I've just discovered MCT!

[Handmaiden]

It's all your fault, fellow hivers, that I went to bed past midnight last night! I haven't been on the boards for a while and have just found and read most of the MCT threads. I have looked for YEARS to find a LA program that makes sense.

 

I think I've found it!

 

I'm combining my two youngest (4th & 3rd) in the Island series and putting my oldest (6th) in the Town series, but I'd like to have the 6th grader review the beginning level first.

 

Questions:

 

1. For those who have put an older child through an accelerated trip through the first level, how did you do this? How much time did it take? Can I do it concurrently with the Town level?

 

2. We're using JAG for my 12yo. He is not "getting" diagramming. Are any of your kids who struggle with diagramming doing better with MCT?

 

3. I'm assuming the workbooks are consumable, so I need 2 workbooks for 2 kids in the Island level, right? Should I also get a workbook for my older child if we are going through it quickly?

 

4. Is there anything else I should order beside the homeschool package and extra workbook?

 

TIA!

Edited January 13, 2010 by Handmaiden
clarity

[Kissy]

1. For those who have put an older child through an accelerated trip through the first level, how did you do this? How much time did it take? Can I do it concurrently with the Town level?

 

We did not do this for our older child. I started in 5th grade and used the Town series. This went well for us. I didn't feel it was necessary to back up and go through it quickly. However if you are already going to have the books anyway you could just get that child to read through. Then move on.

2. We're using JAG for my 12yo. He is not "getting" diagramming. Are any of your kids who struggle with diagramming doing better with MCT?

 

My son was doing Abeka and couldn't get diagramming either. Still does not. However he loves the 4 level analysis and gets it.

 

3. I'm assuming the workbooks are consumable, so I need 2 workbooks for 2 kids in the Island level, right? Should I also get a workbook for my older child if we are going through it quickly?

 

Some people do not write in the workbooks instead have the child to copy on a seperate sheet. I like to use the workbooks so I would buy 1 per child.

4. Is there anything else I should order beside the homeschool package and extra workbook?

 

Some people have loved the classical literature component MCT does however for language arts program the homeschool package is sufficient.

After answering all your questions I have to tell you that my son who is not a writer is understanding more than ever. He seems to really retain it and love the way the material is presented. We will forever be fans of MCT. I can't wait for the younger child to get to the chance we can use it with him too. Good luck!

 

[rafiki]

.

[Annie Laurie]

I'm not sure how much overlap there is with Island and Town, but can tell you it took us 3 weeks to finish Grammar Island.

 

Hijack-

 

Is this the norm? It's a lot of money to be done with it in 3 weeks, or am I not understanding the system- which I'm not really, so I'm sure I'm missing something. Do you do grammar alone first, then move on to the next thing at the Island level, and so on? If I order the complete Island set, it won't last a school year?

[Handmaiden]

Thank you, Kissy and Michele. I wish I could see the workbook to decide whether to buy it as a consumable or use it as a text like you both do.

 

Is it fill-in-the-blank work?

 

How difficult would it be to use it for copywork?

[Capt_Uhura]

Yes, you do the grammar first. Grammar Island is meant to be done in under 4 weeks MCT said. You then spend the rest of the time w/ Music of the Hemispheres, Sentence Island, and Building Language and the Practice Book.

 

There is a quite a bit of overlap between levels. If i remember correctly, if you look at the last page of the sample pages, it tells you what was learning in that level. You'll see that each level does nouns, pronouns, adj, adv, sentences, predicates etc but in each next level, it goes from being a level to just a page or two for each topic from the previous level and then going deeper.

 

The grammar books seem to be the easiest at any of the levels. I think the writing book and vocabulary is what warrants the grade level. DS would have been fine w/ higher grade level for grammar but the writing would have been challenging.

 

Capt_Uhura

Edited January 13, 2010 by Capt_Uhura
forgot to add the Practice Book

[Capt_Uhura]

The Practice books are very simple. Each page is a sentence. Below the sentence there are 4 lines for the 4-level analysis. Dc writes in the parts of speech on the first line, the parts of a sentence on the 2nd, phrases on the 3rd and clauses on the 4th.

 

Wild winds whirled and curled around the island.

 

 

DC could easily re-write this sentence on a dry erase board/chalk board or blank sheet of paper. All the sentences are in the teacher's manual. I bought the workbooks b/c I like the having a product at the end of the year. Also, much of what we do requires my involvement and I wanted something they could do independently. DS9 does a daily edit paragraph so this will be done along with that when I'm busy working w/ DS6 or playing w/ DD3. And my son is writing phobic when it comes to things NOT coming out of his head and I didn't want a battle over him having to re-write the sentence since we also do dictation w/ WWE and spelling. So for $10, seemed like money well spent. But if I were counting pennies, I'd forget the workbook and have DC write the sentence OR do it on a white board/chalk board.

Edited January 13, 2010 by Capt_Uhura
clarification of workbooks vs Practice books

[rafiki]

.

[radiobrain]

I hope that you are not confusing "workbook' with "student book".

 

You will need the Teacher books ONLY although you might want the "practice" student books, and you can forgo that if you write it on a board or sheet of paper.

 

I was kind of glazing over the last few responses but I think your older one should do Town, but should listen to the stories in Island, they are great. But for work... Town should be just right.

[Kissy]

Hijack-

 

Is this the norm? It's a lot of money to be done with it in 3 weeks, or am I not understanding the system- which I'm not really, so I'm sure I'm missing something. Do you do grammar alone first, then move on to the next thing at the Island level, and so on? If I order the complete Island set, it won't last a school year?

 

For us it is worth it..we read it and refer to it as needed. We do grammar first which is what MCT suggests but then you begin to add in the other parts. However with my son I use the instruction in writing to aid him with his writing in other subjects. Right now he does a practice sentence 2x a week to make sure we are still keeping fresh but is doing the writing because we didn't get to start that until this month. There is a powerpoint presentation on the website that shows MCT's thinking about how to use the program throughout the year.

[Handmaiden]

Thank you, everyone, for the feedback. Very helpful!

 

 

I hope that you are not confusing "workbook'

with "student book".

 

You will need the Teacher books ONLY although you might want the "practice" student books, and you can forgo that if you write it on a board or sheet of paper.

 

Are you saying I don't need the student book then?

[Kissy]

You don't need the student books just the teacher manuels but you will need the practice books and answers. Everything in the teacher books are the same in the student books there are some answers given but you can do the examples on the board. Some people like to have the student books so the child can read along with you. With mine I only have one so it isn't really an issue. For us we just use the teacher books.

[Handmaiden]

If I have more than one child, would it be worthwhile to get the studen book?

 

How teacher intensive is MCT? (ie, how much time do you spend on it each day?)

[Matryoshka]

If I have more than one child, would it be worthwhile to get the studen book?

 

I have twins, and do just fine with just the TM. I sit on the sofa with the book on my lap and a kid on each side and it works fine.

 

How teacher intensive is MCT? (ie, how much time do you spend on it each day?)

 

I'm guessing about 20 min? They may have some independent work above and beyond that, but from a teaching-time standpoint, that's about right I think. We're doing Town.

[Handmaiden]

Okay, I went ahead and submitted my order. It's quite pricey, so I am praying this works for us!

 

We have 3 different kinds of learners in our home. Do any of you find that the material is not grasped by one of your children who is not considered "gifted"? Any success stories with kids with learning disabilities?

[rafiki]

.

[Handmaiden]

Thanks, Michele! :001_smile:

[Matryoshka]

Neither of mine are gifted and they have completely different learning styles, yet both are doing quite well.

 

:iagree: No gifted kids here, either, nor LDs - just garden-variety bright kids.

[Annie Laurie]

Yes, you do the grammar first. Grammar Island is meant to be done in under 4 weeks MCT said. You then spend the rest of the time w/ Music of the Hemispheres, Sentence Island, and Building Language and the Practice Book.

 

There is a quite a bit of overlap between levels. If i remember correctly, if you look at the last page of the sample pages, it tells you what was learning in that level. You'll see that each level does nouns, pronouns, adj, adv, sentences, predicates etc but in each next level, it goes from being a level to just a page or two for each topic from the previous level and then going deeper.

 

The grammar books seem to be the easiest at any of the levels. I think the writing book and vocabulary is what warrants the grade level. DS would have been fine w/ higher grade level for grammar but the writing would have been challenging.

 

Capt_Uhura

 

Thank you! That clarified a lot for me.

 

You complete Grammar Island and move into Practice Island. MCT recommends PI be done 3X per week, but my kids actually get upset when I don't have a sentence on the board for the day. It's something you have to experience to understand - LOL!

 

As far as it lasting a whole year, it could, however there is no suggested pacing with the materials that breaks it down over a typical school year. Also, I've found when trying to schedule the week in advance, we often do not stick to it. With MCT there are just so many learning opportunities hidden within and bunny trails your kids may decide to follow, it's not a rigid schedule.

 

Today for example, their assignment was to write 3 sentences that use an action verb. They did that, but also wanted to do the 4 step analysis on each one, I could hardly say no. ;)

 

 

Thanks, I'm kind of starting to understand.

 

For us it is worth it..we read it and refer to it as needed. We do grammar first which is what MCT suggests but then you begin to add in the other parts. However with my son I use the instruction in writing to aid him with his writing in other subjects. Right now he does a practice sentence 2x a week to make sure we are still keeping fresh but is doing the writing because we didn't get to start that until this month. There is a powerpoint presentation on the website that shows MCT's thinking about how to use the program throughout the year.

 

I've seen the powerpoint presentation and it's part of what stops me from buying it- I don't get it. Really. My brain does not work that way and I can not seem to make sense of MCT LA from the samples. Maybe I need to look at it again and go veeery slowly. I love what I hear about it, my kids are very creative and it sounds like something that would appeal to them.

 

But both MCT and CW have been hard for me to get a handle on. IEW makes the most sense to me, but I don't know if it would make as much sense to my kids. And my dd is SO artsy and imaginative, that I wonder if IEW would be too formulaic for her.

 

I tend to need to hold it in my hands and read through it so I can get the big picture first. But it would be expensive buying both CW and MCT just to look at them. (I already own IEW). I'm thisclose to buying MCT to look at though.

 

Thanks for replying.

[radiobrain]

Thank you! That clarified a lot for me.

 

 

 

Thanks, I'm kind of starting to understand.

 

 

 

I've seen the powerpoint presentation and it's part of what stops me from buying it- I don't get it. Really. My brain does not work that way and I can not seem to make sense of MCT LA from the samples. Maybe I need to look at it again and go veeery slowly. I love what I hear about it, my kids are very creative and it sounds like something that would appeal to them.

 

But both MCT and CW have been hard for me to get a handle on. IEW makes the most sense to me, but I don't know if it would make as much sense to my kids. And my dd is SO artsy and imaginative, that I wonder if IEW would be too formulaic for her.

 

I tend to need to hold it in my hands and read through it so I can get the big picture first. But it would be expensive buying both CW and MCT just to look at them. (I already own IEW). I'm thisclose to buying MCT to look at though.

 

Thanks for replying.

 

If you don't quite get it, and your "brain doesn't work that way", it might not be a good fit for you. See, my brain gets MCT immediately, but I cannot even think about IEW...

 

However, that doesn't mean that it is not going to be a good program for you and your kids. So, I would say not to sweat it, and do what you are comfortable with... but keep in mind that there is another option out there that is VERY different an worthwhile. But no matter what you choose to do, your kids will learn the stuff they are supposed to.

 

I just happen to be in the MCT devotee section of the LA world. Can't see doing it any other way, and I wish I had been taught this way.. oh wait... I AM! I have been learning all the stuff that I either forgot, didn't understand or was never taught. :D

 

BTW, I have never watched the powerpoint or slideshows...

Edited January 17, 2010 by radiobrain
forgot

[Capt_Uhura]

attachtedto4 - Perhaps you should call Royal Fireworks Press and see what their return policy is? I think a curriculum at the young ages, needs to work for both teacher and student. If you get how IEW works, can you tweak it to fit your DD? I would think that's easier than forcing yourself to "get" something like MCT or CW so that you can effectively teach your DD. I consider my teaching style first, and then consider DS's learning style.

 

THe MCT website is the worst. The sample pages chosen are not good choices. I let a friend buy first so I could look at hers before buying.

[Julie in MN]

I've seen the powerpoint presentation and it's part of what stops me from buying it- I don't get it. Really. My brain does not work that way and I can not seem to make sense of MCT LA from the samples.

 

One thing that isn't evident from the power point is that when you finish grammar, you haven't really finished grammar. There is the practice book and there is grammar discussion in almost every single MCT book.

 

And the reverse is true, too. When you haven't started some of the books yet, there is still some discussion of all topics in all the books. At least with the books we've used -- there is poetry discussion in the grammar practice books, vocab discussion in the writing books, and so forth.

 

Julie

[lauracolumbus]

Well, I'm glad to hear that it's not me, but the website. I have been skeptical in part b/c of their poor website. Besides the whole layout, I look at the sample pages and think ?????

 

Laura

[Colleen in SEVA]

1. For those who have put an older child through an accelerated trip through the first level, how did you do this? How much time did it take? Can I do it concurrently with the Town level?

 

It won't be needed as there is a quick review at the beginning of Grammar Town, but if you really wanted him to do Island first, he could read it over 4 or 5 days and skip the exercises.

 

2. We're using JAG for my 12yo. He is not "getting" diagramming. Are any of your kids who struggle with diagramming doing better with MCT?

 

MCT skips traditional diagramming (he explained why in a workshop I attended, not sure if that part is on the videos on the website or not), and the 4 level analysis is very logical.

 

3. I'm assuming the workbooks are consumable, so I need 2 workbooks for 2 kids in the Island level, right? Should I also get a workbook for my older child if we are going through it quickly?

 

Definitely skip the Island level practice book for your oldest. Buy 2 Island practice books for your younger kids, and the Town practice book for your oldest.

 

4. Is there anything else I should order beside the homeschool package and extra workbook?

 

No, unless you wanted to try some of their novels. :)

 

.

[Annie Laurie]

If you don't quite get it, and your "brain doesn't work that way", it might not be a good fit for you. See, my brain gets MCT immediately, but I cannot even think about IEW...

 

 

 

That might be true. I like IEW, I like what Andrew Pudewa has to say so I would probably be safest sticking with that. But I did watch a YouTube video of MCT speaking about his LA program and I loved what he said about using strong verbs instead of throwing in a bunch of adjectives, which is commonly taught in writing programs- including IEW. That really clicked for me, so I think I might like the writing portion of his LA program. My dd is already a natural writer, I'm not sure she needs to be influenced by the style portion of IEW. A reluctant writer like my son will benefit from IEW, but I'm afraid of stifling the wonderful writing style my dd already has.

 

I'm a big picture person, it's hard for me to get a handle on any program when all I see are bits and pieces of samples on websites. I end up buying a lot of things just so I can make sense of them.

[Annie Laurie]

attachtedto4 - Perhaps you should call Royal Fireworks Press and see what their return policy is? I think a curriculum at the young ages, needs to work for both teacher and student. If you get how IEW works, can you tweak it to fit your DD? I would think that's easier than forcing yourself to "get" something like MCT or CW so that you can effectively teach your DD. I consider my teaching style first, and then consider DS's learning style.

 

THe MCT website is the worst. The sample pages chosen are not good choices. I let a friend buy first so I could look at hers before buying.

 

That's a good suggestion, I probably will call them and see, and then if the return window is long enough, I'll go ahead and buy it to look at it.

 

I suppose I could just teach my dd the structure parts of IEW, to help her organize her thoughts and to teach her how to summarize information, without getting into the style parts of it. She already rewrites fairy tales in her free time, so not sure if the key word outline idea is necessary for her.

 

Thanks for giving me some things to chew on.

 

One thing that isn't evident from the power point is that when you finish grammar, you haven't really finished grammar. There is the practice book and there is grammar discussion in almost every single MCT book.

 

And the reverse is true, too. When you haven't started some of the books yet, there is still some discussion of all topics in all the books. At least with the books we've used -- there is poetry discussion in the grammar practice books, vocab discussion in the writing books, and so forth.

 

Julie

 

Thanks for that clarification.

 

Well, I'm glad to hear that it's not me, but the website. I have been skeptical in part b/c of their poor website. Besides the whole layout, I look at the sample pages and think ?????

 

Laura

 

Me too!

[Handmaiden]

Thanks, Colleen! :001_smile: