OH MY GOSH!!!! I used Word Wealth in high school---LOVED IT!!! It is a great book. I don't know how much using the book helped with with my SAT scores as I love words and vocab anyways---but what a blast from the past seeing that book!! :tongue_smilie: Another suggestion for vocab is the IEW program Advanced Spelling and Vocabulary---one of the levels is specifically for SAT/ACT.

Unfortunately, this is what has been happening since the induction of 'compulsory education'. It's all about the indoctrination du jour. I can't believe how ridiculous textbooks are, though, that they have to fight over teaching basic facts of history. Yeah---I REALLY glad I can teach my kids ALL the facts no matter how un-PC, dirty, messy---but most importantly true--they are! ;)

All of the MC levels with the exception of the 12th Research Report one are the exact same writing assignments in CQLA----so you don't need to use both. I asked the same question at their website and this is what they told me. There might be another high school level that is different from what's in the CQLA---but right now all the MC levels are right out of it. So---in a nutshell---I was told that if your child, especially a high school student, needs grammar, dictation, spelling etc. use the CQLA. If they are fine on grammar, just get MC and then add a literature program to round it out. My thoughts are that you could just add the Easy Grammar Ultimate to keep grammar fresh and do the MC and Literature for a well rounded but not ALL DAY English program.

Well, my dd IS using the Music program for 7th this year---it's a college level book! And now that she is loving it, she wants to finish up the program next year. I notice that they are updating ALL of their lesson plans for ease of use and to follow the newer editions of books-great! So I probably will now order when the newer plans come out. Have you used the Critical Thinking books/plans? They now have samples of the Great Books guides and those look GREAT! Wow---but are there answers to go along with it? I am really undecided about Great Books. It sound wonderful, but my kids are really enjoying Sonlight. Now if those Study Guides have answers---then I just might sneak in a few Great Books to read and discuss! :D

Well, as far as them being German it's not surprising. Germany has always been militaristic and conformist. :glare: And my entire family is from Germany---but came to the US after ALL the hardship caused by ALL those years of wars and famines..........It's too bad Germany can't lighten up and learn from their own long, horrific history.

And don't forget American are THE MOST generous in giving to any and every cause around the world too. :D I guess all of our stuff comes in handy. I just want to add that trying to live up to the ideals set forth there are fine---but alas my husband and I just need to drink wine, waste time on the internet, watch TV, let our kids play video games, PLAY and buy stuff we don't really need sometimes!!! We balance that with lots of family time, lots of love in our family, lots of praying (even in the kitchen) and lots of Bible reading and attending mass, etc, teenagers that are thoughtful kind and generous---even though they do have too many clothes, cell phones and xboxes. Perhaps we are simply 'per warmers'---but alas---God knows our hearts and will judge us accordingly no matter what the outside package looks like. :tongue_smilie: BUT----I don't want to bash a schooling program that is obviously working well and a good fit for you and others here. Really! So I will just end with the comment that a program like that would be too rigid and not a good fit for my family and my kids. It's obviously working for some families and that is what counts.

I guess my family is suspect then, huh? :D I don't think it's the subjects, just the overbearing tone of how it is all presented. But if they use the 1885 not updated BC---isn't that considered PreVII? I notice no mention of the CCC.

I agree with the Points too 100%---just not the Holier than Thou 'Finger Pointing' method expounded on that page. I guess it doesn't surprise me, though, coming from a missionary family probably serving in a very poor country who would look at their American home and become disdainful and disgusted with our 'self created' problems. It's just a real turn off.

I guess what is bothering me is that I am sensing that Mr. Michael is Pre Vatican II Ultraconservative? The critical, negative light that is shed on American families---just the 'tone' he takes with comments like this: 4. Simplify Your Life You wouldn't have piles of laundry if you had a daily routine and stuck to it. Your children wouldn't need ten outfits and they wouldn't be randomly changed (and thrown into the hamper or on the floor) throughout the day. You wouldn't have piles of dishes and hours of food preparation if you simplified your diet. The hectic housewife is a product of her family's inordinate tastes and impractical schedule. You can simplify. 5. Serve the Poor Most American families are idle and invent problems for themselves. Scripture tells us, "You who have two tunics (shirts) give to him who has none, and you who have food do likewise." One of the causes of impiety and unhappiness is selfishness. Get out of your house and go help the poor, the elderly, etc.. They need clothing, food and help. You have it all. 2. Family Chapel You cannot meditate and pray in the middle of the kitchen. There needs to be a sacred (set apart for the Lord) space in the home where you can go for quiet prayer, read a devotional book, meditate before a crucifix, etc. Rather than devoting a room to the television or to extra beds, devote it prayer and worship. You have room. Nothing wrong with these ideas---but YOU HAVE ROOM? Really? MOST American families are idle and invent problems for themselves??? Really? If life is hectic it is because of my family's inordinate tastes and impracticle schedule??? Could this be any more ridiculous and offensive? And I can say that I know of no Catholic Churches, so far, that use the 'Original" 1885 Baltimore Catechism in its sole entirety. I think it's because of things like teaching our kids that even 'attending' a wedding in a Protestant church is a mortal sin and even if it was a child---the family should excommunicate them? Sorry---this is NOT Christian thinking. I won't teach my kids bigotry and uncharitable behavior like this. Ever. And our Parish Priest agrees. So I guess this is the tone I am picking up from this site---an old-fashioned sort of bigoted attitude about being Catholic and somehow 'we' are better than the rest of humankind. Well, especially with a True Classical Education under our belts. I do believe that this type of attitude is what fueled HUNDREDS of years of bloodbath wars throughout Europe. I'll take a more American Melting Pot kind, charitable, loving Christian attitude over this any day. ;)

I get what you are saying---really ;) But I am American, and this tone doesn't sit well with me----and so I can't bring myself to do any more reading/research about this particular program. Where are you ----in a general geographic sense :D----that this tone sounds like normal, charitable Catholicism to you? Classical sounds awesome---don't get me wrong. But the whole tone of THIS particular Classical program sounds like an attempt to create some sort of New Classical Master/Monster Race or something---ew. :tongue_smilie: As an American and most importantly a Catholic Christian---I simply cannot look down on my fellow Americans in this manner-------even if they studied Accounting and not Aristotle.....

That article is great! There was a time when Ivy League meant something important---no longer in my book. But I still can't stand the tone from LCAA---they take Classical to the extreme snobby end---at least that's the way it sounds on the website. And True Classical certainly isn't the only method of educating to avoid being part of that "General Population"----but apparently Mr. Michael has other thoughts on that. :glare: I find the tone strange especially for such a 'pious' missionary family at that. :confused:

I know this thread is older, but after reading the Requirements for Admission, it sounds more like Cult Training than academic training!! Can anyone say: Stuck Up and Egotistical?! This Mr. Michael sounds like he wants to mold any student in 'his' program to the values and habits of his own family instead of letting each family be who they are while using his program. This alone should be a warning: "Families must also commit to cultivating a spirit of sobriety and maturity among their children, rather than allowing the perpetual childishness that ruins American children. The Catholic Church teaches that the age of reason is normally around 7 years old--not 18, not 22. Children are considered morally accountable by the age of their first confession and this should be taken seriously. There is no excuse for inordinate play, entertainment, idleness, etc.. "Youth is the time for extraordinary toil." said the philosopher Plato--who knew a thing or two about true classical education. " We ARE Catholic, but I would never do this to my children! This program sounds set up to create large ego's if followed according to this philosophy! I don't like the Holier and Smarter Than the General Population Tone one bit! There is just something that smacks "Really Wrong" with this program :001_huh: I found this thread trying to find reviews on Angelicum Academy---which certainly has a MUCH different tone than this one....shudder....

I suggest taking a look at Meaningful Composition 8+. It is based on IEW style, but teaches the writing step-by-step and is written directly to the student. I just ordered it after looking at samples online and it seems that there is a lot more hand holding and specific, guided directions in this program than a regular IEW program. But if the Christian content in MC is not for you, then I also second IEW!

Why thank you friend!! :D FWIW---I am using the Ace with my non-science dd next year and after looking at Timberdoodle all day yesterday, i'm pretty sure I will use Bio101 to visually supplement. But I think I told you this already, huh? :001_huh:

Hey---you're opinion counts! :001_smile: And honestly, if you say your kids aren't science whizzes and they do well in Apologia----sounds like they're doing better than you think! My son LOVES science, and really does well and grasps concepts---but he bombed pretty much every single Apologia General test. Go figure :tongue_smilie:

I wasn't pouncing--sorry that it appeared that way! :001_huh: I just truly disagree that Apologia is easy----it was very challenging for my dd, who is a good student. Reading through it myself, I found the material challenging myself because of the detail that is gone into. I also have the Ace Biology Paces---and trust me---WAAY easier, but also adequate. Just not as deep and technical as Apologia. If you are talking about the other 'easy Biology' thread---sorry. I haven't been to that one so I don't know what else you and your dh have evaluated. ;)

Where is your son's class---a high school, CC---or is this a group of homeschoolers??:001_huh: I guess how homeschool kids act outside of home depends on what is expected of them. If this is a local high school---typical. If it is a CC---I guess I would be surprised since at that level you pay for your education and aren't just handed it. If it is a homeschool co-op type thing, I would quit and ask for some of my money back and let the teacher know why. I would be frustrated too!

I disagree. Apologia is pretty rigorous---though granted probably not very WTM rigorous. The books may be 'easy' to read through, but the content is challenging. Have you looked at Paradigm Accelerated Curriculum's Biology course? Generally, the PAC materials cover all the bases but truly are a lot easier than Apologia. Power Basics? Standard Deviants? Biology 101?

This is my biggest pet peeve with BJU---it's GREAT, it's THOROUGH---but just TOO much! I think Govt with Notgrass will be the better choice for my kids, but BJU's Economics is newly upgraded, and Notgrass Econ is new too---decisions, decisions! :confused: Thanks for the replies so far. ;)

It all depends on your child and what you expect, I guess. I personally think the notebooking and detailed lab write ups can be made more advanced without having to do a rigorous program like BJU or Abeka. The books that make up the spines for the programs have plenty of info and details. Some kids retain more with this Charlotte Mason/Classical style that typical textbook learning styles. And the Chem III is for up to 9th, although obviously some kids can do it earlier. My son did Chem II in 6th grade and it was quite appropriate.

I just went to the Noeo site and looked at samples. Of course, I am no expert, but it looks appropriate for a 7th grader to me---meaning I would use it. simply requiring more detailed notebooking and sketches, I think, can make it 7th grade.

The Chem II from Noeo is not too babyish at all! Noeo says the program is for 9th grade? Even the Chem II has books that are definitely jr high level. And the chemistry set that comes with the level III program is really fun! :D

I am starting to research these subjects for next year, and I really want to choose between the 2. I know they are both good and thorough, but looking at CBD at many, many page samples, it just looks like BJU is more thorough and has more thought provoking questions. Has anyone used these programs and have advice about them? They both seem to have the same conservative Christian slant?

Yes--Middle school is a different story. My recommendations would be Rainbow Science or Noeo---not too rigorous and fun! :001_smile:

Paradigm Accelerated Curriculum! Great for non-math, non-science kids----2 high school credits too. It's called Integrated Chemistry and Physics---all the precepts and concepts and history of physics and chem---without the math.