Gosh, I am really having a hard time putting into words how I feel on this topic. I think that it might be difficult for "those who believe in something other than Christianity" to understand this concept without judging it. Christians are called to fulfill the "Great Commission" which is to "Go and make disciples of all nations". It is our duty (and our privilege) as Christians to spread the Gospel, not just something we feel like we should do. It looks different in everyone's life as some might be called to be a missionary and others might just share their faith with neighbors, etc. Yes, we should treat EVERYONE with love and respect. Everyone from the checkout girl to your neighbor to the ladies on this board. We should help those in need regardless of their beliefs. We should reach out in love to anyone and everyone. And I completely respect those who do NOT want to be proselytized or seen as a conversion opportunity. I have a co-worker who has said "I know my options so I don't need to be witnessed to." I can appreciate that. Although we are called to witness to all that doesn't mean everyone is going to accept our viewpoint. I don't like Christian bounty hunters.:D I don't have a problem being involved in certain activities with "those who believe in something other than Christianity". My kids are in a secular karate class, I work all day in a secular setting as does my dh, etc. However, there is a difference between being kind, loving and respectful to everyone, and cultivating deep, long-lasting friendships with those of a faith other than Christianity. That's where those verses quoted by a PP come in. My brother has this saying, "We are the average of the 5 people closest to us". Face it, whoever is a big part of my life, like my best friends, are going to have an impact in my life. So those people need to be similar in their belief systems. If you are someone who is unsure of your belief and is interested in learning about Christ, even if you don't convert, it is easier to be friends with you as I can share my faith openly which is who I am, not just something I believe. But if you are someone who has told me that you have no interest in the possibility ever, I will still be friendly and respectful but I doubt we will be close, personal friends. This sounds terrible...I'm not a terrible person, honestly. I still don't know if I am explaining this right and I am not trying to offend. Those verses quoted about "lawless" do not mean lawless as in the laws of the land but the laws of God. If you do not believe the same as I do about sin then it will be difficult for to describe how insipid sin is and how easily it can creep into your life even under the guise of an innocent friendship. And "unwise" refers to that fact that the Bible tells us that belief in God is the foundation of wisdom, not that you are stupid. So the whole problem is one of presupposition. We presuppose that the Bible is true and everything else stems from there. If you don't believe that then it might be difficult to understand why we act the way we do and why it is easy to care about someone who believes differently but it is not easy to be close friends with them. I am probably just making this worse but hopefully you all understand my intent. :leaving:

No, we are shipping a crate so I plan to buy in bulk. OK, so Degree, Secret, and Clinical Strength (which I had never heard of) are the best options. I assume all in the clear version? I actually have always used spray deoderant (Soft and Dri) but it may be time for a switch.

That is interesting to hear because I have always felt that the college requirement that we have two years of all these "prerequisite" classes was a waste of time and just a way for them to take my money. Then I only get two years of concentrating on my chosen field before I have to practice it out in the real world?

Would it help if I told you that in 1982 I told my teacher I wanted to be a "Solid Gold Dancer" when I grow up? Come on, someone tell me they remember that TV show! :D

I just ordered those! And I am WAY jealous that you met Tackett. He seems like such an intelligent and God-honoring man.

That's what I have heard which is why I plan on stocking up now. :D

deoderant. :D So it is HOT in Malaysia. And HUMID. What is the best deoderant for women as I will be sweating a lot?

Pretty much, yes. You could go to a school board meeting and complain but it generally doesn't get you anywhere. If you ran for school board AND you had other friends on the board so that you had a majority vote in all decisions, you could make some changes. But other than that, parents have very little power.

That is so funny because I wish they were longer! :D It seems I am so wrapped up in the info and then it's over. It would be nice if there were some females but thankfully, I really like all the experts they have on there especially Zacharias!

Not really. They should, since that is where their money comes from. But they don't. They answer to their state department of education which in turn answers to the USDE. And it is all about money.

I use my first name and my maiden name and my married name.

WHAT??? Are you trying to tell me something? If there is no coffee in Malaysia then the deal is OFF.

It is about priorities and having a certain "mind-set". My dh and I have ALWAYS both worked full-time AND we have always homeschooled our kids and taken them to church and they have sports and music lessons and I take grad-school classes, etc. etc. Is life hectic? Sure. But nothing is more important than raising my children well. As for mind-set...that is really the biggest problem in the low-income districts. The apathy in the parents and students is STAGGERING. Even the very few students that I was able to pull out of the situation and get them into a college were shunned by their friends and families...like they were "trying to be something they're not." In fact, a couple of kids that were able to get academic scholarships were told by their parents that "they need to stop trying to act white." It was very discouraging to watch them get pregnant at 15 yo, or end up in jail, or drop out. And the saddest part is that nobody was shocked by it. :banghead:

Honestly? I don't know that you can. That's why I am a big fan of homeschooling. Those parents are some of the most motivated and involved parents I've ever met. Instead of hasseling homeschool parents, why isn't the PS system grateful that at least a certain percent of the population actually cares enough about their child's education to take it on themselves? They need to spend less time trying to take away homeschooling rights and devote all their energy to the things they can control and that need thier attention. As far as schools are concerned, the first thing they should do is eliminate the NEA. Unions do nothing but protect lazy people. Tenure should be harder to get and NOT irreversible. Teachers should be paid more AND there should be higher educational requirements to become a teacher. It should be more like the process of becoming a doctor or lawyer but should also pay as much. Classes have to be smaller. Schools have to be smaller. And grades should be grouped differently (k-2 in a building, 3-5 in another, 6-8 in another, 9-10 in another, 11-12 in another...although my favorite idea is letting children attend classes according to their demonstrated ability in that subject and NOT according to their age!). The school year should be spread out more evenly (I love the idea of 9 weeks on, 3 weeks off). There should be ZERO fluff classes. All students should have volunteer work/community service/internship opportunities in their last years of high school. Those are just a FEW things that I think should change. But I am not in charge...YET. :D

LOVED IT so much that I went to a training to become a leader for it and got my own copy of the DVDs. It is awesome!!!

Sorry...I thought my rant was over but it's not. I deal a lot with test score data. I was looking at the most recent scores, comparing them with other districts, etc. And I started thinking about a child's educational experience as a pie chart. How much does each thing that goes into a child's education account for on this pie chart? The district I work in is blue collar and/or unemployed. We have about 60-70% poverty with our students. Our population is about 50/50 caucasian/african american. Our high school test scores are DISMAL and our dropout rate is about 20-25%. About 15 miles from here is another district. Upper middle class, mostly white, poverty rate is nearly 0%, parents are college educated, about 95% of the students go on to a 4 year college. Their test scores are through the roof. So my co-workers and I were talking about what makes the biggest difference between these two districts? -is it the nicer buildings/better technology/newer books? If we moved all of our kids to their district to use their buildings/technology/books would the test scores suddenly go way up? It might help but not a lot. -is it the teacher quality? If we switched staffs would the test scores suddenly go way up? It might help but not a lot. - is it the water? What is it that makes the kids in district B score so much better than district A (and we are talking more than 50% better not just a small gap). What is the biggest piece of the educational pie? We decided it was a combination of parenting and a small part of socioeconomics. The students in district B aren't necessarily "born" smarter. Shiny new buildings doesn't make the smarter either. What makes them "smarter" is having parents who value education, who are a big part of their children's education, who expose their children to more opportunities and life experiences (usually because they have the funds to do so, hence the socioeconomic link). These kids go to French camp and take music lessons and travel abroad, etc. Getting a good education, going to college are things that are expected of them and they grow up knowing that. The kids in district A? Not so much. People don't expect too much out of them. We are lucky if we get 20% of the parents to come to conferences. These kids are at a disadvantage educationally speaking the moment they are born because their parents do not value education as much as other parents do. Their parents do not take an active role in their child's education. Now of course, there are the exceptions. The parents that want more for their kids and really push that, but these situations are far too few. And of all the things that public schools CAN control...parental involvement (or lack thereof) is NOT one of them. So going back to my pie chart, if parental involvement makes up, say, 60-70% of a child's education and the schools cannot control that, then the best the schools can do is improve 30-40% of a child's education and that is not enough. Parents are the key. OK, now my rant is over...I think. ;)

I've been thinking about this too. This kid cannot seem to concentrate on anything. Add to that all the excitement about our upcoming move and it makes for a long, frustrating school day! I've been thinking about paring back to the bare essentials until we move. Any advice?

I did the mouthguard thing but it didn't work. The only thing that has helped is...Paxil. Lowering my anxiety levels keeps me from clenching my teeth at night (and during the day) and relieves the TMJ symptoms.

I am SO GLAD to read this. My ds turns 11yo next month and just in the last couple of weeks it seems his brain has also been misplaced! Suddenly he daydreams constantly, is always tired (and has been taking afternoon naps again which he hasn't done since he was 4yo!), and it takes him eons to get through his math lesson even though he gets them all correct. It's like he is a totally different kid. Add to that the moodiness and a new found sense of the lack of "justice" in the world :confused: and it is like he is possessed or something. How long is this going to last???? :tongue_smilie:

I'll do it! This is a dream of mine. Of course, I probably wouldn't be popular with the politicians because my "symbol" would be the weedwhacker! :D I have worked in all levels of education for the last 15 years and one of the problems is that there is BIG money in school "reform". LOTS of people have jobs in school reform, write books about school reform, run workshops on school reform, etc. If I told you how much money our district spent on "professional development" for reforming our schools you would faint (but it is in the 7 digit range). If the schools were ever really "reformed" all those people would be out of work. I don't think the schools can be reformed. They need to be dismantled and remodeled. We need a nation-wide "do-over". :D I also did my master's thesis on the effects of the extended school day/ school year and all of the research shows that quality "time on task" gives far more gains than merely increasing "seat time" (and that was in 1996!). Having said that, we do school year-round with our kids and always have but it doesn't look the same all year round. I also don't feel that my highest educational goals for my kids are so they can compete with other nations. :rant:

Oh please do! And no t-shirts that say "HOTTIE" across the bosom (I saw this on a 7yo girl!).

No more coffee? Perish the thought! :svengo: I would have an IV of coffee if I could! :D

Thank you for all the wonderful advice!!! I wish I had some musical background :glare:. The violin suggestion is really more my idea than his :D. I just LOVE violin! But I love the ideas you ladies gave about letting him hear some of the music (maybe without telling him what the instruments are so he is not biased before he hears them!). They provide the instrument (thank goodness). And I am concerned about him getting into something that is really difficult to play since it would take more practice time and we are not willing to sacrifice his piano time. It is nice to hear what instruments are more difficult to play for that reason. Thanks!!!!

I never said you made that statement (I was just summarizing) and I was trying to be supportive of you. :confused:

Asta, I don't have a problem with the "kool-aid" phrase...it is used pretty commonly and I'm not very PC anyways. I do understand your need for secular homeschooling materials even though I don't use them very often. The demand has just not been there maybe until recently so perhaps in the near future it will be. I would feel the same way if I needed Christian materials and couldn't find any. As others have pointed out, more Christians actually DO teach their children about other points of view than not so I am sure they will all be fine when they go to college (Christian or secular). Your original question as to WHY people use religious materials has been answered and WHY aren't there many secular materials available has been answered as well (some more respectfully than others). We are all getting a little touchy about things (myself included) and when we do we start making this sweeping statements about people being "afraid" of secular matierials or "afraid" of Christian materials. If you are firmly grounded in your beliefs you have no reason to fear. I hope you are able to find what you are looking for just as I am grateful to have what I need for my kids. :grouphug: