OK, would any of you wade into this situation?

[OhM]

First, a long overdue update:

Some of you might remember a post long ago about dd cutting. She's been seeing a counselor since the beginning of the year, and I must say things have worked out tremendously. Not just for her, but for the entire family. We have all really grown through this experience.

 

But...

 

When her counseling started last year, she was in the middle of her first year back in ps (8th grade) after 3 yrs. of homeschooling. He has made a couple of comments along the way which caused me to think that he holds a bias against homeschooling, and has some erroneous beliefs about homeschoolers (specifically, the "socialization" issue, as usual). Because his comments were only peripheral to the central topic each time, I mostly let them roll off my back.

 

At today's visit, he learned that she has enrolled with an on-line charter this year. He made some comments to me at the close of her visit that he is very concerned about this - that she will become isolated "again", and that we'll have to carefully monitor that she stays in contact with her friends. He didn't come out and say, "Or she could slip back into self-harming behaviors," but it sounded like it was coming next. He also indicated that it sounded like she was taking "the path of least resistance" and trying to avoid the stress of deadlines and people pleasing she would feel with her teachers. :001_huh: He seemed mystified when I pointed out that she does have teachers and deadlines to answer to with the on-line charter. His attitude throughout the conversation was cordial, but he betrayed disapproval with his expression and comments.

 

Do I need to address this bias directly with him? Would you? How would I even go about it? Is there any reading I can suggest to him that could help him have a more balanced view of homeschoolers? Are there any therapists/psychologists out there who can enlighten me about this situation? I like him a lot, and really appreciate what he's done for our family, but I think he needs some education about our educational and lifestyle choice!

Edited August 19, 2009 by OhM

[flyingmommy]

It sounds to me like you need to have a very calm, non confrontational conversation with him and address whatever misconceptions he seems to have. If you are noticing it repeatedly, it's not your imagination. Perhaps you might even suggest a book or two for him to read. He probably would take information from a book more readily than from you. In the end, you can't change his mind if he doesn't want it changed. At least you will have tried. It does sound to me like his opinions and misinformation are probably affecting his understanding of your daughter. That could be a dangerous thing if he overlooks something important because he is blaming it on home schooling. Anyway, that's my two cents.

 

Jeannie

[ravengal]

If you have been happy with what your family has accomplished with this particular therapist so far, perhaps you might give some thought to the therapist's concerns about your dd. Forgive me for not being familiar with your previous post regarding your dd, but has your dd expressed feelings of loneliness and isolation?

 

Our eldest dd loved the educational side of homeschooling, but socialization, in our family, was not a settled issue, despite her enrollment in extracurricular activities, and despite weekly outings with our small homeschool group. In hindsight, we did not adequately address her needs because, at the time, we didn't realize the extent of her loneliness.

[OrganicAnn]

I would say that you should probably take his concerns seriously, because it is a serious thing your DD health and well-being. But you should also try to educate him some about what you are doing. I wouldn't give him a book about homeschooling, but would give him information about your specific charter/umbrella school. The website, the curriculum, the teacher/student interaction, whatever you think might be relevant to the situation. Ask if he has questions. Maybe suggest that you work together to come up with a strategy given the current school choice.

[Laurie4b]

You need to schedule an appointment to address this directly. I would indicate a willingness to be open-minded about his point of view and to ask him to be open-minded about yours. None of us know your exact situation and your dd was in a very harmful place. This is the person who helped her out of it, so I would be open to his concerns while asking him to be open to considering whether they are based on bias or on specific insight about your dd.

[LMA]

First, a long overdue update:

Some of you might remember a post long ago about dd cutting. She's been seeing a counselor since the beginning of the year, and I must say things have worked out tremendously. Not just for her, but for the entire family. We have all really grown through this experience.

 

But...

 

When her counseling started last year, she was in the middle of her first year back in ps (8th grade) after 3 yrs. of homeschooling. He has made a couple of comments along the way which caused me to think that he holds a bias against homeschooling, and has some erroneous beliefs about homeschoolers (specifically, the "socialization" issue, as usual). Because his comments were only peripheral to the central topic each time, I mostly let them roll off my back.

 

At today's visit, he learned that she has enrolled with an on-line charter this year. He made some comments to me at the close of her visit that he is very concerned about this - that she will become isolated "again", and that we'll have to carefully monitor that she stays in contact with her friends. He didn't come out and say, "Or she could slip back into self-harming behaviors," but it sounded like it was coming next. He also indicated that it sounded like she was taking "the path of least resistance" and trying to avoid the stress of deadlines and people pleasing she would feel with her teachers. :001_huh: He seemed mystified when I pointed out that she does have teachers and deadlines to answer to with the on-line charter. His attitude throughout the conversation was cordial, but he betrayed disapproval with his expression and comments.

 

Do I need to address this bias directly with him? Would you? How would I even go about it? Is there any reading I can suggest to him that could help him have a more balanced view of homeschoolers? Are there any therapists/psychologists out there who can enlighten me about this situation? I like him a lot, and really appreciate what he's done for our family, but I think he needs some education about our educational and lifestyle choice!

 

Not to be nosy, but was your daughter's behavior a result of being homeschooled? Is that what the counselor is implying? Does he think that there a cause and effect relationship here with homeschooling? I would ask the counselor to be direct and honest about his opinion and go from there. I wouldn't try to convince him about homeschooling right now. I would find out where he stands. Because down the road, if your daughter has setbacks, he may blame homeschooling for the problems even though it doesn't have anything to do with homeschooling. Just something to think about.

 

Louise

[LaxMom]

IIRC (and it's been a long time since psych), don't kids who cut self-isolate? I'm wondering if his concern is driven more by creating an atmosphere where she has the ability to isolate, rather than a blanket disapproval of homeschooling. And, frankly, I wonder what his focus as a therapist is; if he sees a lot of kids with tendencies to isolate, his experience would color his view of homeschooling. You know, the old "when you're a hammer, everything looks like a nail" thing.

[OhM]

I agree with the advice to take his concerns seriously - I am and have. But even when she was self-harming, she wasn't precisely isolating - we didn't see her disappearing for hours or anything like that. In fact, it was a puzzle as to when she was doing it, because we didn't see her withdrawing from the family. The self-harming came up after she had returned to public school, and though he never said it outright, he implies that her years of homeschooling "caused" the situation. But the issues he has addressed with her were in the works before she homeschooled, and still there after she homeschooled - I don't see her being at home as "cause", necessarily. He also implies that she had no social contact during those years, and doesn't seem to "hear" either her or me when we tell him otherwise. (She wasn't and isn't isolated from people! She participates in many activities, and has friends in all of them.)

 

My discomfort with him is coming more from the stereotypical statements I hear from him regarding homeschooling. For instance, the implication that homeschoolers are "often" trying to reduce stress by avoiding p.s., and homeschoolers "often" lack the ability to negotiate social situations because they've been isolated. (He likes to use "often". Maybe if he used "sometimes", or better, "With P, homeschooling has..." I wouldn't have these red flags going up!)

 

I get the impression he doesn't deal with homeschoolers much.

 

Maybe that in itself says something?;)

 

Anyway, any books specifically he could read? I'm thinking Family Matters might cause him to question his bias (if in fact that's what it is). I'm not at all concerned with defending our homeschooling - I'd just like him to see another side of homeschooling that it seems to me he hasn't seriously considered yet.

[mommy2be]

One thing that I would suggest is just having an honest to goodness conversation with him. Just tell him "Let's just both be completely honest with each other here and get it all out in the open so we can work better together. We both have the same goal here - and that is helping DD"

 

Just flat out ask him "How do you feel about homeschooling? I'd like to know so that we can discuss it and I can find out what you think might actually be an issue, or help clear any misunderstandings" During that conversation he may mention something to you that you may not have thought of about her homeschooling (It could happen...) and you might help him to think a little differently about it. Make sure it never sounds argumentative, but just lay all of the cards out on the table!

 

Although a book might be a good solution... it doesn't seem like it'd be a very good first step. That may seem like "Eh, you don't know what you're talking about - read this" Or maybe even "I don't really know enough about it myself, but I'm doing it anyways, just read this" But - if you discuss it in person then you may find out the root of his issues and then let him know how you feel about it, then maybe suggest a book...

 

Anyways, hope that helps! Also, glad to hear that your DD is doing better. :001_smile:

[LaxMom]

I agree with the advice to take his concerns seriously - I am and have. But even when she was self-harming, she wasn't precisely isolating - we didn't see her disappearing for hours or anything like that. In fact, it was a puzzle as to when she was doing it, because we didn't see her withdrawing from the family. The self-harming came up after she had returned to public school, and though he never said it outright, he implies that her years of homeschooling "caused" the situation. But the issues he has addressed with her were in the works before she homeschooled, and still there after she homeschooled - I don't see her being at home as "cause", necessarily. He also implies that she had no social contact during those years, and doesn't seem to "hear" either her or me when we tell him otherwise. (She wasn't and isn't isolated from people! She participates in many activities, and has friends in all of them.)

 

My discomfort with him is coming more from the stereotypical statements I hear from him regarding homeschooling. For instance, the implication that homeschoolers are "often" trying to reduce stress by avoiding p.s., and homeschoolers "often" lack the ability to negotiate social situations because they've been isolated. (He likes to use "often". Maybe if he used "sometimes", or better, "With P, homeschooling has..." I wouldn't have these red flags going up!)

 

I get the impression he doesn't deal with homeschoolers much.

 

Maybe that in itself says something?;)

 

Anyway, any books specifically he could read? I'm thinking Family Matters might cause him to question his bias (if in fact that's what it is). I'm not at all concerned with defending our homeschooling - I'd just like him to see another side of homeschooling that it seems to me he hasn't seriously considered yet.

Well, it would be interesting that he, I assume, deals with kids with anxiety all the time, but it's the homeschooling thing (particularly if he doesn't deal with homeschoolers much) is what stands out to him... I realize it's outside the "norm", but it seems obvious that, if the majority of his patients are public schooled, the norm isn't a panacea.

 

I would definitely have a discussion with him, maybe a complete private session to discuss this. As much as he has helped, his bias about a life change could be detrimental in the future.

[KidsHappen]

I believe that it is imperative that you have a discussion with him about this issue right away. For one thing it could affect his treatment and her results. Another thing is should there be more cutting incidences and he stated that in his professional opinion homeschooling was to blame then it is possible that you could be forced to put your dd in school.

 

You also need to do your research on self-harm and how incredibly common it is becoming amoung today's youth. Obviously, the majority of self injurors go to school. It would help if perhaps you had a family doctor on your side as well. If you are not able to come to an agreeable resolution over this issue with this counselor it might be better to find one that is more supportive of homeschooling.

[songbirdie]

There is a very good book called "The Socialization Trap" that provides insight into the misinformed opinion that homeschooled children are under-socialized. Maybe he could read that. I can't remember the author's name but it was available from Christianbook.com.

 

Also, let's use logic and reason here. If homeschooling were the CAUSE self-harming behaviors due to isolation, then most homeschoolers would be harming themselves. Since most are not, obviously he's wrong about his assumptions. I've also seen many children go into the public school system after homeschooling, and they aren't exhibiting these behaviors. So it clearly isn't from homeschooling, or from moving to a public school. THE POINT: My concern would be that he is quickly blaming homeschooling or moving into the ps system, instead of digging deeper to find the actual cause. I'd hate for your daughter to not receive the treatment she needs because he never really got to the heart of the matter.

[KristenS]

I would ditto the frank discussion, not confronting but discussing. I see a counselor for anxiety issues, and he was very concerned that homeschooling would be placing an undue burden on me. He has nothing against homeschooling, as it turned out, but he was truly concerned about its impact on ME, his patient.

 

We discussed it (and occasionally revisit the issue), and he's been very supportive. I pointed out how many of my anxiety problems would be way worse if I had to work around a PS schedule, how this enabled us to have more quality family time, and so on. And he and my dh insisted I get a set time to myself with a mother's helper to watch the kids, once a week. So ... compromises were in order, but it did help to have the chat.

 

It also helps that he can see how happy I appear when I discuss homeschool stuff, as opposed to other things in my life.

 

I know it's easier since I'm an adult and could speak up for myself, using good logical reasons as well as my own emotional ones. It's harder to speak as the parent of a teen with issues, because you and your daughter may not see things the same way, or at least the counselor might believe that you don't. But still, it couldn't hurt to have a talk about the issues.

[OhM]

Thanks, all. I appreciate the comments. We'll be having a direct discussion. I'm hoping I'm misunderstanding the comments. I appreciate the book suggestion. In the event that he really is uninformed about homeschooling, I have something at the ready to suggest.

[Maria from IN]

Chiming in late, but...

 

Um, she started cutting after she went back to school and the homeschooling caused it? Yeah.:001_huh:

 

If he's a counselor who works with children, he should already know that homeschooling is legal in every state and that the education of your child is up to you. Period. There's no misunderstanding there.

 

It sounds as if he's looking for a quick explanation for the behavior.

[mom4him]

First, a long overdue update:

Some of you might remember a post long ago about dd cutting. She's been seeing a counselor since the beginning of the year, and I must say things have worked out tremendously. Not just for her, but for the entire family. We have all really grown through this experience.

 

But...

 

When her counseling started last year, she was in the middle of her first year back in ps (8th grade) after 3 yrs. of homeschooling. He has made a couple of comments along the way which caused me to think that he holds a bias against homeschooling, and has some erroneous beliefs about homeschoolers (specifically, the "socialization" issue, as usual). Because his comments were only peripheral to the central topic each time, I mostly let them roll off my back.

 

At today's visit, he learned that she has enrolled with an on-line charter this year. He made some comments to me at the close of her visit that he is very concerned about this - that she will become isolated "again", and that we'll have to carefully monitor that she stays in contact with her friends. He didn't come out and say, "Or she could slip back into self-harming behaviors," but it sounded like it was coming next. He also indicated that it sounded like she was taking "the path of least resistance" and trying to avoid the stress of deadlines and people pleasing she would feel with her teachers. :001_huh: He seemed mystified when I pointed out that she does have teachers and deadlines to answer to with the on-line charter. His attitude throughout the conversation was cordial, but he betrayed disapproval with his expression and comments.

 

Do I need to address this bias directly with him? Would you? How would I even go about it? Is there any reading I can suggest to him that could help him have a more balanced view of homeschoolers? Are there any therapists/psychologists out there who can enlighten me about this situation? I like him a lot, and really appreciate what he's done for our family, but I think he needs some education about our educational and lifestyle choice!

I will share with you my experience with my dc's councilor. We were seeing her as our ds was raging every day and many/most days several times a day. She started in on how they needed to 'learn' to 'play' with other children. I explained that they do have interaction with my middle son's children, children at church and neighbor hood children but it isn't a scheduled thing and not normally a lengthy period of time. She kept on this route every week. Every week I got the question of had I arranged any play dates for the dc. One day as I was driving to the appointment and we were listening to a 'Little House' cd I had this revelation that the modern day idea that our children need to be 'together' with other children all the time is really that, a modern day idea.

I went into her office and when she questioned me about the play date thing I told her just that. I reaffermed that they are not locked in their closet but that they do have interaction with other kids their age but NO I had not arranged a play date.(If she would have really thought about it I am not sure how I would have done that as at that point he was so unpredictable, I just never new when he would totally loose it over nothing.) That was the last time she addressed the issue.

I would definitely talk to him and tell him where you are with this issue.