Freelance...problem.

[Aubrey]

So I saw a job posting where a guy wanted some sketches done for a book. I contacted him, he looked at some samples, & said he was interested.

 

Then no contact for 2-3 wks. I figured he'd flaked out or found someone else.

 

Then an email, stating that he & his wife would be off the following week & would like to schedule a time to get together. So I suggested a very specific time AND place. Some people need that.

 

No response for several days. Then another email saying we need to schedule a time to get together. Can he have my phone #?

 

At this point, I really don't like it, but I give the guy my # & tell him I answer email faster.

 

No call. Instead, another email. "Aubrey, could you call me so we can set something up?"

 

I was so annoyed I just ignored it. This morning, more than a week after I suggested a time & place, he emails me again & says he emailed me w/ no response, & could I please call him to set something up. Now there are two phone numbers.

 

People like this seem to usually want to talk forever about their grand ideas, through several phone calls and meetings, but it never seems to turn into (or even be treated like) a real job. When you say "Call me," to *me,* that's it. You've just lost me. I don't call my own grandmother.

 

So tell me what to do. If there were any chance this was a job, I'd love it, but I've seen this pattern before, & I'll end up giving the guy his drawings for FREE just to get rid of him, & he'll still want some changes. Maybe I'm mean and wrong about him, but...I don't think so. (I love the Monk theme song.)

 

*sigh* That means I have to email him back & tell him to go away, doesn't it?

[RamonaQ]

I think the alternative would be to have a very clear path of how you will work. I think you can take all the knowledge you have of working with these disorganized types, and create a very clear contract to cover yourself.

 

1-You set up a meeting time, with the stipulation that if he intends to cancel you insist on 24 hours notice. If he cancels, you decide even if you want to continue. Of course, meet in a public place and give no personal information!

 

2-I would then, upon accepting the work, have a very clear contract that includes review and edit (perhaps 48 hours to review the work and request edits, afterward he pays a certain amount for any changes).

 

3-I would also make sure you are charging for each step-- ie- charge after initial sketches (don't start next work until paid). Charge for final sketches-- bill after 1st round of review/edit. Don't start any other edits until paid.

Edited July 8, 2010 by RamonaQ

[Aubrey]

I think the alternative would be to have a very clear path of how you will work. I think you can take all the knowledge you have of working with these disorganized types, and create a very clear contract to cover yourself.

 

1-You set up a meeting time, with the stipulation that if he intends to cancel you insist on 24 hours notice. If he cancels, you decide even if you want to continue. Of course, meet in a public place and give no personal information!

 

2-I would then, upon accepting the work, have a very clear contract that includes review and edit (perhaps 48 hours to review the work and request edits, afterward he pays a certain amount for any changes).

 

3-I would also make sure you are charging for each step-- ie- charge after initial sketches (don't start next work until paid). Charge for final sketches-- bill after 1st round of review/edit. Don't start any other edits until paid.

 

We haven't even talked about $, & I'm already hyperventilating. I'm an extreme introvert; he's *obviously* extraverted. These kinds of things make me feel like a failure as a person, when, really...I think it's just that these are difficult people to talk to (for me).

[MBM]

He sounds like he could be more than just a flake, possibly dangerous. Do you know anything about his background? I'd be cautious with someone like that.

[Aubrey]

He sounds like he could be more than just a flake, possibly dangerous. Do you know anything about his background? I'd be cautious with someone like that.

 

 

LOL, I'm paranoid like that, but this is typical behavior (imo) of someone w/ a creative-religious idea. His "job posting" was on the seminary job board.

[MBM]

Okay, well, with that information...

 

I worked as a freelance graphic designer in Chicago for about 10 years and refused to work for people who didn't take my time seriously even during my slow, hungry times. It's not worth the hassle, and that's what it sounds like you're getting from this person. Don't sell yourself short.

[Aubrey]

Okay, well, with that information...

 

I worked as a freelance graphic designer in Chicago for about 10 years and refused to work for people who didn't take my time seriously even during my slow, hungry times. It's not worth the hassle, and that's what it sounds like you're getting from this person. Don't sell yourself short.

 

I don't have the guts to tell him. I feel certain that I will get a virtual reaming. Why do I care? Because I can't help it.

[OLG]

LOL, I'm paranoid like that, but this is typical behavior (imo) of someone w/ a creative-religious idea. His "job posting" was on the seminary job board.

 

Agree completely with the "type" and the behavior. No harm in calling the guy though. If you do decide to work together UP the price to accommodate the disorganization and proceed with the excellent suggestions for outlining your agreement. I worked with a guy like this ( or tried to) who was on a completely different time schedule than me - a few months to him was like a few days to me. But, if the money is good and you can deal with the 'conditions" why not? Give him one more shot with a call and you'll probably be able to ascertain more about him with that call as well! Good luck.

 

Mary

[i.love.lucy]

My dh is a graphic designer and worked for years as a freelancer/principal of his own business. It's so frustrating!!! People have no idea what they are doing. I think they literally think you are sitting by the phone waiting to respond to their calls. You have no other clients and no other responsibilites, right? :rolleyes:

 

If it's a job you'd like to do, instead of blowing it off I'd either call or email him one more time and lay out some parameters of how you work. Like "I only work nights, so email is really the ONLY way I can communicate effectively but I will do so within a few hours of your email". If he can't handle that or it doesn't work for him then turn down the job. You can be clear that you are simply not available for long talks on the phone and meetings and so if he needs that, maybe you are not the right person for the job. If he can work within your parameters, then it's all good. I think this is the most professional way to handle it.

 

Good luck!!!!

[Aubrey]

Agree completely with the "type" and the behavior. No harm in calling the guy though. If you do decide to work together UP the price to accommodate the disorganization and proceed with the excellent suggestions for outlining your agreement. I worked with a guy like this ( or tried to) who was on a completely different time schedule than me - a few months to him was like a few days to me. But, if the money is good and you can deal with the 'conditions" why not? Give him one more shot with a call and you'll probably be able to ascertain more about him with that call as well! Good luck.

 

Mary

 

There's just no way the $ is going to be good. I was fine w/ that at first--a little extra pocket change in exchange for something I love to do, esp in a bad economy, sounded good to me. But I'd guess that the guy wants at least 10 drawings & that he's not going to be expecting that to cost over $100. I could be WAY off base, but...you know when someone writes a poem that they think will be a great song, & they try to hire a guy w/ a guitar to write the music? This has that kind of feel to it.

[lailasmum]

If you do call him maybe just ask at the beginning if he is getting your emails as he is replying in a way that suggests he isn't and its obviously an inconvenience to both of you if you aren't communicating efficiently. Make him aware of it.

Edited July 8, 2010 by lailasmum

[Aubrey]

Is this horrible?

 

I'm sorry, I really prefer not to use the phone. If you call & I can answer, I will, but I'm extremely introverted, do lots of freelance work, and homeschool four children. I write emails, but I do not make phone calls.

 

I did suggest a meeting time & place, but you neither accepted it nor rejected it--just wanted to talk about it some more. I also invited you to suggest a meeting time/place, but again, wanted to call rather than confirm by email. Which would have been fine--I gave you my number.

 

I think your project will be more successful with someone else who is better able to meet your scheduling needs. Thank you for your interest in my work, & I wish you great success in your endeavors!

[Aubrey]

My dh is a graphic designer and worked for years as a freelancer/principal of his own business. It's so frustrating!!! People have no idea what they are doing. I think they literally think you are sitting by the phone waiting to respond to their calls. You have no other clients and no other responsibilites, right? :rolleyes:

 

If it's a job you'd like to do, instead of blowing it off I'd either call or email him one more time and lay out some parameters of how you work. Like "I only work nights, so email is really the ONLY way I can communicate effectively but I will do so within a few hours of your email". If he can't handle that or it doesn't work for him then turn down the job. You can be clear that you are simply not available for long talks on the phone and meetings and so if he needs that, maybe you are not the right person for the job. If he can work within your parameters, then it's all good. I think this is the most professional way to handle it.

 

Good luck!!!!

 

This is a good idea, but...we haven't even talked about the project, & it's already like this. And it's not *could* you give me a call; it's CALL me. It's the personality type that simply takes over things & says how it's going to be. And I'm the type who won't argue but won't comply. I simply won't return mssgs. :D

 

Yeah, yeah, I know that's awful.

[lailasmum]

I would remove the bit about being introverted, being busy is enough. Also email creates a paper trail which can be useful in any creative process, I have found anyway.

[Aubrey]

I would remove the bit about being introverted, being busy is enough. Also email creates a paper trail which can be useful in any creative process, I have found anyway.

 

You know, really, your last idea about presenting it as if he hasn't been getting my emails is brilliant. Except...I don't want to leave the door open to working with him. Because if it is, I will, because I'll feel to bad not to, even when my gut is screaming RUNNNN. Not from danger, but from ulcers. :lol:

[MBM]

I think your project will be more successful with someone else who is better able to meet your scheduling needs. Thank you for your interest in my work, & I wish you great success in your endeavors!

 

That's all you need to say. Short and sweet. :)

[RamonaQ]

Ok, so you really don't want to do this?

 

Then, I would keep it professional.

 

Dear so and so,

 

Thank you for your interest, and the time you have taken to share your exciting project. Unfortunately, upon closer consideration of my current commitments, I am unable to accept your project. I apologize for any inconvenience and wish you the best in your work.

[JoyfulMama]

I'm sorry, I really prefer not to use the phone. If you call & I can answer, I will, but my attention to four children make emails more conducive to uninterrupted communication. I enjoy my freelance work because it is flexible to my family's needs.

 

I did suggest a meeting time & place, but you neither accepted it nor rejected it. I also invited you to suggest a meeting time/place. If you preferred to confirm via telephone, that would have been fine--I gave you my number.

 

I think your project will be more successful with someone else who is better able to meet your scheduling needs. Thank you for your interest in my work, & I wish you great success in your endeavors!

 

I edited just a bit to take out some of the frustrated tone. (Understandably so.) As for the last paragraph - do you want to close the door on this customer, or are you open to one last try? This is a very final "goodbye and good luck".

 

ETA: If you don't want to do this work, then I agree with RamonaQ.

Edited July 8, 2010 by JoyfulMama

[claire up north]

maybe your e-mails are getting lost in his spam filter.

[Aubrey]

maybe your e-mails are getting lost in his spam filter.

 

No, they're quoted in his responses. Good thought, though.

[Aubrey]

Ok, so you really don't want to do this?

 

Then, I would keep it professional.

 

Dear so and so,

 

Thank you for your interest, and the time you have taken to share your exciting project. Unfortunately, upon closer consideration of my current commitments, I am unable to accept your project. I apologize for any inconvenience and wish you the best in your work.

 

Ok, I deleted my response & copy-pasted yours. Dh says if he responds w/ a rude email (as I anticipate), then it simply confirms my concerns about working with him.

 

Urgh. This kind of thing makes me feel SO icky no matter what I do.

[Stacy in NJ]

if you're interested in building a resume, putting up with this guy maybe productive in the long term. Even if he's a huge time-suck having the completed work to show other potential clients maybe a big plus. When you're just establishing a reputation, you put up with other peoples foolishness.

[Gooblink]

You've probably resolved this already, but...

 

You said this guy was looking for sketches for a book; does he have a publishing contract? Does he have a buyer for his book? If not, I'd tell him thanks, but no thanks, you've decided to pursue another opportunity. I think your impression of the dreamer, creative types is spot on, and unless he's actually got the go ahead from a publisher to pursue the book, it's just pie in the sky and he's not going to have the $$ to pay you. If he's planning to self-publish - even worse, 'cause he's going to have to shell out the money upfront to have the book produced and then he's not going to be broke until and if he sells that big pile of inventory sitting in his garage. :)

 

If he does have a contract...it might be worth putting up with his flakiness.

 

We used to do web design - got out of it altogether because of too many "buyers" like this guy.

[Guest RecumbentHeart]

I personally liked your original response (minus the specific details, like being introverted, as a PP said). I especially liked the last paragraph. I know you've already sent something else but I just wanted to give you a vote of encouragement and confidence on your own writing/thoughts/whatever you want to call it. :p

[Carol in Cal.]

Audrey, here is how I see it: You don't want to work with this man. He can't make you do it. You don't have to do it. That's the bottom line.

 

Now, it might be a bit awkward turning him down at this point since he is in your seminary community. But I still think you should do so. You just have to be especially cordial and diplomatic because of that connection.

 

My inclination would be to say that you have a number of other pressing assignments and cannot take on any other work at this time. Or possibly to say that you have reconsidered your priorities and that you want to concentrate your energies in other areas so you will not be working with him. Or maybe, "I have concluded that this job is not a good fit for me and will not be pursuing it further."