Resolved: Academic perfomrance is the best indicator for potential success in life.

[Heather in Neverland]

So our high school debate team (for practice purposes) has challenged teachers and admin. to a debate. The above title is the topic. I am to argue in the affirmative.

 

I know ZERO about proper debate procedures. I have been briefed on the procedure but that is about it. I am still trying to figure out what "values criterion" means.

 

At any rate, anyone want to contribute to a principal down her luck? :) I need arguments in the affirmative. Anyone wanna take a stab at it? Anyone with debate experience wanna give me some pointers?

 

Of course the school is abuzz and they are ALL planning on showing up to watch the students debate the principals. What have I gotten myself into?

[linders]

I have no debate experience whatsoever, but this is intriguing.

 

First, you need to define "success in life." Money? Fame? Contributions to humanity? Personal satisfaction and happiness? Contributions to the happiness and welfare of your personal circle (e.g., children)?

 

For all of these, especially the last two, it seems easier to argue the negative. "Academic performance" sounds like "good grade, good test scores," and there are going to be lots of contrary examples. However, maybe you can define "academic performance" in terms of willigness to learn, grow, and work hard, and make a better case. Those who aren't willing to learn and grow don't seem as likely to be successful in any way.

 

Good luck, and keep us posted!

[Danestress]

but it seems like you could spend the whole time debating how "success" should be defined, and that seems like a very subjective thing to me. My success might look very different from yours.

[Jean in Newcastle]

The value is that which you are arguing for as a what "ought to be" - ie. "Success" in this case.

 

The criterion is what defines that value. So when PPs said that you need to define what "success" means, they are correct.

 

In your case, you might define "success" as meaning having a good grasp of basic skills and a good work ethic. Having good academic performance means that you have a good grasp of basic skills and a good work ethic. Therefore, having good academic performance leads to success. (Of course your opponents are going to come up with another logical argument just like this one on the other side.)

Edited October 18, 2010 by Jean in Newcastle

[Heather in Neverland]

OK, now I am intimidated as these kids are NOT slouches in debate!

 

so step one is to determine a definition for success

 

step two is to come up with reasons why academic performance is the best indicator for my definition of success

 

Most interestingly, I don't actually agree with the resolution...but I suppose that is the point of debate, no?

 

So i suppose it would behoove me to come up with a defintion for success that WOULD depend on academic performance and go from there....

 

I am going to get my butt kicked by a bunch of teenagers. :tongue_smilie:

[Caroline]

As I recall, you need research. You need to be able to back up what you say with numbers and statistics and references.

 

We always had to prepare for both sides because we didn't know which side we would have to argue until 10 minutes before the debate. This practice made our rebuttals stronger.

[ElizabethB]

Here is a good graph for you.

 

http://www.thephonicspage.org/On%20Phonics/profitable.html

 

The ability to read well also enables you to read the Bible and find out anything you want to know to have success in that field. (You might also want to look up the linked stats, an amazingly high percentage of people don't read well...and I have seen the underlying questions, even level 3 is not that great.)

 

Plus, you can get all sorts of questions answered here if you can read well.:lol::lol:

 

Shopping carts and shoes, for example. You must know the proper answer to these kinds of things for success in life.:D

[TechWife]

Perhaps the NCFCA site will help you. A value debate is a Lincoln-Douglas style debate. They are not team debates, but one on one. In competition, the candidate must prepare both sides of the debate and then the opponents draw to see which side they present. This means that they must have both affirmative and negative sides ready, complete with counter arguments for what they anticipate their opponents to say. So, you are halfway there, since you only have to prepare for one side!

 

Your first step would be to see if this will be a formal debate, following debate protocol. This will tell you how much time you have. This information will help you plan your argument.

 

Depending how much time you have, I'd probably go with developing your argument over worrying about the rules past the time limit. There should be someone there to guide you through the process itself.

 

Lincoln Douglas Value Debate is the curriculum that ds is using in his speech & debate class. I wonder if you might be able to find it or find something like it to help you out?

 

Edited to add: I just found this free LD debate resource.

 

Here's another one, complete with videos.

 

Here's a site on how to construct an LD case.

Edited October 19, 2010 by TechWife

[Teachin'Mine]

I would narrow your definition of academic success to the point that you almost believe what you're saying. :D Academic success doesn't have to mean the top five percent of the class, it can mean having attended school and having achieved basic competency. I mean after all, isn't this what the schools are testing for and using as the benchmark of schools' and teachers' success? So now your argument can switch from arguing for academic success to how a lack of this academic success, or basic skills competency, can hamper a student when they enter the workforce. I think that might be easier to genuinely argue. Then again, I know nothing about debates. :lol:

 

I look forward to hearing how your debate goes. :)

[Heather in Neverland]

awesome resources!!! Thanks! I'll let you know how it goes. :)

[TechWife]

I was reading through this year's red book & thought of this post. How did the debate go?

[Heather in Neverland]

The debate was so much fun but totally nerve-wracking!

 

And I won!! Well, I mean my partner and I won but honestly, it was kind of close. :D

 

From what the judges said, the other team lost because instead of tearing down our arguments (since they were the negative side) they just built new arguments to support their view. Even though those arguments were good, they did not discredit OUR arguments which were good.

 

It was a great learning experience for me and good practice for the debate team. I am thnking of traveling with them to watch the competition because it was so fascinating. And now that I have studied on debate formats a bit, I am looking forward to the next time there is a presidential debate!!

[tex-mex]

Perhaps the NCFCA site will help you. A value debate is a Lincoln-Douglas style debate. They are not team debates, but one on one. In competition, the candidate must prepare both sides of the debate and then the opponents draw to see which side they present. This means that they must have both affirmative and negative sides ready, complete with counter arguments for what they anticipate their opponents to say. So, you are halfway there, since you only have to prepare for one side!

 

Your first step would be to see if this will be a formal debate, following debate protocol. This will tell you how much time you have. This information will help you plan your argument.

 

Depending how much time you have, I'd probably go with developing your argument over worrying about the rules past the time limit. There should be someone there to guide you through the process itself.

 

Lincoln Douglas Value Debate is the curriculum that ds is using in his speech & debate class. I wonder if you might be able to find it or find something like it to help you out?

 

Edited to add: I just found this free LD debate resource.

 

Here's another one, complete with videos.

 

Here's a site on how to construct an LD case.

:iagree: Our local HS group has a debate club that travels all over the state using Lincoln Douglas style tactics.

 

Heather: (ETA) Yeah!!

[Jean in Newcastle]

Congratulations on your win! Yep - it's all in how you present things and respond to the other side.