Second guessing my AAS choice and thinking about PR

[happyhappyjoyjoy]

I had not looked at PR at all before I purchased AAS 1 and 2. I do like the look of AAS after reading through it. One thing that concerns me is that I want a true Spalding (or should I use that other name that begins w/ an O that I can't think of right now) method. I like the idea of marking for rules and learning all the phonemes quickly. (I did have WRTR, but it just doesn't fit with my style. Looks too boring for me.) At first PR seemed like overkill with all the DVDs etc...., but the idea of a complete language arts program starting with level 2 is appealing. The bridge to latin is very appealing.

 

Also, my son is a new 6yr old that has been reading since he was 3 1/2. He's already a decent speller for his age. I don't need any basic reading instruction. I really want to cement the more complicated phonetics.

 

Any input will be greatly appreciated.

[A home for their hearts]

 

Also, my son is a new 6yr old that has been reading since he was 3 1/2. He's already a decent speller for his age. I don't need any basic reading instruction. I really want to cement the more complicated phonetics.

 

Any input will be greatly appreciated.

 

 

I haven't used PR so I can't help with any imput there. I have used AAS and there are a lot of people here on this board that have used it and loved it as well. My problem with AAS was retention, my dd10 would remember the rules and could repeat them and apply them to her spelling words but wouldn't carry them over to her writing. It was as if her brain just remember everything when we were doing spelling but than wouldn't remember anything when we weren't doing spelling. I just don't think it was a good fit for her but it works well with a lot of children. AAS does cover all the phonograms but it a more gradual pace were as something like Spell to Write and Read teaches them all up front. I've decided to give SWR a try with her to see if works better than all about spelling.

 

If your son is reading and spelling well I think either approach could work for him.

 

HTH!

[siloam]

I had not looked at PR at all before I purchased AAS 1 and 2. I do like the look of AAS after reading through it. One thing that concerns me is that I want a true Spalding (or should I use that other name that begins w/ an O that I can't think of right now) method. I like the idea of marking for rules and learning all the phonemes quickly. (I did have WRTR, but it just doesn't fit with my style. Looks too boring for me.) At first PR seemed like overkill with all the DVDs etc...., but the idea of a complete language arts program starting with level 2 is appealing. The bridge to latin is very appealing.

 

Also, my son is a new 6yr old that has been reading since he was 3 1/2. He's already a decent speller for his age. I don't need any basic reading instruction. I really want to cement the more complicated phonetics.

 

Any input will be greatly appreciated.

If you know the markings there is no reason why you can't add them to AAS, as well as cover all the phonograms. AAS even sells a set of all the phonograms you could buy instead of waiting to get them all by buying each package. My oldest two were used to covering all the phonograms with SWR, so I just continued to cover them all with AAS. In addition I still have my oldest mark up her vocab words via SWR/Spalding, though I don't have her do her spelling words.

 

I love how by the time you are in book 3 you are working with the words and concepts in so many different ways: word banks, sorting words exercises, dictation, writing station, review sections, silent e book, homophone list. There really is a lot going on. Levels 1 is very simple and even level 2 only has a few of those pieces, like the review and the word banks.

 

But I admittedly think that Spalding is strong, but is overwhelming. I am still finding odd holes in my oldest dd's understanding. She did SWR for 3 years, and while it did take her far, she was stuck at the same 7th grade spelling level for the last year and a half. With AAS I am finding some of those holes, those rules she seemed to know but didn't apply. Instead she got by in her visual memory most of the time. In SWR it was hard, for me, to see patterns of which she was getting consistently wrong. That might have been because how I used it, but probably more because the whole program overwhelmed me.

 

Really I think either one will get you where you want to go. I prefer AAS, because it makes more sense to me to do things incrementally and I love the additional hands on aspect. I haven't used PR but it looks to be a very strong program. If it clicks for you then go for it!

 

Heather

[happyhappyjoyjoy]

the problem is I don't know the markings. maybe the DVDs that seemed overkill at first in PR would actually be just what I need to implement the spalding approach

 

would love to hear more:lurk5:

[Sue G in PA]

We had used both AAS and PR. I purchased AAS first and started it with my ds8 and ds6. For ds8, AAS moved way too slowly. It was a good fit for ds6 at the time. He loved the letter tiles and it really built up his confidence. He is a good speller, but does not read very fluently yet. Anyway, after a few months of AAS, I got my hands on PR and fell in love with it. I ditched AAS for my ds8 and am moving him quickly through PR1 right now. I kept up AAS for ds6 for a while and then ditched spelling altogether to focus on reading. We are just starting PR with him now. I kept the letter tiles b/c he likes to use those and play with them (as does dd4). What I can tell you is that PR1 is about the equivalent of levels 1-3 in AAS (thereabouts) and when you move to level 2 you begin grammar as well as literary analysis. There is much, much more to PR than AAS as you advance. The price about evens out so that wasn't an issue here. I learned more from PR using the "rule tunes" for spelling than I did with AAS. And my ds8, who is very musical, can even remember. Put anything to music and the kids will remember it.

[Lovedtodeath]

Also, my son is a new 6yr old that has been reading since he was 3 1/2. He's already a decent speller for his age. I don't need any basic reading instruction. I really want to cement the more complicated phonetics.

This is my opinion of course: You will want Phonics Road and you will probably be able to move a little quicker in it. At the very least you will want to return AAS level one. Level one is just not needed for some kids and moves so slow that it is a waste at the least. I am thinking that I would have a higher opinion of AAS if I had used more levels. We only used the first couple of weeks of level two and I realized that we had already covered most of level two while we were using level one and I was constantly trying to supplement up.

 

The DVDs are overkill... but you don't really have to watch all of them. You can put them on super speed and just see when a new building code has a word added to it, or watch a certain lesson when you don't know the tune. I have had no problem using the program and then going back and watching the DVDs.

 

The main reason I prefer PR is that for some reason I couldn't follow the scripted layout of AAS. There was so much in the guide that I would always leave something out. I also love that PR includes other subjects.

Edited May 3, 2010 by Lovedtodeath

[happyhappyjoyjoy]

If you know the markings there is no reason why you can't add them to AAS, as well as cover all the phonograms. AAS even sells a set of all the phonograms you could buy instead of waiting to get them all by buying each package. My oldest two were used to covering all the phonograms with SWR, so I just continued to cover them all with AAS. In addition I still have my oldest mark up her vocab words via SWR/Spalding, though I don't have her do her spelling words.

 

I love how by the time you are in book 3 you are working with the words and concepts in so many different ways: word banks, sorting words exercises, dictation, writing station, review sections, silent e book, homophone list. There really is a lot going on. Levels 1 is very simple and even level 2 only has a few of those pieces, like the review and the word banks.

 

But I admittedly think that Spalding is strong, but is overwhelming. I am still finding odd holes in my oldest dd's understanding. She did SWR for 3 years, and while it did take her far, she was stuck at the same 7th grade spelling level for the last year and a half. With AAS I am finding some of those holes, those rules she seemed to know but didn't apply. Instead she got by in her visual memory most of the time. In SWR it was hard, for me, to see patterns of which she was getting consistently wrong. That might have been because how I used it, but probably more because the whole program overwhelmed me.

 

Really I think either one will get you where you want to go. I prefer AAS, because it makes more sense to me to do things incrementally and I love the additional hands on aspect. I haven't used PR but it looks to be a very strong program. If it clicks for you then go for it!

 

Heather

 

 

ok after thinking about this all night and even dreaming about it, i think i'm going to get the SWR book and use the markings w/ AAS. thanks for all the help

[LittleHouseHomeschool]

Hi Heather,

 

I'm using SWR with two of my kiddos right now. Your post indicated that your daughter seemed stuck to a 7th grade level within SWR. I'm seeing the same thing happen with one of my children.

 

The first child is a natural speller and has an incredibly large visual memory. He is gifted and advanced in every subject.

 

But I have a child with auditory processing disorder and while he made huge gains in the first year we used the program, he is no longer making progress in spelling. I thought it was his learning disorder, but he's made progress in every other subject this year, so I'm now wondering if it's the program.

 

AAS sounds like it is written to be simple for the child to process. Would you agree?

 

How did you place your daughter into the program? How do I know what level to use?

[Lovedtodeath]

AAS has some student placement information: http://all-about-spelling.com/spellingprogramfaq.html#student-placement

 

In addition, each level of AAS has the scope and sequence spelled out very well. http://www.all-about-spelling.com/spelling-book-level-1.html You may be able to use these to test your student.

 

Level two has a lot of work on syllable division that you probably won't want to miss.

[happyhappyjoyjoy]

so here's where I am today:

 

I'm going to use AAS, no wait I think I'll try PR, no wait maybe I should just stick w/ my original plan of WRTR, or I could just get SWR..................:banghead:AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

 

I do really have a sense of humor about this choice. I'm just not ready to decide yet!:):lol:

[siloam]

the problem is I don't know the markings. maybe the DVDs that seemed overkill at first in PR would actually be just what I need to implement the spalding approach

 

would love to hear more:lurk5:

 

You can pick up an older version of WRTR cheap, and it would have all the markings and spelling rules. I have a single piece of card stock which has the ponograms on one side and the rules listed by number on the other. When my dd marks up the words she uses that as a guide, and just writes the number of the rule by it. I go in and check them to make sure she has done it right and correct anything she doesn't do correctly.

 

Not trying to talk you out of PR, just giving you options. AAS isn't a perfect fit for everyone.

 

Heather

[bethben]

My problem is that I really like AAS (except for the slowness of it), but I really need to have more of a nice language art flow where I'm not constantly switching programs like I have with DS #2. He is finishing his AAS round this year (3rd grade - level 5- we're not going to level 6) and I have to switch programs. His grammar program has been switched once because he graduated from the first set of programs he did. I'm looking for continuity going all the way to junior high. PR gives me that. I'll probably wind up doing an AAS/PR combo.

Beth

[abrightmom]

Beth,

 

Will you elaborate on your AAS/PR combo? How will you do this and why would you want/need to?

 

Also, why won't you go on in AAS?

 

:001_smile:

[LoveBaby]

I love, love Phonics Road. The DVD's took me a bit to get used to, but now I *love* them and what they are teaching me and allowing me to teach my children. I also love that I am going to be able to cover *all* LA for 1st-4th grade without gaps, without switching, without umpteen differnet books/keys/manuals for each of my students!

 

I bought AAS, looked through it, but I am remediating an older student and it moves much, much too slowly. I also am completely driven batty by things that are scripted!

[bethben]

I'm not sure how I'll combine AAS/PR, but the main reason I think I'm not continuing with it on it's own is because of my having to piecemeal all my language arts. I was trying to figure out ds#3's language arts this year (a WWE/FLL/AAS/handwriting program). There was just too much writing disconnect and too much program disconnect. I'd like everything he does with language arts to go in a certain direction all together. There's a certain place I want my kids to be by the time they get to junior high and PR seems to get them there seamlessly. I saw the gaps already in my 3rd grader when he hit IEW especially with his grammar. It would have helped for him to have some more solid grammar to help with his writing. He does pretty good with spelling, but I just need an all in one program. I also need a program that's heavy on the memorization because actually doing that in our home is sketchy at best.

 

Beth

[Lovedtodeath]

I have a hunch that some kids could possibly do a handwriting program in addition to PR... especially if they didn't do the handwriting portion of PR 1. But we aren't even halfway through PR 1, so ignore me. lol

[abrightmom]

so here's where I am today:

 

I'm going to use AAS, no wait I think I'll try PR, no wait maybe I should just stick w/ my original plan of WRTR, or I could just get SWR..................:banghead:AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

 

I do really have a sense of humor about this choice. I'm just not ready to decide yet!:):lol:

 

:lol::lol: My life in a nutshell! I OWN PR 1 and now I'm thinking about NOT using it and just using AAS . . . then I swing to PR . . . then to AAS . . . then to . . . :lol::lol:

[siloam]

Hi Heather,

 

I'm using SWR with two of my kiddos right now. Your post indicated that your daughter seemed stuck to a 7th grade level within SWR. I'm seeing the same thing happen with one of my children.

 

The first child is a natural speller and has an incredibly large visual memory. He is gifted and advanced in every subject.

 

But I have a child with auditory processing disorder and while he made huge gains in the first year we used the program, he is no longer making progress in spelling. I thought it was his learning disorder, but he's made progress in every other subject this year, so I'm now wondering if it's the program.

 

AAS sounds like it is written to be simple for the child to process. Would you agree?

 

How did you place your daughter into the program? How do I know what level to use?

Yvonne,

 

Yes AAS is written so that the words seem easy. That is one of the complaints about the program is that it uses too many easy words, but I think part of the issue is that like word family methods they all pertain the the rule just introduced. The kids just learned it and that makes the words really easy. The key part, for me is after that. When you shuffle the cards into one pile and cover them again outside of the nice neat context, so they still remember to apply the rules.

 

To be honest I don't think most people have the will to go through AAS with good speller the way I have. She started with level 1 (because I bought it for my 3rd dd), because I had it and knew she didn't know the syllable rules. SWR has the rules in the SWR manual but doesn't activity teach them in the WISE guide because of exceptions.

 

In having her start at the beginning I learned one huge thing. She will rely on her visual memory instead of apply the rules. It explains why when we would start the lists over at the beginning of the year she would get the same words wrong over again. Even though I had spend extra time working on them, she was still relying on visual memory to spell them, not the rules and she would get stuck with the wrong spelling in her head. Thus I have had to have her tell me the steps in applying the rules while demonstrating them to me instead of me teaching it.

 

I don't know how to advise you. I am still figuring it out myself. I do have days when I wonder if she wouldn't be better off doing Megawords (though she hates workbooks), and if she never gets beyond a 7th grade spelling level, who cares? That isn't too bad. She does like doing AAS, so that is probably the strongest factor for my continuing it. She did levels 1-3 in just a little over a year, and only got a few words wrong at the end of level 3, and that was back to the visual memory issue. When we covered the y dropping rule she didn't follow it with penny, probably because of its use as name: pennies vs Penny's. Anyway she got her first two words wrong with the y dropping rule.

 

What do you do with a child with a good enough visual memory to memorize the rules, parrot them back to you, and memorize the words, but who is not good about applying those rules? For now I have decided to continue with AAS, but that is subject to change. As I said earlier though I don't think many people are willing to do a program like AAS when all the words are easy for the child. My focus has been on the rules instead of the words, and she does know the rules well. She just trust her visual memory first and goes to the rules second.

 

Hopefully my new, you teach it to me strategy will force the issue and she will really own the rules and start to use them more.

 

Heather

[siloam]

so here's where I am today:

 

I'm going to use AAS, no wait I think I'll try PR, no wait maybe I should just stick w/ my original plan of WRTR, or I could just get SWR..................:banghead:AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

 

I do really have a sense of humor about this choice. I'm just not ready to decide yet!:):lol:

 

It sounds like PR is more incremental than other Spalding programs, which is really only a concern if there is a LD present. Some LD kids do well with Spalding and some are overwhelmed, just to avoid another failed program I tend to recommend they go with O/G programs instead. But given your child is already reading I doubt you would have problems with them being overwhelmed. Neither of my already reading kids had problems with SWR, only my 3rd dd who wasn't reading well did.

 

If you want to condense than it sounds like PR is your best choice. If you want to simplify what you are already using I wouldn't do any writing from FLL, and cut the copywork in WWE in favor of dictation sentences in AAS (done as copywork or dictation, preferably dictation).

 

But what do you plan to do long term for spelling? Can you let it go and not cover it? If you are going to do spelling anyway maybe you don't need a quick fix. They are only 6 it is fine if they have gaps for a few more years.

 

Either way I don't think you can make a bad choice here. Something might not click with one of you with either program, but but programs will get to your goals, just at different speeds. If you really want a quicker approach then go with PR.

 

Heather

 

[MerryAtHope]

:lol::lol: My life in a nutshell! I OWN PR 1 and now I'm thinking about NOT using it and just using AAS . . . then I swing to PR . . . then to AAS . . . then to . . . :lol::lol:

 

LOL, that is exactly where I am today over math programs!

 

Merry :-)

[LittleHouseHomeschool]

Thanks for the links. After thinking about this, I don't want to my son to have to start all over with another program. I don't have a peace that this is what he needs.

 

I'm going to pull out SWR again, review all the steps myself, analyze my son's spelling notebook, my teaching and consider and pray about what I find.

 

I've learned the hard way that sometimes it's not a new program I need, but rather, the perseverance and courage to teach my students where they are at, rather than where they, "should be."

 

I may still use another program after thinking about this, but I don't want to jump into another curriculum too quickly, only to have the same result.

There is nothing else so frustrating for mom and child! :ohmy:

[siloam]

 

I've learned the hard way that sometimes it's not a new program I need, but rather, the perseverance and courage to teach my students where they are at, rather than where they, "should be."

 

Yep, the only reason why I moved my dd over is because my youngest was overwhelmed by SWR and needed the slower one thing at a time pace of AAS. But after she saw the tiles and such she wanted to do AAS instead. In hind site I probably should have had her continue in SWR, but add elements of AAS. But SWR was always a struggle for me, so I was glad to step away from it.

 

Heather

 

[siloam]

LOL, that is exactly where I am today over math programs!

 

Merry :-)

 

Me too! (With math)

 

Heather

 

[happyhappyjoyjoy]

LOL, that is exactly where I am today over math programs!

 

Merry :-)

 

Alright, I've decided to do AAS:) I already bought 1 and 2. Honestly my oldest can learn quickly with most anything. And, my 2nd is the poster child for 'tactile-kinesthetic' learner, which was one reason I picked it (even though he won't use it for several years from now.)

 

There, it is done. I can always change my mind later if I decide to look at something different, but I'm going to give this a go.

Edited May 4, 2010 by happyhappyjoyjoy

[Lovedtodeath]

Good for you!

[johnandtinagilbert]

so here's where I am today:

 

I'm going to use AAS, no wait I think I'll try PR, no wait maybe I should just stick w/ my original plan of WRTR, or I could just get SWR..................:banghead:AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

 

I do really have a sense of humor about this choice. I'm just not ready to decide yet!:):lol:

I'm just sayin'....think of PR as a pick up and go SWR :)

[happyhappyjoyjoy]

Alright, I've decided to do AAS:) I already bought 1 and 2. Honestly my oldest can learn quickly with most anything. And, my 2nd is the poster child for 'tactile-kinesthetic' learner, which was one reason I picked it (even though he won't use it for several years from now.)

 

There, it is done. I can always change my mind later if I decide to look at something different, but I'm going to give this a go.

 

 

bumping to say that WE LOVE ALL ABOUT SPELLING!!!!!

 

My DS1 is often asking me to do 2 lessons a day. I'm so happy I went with my first instinct. I do have a friend that gives WRTR workshops and will be giving one to another friend. i'm going to sit in on that next month for my own enlightenment, but we really love AAS. I want to write a separate post some time on why we love it so much:)

[Snowfall]

I have a hunch that some kids could possibly do a handwriting program in addition to PR... especially if they didn't do the handwriting portion of PR 1. But we aren't even halfway through PR 1, so ignore me. lol

 

This is absolutely true. We just got our PR1 and haven't started it yet, but it uses the same approach as SWR - the whole clock face thing. That didn't work with DD when we were doing SWR and it still doesn't work now. Presenting it in conjunction with PR isn't going to make it suddenly work for her. Some kids just don't visualize the clock face on their papers like that. DD can't "see" a clock face every time she tries to write a letter. It's especially difficult for her because there are supposed to be different sizes of imaginary clock faces for capital and lower case letters. So when writing a lower case c, the clock face should stay in the bottom half of the lines, but for an upper case c, it should go from the top to the bottom. Totally doesn't work for her.

[MerryAtHope]

bumping to say that WE LOVE ALL ABOUT SPELLING!!!!!

 

My DS1 is often asking me to do 2 lessons a day. I'm so happy I went with my first instinct. I do have a friend that gives WRTR workshops and will be giving one to another friend. i'm going to sit in on that next month for my own enlightenment, but we really love AAS. I want to write a separate post some time on why we love it so much:)

 

So glad it's working well for you! Thanks for the update!

 

Merry :-)

[johnandtinagilbert]

YEAH! It's always good news when we find what works well! Congrats.

[H_Household]

I did AAS1 with my son but decided to try out PR1 with him to do spelling, writing and reading all in one. Well, tried PR for a short time but didn't really love it. Maybe I don't see the whole picture. I liked how AAS discussed a rule and then had words that went with that rule. PR seemed to skip around with all different kinds of words so I had trouble seeing the pattern. Maybe it was just me as I have a friend who loves it. I would love to know from someone who uses PR how it works so that I better understand it....otherwise I just wasted $200.