High School Sciences- Biology

[TXMary2]

If your child was going to be a science major (Zoology or Wildlife Biology) what science course publisher would you suggest for the high school sciences.

 

This year he is using Apologia Physical Science. He hates Physical Science, although he has an A. He will be doing Biology next. He wants to do Apologia, but he also wants "a regular high school biology text like the public schools use." His words. Would the Miller/Levine Dragonfly book be good or will any old Biology textbook no older than 2007 be fine to just read on his own? He read the Abeka Biology book last year on his own. He reads science topic books on his own also - this year he has read:

 

The Origin of Species (with a dictionary handy)

Why Evolution is True- Jerry Coyne

DK Eyewitness: Evolution

Evolution The Triumph of an Idea - Carl Zimmer

What Evolution Is- Ernst Mayr

Evolution: The Remarkable History of a Scientific Theory - Edward Larson

Evolution: The Grand Experiment - Carl Werner

Archimedes and the Door of Science

The Edge of Evolution - Michael Behe

Evolution: A Theory in Crisis - Michael Denton

 

DVD's:

Icons of Evolution

The Priveleged Planet

Unlocking the Mystery of Life

Creatures that Defy Evolution I, II, III

Planet Earth series

Life series

 

He has read several others, but these are the ones I can remember without going to his reading log.

 

I guess because he is going to be a science major at a non-christian university or college, I want to make sure he is prepared. Apologia is my favorite science and although I have heard people say it was plenty to prepare for AP or CLEP tests, I am just not sure. He is likely going to do the CLEP Biology.

 

If he continues with Apologia, does the extra reading on the side, and studies a CLEP guide - do you think this would be enough? I'd like to hear from anyone who has BTDT or was a science major.

 

Also, any other book suggestions??? Thanks!!!:001_smile:

Edited April 18, 2011 by TXMary2

[creekland]

We probably haven't gotten along far enough yet, but we supplement Apologia with Glencoe for a text - chosen because our local ps uses it. My guys all like Apologia better, but I want them to be able to read a more traditional science text too, as well as to have a secular option.

 

Then they supplement with a lot of outside things from google to documentaries based on what is on their minds or taped on TV. To me, they learn the basics from the texts, then add to it in more depth via the supplements.

[Julie in MN]

My oldest is in a sciency career (petroleum engineer) and I would really say that high school math is far more important than high school science.

 

I also am not totally sure where he's at on all the evolution topics he's reading, but if he is a committed young earther and heading into a secular university in the sciences, I have a suggestion. Some time before he graduates (not necessarily 9th grade), you might order some of the free videos from Howard Hughes Medical Institute. http://www.hhmi.org/catalog/main?action=getCategoryListing&catId=2

 

Some of their videos are really cool supplements. But they are really, really enthusiastic evolutionists. They are in love with the theory and find great meaning and fulfillment in their careers as this theory unfolds. One of their videos is even designed just to try to reach young earthers (according to the separate discussion segment on the DVD), and another is very excited that he won a debate with a young earther (the mousetrap one). And I just think watching them on video is more powerful than reading it in a book.

 

My idea is that you could watch them first and then when you feel your child is ready, have him watch with the idea that some of his future professors will have these views and you don't want them to shock him. Plus you don't want him to get a bad grade by a quick reaction that disagrees with them. They seem to have already heard all the young earth arguments and they will not likely budge.

 

But back to the math... even the teachers on these videos (there are bios and discussion segments) often came into serious science careers from the math field or from not liking science in high school. So that adds to my thoughts that math may be more important than extensive science in high school.

 

Julie

Edited April 18, 2011 by Julie in MN

[EKS]

Some time before he graduates (not necessarily 9th grade), you might order some of the free videos from Howard Hughes Medical Institute. http://www.hhmi.org/catalog/main?action=getCategoryListing&catId=2

 

THANK YOU for this link! I am currently designing a biology course and these will be a wonderful supplement!

[TXMary2]

Thank you to those who have replied.

 

Anyone with opinions on the Miller/Levine text? I see I can order the student text and the workbooks A and B on Amazon. I didn't see a TE. I really don't want to use something without a TE.

 

My son did some research today and said he wants to do the BJU science. We could do the DVD class, but again, because it is a christian company I feel I need to have something supplementary.

 

Just for giggles I printed out the sample AP Biology test and he he knew quite a few just because he reads so much already.

 

Someone, anyone please tell me your favorite biology resources.

[Guest ikester7579]

If your child was going to be a science major (Zoology or Wildlife Biology) what science course publisher would you suggest for the high school sciences.

 

This year he is using Apologia Physical Science. He hates Physical Science, although he has an A. He will be doing Biology next. He wants to do Apologia, but he also wants "a regular high school biology text like the public schools use." His words. Would the Miller/Levine Dragonfly book be good or will any old Biology textbook no older than 2007 be fine to just read on his own? He read the Abeka Biology book last year on his own. He reads science topic books on his own also - this year he has read:

 

The Origin of Species (with a dictionary handy)

Why Evolution is True- Jerry Coyne

DK Eyewitness: Evolution

Evolution The Triumph of an Idea - Carl Zimmer

What Evolution Is- Ernst Mayr

Evolution: The Remarkable History of a Scientific Theory - Edward Larson

Evolution: The Grand Experiment - Carl Werner

Archimedes and the Door of Science

The Edge of Evolution - Michael Behe

Evolution: A Theory in Crisis - Michael Denton

 

DVD's:

Icons of Evolution

The Priveleged Planet

Unlocking the Mystery of Life

Creatures that Defy Evolution I, II, III

Planet Earth series

Life series

 

He has read several others, but these are the ones I can remember without going to his reading log.

 

I guess because he is going to be a science major at a non-christian university or college, I want to make sure he is prepared. Apologia is my favorite science and although I have heard people say it was plenty to prepare for AP or CLEP tests, I am just not sure. He is likely going to do the CLEP Biology.

 

If he continues with Apologia, does the extra reading on the side, and studies a CLEP guide - do you think this would be enough? I'd like to hear from anyone who has BTDT or was a science major.

 

Also, any other book suggestions??? Thanks!!!:001_smile:

 

Your son's reading list looks like my library of creation books. But I'm more of a DVD watcher. Some really good DVDs I have run across besides the ones you mention are:

 

1) The Exodus revealed. Put out by Questar. It's where this guy goes out to prove the the Israelites lived in Egypt, and he follows the clues to find the Red Sea Crossing. In the video they find a golden layered chariot wheel believed to be that of the pharaoh when he drowned trying to chase the Israelites down.

 

And other chariot parts also.

 

 

Then we have the wonders of God creation series DVDs, has about 4 DVDs in it.

1) Thundering Earth and Roaring waters.

2) The Milky Way and our Solar System.

3) The animal Kingdom.

4) Planet Earth.

 

Also anything on creation by Dr. David Menton (AIG).

 

And the DVD named: Raising the Allosaur. Put out by vision forum video. It's where Home Schoolers uncovered a rare dinosaur.

 

And if you have Netflix, in the documentary section they now have a few videos on creation in there.

 

1) The whole Kent Hovind series is in there (disk rental).

2) Just about all of Lee Strobels videos are in there (The Case For Christ, Case for Faith, etc).

3) Creatures that defy evoltion.

4) Wonders of God's creation series (disk rental).

5) Creation adventure team (disk rental).

6) God of wonders.

etc...

 

Plus all the evolution videos you can think of. And science documentaries.

 

When watching evolution videos, he needs to realize that over 90% of evolution processes have to be animated for a reason. That is because they cannot be observed. But they will imply that animation = evidence. And many have bought into that.

[johnandtinagilbert]

We're enjoying a ton of Netflix science right now that includes much Intelligent Design. We have used the Apologia Biology this year with many living books intertwined to prepare them for Academia. Go to my Homeschool Launch page (in siggy) and look for the book list I put together from recs here. I'm devouring Darwin on Trial right now and finished up The Double Helix. It's a great booklist and I'm enjoying it almost as much as my animal loving son!

[TXMary2]

Your son's reading list looks like my library of creation books. But I'm more of a DVD watcher. Some really good DVDs I have run across besides the ones you mention are:

 

1) The Exodus revealed. Put out by Questar. It's where this guy goes out to prove the the Israelites lived in Egypt, and he follows the clues to find the Red Sea Crossing. In the video they find a golden layered chariot wheel believed to be that of the pharaoh when he drowned trying to chase the Israelites down.

 

And other chariot parts also.

 

 

Then we have the wonders of God creation series DVDs, has about 4 DVDs in it.

1) Thundering Earth and Roaring waters.

2) The Milky Way and our Solar System.

3) The animal Kingdom.

4) Planet Earth.

 

Also anything on creation by Dr. David Menton (AIG).

 

And the DVD named: Raising the Allosaur. Put out by vision forum video. It's where Home Schoolers uncovered a rare dinosaur.

 

And if you have Netflix, in the documentary section they now have a few videos on creation in there.

 

1) The whole Kent Hovind series is in there (disk rental).

2) Just about all of Lee Strobels videos are in there (The Case For Christ, Case for Faith, etc).

3) Creatures that defy evoltion.

4) Wonders of God's creation series (disk rental).

5) Creation adventure team (disk rental).

6) God of wonders.

etc...

 

Plus all the evolution videos you can think of. And science documentaries.

 

When watching evolution videos, he needs to realize that over 90% of evolution processes have to be animated for a reason. That is because they cannot be observed. But they will imply that animation = evidence. And many have bought into that.

 

 

Thanks. We have the Wonders of God's Creation and about 15 videos from AIG. We also have the Allosaur video from VF - I thought it was interesting but later read about some controversy. I agree about the animation and cartoons.

 

We have plenty of creation and ID resources - really what I am after is a non christian biology text to use in conjunction with whatever we end up using for biology.

 

@Tina- Thanks, I will go print your list!!

[Mom22ns]

I followed the instructions found in this thread and bought the new Miller Levine textbook along with the 5 yr online access for free. It gives access to the TM, labs, tests and more. The total cost was less than buying the pieces of the dragonfly book used on Amazon.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Momto2Ns

[Jane Elliot]

Apologia is my favorite science and although I have heard people say it was plenty to prepare for AP or CLEP tests, I am just not sure. He is likely going to do the CLEP Biology.

 

If he continues with Apologia, does the extra reading on the side, and studies a CLEP guide - do you think this would be enough? I'd like to hear from anyone who has BTDT or was a science major.

 

 

 

It seems you already have a handle on this, but I just wanted to emphasize that Apologia is *not* enough to prepare for the biology CLEP because it doesn't cover enough evolution. He really does need to study the material in the REA guide in order to do well on the CLEP.

 

However, I would reconsider having a future biology major take the biology CLEP unless you're needing it to validate your transcript. Taking the introductory classes in their major is a great way for students to get their feet wet in the department they'll be dealing with for the next four years. I tend to have my kids take CLEP credit for classes that have nothing to do with their major. This way they can focus on their field in college. Of course, he can always take the CLEP but not use it for credit.

 

My son is finishing up his sophomore year as a biology/pre-dental major at LeTourneau. He gets mostly A's, with an occasional B. He studied both Apologia texts in high school and felt they prepared him well. He also went over Teaching Company's Understanding the Human Body which is from an evolutionist perspective. He said it was just okay.

 

On a side note, I'll say that dh, who is an MD, has always said that high school labs are way overblown, so he crosses out nearly all the labs in the dc's Apologia books when he's assigning their work. I was skeptical and nervous about this for years. But after ds had been at university for awhile, I asked him if we had made a mistake in not doing more labs, and he replied emphatically that we had not. He said that the main skill needed to do well in college labs is writing. He said it would have been a waste of time to do more labs and that the time is better spent working on writing skills.

 

I wish I had made sure ds was very comfortable writing a scientific research paper before leaving home as this was his main struggle his first year at university. He did manage, but it would have been easier on him had we done that bit of preparation more thoroughly. Writing Papers in the Biological Sciences is a resource he uses. It would have been helpful to be familiar with that book before going to college.

 

This is the biology text ds's college uses for introductory biology. This is a secular text. Your ds might be just as happy with a college text as a public high school text, since he's already done so much reading.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Luann in ID
added some resources

[Sweet Home Alabama]

It seems you already have a handle on this, but I just wanted to emphasize that Apologia is *not* enough to prepare for the biology CLEP because it doesn't cover enough evolution. He really does need to study the material in the REA guide in order to do well on the CLEP.

 

However, I would reconsider having a future biology major take the biology CLEP unless you're needing it to validate your transcript. Taking the introductory classes in their major is a great way for students to get their feet wet in the department they'll be dealing with for the next four years. I tend to have my kids take CLEP credit for classes that have nothing to do with their major. This way they can focus on their field in college. Of course, he can always take the CLEP but not use it for credit.

 

My son is finishing up his sophomore year as a biology/pre-dental major at LeTourneau. He gets mostly A's, with an occasional B. He studied both Apologia texts in high school and felt they prepared him well. He also went over Teaching Company's Understanding the Human Body which is from an evolutionist perspective. He said it was just okay.

 

On a side note, I'll say that dh, who is an MD, has always said that high school labs are way overblown, so he crosses out nearly all the labs in the dc's Apologia books when he's assigning their work. I was skeptical and nervous about this for years. But after ds had been at university for awhile, I asked him if we had made a mistake in not doing more labs, and he replied emphatically that we had not. He said that the main skill needed to do well in college labs is writing. He said it would have been a waste of time to do more labs and that the time is better spent working on writing skills.

 

I wish I had made sure ds was very comfortable writing a scientific research paper before leaving home as this was his main struggle his first year at university. He did manage, but it would have been easier on him had we done that bit of preparation more thoroughly. Writing Papers in the Biological Sciences is a resource he uses. It would have been helpful to be familiar with that book before going to college.

 

This is the biology text ds's college uses for introductory biology.

 

 

Luann,

If you could do biology over with your son, what would you do given what you know now..... hindsight? Could you make any concrete recommendations for those of us who are trying to make decisions for high school biology? I have science-minded kids. I'm trying to prepare for the possibility of them going into science-related careers.

 

Most of the public/private schools in my area use the Miller-Levine Dragonfly book. It makes me think that there must be a good reason for this. It isn't very homeschool friendly on its own. I've found that Kolbe has lesson plans written to the student to go along with this book which makes it more independent, but the virtual labs are only so-so. Some use Labpaq labs or labs from Quality Science Labs or Castle Heights. But these take additional time to do. Science could end up taking up to 2 hours/day to do....not so good. I'm researching for 9th grade biology too.

 

Another post that I read yesterday pointed out that math may be more important to master than science. (Not that science isn't important.... just that math carries more weight in a direct comparison.)

 

Thank you for your comments to the OP.

 

Oh.... Just for comparison sake...Science Shepherd is talked about on this forum. Tests for this series are essay type questions. It seems to be getting positive reviews, but again, it is not heavy on evolution.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Sweet Home Alabama

[Jane Elliot]

Luann,

If you could do biology over with your son, what would you do given what you know now..... hindsight? Could you make any concrete recommendations for those of us who are trying to make decisions for high school biology?

 

1. We like Apologia. It's one of the things I think we've done right from the beginning. Making time for the advanced Apologia courses has been a good move, too.

 

2. I wouldn't worry so much about doing labs. I think dh is right about this. In our opinion, they're usually gravy.

 

3. I would require a lot more scientific writing. I would especially make sure they're very comfortable writing a scientific research paper. For the biological sciences, the book I linked above is a good resource. They Say/I Say has a chapter on writing in the sciences, which I think would be useful.

 

4. I did see the post you mentioned about math being so important for advanced science, and I agreed. She made an excellent point.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Luann in ID

[Sweet Home Alabama]

1. We like Apologia. It's one of the things I think we've done right from the beginning. Making time for the advanced Apologia courses has been a good move, too.

 

2. I wouldn't worry so much about doing labs. I think dh is right about this. In our opinion, they're usually gravy.

 

3. I would require a lot more scientific writing. I would especially make sure they're very comfortable writing a scientific research paper. For the biological sciences, the book I linked above is a good resource. They Say/I Say has a chapter on writing in the sciences, which I think would be useful.

 

4. I did see the post you mentioned about math being so important for advanced science, and I agreed. She made an excellent point.

 

Thank you, Luann.

I'm trying not to hijack OPs thread. If she were to use a combo of Apologia and Miller-Levine.... would you please give an example of a reasonable scientific research paper? Where does the inspiration for these research assignments come from?.... and answers to grade them? Speaking for myself, I know I need a teacher friendly science.

 

Since she asked for favorite biology sources, I would suppose a student could use favorite sources to help with the research paper.

 

I want to throw another idea out...

http://www.scienceforhighschool.com/

 

This is Bridget Ardoin's Science for High School. Her science is made up of pages with questions for the student to research and answer. Any references can be used for research. She also includes answers and experiments with answers. These Q/A pages lend themselves to the kind of writing you might be asked in essay questions.

 

It's not a "perfect" solution, but this kind of curriculum could link the M-L text she is asking about with the kind of scientific writing you say is important. One would be the spine and the other would supplement. Add in some Khan Academy/Hippocampus videoes if needed.... do an additional lab if desired.... I guess at this point you would tailor science for the individual student. But, the writing would be a major focus.

 

Thanks for the links to the biology writing book.... I'm going to take a closer look at this. Kolbe also has a book that describes how to write a lab report. I know nothing about it beyond that.

 

ETA: I don't know if this combination is a good idea or not. I'm trying to figure out what to do for biology as well.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Sweet Home Alabama

[TXMary2]

It seems you already have a handle on this, but I just wanted to emphasize that Apologia is *not* enough to prepare for the biology CLEP because it doesn't cover enough evolution. He really does need to study the material in the REA guide in order to do well on the CLEP.

 

However, I would reconsider having a future biology major take the biology CLEP unless you're needing it to validate your transcript. Taking the introductory classes in their major is a great way for students to get their feet wet in the department they'll be dealing with for the next four years. I tend to have my kids take CLEP credit for classes that have nothing to do with their major. This way they can focus on their field in college. Of course, he can always take the CLEP but not use it for credit.

 

My son is finishing up his sophomore year as a biology/pre-dental major at LeTourneau. He gets mostly A's, with an occasional B. He studied both Apologia texts in high school and felt they prepared him well. He also went over Teaching Company's Understanding the Human Body which is from an evolutionist perspective. He said it was just okay.

 

On a side note, I'll say that dh, who is an MD, has always said that high school labs are way overblown, so he crosses out nearly all the labs in the dc's Apologia books when he's assigning their work. I was skeptical and nervous about this for years. But after ds had been at university for awhile, I asked him if we had made a mistake in not doing more labs, and he replied emphatically that we had not. He said that the main skill needed to do well in college labs is writing. He said it would have been a waste of time to do more labs and that the time is better spent working on writing skills.

 

I wish I had made sure ds was very comfortable writing a scientific research paper before leaving home as this was his main struggle his first year at university. He did manage, but it would have been easier on him had we done that bit of preparation more thoroughly. Writing Papers in the Biological Sciences is a resource he uses. It would have been helpful to be familiar with that book before going to college.

 

This is the biology text ds's college uses for introductory biology. This is a secular text. Your ds might be just as happy with a college text as a public high school text, since he's already done so much reading.

 

 

Thank you! This is great information. What you said about the CLEP makes a lot of sense, so thank you for that. I am going to check out your links :)

[Jane Elliot]

Thank you, Luann.

I'm trying not to hijack OPs thread. If she were to use a combo of Apologia and Miller-Levine.... would you please give an example of a reasonable scientific research paper? Where does the inspiration for these research assignments come from?.... and answers to grade them? Speaking for myself, I know I need a teacher friendly science.

 

 

As I said, the scientific research paper is an area in which we've floundered, so I'm not going to be a whole lot of help in that arena. I do know what ds has used at university (linked above), but beyond that I'm still learning. At this point, my grand plan is to pay ds to tutor the other dc (and me :D) in scientific writing while he's home on summer break.

 

Maybe someone else would be willing to chime in, or maybe we need to start a new thread.

[Sweet Home Alabama]

As I said, the scientific research paper is an area in which we've floundered, so I'm not going to be a whole lot of help in that arena. I do know what ds has used at university (linked above), but beyond that I'm still learning. At this point, my grand plan is to pay ds to tutor the other dc (and me :D) in scientific writing while he's home on summer break.

 

Maybe someone else would be willing to chime in, or maybe we need to start a new thread.

 

 

Thank you!

[TXMary2]

OK Luann- I ordered the book about writing biology papers. I got it on Amazon for $4 including shipping! I love the penny deals.

 

Now I am thinking I want to stay with Apologia, but get the Miller/Levine book for ds to read on the side. I have reconsidered the CLEP as well, thinking he would enjoy doing Biology his first year at college.

 

Does anyone know if there would be a benefit to ds doing the AP test? Will it "look better" on his high school transcript? AP isn't college credit is it? Doesn't it just show the student can work at a high level than some other students?

 

Edited to add: I see that AP can be for college credit, but I assume it doesn't have to be. Is it wrong to take the AP test just for looks? Seriously. :)

Edited April 19, 2011 by TXMary2

[Jane Elliot]

Does anyone know if there would be a benefit to ds doing the AP test? Will it "look better" on his high school transcript? AP isn't college credit is it? Doesn't it just show the student can work at a high level than some other students?

 

Edited to add: I see that AP can be for college credit, but I assume it doesn't have to be. Is it wrong to take the AP test just for looks? Seriously. :)

 

Yes, AP looks better than CLEP. And, they're a lot harder than CLEP. Generally I have the kids take AP tests in areas they are strong, and CLEP tests in subjects they'd rather avoid when they get to college.

 

I like the testing. I find it motivates my boys and gives them a goal. But, there's nothing wrong with testing just for looks, especially if you think he might be trying for a more competitive college.

[Clover11]

1. We like Apologia. It's one of the things I think we've done right from the beginning. Making time for the advanced Apologia courses has been a good move, too.

 

 

Quick question- in your opinion, would it be better to do Biology & then Advanced Biology right afterwards (continuing with Chemisty/Advanced Chem & then Physics/Advanced Physics), or do Biology, Chemistry, Physics, then do the advanced courses after the basic ones are all finished? (or does it matter??)

We are using Apologia as well. My son is going to do Biology in 8th & is wanted to do the advanced right after the same year (working into the summer if needed).

 

 

Does anyone know if there would be a benefit to ds doing the AP test? Will it "look better" on his high school transcript? AP isn't college credit is it? Doesn't it just show the student can work at a high level than some other students?

 

 

 

Or would doing the SAT Subject test in Biology be a better move?

 

BYW, I'm loving this thread; it is really helping me figure some of this science stuff out! :001_smile:

[johnandtinagilbert]

OK Luann- I ordered the book about writing biology papers. I got it on Amazon for $4 including shipping! I love the penny deals. I bought it, too and I used my Swagbucks Amazon card, so I got it for free! WOO HOO!

Now I am thinking I want to stay with Apologia, but get the Miller/Levine book for ds to read on the side. I have reconsidered the CLEP as well, thinking he would enjoy doing Biology his first year at college. I got the text from a local high school and compared them to Apologia. They had the same contents, save the evolution slant. By adding in our living books, we're actually covering evolution far more thoroughly and giving a great understanding. I figure, if I add in the Hakim books (The Story of Science), we'll really get a rounded opinion, different styles for different users, and be ready for the college bio they have to take.

 

Does anyone know if there would be a benefit to ds doing the AP test? Will it "look better" on his high school transcript? AP isn't college credit is it? Doesn't it just show the student can work at a high level than some other students?

 

Edited to add: I see that AP can be for college credit, but I assume it doesn't have to be. Is it wrong to take the AP test just for looks? Seriously. :)

Smart. not wrong. Use what fits your dc best! I've decided to have my dc ready for the evolution argument and after biology, I'm giving the sciences over to the local CC. They're grounded in their faith and the classes there will accomplish their goals better than I will. Weird that I'm relinquishing my hand in their education (feels weird, I mean), but also feels right for us. Best of luck in your search.

 

THANKS for the bio. research rec. I'll be having that paper in our line up for sure! You are not the first person to mention that!

[flyingiguana]

We've had better luck with college texts than high school texts for science. We've found the high school ones to be too brief to really get much understanding out of them. (But I haven't looked at the Miller Levine one in particular).

 

For chem and biology, we've used college texts, but just did a few of the chapters in detail rather than trying to get through most of the book. This works fine for chemistry (most high school courses don't get all that far anyway) but may not be the best approach for biology. You might try a text that is specifically for non major biology courses.

 

We've also used the Thinkwell lectures. The biology ones start with evolution. At times the lecturer in the biology series gets off track and gives a few nonsensical lectures (he also mis-pronounces a few things which can get very annoying) but I can see where they'd be a good overview.

 

Any videos where David Attenborough was the creative force are good. (There are a couple he just narrated which aren't quite as good.) A few of the better ones are:

Life of Mammals

Life of Birds

Life in the Undergrowth

The Private Life of Plants

 

A good DVD series about evolution is the one that was shown on Nova on PBS called Evolution. I found the one called Darwin's Dangerous Idea to be the most interesting, but some of the others are also good.

 

E.O. Wilson's The Future of Life is supposed to be really good (but I can't speak from personally reading it as I haven't gotten to it yet).

 

A few others that might be interesting for biology:

Next of Kin (Fouts)

The Selfish Gene

Reading the Landscape

anything by Rachel Carson

Never Cry Wolf

 

I couldn't get through The Double Helix. There wasn't much science in it and what there was wasn't explained all that well. I suspect there are more recent books on the topic that are better, but I haven't found them yet.

 

For chemistry, I still want to read Uncle Tungsten, and maybe find some other popular chemistry books.

[TXMary2]

Smart. not wrong. Use what fits your dc best! I've decided to have my dc ready for the evolution argument and after biology, I'm giving the sciences over to the local CC. They're grounded in their faith and the classes there will accomplish their goals better than I will. Weird that I'm relinquishing my hand in their education (feels weird, I mean), but also feels right for us. Best of luck in your search.

 

THANKS for the bio. research rec. I'll be having that paper in our line up for sure! You are not the first person to mention that!

 

 

Tina-I am considering the CC for Chemistry. That's the beauty of homeschooling - we decide :D

 

I don't know what Swagbucks are, but AWESOME. Technically the $4 I spent was free money on an Amazon gift card that I earned from my blog!

 

Also, thanks for the reminder about The Story of Science, it is on my wish list and I had forgotten about it. You make a great point about the living books. I am wondering now if my ds may have already read more than what he would learn from the evolution sections of a textbook.

 

I think this is what I have decided on:

 

Apologia Biology

Anatomy (haven't decided on a text - but am thinking the Apologia lower level anatomy fleshed out with writing and lab reports??) for .5 Credit

Miller Levine Text for reading and test practice questions (or maybe for the Anatomy coverage)

AP Biology prep book

Writing Papers in the Biological Sciences

The Story of Science

Various evolutionary and ID books for side reading

 

It looks like a lot now that I have typed it out, but TWTM says 4 or more hours per week so that would cover it! Since he will be a science major, I don't think it is unreasonable to spend 90 minutes a day on science.

[TXMary2]

Any videos where David Attenborough was the creative force are good. (There are a couple he just narrated which aren't quite as good.) A few of the better ones are:

Life of Mammals

Life of Birds

Life in the Undergrowth

The Private Life of Plants

 

A good DVD series about evolution is the one that was shown on Nova on PBS called Evolution. I found the one called Darwin's Dangerous Idea to be the most interesting, but some of the others are also good.

 

.

 

DS has borrowed some of these DVD's from our library. He is also reading a David Attenborough book right now, called Life in Cold Blood. He tried to read Dawkins, but couldn't get through it because he can't stand the guy. He may attempt again in the future.

 

Thanks for the list!

[flyingiguana]

Quick question- in your opinion, would it be better to do Biology & then Advanced Biology right afterwards (continuing with Chemisty/Advanced Chem & then Physics/Advanced Physics), or do Biology, Chemistry, Physics, then do the advanced courses after the basic ones are all finished? (or does it matter??)

We are using Apologia as well. My son is going to do Biology in 8th & is wanted to do the advanced right after the same year (working into the summer if needed).

 

:001_smile:

 

You probably want to do some chemistry in between biology and advanced biology. Advanced biology would generally use a lot of chemistry, so it's good to have the background.

 

My suspicion is that a dual enrollment college course or an AP test would "look" best, followed by the SAT subject test and then the CLEP -- on a high school transcript. If the student can take a college course at a decent college, that would probably be better than an AP test. It's more likely to transfer as credit (but you have to be sure to take the right course). Even if it doesn't, a good grade in a course seems to impress colleges more than an AP test.

 

The AP test is supposed to give college credit, but that's entirely up to the college. Our experience has been that the AP bio test isn't as likely to get credit at all (and if it is, only for non majors courses). For the chem and physics AP tests, a 5 is often required to get a full year of credit (and the physics test has to be the harder one). A 4 may get a semester of credit.

 

But colleges vary on what they will give credit for.

[flyingiguana]

DS has borrowed some of these DVD's from our library. He is also reading a David Attenborough book right now, called Life in Cold Blood. He tried to read Dawkins, but couldn't get through it because he can't stand the guy. He may attempt again in the future.

 

Thanks for the list!

 

It is true that Dawkins would probably be more useful if he wasn't so full of himself.

 

Did your son try to read The Selfish Gene or Dawkins' later books? My recollection is that The Selfish Gene wasn't so Dawkins-y as the later ones, but I may be misremembering.

 

Another author I just thought of is Bernd Heinrich. I haven't read his books, but he's written a number and I've heard other people saying they liked them. They probably tend more toward the natural history end of things.

[TXMary2]

It is true that Dawkins would probably be more useful if he wasn't so full of himself.

 

Did your son try to read The Selfish Gene or Dawkins' later books? My recollection is that The Selfish Gene wasn't so Dawkins-y as the later ones, but I may be misremembering.

 

Another author I just thought of is Bernd Heinrich. I haven't read his books, but he's written a number and I've heard other people saying they liked them. They probably tend more toward the natural history end of things.

 

He started reading The Greatest Show on Earth. Interestingly, he enjoyed Coyne's book, even though I think he is right up there with Dawkins on the arrogance scale. I'll look into The Selfish Gene.

[Jane Elliot]

The AP test is supposed to give college credit, but that's entirely up to the college. Our experience has been that the AP bio test isn't as likely to get credit at all (and if it is, only for non majors courses). For the chem and physics AP tests, a 5 is often required to get a full year of credit (and the physics test has to be the harder one). A 4 may get a semester of credit.

 

But colleges vary on what they will give credit for.

 

This is very true, and the same goes for CLEP. In addition, at my dc's university, they might give credit for the course but not the lab that goes with it. We have not wanted our dc to have to deal with being in the lab while not attending the class that goes with it.

 

Thanks for pointing this out.

[Jane Elliot]

Quick question- in your opinion, would it be better to do Biology & then Advanced Biology right afterwards (continuing with Chemisty/Advanced Chem & then Physics/Advanced Physics), or do Biology, Chemistry, Physics, then do the advanced courses after the basic ones are all finished? (or does it matter??)

We are using Apologia as well. My son is going to do Biology in 8th & is wanted to do the advanced right after the same year (working into the summer if needed).

 

 

 

Or would doing the SAT Subject test in Biology be a better move?

 

BYW, I'm loving this thread; it is really helping me figure some of this science stuff out! :001_smile:

 

As flyingiguana noted, the student should have chemistry before Advanced Biology. And the student needs precalculus before Advanced Physics. Beyond that, I let the kids choose whichever courses interest them. By that age, giving them a say is very motivating for them and makes sense.

 

For our science-loving kids, it has worked well to do two courses a year, working into the summer if necessary. (The key word in that last sentence is "science-loving." My 17yos would rather die a thousand deaths than take two sciences in one year, but it's worked out well for the others.)

 

We have had no experience with SAT subject tests.

Edited April 20, 2011 by Luann in ID

[DarlaS]

OK Luann- I ordered the book about writing biology papers. I got it on Amazon for $4 including shipping! I love the penny deals.

 

Now I am thinking I want to stay with Apologia, but get the Miller/Levine book for ds to read on the side. I have reconsidered the CLEP as well, thinking he would enjoy doing Biology his first year at college.

 

Does anyone know if there would be a benefit to ds doing the AP test? Will it "look better" on his high school transcript? AP isn't college credit is it? Doesn't it just show the student can work at a high level than some other students?

 

Edited to add: I see that AP can be for college credit, but I assume it doesn't have to be. Is it wrong to take the AP test just for looks? Seriously. :)

 

IEW has writing lessons from life science also. It's listed as for grades 9-12 and covers the research paper, MLA documentation, documenting documentaries etc.

[Guest ikester7579]

Here is a video showing empirical, repeatable evidence that the flood laid the fossil record. You cannot buy this video because of some stupid international law that country has. So the only place you will see it is here:

 

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3569640131781244424#

 

This video totally destroys the fossil record supporting evolution. And show every type of layer that was laid can be duplicated in a water simulation. And they also use mathematics to prove it as well.

 

Of course this empirical evidence is rejected by mainstream science, because it does not conform to their naturalistic view of evolution. Just thought you guys would enjoy this.

 

Also, if you have a way to download it, you might want to do that. because if it suddenly disappears off the net, I don't know where you could get it.

[creekland]

 

My suspicion is that a dual enrollment college course or an AP test would "look" best, followed by the SAT subject test and then the CLEP -- on a high school transcript. If the student can take a college course at a decent college, that would probably be better than an AP test. It's more likely to transfer as credit (but you have to be sure to take the right course). Even if it doesn't, a good grade in a course seems to impress colleges more than an AP test.

 

The AP test is supposed to give college credit, but that's entirely up to the college. Our experience has been that the AP bio test isn't as likely to get credit at all (and if it is, only for non majors courses).

 

 

 

If your student is considering a selective or highly selective private school they are unlikely to get credit for any science within their major. If they are planning on continuing to med school they shouldn't accept any cc or AP credits for their pre-req courses including Bio as med schools frown upon that. Otherwise, adcoms have told me they prefer to see AP over cc because they "know" what was covered on the AP test. They have no idea what was covered in the cc course. Some are good, some are not. However, they prefer either to nothing when it comes to admission.

 

We went the cc route for microbio and don't regret it at all (not that there was even an AP option). We've opted out of the cc or AP route for Bio and Chem. I'm still toying with whether or not middle son should take the SAT II in those. It might depend on what adcoms say/suggest. Right now I'm letting middle son just study for the AP Stats test and finish his regular courses, then we'll consider SAT II's more.

 

If planning on a state school - here - our state schools will accept anything (cc or AP). We still have med school to limit our options though.

[LauraQ]

What they use in the Public Schools here are pathetic and not worth his time often. Big books full of lots of pictures, bulleted lists and such, but not enough substance. Instead, check out Singapore's Biology for something that would complement Apologia well (some overlap but also covers MANY topics that are not covered in much depth or at all in Apologia's Bio--more chem eg--and from a secular POV that is matter-of-fact rather than with the more zealous air one finds in textbooks from both sides here in the states). Doing the labs requires a bit of an investment in supplies and some shopping around, but they are doable. I can provide a materials list for you if you'd like.

[LauraQ]

My oldest is in a sciency career (petroleum engineer) and I would really say that high school math is far more important than high school science.

This is true for Engineering but less so for Biology. Dh did have to take Calculus in college (one class) to get his Bio degree, but it was nicknamed "Cowboy Calculus" because it was SO much easier than what the Engineering majors had to take. It was so easy that dh said it was all review of the Cal he'd taken in high school.

[flyingiguana]

Otherwise, adcoms have told me they prefer to see AP over cc because they "know" what was covered on the AP test. They have no idea what was covered in the cc course. Some are good, some are not. However, they prefer either to nothing when it comes to admission.

 

 

 

In our neck of the woods, the cc courses seem to be preferred over AP and are more likely to result in credit (assuming it was actually the correct course that was taken). This may have to do with the quality of cc's in our area.

 

But what gets counted for credit is often not the same as what counts for admissions. Credit is usually determined by the department in question. Admission is granted by the admissions office. They may or may not have much communication going on between them.

 

Also, I know there are a number of students in our area who went to very selective colleges and got credit for at least some of their AP tests. There are a few high profile schools (MIT, for example) that just don't grant credit as a general policy, but I'm not convinced this is the case for most other schools. In fact, where we are, it's the not so selective schools that are least likely to grant credit in the sciences. So there's really no way to tell without asking the school.

 

Although colleges know what is supposed to be covered on the AP test, they have empirical evidence (unfortunately) that a high score on the test doesn't always translate into a student who knows the material well enough to go on in the sequence. And they can't tell those students from the ones who are ready. A high score on an AP test doesn't discriminate very well between students who know their stuff and those who just memorized a certain number of random facts. This is unfortunate for those kids who did learn a lot from their AP studying, but there doesn't seem to be any way around it.

 

I suspect this may be why we've found more colleges willing to accept credit for AP calc than for other tests. It may be that it's just a lot harder to fake the knowledge on the calculus test. You either know it or you don't and there's not a good method for determining what "should" be the right answer on the multiple choice questions or to just write down enough random facts on the free response questions to get enough points for a good grade. That's just a hypothesis I have. I have no proof.

 

And the other hand, the calc test is very up front about spending an entire high school year on what turns out to be a semester college course (AB and BC are supposed to take 2 years together). Chem and bio, on the other hand, although the implication is that they should be the 2nd year after a student has taken the regular high school course, often just taught as a sort of "honors" course that goes a bit faster and covers a bit more. In other words, some schools are trying to pass off a one year course as a two year course, and it's awfully hard to cram enough into one high school year to count for one college year, given the nature of how high school works.