extent) in their native language (English). This book might help a bit, but definitely don't spend a lot of money on it as it is missing things that it seems should be included.:001_smile: Side by Side French and English Grammar Joan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted January 8, 2012 Share Posted January 8, 2012 This book might help a bit, but definitely don't spend a lot of money on it as it is missing things that it seems should be included.:001_smile: Side by Side French and English Grammar Joan Thanks!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nan in Mass Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I am struggling to get the rudiments of French grammar into my son this year. Ug. He can read Tristan et Iseult, but he can't remember how to conjugate être in the present tense. Grrrr..... He is working his way through a grammar book, but it is low on his priority list. I just counted up the pages and if he does a spread a day for the rest of the year he will get through it. I can't see him managing that rate, though. He spent the first semester getting through the first eighth of the book. Ug. I, too, had the impression that French grammar was fairly easy - until I started trying to explain it. Nan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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