Hmm, that's a different perspective I hadn't thought of. I always thought parks were better since they could say hi, stand for a few minutes talking about whatever, then inevitably a game of tag starts and the kids can run wherever and don't have to interact but she gets to "spend time" with them for a while. Whereas with a computer there is just awkward staring at each other after 3 or 4 minutes, but she is the type of person to insist she gets the full time allotted, or will start asking and saying the things we are actively avoiding her for. Thanks, that does give me more food for thought.

I won't open the door up to Skype or FT for her. That will not be an option even if she lives on another continent, at least as things are currently. The kids do not want to see her because we lived with her for a year and they got to know her past a few hours at a park.

The conflict comes in me that she's moving, so while we have effectively cut off, it's been framed as "taking a break". And if she is moving out of state, this could be the last opportunity for her to see kids for years (because we won't have funds for a trip regardless of a pandemic, for at least 3 years, and I wouldn't spend more than $25 to see her anyway). I do still feel obligatory pressure of "grandmothers love their grandchildren," and she does love them, I think...she just isn't someone that should have any influence whatsoever on developing minds. Then again, maybe she's just moving to Phoenix or something. I don't have enough information. Maybe I should reply with, "Glad to hear you found some place, where are you moving?" to better gauge if this is a true last chance or something less dramatic. And I'm trying to judge if I'm letting my own dislike of the idea of a visit color my risk assessment, and if Covid IS a valid excuse in this situation or if I am stretching it too thin.

Okay, quick background: We are in AZ. Our numbers are crazy. I had let the kids visit my parents twice over May-June when the state opened and before the numbers started to rise again. Otherwise they have been at home only. My husband is higher risk and he has been out of the house 1 time only (dr appt) since February. So, we are taking this seriously. We are currently "taking a break" from his family. I got a text from his mom this morning, saying, "I am moving away. Temporarily living in same-town-as-Moonhawk's-parents. Can I visit kids at Moonhawk-parents house?" Now, seeing them at my parents house is completely out for a variety of reasons. But, seeing her at all? This is the second time since February that she has told me she is moving away. The first time "didn't pan out" and she didn't see the kids. While I tentatively trust she is telling the truth, I don't know if "moving away" means at the end of the year or what. Background on her: She is a doctor. I do not say this with malice, but I've heard 2 other doctors refer to her (in front of me, a known DIL) as "a quack." She believes, based on email forwards and some FB posts I've seen, that Covid is a hoax or immensely blown out of proportion. She is the person who forwarded me the Plandemic video, for example. So, I know she may be in higher risk situations if she is still working (idk if she is), and I don't know if she is taking precautions seriously. We did live with her for a year (summer 2018-summer 2019). The kids have not asked to see her once since the day we moved out. How do I respond to this? (I am not involving DH, by previous agreement.) My current thoughts: 1. Telling her we have not been visiting anyone due to the virus. 2. Telling her we may be open to meeting at a park near her for an hour or two, using social distancing and masks. 3. Asking what current precautions she is taking and what activities she has been doing recently. What am I missing? Do I just say 1 and 3 and then see how she responds before suggesting a park? I know I sound heartless. Please understand there is very, very good reason that we cut off and why I won't even bring it up to DH.

Update: Stuff on the door needed to be either thrown out or cooked tonight, just depending on what part of the door. So I will be snacking on bacon tonight. Don't know what to think about the chicken stock. ~2 bacon packs left, 15 cups of chicken stock. 4 meals past saving. Front layer of food needs to be eaten within 24-48 hours probably. All still cold but completely thawed except for a couple on the bottom of the piles. Unfortunately due to how things were currently being rotated/eaten, this is the category for majority of the packs, 27 packs = ~14 meals Back layer is partially still frozen. But, all have squish on exposed areas and in for a couple inches. So I'll keep those but will probably just eat those over the next couple weeks instead of next couple months so I can just start over from scratch with uncompromised food and clean out the freezer before restocking. ~10 meals. This is workable.

Yeah, I didn't know until a couple days ago that freezer alarms existed until one of the freezer threads mentioned it. I thought how cool, I should totally get one. LOL. Turns out it was more of a warning or omen than just a cool idea. In 10 minutes I'll take a sharpie out there and marking things as salvage or not. We'll see how bad it is. I only did a cursory check before I decided to just close it up and take a moment. And order a freezer alarm. lol Ah well. Worse things have happened to better people.

The chicken stocks are completely liquid. Anything to the front of the freezer (it's a stand up, not a chest) has at least completely squishy sides, some are still slightly frozen cores but easy bend/break without effort. Things in the back seem to be partially frozen but it's hit or miss. Nothing is fully frozen. The bacon on the door is floppy. Everything is cold to the touch but it's 100 degrees today, so basically anything not hot is cold to the touch, lol. (edit: I'm trying to say: I can't gauge if it's "fridge cold" or not. Just...vaguely cold.) I've closed the door. My initial reaction is today, tomorrow, and maybe Monday are all freezer packs, all meals. Most of my meals were meat-based (had been focusing on that intentionally since meat less reliable to find and more expensive), and since I don't know exactly how long it was open, other than at least overnight and probably until 3pm today, in 100+ weather, I'm not feeling very risky.

It had 24+ fully ready dinners. Plus vegetables and chicken stock. That is all.

This one is original!

One time my then 4yoDD and 2yoDS were visiting my parents. It was lunch time. My parents put food down on the table, each kid with identical plates. Prayer, etc. All normal. But then when it came to the first bite, my DD was looking skeptically at her plate. 2yo picks up whatever it is and just as he's bringing it to his mouth, she yells and lunges at him, "DON'T DO IT TOMMY!!!" as if it was poisoned. He immediately dropped the food. They both pushed away their plates and refused to eat no matter what. My parents were so ticked but I secretly thought it was funny a) how concerned she was for him and b) he followed her instructions without thought. So the knife cuts both ways, lol.

No yeast anywhere still. I'm down to my last tablespoons. No bread flour still. And, our local Safeway bakery has suddenly stopped baking: no made on premises baked goods at all for the past weeks. The shelves for the branded breads looks ok, but the 3 displays for in-store cakes, cookies, breads, etc., is bare.

Okay, I am very cautious right now, in AZ, so similar situation to you. Yesterday maybe I would be okay with it. This is why today I'm not: I am letting my kids play with one neighbor friend, or was, until I found out their family's "not going anywhere" "wearing masks" "staying away from everything" includes unmasked farmers markets, a kid on a track team also unmasked, and using the local senior center for internet unmasked. I found out last night when the kids came in and mentioned things in passing. They are only playing outside, which is lower risk, but I'm a little ticked right now. So, even if I trust the family, Idk if I would trust the grandma to be telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth about her own approach. UNLESS she was also a paranoid type. But even just a "oh yeah, I take all the precautions" response would be a no from me since I'm finding so many people say a general answer that is not true in specifics. They may even be thinking they are being accurate because at the store they are masked, and a quick "oh we aren't going anywhere" is true in relation to the fact they used to go 2 places a day everyday.

Hmm, I'm sorry to hear that. Apparently my information is AZ -based: https://www.12news.com/article/news/verify/verify-contrary-to-social-media-claims-theres-no-evidence-arizona-is-double-counting-positive-tests-for-coronavirus/75-fbf8ad46-a2a8-4565-aa5f-0b313978bd7b " Arizona Health Services Director Dr. Cara Christ refuted the claim of double-counting at a news conference June 25. “We are aware the people will get multiple tests,” she said. “We work very carefully to de-duplicate. Each case is a unique individual.”

The short answer is all tests for one person counts only once. So if you test positive 15 times you are only counted in the statistics once. I will look for a source but I've seen it stated on this board (I think) and a few other places.

Either "Yes", or The alternate thing it might possibly be saying is the BDSM/otherwise atypical practice folks are not so niche. From a certain point of view. Just spitballing here. Thought exercises really. Whew, I need to start taking the stairs more. edit: there is the other alternate answer that "No, it's geared exactly to us, because it is great clickbait and can start arguments about Covid AND sex at the same time. Which is great revenue."

Let them clutch their pearls, I'm grabbing my popcorn! Keep it going guys! I'll add fuel to the fire: "Fuzzy cuffs are easier to talk about with family than Covid." Proof: conversations with my family.

I don't think we are disagreeing (my original post was a clarification, I didn't have an opinion at that point). I agree there wasn't a "need" to reference the extreme sexual examples, but it may be helpful to some who have been trying to figure out if it's okay/how to talk about masks with people they are going to see soon. It's true, if you aren't comfortable doing X, don't do it. The article is simply advocating that you talk about X beforehand so that your plans aren't ruined down the line when it becomes clear others have different expectations.

LOL I just finished reading it and there are some gems for sure. ""I wish I had more polyamorous friends to help me navigate that situation," says Park, the physician and STI expert." It does feel a bit of a stretch, but people see parallels with what they do all the time. Give me 2 minutes and I can link the coronavirus and social distancing to similarities in the music industry or the type industry, I'm sure. The basic takeaway from the article though is sound: as we start to go out and interact with more people, we need to be clear if we have any musts or must-nots while we are interacting. I will not interact with someone who refuses to mask and who has been going out and about without any "protection" and to multiple places without need. By knowing my "boundaries" and being able to communicate it clearly, it makes it easier to know "do what with who." I guess if you are uncomfortable with the analogy it seems ridiculous, but I don't see anything in the actual article that was actually ridiculous. No safe words, which was slightly disappointing. (lol...)

... I think it is also a courtesy to ask if the host is comfortable with them, a possible carrier, using their bathroom and touching things in said bathroom. It's not just the guest at risk, it is also the host. By simply asking of time both know what's going on before they get there. And I don't think anyone is saying that the host possibly responding "no, I ran our of clorox wipes yesterday" would be a risky response. Again, I haven't read the article, but I don't see what part of what's being discussed in the thread is controversial or difficult. Maybe the article wants you to lay out "safe words" and definitions of "bases" and that's what is generating this type of response?, but again the example in the thread didn't seem outlandish to me.

I think the risk being referred to is how clean the bathroom is, and the walkway to get there. Since our private bathrooms are private, we may not be following the CDC guidelines in terms of cleanliness to prevent spread (slight hyperbole here, I am not saying that you need to). By giving the host advance notice that bathroom use may be requested, they were able to accommodate in advance instead of spraying with Clorox as the guest sits in the living room, crossing their legs, thinking of dry desert places instead of tall beautiful waterfalls. Or the "riskier" option of just using the bathroom as is. (I don't have an opinion on the actual content since I haven't read the article yet)

So I'm following for the clear mask which would be very helpful in a couple situations I've found myself in. I've already recommended face shields in another thread, but here's the ones I'm using in case it's helpful: https://mypowis.com/blog/portfolio/myshield/ A face shield might be in your interest anyway if you are working with K'ers (like you said). I remember my mom as a school librarian during reading time (much as you describe on the ground in a circle) where inevitably someone would try to sit on her or use her skirt to wipe their nose or just plain run/fall into her because, you know, kids. Accidental contact with your face is kind of their specialty. For the air circulation, will you be able to have windows or doors open? I have no idea if air purifiers are any help with this type of situation. Good luck, many hugs in your journey with this!

Okay, I have to disclaim that I hate, hate, hate Beevis and Butthead. Totally cringe just looking at this pic. But...it was funny. So here we are, with me betraying my most dearly held principles, lol.

Looks safe to me!