Narrative history of Native Americans

[stripe]

I stumbled across this, and it's certainly not perfect....It has anti-Spanish/Catholic comments in places, and refers to Native Americans as "American red-men" (as part of rejecting the geographically inaccurate term "Indian") and the term "savage" is bandied about....but it does present a rather different perspective, all the more amazing considering it was written in 1887.

 

The story of the American Indian: his origin, development, decline and destiny

by Elbridge Streeter Brooks

 

Full text with illustrations available on Google Books, or from the University of Georgia.

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

I stumbled across this, and it's certainly not perfect....It has anti-Spanish/Catholic comments in places, and refers to Native Americans as "American red-men" (as part of rejecting the geographically inaccurate term "Indian") and the term "savage" is bandied about....but it does present a rather different perspective, all the more amazing considering it was written in 1887.

 

The story of the American Indian: his origin, development, decline and destiny

by Elbridge Streeter Brooks

 

Full text with illustrations available on Google Books, or from the University of Georgia.

 

This is wonderful! Thanks! I was just looking at resources for studying Native American life before the arrival of all the explorers. I found The Real Book About Indians by Michael Gorham. It's pretty good too. Everything I've read so far has had a very respectful tone, which thrills me.

[Amie]

Thanks! I saved the link and also plan to pass it along.

[stripe]

Oh, good!

 

Incidentally I found it listed in this resource. I'm hoping that I will find other useful things in it, although it is so old, I'm not quite sure.

Five Hundred Books for the Young: A Graded and Annotated List‎

 

by George Edward Paul Hardy - 1892 - 94 pages

Prepared for the Committee on literature of the New York state teachers' association

[Orthodox6]

If you would find this helpful, here is a list of books suggested that people avoid, because of the stereotypes, and/or bigotries, and/or plain inaccuracies prominent in the texts: http://www.oyate.org/books-to-avoid/index.html

 

A number of books popular among homeschoolers appear on this list. Each title links to an essay analyzing the work's defects.

 

I think this is a valuable resource. If any board members with personal knowledge of the subject notice this post, and care to weigh in, I know that I would value their input !

[Amie]

Wow Stripe, what a fun list!

[stripe]

I feel this holds for all ethnic groups and nationalities -- anything that reduces a person or a group to a cartoonish image (be it positive or negative, from "inscrutable" to "savage") is not a very interesting or accurate resource. I am not unusually interested in Native American issues, but I have been deeply unhappy with many of the old history resources I've seen that begin with dreadfully negative depictions of them as well as others, so that knocks them off my list.

 

I think those leveled readers on Oyate's site look cute, but wow! so expensive.

[Peela]

If you would find this helpful, here is a list of books suggested that people avoid, because of the stereotypes, and/or bigotries, and/or plain inaccuracies prominent in the texts: http://www.oyate.org/books-to-avoid/index.html

 

A number of books popular among homeschoolers appear on this list. Each title links to an essay analyzing the work's defects.

 

I think this is a valuable resource. If any board members with personal knowledge of the subject notice this post, and care to weigh in, I know that I would value their input !

 

Thanks for this link. Interesting that Little House books and many others that are popular in homeschooling ciclres are included in the books to avoid due to their disrespect of Native Americans. I read the explanation and I can understand why they are included.

Its a bit like noticing what you buy- like buying Nestles is supporting the killing of 3rd world babies because of Nestle's practices there, but if you never look that bit deeper, or come across the information, you just dont know. I would rather know that not know, even if I make an informed choice to still read the book.

[Bayt ul-Hikmah]

If you do chose a book with offensive terms, how much do you edit as you read aloud? I'm currently reading Peter Pan aloud and Native Americans are called redskins. They are stereotyped as savage warriors out for scalps. Of course, this is in Neverland right up against pirates, fairies, mermaids, etc and is hardly a realistic story, but still this aspect troubles me.

 

What to do?

[JudyJudyJudy]

Thanks for the suggestions! I'll read them and see what I think of them. :)

 

 

If you do chose a book with offensive terms, how much do you edit as you read aloud?

I don't edit. I use it as a teaching opportunity. I try to explain why the negative stereotypes were used during that time period and why such stereotypes should not be used. I don't think we should try to change history and pretend that everything was hunky-dory back in the day, and I don't think that great books should be avoided simply because words were used that we now see as offensive. (I really dislike classics that have been changed to make them politically correct.)

[kimmyandgracie]

If you would find this helpful, here is a list of books suggested that people avoid, because of the stereotypes, and/or bigotries, and/or plain inaccuracies prominent in the texts: http://www.oyate.org/books-to-avoid/index.html

 

A number of books popular among homeschoolers appear on this list. Each title links to an essay analyzing the work's defects.

 

I think this is a valuable resource. If any board members with personal knowledge of the subject notice this post, and care to weigh in, I know that I would value their input !

Wow! I looked on the list linked here and skimmed some of the essays. It sure gives a lot of food for thought. Very helpful to see another perspective on these books.

[JudyJudyJudy]

If you would find this helpful, here is a list of books suggested that people avoid, because of the stereotypes, and/or bigotries, and/or plain inaccuracies prominent in the texts: http://www.oyate.org/books-to-avoid/index.html

 

A number of books popular among homeschoolers appear on this list. Each title links to an essay analyzing the work's defects.

 

I think this is a valuable resource. If any board members with personal knowledge of the subject notice this post, and care to weigh in, I know that I would value their input !

While I don't agree that some of these books should be avoided, I do like the books that are recommended. I think it's wonderful to provide a different perspective than is generally taught. I'm especially interested in reading 1621: A New Look at Thanksgiving. I put that book and some of the others on the list to get from my library. However, I think it would be just as bad to only read books from the Native American perspective as it is to read only books from the "white man's" perspective. I don't think anyone has ever considered the Little House series to be some perfect version of history.

Edited June 28, 2009 by JudyJudyJudy

[stripe]

Its a bit like noticing what you buy- like buying Nestles is supporting the killing of 3rd world babies because of Nestle's practices there, but if you never look that bit deeper, or come across the information, you just dont know. I would rather know that not know, even if I make an informed choice to still read the book.

I don't think it's really hidden information, though, in some of the books. Read the end of Nesbit's Five Children and It (a book not on Oyate's list, mind you), and see what you think. I was merrily reading this to my son, when, one night, he fell asleep as we were about 3/4 of the way through the book, so I read ahead. I learned my lesson when I got to Chapter 10: Scalps.

 

I think Oyate has two main objections to books about Native Americans, and unfortunately their list puts both groups together:

* books that are very disrectful, as they perceive it, showing Native Americans as monolithic and evil/wild/violent

* books that may lack that tone completely but portray NA culture in a completely inaccurate way, confusing tribes, and romanticizing the cultures so that it becomes uninformative (see Brother Eagle, Sister Sky discussion on this -- historically inaccurate, inappropriate drawings, and implies NAs are some distant, now extinct group)

 

 

HOWEVER, it would be my hope that in this thread we might be able to share any other books that might be appropriate about early American history and about Native Americans in general, for those of us who are concerned with reading racist sorts of books to our children, and would like to have minimal "adaptations" required. We have had discussions about racist language on this board (to use, to not use, to edit, to not edit, to supplement, etc), and I think it is a really excellent thing to consider, but more than that, we need good resources, and, as there are so many, I for one would like to know about them.

 

(Incidentally, I've started threads before about other history topics in order to find resources that are not mired in racist language or outlook, so this is an important discussion for me.)

[Orthodox6]

Hi, Judy ! I don't avoid all of these books just because they appear on the Oyate "avoid" list. Rather, I find their analyses helpful in setting a text into a broader context. Similarly, I would find helpful observations on children's literature [generally, older works] that takes for granted stereotypes and wrong attitudes toward other groups of people, such as Black Americans, Orientals, Eastern Europeans, individuals with physical limitations, etc. (There are plenty such children's books.)

 

I found the Oyate website good because it forces me to rethink which issues or points I have internalized (without effort) and taken for granted, rather than have thought through.

 

I did not share the resource as a platform for throwing out books on our shelves ! :)

 

While I don't agree that some of these books should be avoided, I do like the books that are recommended. I think it's wonderful to provide a different perspective than is generally taught. I'm especially interested in reading 1621: A New Look at Thanksgiving. I put that book and some of the others on the list to get from my library. However, I think it would be just as bad to only read books from the Native American perspective as it is to read only books from the "white man's" perspective. I don't think anyone has ever considered the Little House series to be some perfect version of history.

[Orthodox6]

Stripe, I guess I took your thread in a direction you did not intend for it to go. But I'm not sure. I'm studying your last post, and am a tad confused as to whether you would have preferred I not link the Oyate information. (Your boldface font made me think that I was off-track.) At any rate, I'm off for choir warm-up now, so am not writing clearly.

[stripe]

No, no, I was just trying to draw attention as my post got so long!

 

I was delighted to get more contributions to my unofficial list of books to look at; I had seen the Oyate site but not recently. I think the Oyate website is good for pointing out, say, inaccuracies in depictions that we ourselves may not know due to being not educated about Native culture/history, or having been educated by such volumes.

 

I would love to see more suggestions of good books, that was all I was saying.

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

If you do chose a book with offensive terms, how much do you edit as you read aloud? I'm currently reading Peter Pan aloud and Native Americans are called redskins.

 

How interesting that I was just reading this section of The Real Book About Indians again last night.

 

From page 13: "Sometimes people call Indians "redskins," too. This name comes from another mistake. Red was a favorite color the Indians used when they painted their bodies for ceremonies, or for protection against the sun, or to bring good luck in war. Probably the early Spanish sailors told tall tales of the strange new race they had seen in America, and they spoke of red-skinned people when they should have called them copper-colored, or brown."

 

In the previous paragraph, he explained why the term Indians is used at all. The more I read this book, the more I like it. The author tells a few stories of famous Native Americans and then tells some stories about the lives of fictitious people from different tribes. This is a treasure for me, as I was specifically looking for a narrative resource to use in our American history study that establishes that Native Americans had a rich and vast history long before the first explorer ever arrived. My problem is that I have no internal knowledge on which to base an assessment of truth or fiction, you know? I'm happy enough at this point to have found something that seems to look at things through the perspective of Native Americans and tells stories about their history that do not revolve around their relations with explorers and colonists. I want the stories of the thousands of years prior. We'll get to the other stuff, of course, but this is what I wanted to start with.

 

They are stereotyped as savage warriors out for scalps. Of course, this is in Neverland right up against pirates, fairies, mermaids, etc and is hardly a realistic story, but still this aspect troubles me.

 

What to do?

 

You know, my opinion is evolving on this. Six months ago, I would have said I didn't even want my kids (at their young ages) to hear those terms and that I would deal with conversations when they hit logic stage. However, I'm feeling more and more that my older kids are capable of understanding perspective. The example from Peter Pan is a stereotype that stems from someone's perspective. So then I would talk to them about perspective...and probably caricature.

[Mama Lynx]

If you do chose a book with offensive terms, how much do you edit as you read aloud? I'm currently reading Peter Pan aloud and Native Americans are called redskins. They are stereotyped as savage warriors out for scalps. Of course, this is in Neverland right up against pirates, fairies, mermaids, etc and is hardly a realistic story, but still this aspect troubles me.

 

What to do?

 

I read the book straight out, and then discuss those issues with the kids.

 

The only reason I might ever edit on the fly is if I'm reading to my young kids, and it's a small part of the book, and if we don't need to be getting sidetracked right then. We did not edit out references in Little House - in fact, I thought it was pretty important for us to look at and talk about their experiences and Ma's prejudice, in particular. There's far too much you'd have to edit in Peter Pan, so that is not a book I'd read aloud unless I was prepared to have the discussions.

 

But i don't see this as a difficult issue. When the books display a bias or a prejudice, or inaccurate information, we just talk about it.

[Lovedtodeath]

Some Indian tribes were very war-like and did take scalps, torure prisoners and the like. I am not going to leave that out in order to be PC. Not all of them were that way, and they weren't necessarily doing those things all of the time, of course, but it did happen. So we will learn that when I feel comfortable teaching about other atrocious war acts.

[stripe]

Okay, after consulting "Our Family, Our Friends, Our World: An Annotated Guide to Significant Multicultural Books for Children and Teenagers" by Lyn Miller-Lachman, I have these to ask about -- has anyone seen them?

 

* Indian Chiefs by Russell Freedman, Newbery Award winner, 1987

* The People Shall Continue, Simon Ortiz, 1988 (out of print)

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

Some Indian tribes were very war-like and did take scalps, torure prisoners and the like. I am not going to leave that out in order to be PC. Not all of them were that way, and they weren't necessarily doing those things all of the time, of course, but it did happen. So we will learn that when I feel comfortable teaching about other atrocious war acts.

 

True and I agree. The problem is finding balance in books. The truth. That's hard to find. Most books seem to be so skewed by a Western perspective that the overall portrait of Native Americans becomes a one-dimensional image of all people in all tribes being savage. As usual, the truth is more nuanced than that.

Edited June 28, 2009 by Alte Veste Academy

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

* Indian Chiefs by Russell Freedman, Newbery Award winner, 1987

 

How funny. I have four books by Russell Freedman in my library bag, including Buffalo Hunt. My library has Indian Chiefs but I was maxed out on that call number and figured the rest of my RF books would help me figure out his overall style. To me, his style is respectful, factual and interesting but not so much a storytelling style as facts presented in an interesting way. He seems to be impartial, although I admit I haven't read through the book in full yet. I would liken his style to Edward Tunis somewhat, if that helps. I will likely use his books when my kids are older. For now, I'm very happy with the Real Book and lots of picture books. For the younger set, I love The First Strawberries by Joseph Bruchac so much that I bought it for the kids. It's a Cherokee legend and just lovely. It made me want to look much more into Bruchac's picture books.

Edited June 28, 2009 by Alte Veste Academy

[Mama Lynx]

Some Indian tribes were very war-like and did take scalps, torure prisoners and the like. I am not going to leave that out in order to be PC. Not all of them were that way, and they weren't necessarily doing those things all of the time, of course, but it did happen. So we will learn that when I feel comfortable teaching about other atrocious war acts.

 

Right. Going too far in the opposite direction doesn't serve history, either.

[Guest Alte Veste Academy]

If you would find this helpful, here is a list of books suggested that people avoid, because of the stereotypes, and/or bigotries, and/or plain inaccuracies prominent in the texts: http://www.oyate.org/books-to-avoid/index.html

 

I think this is a valuable resource.

 

This is an interesting and informative list. What I find just as valuable is the treasure trove of books from their catalog which they do recommend! Good stuff and I feel safe (ignorant as I am) to select from these resources.

[EmilyK]

OK, this isn't a book, but just bought the DVDs of We Shall Remain for my husband for Father's Day. My 10 year old history and I had watched a bit on PBS and thought my husband would like it (he's very interested in Native issues). Haven't seen enough to recommend ages, but from what I saw was very well done. If not reshown on PBS, may be available at libraries.

[coffeefreak]

Thanks for the suggestions! I'll read them and see what I think of them. :)

 

 

 

I don't edit. I use it as a teaching opportunity. I try to explain why the negative stereotypes were used during that time period and why such stereotypes should not be used. I don't think we should try to change history and pretend that everything was hunky-dory back in the day, and I don't think that great books should be avoided simply because words were used that we now see as offensive. (I really dislike classics that have been changed to make them politically correct.)

 

:iagree:

[JudyJudyJudy]

Hi, Judy ! I don't avoid all of these books just because they appear on the Oyate "avoid" list. Rather, I find their analyses helpful in setting a text into a broader context. Similarly, I would find helpful observations on children's literature [generally, older works] that takes for granted stereotypes and wrong attitudes toward other groups of people, such as Black Americans, Orientals, Eastern Europeans, individuals with physical limitations, etc. (There are plenty such children's books.)

 

I found the Oyate website good because it forces me to rethink which issues or points I have internalized (without effort) and taken for granted, rather than have thought through.

 

I did not share the resource as a platform for throwing out books on our shelves ! :)

That makes sense. :) As I said, I put some of the books from the site on our reading list. I was pleasantly surprised to see that our library has a number of them.

[jg_puppy]

I feel this holds for all ethnic groups and nationalities -- anything that reduces a person or a group to a cartoonish image (be it positive or negative, from "inscrutable" to "savage") is not a very interesting or accurate resource. I am not unusually interested in Native American issues, but I have been deeply unhappy with many of the old history resources I've seen that begin with dreadfully negative depictions of them as well as others, so that knocks them off my list.

 

I think those leveled readers on Oyate's site look cute, but wow! so expensive.

 

What are you using for history? I love the narrative writing style of many old history books, but I just don't feel comfortable with most of them because of the descriptions of Native Americans. I would love to find a more balanced approach.

 

Jan

[stripe]

I'm not really doing anything formal for history at present, due to my children's age -- I'm in the research stage. :) I am uncomfortable with the way almost every group is described in the old books.