Foerster Alg. 1 or Lials

[Teresa in MO]

I have narrowed it down to these two. I already have Lials, but I have heard so much about Foersters clear explanations and word problems that I am considering this. I would use Math without Borders cd's. Has anyone seen both and can compare? This is just the first of my curriculum decisions I need to make for next year and it is driving me crazy!!!LOL

[Teresa in MO]

anyone, please? Jann in TX?

[yinne]

I have had two use Foersters for Algebra I and my oldest started out Algebra II with Foersters and we switched midyear to Lials. She and I were both struggling with Foersters and I made the decision to switch to Lials. I don't know if something just clicked or if Lials just fits her better, but it was the best curriculum decision I have made all year!!

 

My ds (my dd did OK with it as well) has done OK with the Foersters book this year for Algebra I, but he does not like the Math W/O Borders CD's at all. In fact I don't know when the last time was that he actually watched one -- he said that they just confuse him.

 

As a Mom, who has never liked math, I much prefer the solutions manual from Lials than Foersters. Nine times out of 10 the problem I would have a question on would not be worked out in the Foersters solution manual -- just an answer. I definitely haven't had that problem with Lials.

 

Yvonne in NE

[8filltheheart]

Nine times out of 10 the problem I would have a question on would not be worked out in the Foersters solution manual -- just an answer. I definitely haven't had that problem with Lials.

 

Yvonne in NE

 

Is that with alg 1 or 2? My alg 1 sm has complete solutions. My alg 2 doesn't. I'm not quite sure why, but 1's sm is much better.

[yinne]

Algebra 2. I don't remember it being a problem with 1 like it was with 2.

 

Y

[Teresa in MO]

how does this progression sound?

 

8th gr. - Foerster Algebra 1

9th gr. - TT Geometry

10th gr. - Lials Algebra 2

11 gr. - Lials Pre-Calc

12 gr. - college dual enrollment class

[Sunshine State Sue]

I've used Foerster's and looked at Lial's at the library. I don't think you can go wrong with either.

[AHASRADA]

I have searched for Lial's on Amazon, Half.com, etc., but there seem to be different versions/editions.

 

Could someone who has used it please share the specific titles I should be looking for.

 

Thanks,

 

Asmaa

[Sunshine State Sue]

I have searched for Lial's on Amazon, Half.com, etc., but there seem to be different versions/editions.

 

Could someone who has used it please share the specific titles I should be looking for.

 

Thanks,

 

Asmaa

This might help:

Sorry for what might be a repeat question...Lial's Basic/Introductory Algebra

[Jann in TX]

Both programs are equally good.

 

I have students in my Algebra 2 classes who used Foerster in Algebra 1 and they were well grounded.

 

I do prefer the 'chart' method of word problems that Lial teaches (especially for the mixture type problems).

 

I like Lial's Intermediate Algebra better than Foersters (classic edition)...I prefer the step by step examples over the 'learn while working the problem set' approach of Foerster.

 

Both cover essentially the same material--but with different 'slants'. Both will prepare a student for Pre-Calc.

 

While I could make Lial's work for any 'level' of student--I would not choose Foerster's Algebra 2 unless the student was naturally Mathy (but Lials would also work well with Mathy students...).

 

I'm using the 7th or 8th editions (These are PAPERBACK) of Lial's Introductory Algebra (Algebra 1) and Intermediate Algebra (Algebra 2) with my online classes... I also used them with my own daughters.

[kymomof3]

I'm hearing a lot about Lial's and Foerster for high school math. I have one headed into middle school and I'm beginning my search for algebra. I'm curious to know why these texts are superior to the Saxon texts. I've never used Saxon, so I'm not asking because I'm biased toward Saxon. I'm wondering because Saxon is what I see recommended most often.

 

Thanks,

Amie

[Jann in TX]

Homeschoolers once had a LIMITED choice in programs for highschool maths (and other subjects too)...now we have too many choices!

 

Foerster and Lial are now popular programs (Lial is a community college text)... they are traditional in format--there is a lesson followed by a homework set that starts out simple and gets increasingly more challenging. Topics are covered by chapter and the chapters build on each other--(ex. when working chapter 6 the student will be using concepts taught in the previous chapters...). Most students do well with a traditional program.

 

Saxon is still popular--but it is still DIFFERENT... Saxon is unique in its presentation, vocabulary and style of problems. It is incremental--and the lessons will seem 'out of order'--with one topic touched on one day and a completely different UNRELATED topic touched on the next...only a very few problems having to do with the lesson are worked each day--with the majority of the homework being review... it works for SOME students--but not for all. It it difficult if not almost impossible to transition into Saxon after the Algebra 1 level...

[Country Girl]

Homeschoolers once had a LIMITED choice in programs for highschool maths (and other subjects too)...now we have too many choices!

 

Foerster and Lial are now popular programs (Lial is a community college text)... they are traditional in format--there is a lesson followed by a homework set that starts out simple and gets increasingly more challenging. Topics are covered by chapter and the chapters build on each other--(ex. when working chapter 6 the student will be using concepts taught in the previous chapters...). Most students do well with a traditional program.

 

Saxon is still popular--but it is still DIFFERENT... Saxon is unique in its presentation, vocabulary and style of problems. It is incremental--and the lessons will seem 'out of order'--with one topic touched on one day and a completely different UNRELATED topic touched on the next...only a very few problems having to do with the lesson are worked each day--with the majority of the homework being review... it works for SOME students--but not for all. It it difficult if not almost impossible to transition into Saxon after the Algebra 1 level...

 

Jann,

 

I think I understand the logistical differences between a program like Lials versus Saxon.... but I wonder if you can comment on the rigor, thoroughness, college prep. value, etc. of Saxon. I've read criticism of Saxon being just drill and kill and that it doesn't deal with the concepts enough (that kids can just memorize algorithms and not really understand the concepts). I've also read criticism that Saxon doesn't have enough application work (ie. story problems). However, I keep coming back to the fact that my dh used Saxon in hs and went far in math in college. I realize that he is a "mathy" person so the text he used may or may not mattered.... but at least Saxon didn't completely screw him up:D. So, if Saxon works for the child and you plan to stick with it throughout the upper maths..... is it as strong a problem as Chalkdust, Lials, Foerster, BJU, etc.?

 

Thanks!

[Country Girl]

Just bumping, hoping Jann or someone else may have some input on Saxon.

 

Thanks!

[Jann in TX]

IF Saxon works for the student then it is a good program.

 

I used to teach from Saxon high school exclusively...MOST of my students were the Mathy type and they did great with the program--went on to be engineers and such...

 

I did have several students who struggled until I switched them OUT of Saxon... it is one of those programs where it is IMPERITIVE that it fits your student's learning type... if not it just will not work.

 

Saxon's difficulty is not in rigour (but it has that too)--it is in the 'unique' way that concepts are explained--and the fact that the incremental approach is harder for many students (at the high school level) than a traditional text where concepts naturally build on each other---and the student has several of the same problem type to practice with at one time--so they can PRACTICE and build their own logical reasoning...

[Country Girl]

IF Saxon works for the student then it is a good program.

 

I used to teach from Saxon high school exclusively...MOST of my students were the Mathy type and they did great with the program--went on to be engineers and such...

 

I did have several students who struggled until I switched them OUT of Saxon... it is one of those programs where it is IMPERITIVE that it fits your student's learning type... if not it just will not work.

 

Saxon's difficulty is not in rigour (but it has that too)--it is in the 'unique' way that concepts are explained--and the fact that the incremental approach is harder for many students (at the high school level) than a traditional text where concepts naturally build on each other---and the student has several of the same problem type to practice with at one time--so they can PRACTICE and build their own logical reasoning...

 

Jann,

 

Thank you so much for this reply. You have really helped alleviate some of the fears I have had about this program. I'm still not sure if we will switch to it but my ds has been asking to. He has looked at the samples and we have discussed the format and he thinks he'd like it. However, I've really been reluctant because of some of the criticisms that I've heard about Saxon not teaching concepts and only teaching kids to plug numbers into a formula. I'm also still concerned that if it doesn't work for us then it would be harder to switch to another program the further we go since it doesn't follow the traditional sequence. Am I correct in thinking that if we go with something like Chalkdust and it doesn't work, then switching to something like Lials/Foerster/etc. should be pretty seamless as far as scope and sequence goes?

 

Thanks!

[TeaTotaler]

We decided to go with Foerster's Algebra. I liked the clean, uncluttered layout. I also preferred the word problems in it. After having completed SM I wanted a text with challenging word problems. I looked at Lial's a couple of years ago but preferred the layout of Foerster. As Jann mentioned, Lial's will also work. I would get both through ILL and see which you prefer.

 

I have narrowed it down to these two. I already have Lials, but I have heard so much about Foersters clear explanations and word problems that I am considering this. I would use Math without Borders cd's. Has anyone seen both and can compare? This is just the first of my curriculum decisions I need to make for next year and it is driving me crazy!!!LOL

[AHASRADA]

I am wondering if anyone knows of a site where I can purchase the correct edition of Lial's books (particularly Algebra I at the moment), or, better yet, to buy the textbook and the DVDs as a set?

 

I have seen Lial's discussed quite a bit on the board, as well as the corresponding DVDs, but it is a little unclear which edition to use, which ones line up with the DVDs, etc.

 

So, which Lial's books should we use for a typical high school sequence, which DVDs correspond with those books, and where do we buy them?

 

Thanks!

 

Asmaa