OrganicAnn Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 This is probably a strange question. My DD has some issues with fine motor skills and maybe some other learning disabilities. She had a IQ test as a part of group of tests to determine what is going on with her. She tested at 131, sorry can't remember which test. She is 7. What I keep thinking is "If she didn't have these learning disabilities would her IQ be higher?" I know it doesn't really matter what her IQ is and at 131 she qualifies for any gifted program in our School District if we were to put her in public school. I guess it is more curiosity on my part. Is the number accurate or would it be different if she had no issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Momling Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 Who knows? I mean... an IQ test is an attempt at quantifying intelligence. It's sort of artificial to begin with. I guess the ideal IQ test is one that isn't limited by language or culture or educational background or literacy or disability. That said... I don't really think it's possible for a test to control for the quirks of any particular test-taker or to be predictive of a test-taker's score with a different set of abilities or skills or background. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKS Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 What I keep thinking is "If she didn't have these learning disabilities would her IQ be higher?" Yes, probably. Keep in mind that the whole IQ thing was invented to predict how well a kid would do in school. A kid with LDs and motor issues is going to have a tougher time in school than if they didn't. If she was given the WISC, one way to see if LDs and motor skills are messing with the results is to look at the VCI and PRI only. If they are much higher than either the WMI or PSI (or both) then the score is artificially low due to something that is not intelligence. If the discrepancy is big enough, they shouldn't even be reporting the FSIQ (as it is invalid) and instead should be reporting the GAI. You can calculate the GAI yourself if you have the subtest scores. But even the GAI is likely to be somewhat lower. My older son has a host of issues but I'm pretty sure that underneath the issues he is as intelligent as his younger brother whose GAI is in the HG+ range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmmetler Posted July 24, 2011 Share Posted July 24, 2011 This is also why a full neuropsychological assessment includes multiple tests, not just one. That single number is not anywhere close to the full story when you're 2e. I have cerebral palsy (at the mild end of the spectrum), and I have ridiculously high (ceiling level as an adult) verbal scores, and then a few very low subtest scores on performance skills requiring motor coordination that are timed. So my Neuropsych reports consist of about half the report using other tests to justify that the verbal score is a reflection of my intelligence, and the other half justifying that the performance score is a reflection of my disability. The result is a report that I can use to qualify for MENSA-or for a 504 plan, assuming anyone actually READS the darned thing! (haven't needed it for anything since I finished grad school and the professional competency tests for my teaching license, but it's still taking up a chunk of my file cabinet). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Runningmom80 Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 This is also why a full neuropsychological assessment includes multiple tests, not just one. That single number is not anywhere close to the full story when you're 2e. :iagree: I would even go as far to say it is never the full story, LD or not. A iq test, at best, is an estimation based on a snapshot of one's life. As someone who has had her child tested twice, I can say that we haven't even scratched the surface on this kid, and aside for some fine motor troubles, he isnt 2e from what I can see. OP, I don't blame you for wondering about the validity of the score. Did the psych administering the test know about the 2e? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAR120C Posted July 25, 2011 Share Posted July 25, 2011 (edited) This is probably a strange question. My DD has some issues with fine motor skills and maybe some other learning disabilities. She had a IQ test as a part of group of tests to determine what is going on with her. She tested at 131, sorry can't remember which test. She is 7. What I keep thinking is "If she didn't have these learning disabilities would her IQ be higher?" I know it doesn't really matter what her IQ is and at 131 she qualifies for any gifted program in our School District if we were to put her in public school. I guess it is more curiosity on my part. Is the number accurate or would it be different if she had no issues. But I'd also add, this is why The Number is of limited value. What's really much more useful is the pattern of subscores. If you have the report anywhere, or if you can get a copy from the tester, you might find that there was "scatter" with some areas higher than others. Depending on the LDs, there might be a characteristic pattern to the highs and lows - generally this isn't diagnostic of anything, but it's a clue of where they should look. And what you might find out isn't that her IQ is "higher" but that, for instance, she's consistently strong in nonverbal skills and less so in verbal (or vice versa)... or maybe that she's got a lot of scatter within each index, and none of them is truly a clear picture of abilities. There are defined points at which the differences in scores render a summary number pretty much meaningless.... but that should be covered in the report that the tester gave you. Edited July 26, 2011 by KAR120C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrganicAnn Posted July 26, 2011 Author Share Posted July 26, 2011 Thanks everyone for not thinking I was weird to ask. I been thinking about this so I pulled out the test results. It was the Woodcock-Johnson III. Her highest scores were in the verbal ability cluster 150 and factor cluster - verbal comprehension 150. So I would guess unless 150 is a ceiling, that 150 would the highest possible IQ she could have. Her low scores were visual matching 72 and reading comprehension 86. The rest were in the 105 to 139 range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaichiki Posted July 26, 2011 Share Posted July 26, 2011 Thanks everyone for not thinking I was weird to ask. I been thinking about this so I pulled out the test results. It was the Woodcock-Johnson III. Her highest scores were in the verbal ability cluster 150 and factor cluster - verbal comprehension 150. So I would guess unless 150 is a ceiling, that 150 would the highest possible IQ she could have. Her low scores were visual matching 72 and reading comprehension 86. The rest were in the 105 to 139 range. These tests don't measure maximum. They're usually considered minimums. Subtest ceilings mean that the child *could* score higher, but the test can't measure any higher. A 72 sounds like a significant relative weakness. You might want to follow up on that one. It could cause her frustration (b/c it doesn't fall in line with the rest of her abilities and could feel like a huge issue to her). We've BTDT with oldest and his significant relative weaknesses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAR120C Posted July 26, 2011 Share Posted July 26, 2011 Thanks everyone for not thinking I was weird to ask. I been thinking about this so I pulled out the test results. It was the Woodcock-Johnson III. Her highest scores were in the verbal ability cluster 150 and factor cluster - verbal comprehension 150. So I would guess unless 150 is a ceiling, that 150 would the highest possible IQ she could have. Her low scores were visual matching 72 and reading comprehension 86. The rest were in the 105 to 139 range. I don't know enough about the test to say anything useful (and I hope the tester had a nice long conversation with you anyway!) But just off the cuff, with a range like that I'm guessing the full scale IQ score is very nearly meaningless. Instead, what you know is that she has some significant verbal strengths, while other areas are much lower. Was the testing useful for figuring out the possible LDs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKS Posted July 26, 2011 Share Posted July 26, 2011 Her low scores were visual matching 72 and reading comprehension 86. Has she had a developmental vision exam? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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