Dayle in Guatemala Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Saxon. It isn't relating to him at all. Once I explain the problem (mostly the word problems) he know exactly what to do, he just gets mixed up on all their little pattern names--LSD, SSM, SWA. Anyway, I'm switching him to a different program. We did Miquon through 3rd grade and he loved it. I'm looking at Devleopmental Math, Singapore, and Horizons. What have you used? Likes or dislikes? He's very visual and hands-on. He uses cuisinaire rods well and understands better when he has good visuals. Thanks so much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrtle Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 What is a pattern name? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dayle in Guatemala Posted January 24, 2008 Author Share Posted January 24, 2008 In Saxon they use these names for what they want the student to do: SSM=some and some more SWA=some went away LSD=larger smaller difference He just gets so confused with all these little names it's frustrating for him. He does get the basic function after I re-explain it to him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather in Neverland Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 My ds (9yo) had major problems with Saxon. He is also a VS learner and does well with manipulatives. We switched to MUS and it was the best thing we ever did! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori D. Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 First, do you think it's just this one topic in the Saxon math that's stumbling your child -- or do you think that overall your child is not making the best connection with Saxon? If it's just one thing, eventually the child gets over that hurdle -- time, patience, and sometimes going to a supplemental math booklet or program for a week or two can let the problem topic "simmer" in the back of the child's mind and suddenly it's not a problem anymore when you come back to the Saxon or whatever the spine program is. Do you have a supplement you could go to for awhile? If this is yet another thing in a long list of things that has stumbled the child with the spine program, then it may be time to consider a change. If you know how your child intakes and then processes information best, you can better judge which math program will connect for your child. Cathy Duffy's book, "100 Top Picks For Homeschool Curriculum: Choosing The Right Curriculum And Approach For Your Child's Learning Style", might be of help there. FWIW, here's our experience with various math programs: Our math-minded son loved Miquon, and went on to do very well with Singapore, Jacobs Algebra, and now Jacobs Geometry. We supplemented with Saxon sometimes -- this child would have been fine with whatever math program we used, but I think he *enjoyed* the Miquon/Singapore/Jacobs more than the times we supplemented with Saxon. My math struggler is a very visual-spatial learner -- does not naturally connect with aspects of math that are either sequential or abstract (things like math facts, long division, and algebra concepts). He did "okay" with Miquon, but really bombed with Singapore (too abstract, moved too fast) and especially with Saxon (broken into too many scattered bits, too much on a page). We found Math-U-See for him in 5th grade, and it really connects with his VSL aspect: seeing the DVD lesson, and seeing how the manipulatives make the abstract concept concrete). We have supplemented the MUS with Singapore. Next year when he does MUS Algebra, we'll supplement with Jacobs Algebra. If you're thinking a visual or video/DVD component might be helpful, the following all have DVD lessons: Math-U-See, Teaching Textbooks, VideoText and Chalkdust (some of these do not have math below 6th grade, however). Math-U-See also uses manipulatives throughout the program (K-12), though in the middle school/high school years, the child doesn't so much use the manipulatives -- they are mostly used on the DVD lessons to make concrete an abstract topic. BEST of luck in finding what works best for your family! Warmly, Lori D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tammyla Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Dayle, Does your edition actually abbreviate them, or is it just the way it's written is confusing him? My ds hated Saxon in the early years. We went with Calvert's full program two years and now we are back to Saxon. He is doing very well and gets it. Anyway, switching for a while helped him. Hope you find the fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue G in PA Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 we just kept plugging away. Now, he can do them completely independently. It took a good month of my reminding him and working with him, explaining the concept in different ways until one way eventually stuck (don't ask me which!). I would stick w/ it. It's just one concept. If he does well with the rest, why switch? Unless, it's Saxon's methods in general. My ds9 was having a tough time (I'm guessing it's 5/4?) with Saxon and some wise woman on this board told me that 5/4 is sort of a transitional year. It's tough going for a while but it will eventually click. I think we've clicked! Don't give up yet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrtle Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 These names are not "math" they are pedagogical techniques or heuristic devices meant to help the child. If they are causing more confusion than help, ditch the names and try another technique without ditching the program which otherwise seems to serve your child well. One device you could try is to represent word problems pictorally and this serves as a kind of graphic organizer for the child. Singapore 2nd grade Challenging Word Problems gives examples of this and the word problems that I have seen in Saxon never use more than one or two steps so while the numbers change, once you learned the technique you could use it for other grade levels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dayle in Guatemala Posted January 24, 2008 Author Share Posted January 24, 2008 Yes it abbreviates them that way. I have an older version. I'm just a little thrown because my 2 dds did awesome with Saxon and had no trouble at all. I guess I thought maybe he'd do well. We are up to lesson 65 and I'm a little tired of the fight. He's the kind of kid that has a math mind, you know? I just want it to not be so much of a struggle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Storm Bay Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Of the three you have mentioned, we've used Singapore. Myrtle has a good point about ditching the names, and if that's your only problem with Saxon, I'd take her advice. If, however, you have other problems, with it, my dd, 9, did better with a Singapore/MUS combination. Singapore doesn't need MUS, but dd does better with the combination due to her vs learning style and because there are certain areas of math she does well with that she'd have to wait too long to do in MUS with (geometry, for eg.) We haven't done the Challenging Word problems YET, because she's more visual spatial, and word problems in general got her goat and grieved her enough with doing them in 2 programs. She does better with the workbook as she sets up her entire problem format before solving (so in a multiplication problem she has all the zero place holders in place and the final line down before she begins multiplying--she also counts places and puts in the decimal point before solving). However, I plan to start Challenging Word Problems in the fall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KS_ Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 We've been using Singapore, and really like it (well, don't ask ds - he hates writing out any problems!). But I had been hearing about MEP on the Ambleside list I'm on, and thought maybe I'd check into it - that maybe some different problems and such would be a nice change for my kids. So we've been working on both now - switching off between the two, and I like MEP quite well. And it's free, so besides the cost of printing the pages out, I don't have to buy anything. So if you're looking at trying some other method to see how it works, this might be an option. http://www.cimt.plymouth.ac.uk/projects/mep/default.htm There's also a Yahoo group discussing using this program: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mep-homeschoolers/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narrow Gate Academy Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 and are planning on continuing with Singapore in 4th. Singapore works very well for my visual learner. She also prefers to know how to reason the answer out for herself rather than just memorizing how to solve a certain type of problem in a certain type of way. I think the reasoning involved is one of Singapore's strengths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tammyla Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Yes it abbreviates them that way. I have an older version. I'm just a little thrown because my 2 dds did awesome with Saxon and had no trouble at all. I guess I thought maybe he'd do well. We are up to lesson 65 and I'm a little tired of the fight. He's the kind of kid that has a math mind, you know? I just want it to not be so much of a struggle. I didn't know the old editions did that. I'll add that to my list of differences for future questions re: editions. I'm using the new editions here. I do understand wanting a calm lesson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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