I also think it would be helpful to have video clips of both types of classes available. Better yet, a short clip of each instructor.

It's unfortunate this has come to the attention of some of us right at the cut-off of preregistration. Better than after class starts, though! Looking forward to hearing the Academy's thoughts...

Obviously I don't know all the ins and outs of your personalities and lives, but to quickly address the topic of control... You mentioned you would probably lose some control. This may be true and is something worth exploring thoroughly. On balance, however, it appears you are actually using some leverage to increase your ds's control. Sometimes we need to give up control over minor, pesky areas in order to gain control in a larger sense. Just my $0.02. :)

Interesting. It looks like Mr. Hummel is also teaching a geometry class.

It might be even better if an additional teacher and section were added. (Probably too late for the upcoming year.) If a teacher feels strongly about a method of teaching, requesting they alter it might not produce a positive change. Better to find a teacher that believes and excels in the teaching model you're hoping to find. Now, if only I knew where to find that teacher...

Have you found another class for your son? I'm wondering if there are other options I've missed. I'm feeling disappointed as well.

Nice try, but having an engineering degree is not considered an acceptable excuse for skipping your turn facilitating the class... :glare: :toetap05: :lol: Thanks for the link!

Hmmm...I wonder how many degrees we have among us? (Just a rhetorical question! No need to post your educational achievements!) I was just thinking we could get our kids together on Skype and take turns facilitating writing discussions! It would save on tuition! (I'm totally joking! ;) )

Sorry for muddling things. I'm discussing Rhetoric for a 9th grader. The issue is not maturity. Hmmm.... well maybe it is. The maturity level will most likely not be the same across the board, and this may lessen or negate the benefits some students receive from the workshop model.

This is exactly how I am envisioning it. :) The students and instructor critique the writing in class, then move on to the next assignment. No written feedback from the instructor, no revisions, and thus no feedback on the revisions at all - not even in class. I was rather hoping for a teacher lecturing and facilitating discussions on great works - not other students' writing. Personally I would rather my daughter not spend precious time reading and discussing other students' writing. It's just not our goal for a writing class. I would instead hope to see the students being exposed to and discussing various techniques, noticing them in other works, and considering how to apply them to their own writing. I was also hoping for detailed written personal feedback.

I wish there was a clear way to know which classes use the workshop model. From the posts, it seems Mr. Hummel and Ms. Brian follow this model. Please, correct me if I am mistaken! Oh, how I would love to be mistaken!!

If this is the case, perhaps they are trying to do too much, too soon. If the instructors are dropping feedback in favor of adding more sections or courses, there seems to be a disconnect somewhere. Some students will quickly notice the work is just discussed a bit in class, with no real consequences. To some, not all, this will seem soft and a bit less high stakes. Assignments might not seem worth much effort, especially if the other students are working on an obviously lower level. (Or a much higher one! It could be quite discouraging!)

So they outsource to other students? :confused1: How does that make any sense? That sounds a bit like an on-line co-op. They are taking time to get input from other students about each student's writing and then the teacher gives input as well. That's just during class. So obviously there's time. There is also some time outside of class that is typically expected of the teacher - such as office hours. If I am paying for a class, I expect teacher feedback to be included.

Yes, yes. A thousand times yes.

Thanks, RootAnn. She is considering Rhetoric I. I've been reading posts and doing other research into Rhetoric 1. I haven't emailed the instructor because I'm trying to get student and parent experiences with the classes. Sometimes those can be quite different from what the instructor says. (For example, I read the syllabus and walked away with a much different impression than I'm getting from other places.) I understand the benefits of workshops in certain situations. I don't find them to be universally beneficial, though. I'm not sure if instructor flexibility would be of extra value for us. If the workshop method isn't going to be a good fit, I would be better off continuing what we're doing at home or hiring a tutor to work individually with my daughter. There's no need to pay for something that I'm pretty sure isn't what we need. I do wish they had several sample classes available to watch. Anyway, thanks for your thoughts!

This has been incredibly helpful. Thank you so much. An excellent reminder that we all have different standards and goals. My daughter loves to write, but she is not the best she could possibly be. It's hard for me to even begin to imagine a high school student not getting much feedback on writing! Goodness! Look at how much editing goes into published books of successful authors! I think I have misunderstood these classes. Thanks so much for your response!

This is one of my concerns as well. The most growth for my daughter happens during the revising process. Skip that and an opportunity is lost... Without wrestling with the issues right then, she'll most likely forget them. Not to mention missing out on the feeling of satisfaction that comes with righting a wrong.

Is his work not discussed in class at all since he's on the delayed schedule? Does he get feedback from the instructor? It's my understanding corrections and rewrites aren't a normal part of the class. Do you know if that has been your son's experience? In other words, the impression I'm getting is that they discuss the assignment and what can be improved in the future, but they don't work on improving the writing at hand. (Beyond just discussing it.)

So strange! I read that several days ago and conjured up something completely different in my mind than what I'm reading here. I thought there would be discussion, which would be fantastic. Reading and critiquing each other's work during class time? Hmm...with all different levels of students? Not sure that will work in our situation...What a disappointment!

I just read on another thread (http://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/545755-wtma-expository-writing-ii-feedback-please/?p=6295276) about the classes following the workshop model. Would anyone care to share their experiences, either here or in PM? Is this the case for all the classes? This has been quite a surprise to me. Unfortunately, it's not been a pleasant one. I may need to rethink next year's plans... :crying: ETA: Update! New sections and instructors have been added to the writing classes. Both the workshop model and a more traditional class structure are now available. :)

I wish I would have seen this thread earlier... A big thank you to all those who have posted. This is not what I had expected at.all. I must have missed something somewhere. I thought I had read all the info for the classes...hmm...guess I need to double check... The workshop model really concerns me. I wonder if that is how Rhetoric is handled as well? Do the students read their papers and the classmates critique them? I am so glad to know this might be the case. I had no idea this is how class time would be spent... Please, someone correct me if I'm mistaken!

Thanks for clarifying!

Is that sarcasm? I can read it both ways! Just trying to clarify...

"What do you want? What do you need to do to get what you want?" echoes through our house as well! Very Machiavellian in the best of ways. ;) Reading The Prince together was good for us. Typical scenario: DD being loudly stubborn, me trying desperately to outdo her :blush: , and dh calling from another room "What is it that you want, Lily? Think! What is in your best interest?" Silence. Lily and I quickly refocus on the best personal strategy and the situation is transformed. We still each try to get our way, but somehow in the end we often both get very close, even though our goals seemed worlds apart at the beginning of the battle. We have also discussed how the winner is sometimes the person who disengages and walks away.

:grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: That sounds familiar... It's one of the reasons we'll be outsourcing more. Not the only reason, but one of them. Sometimes I think different thoughts and feelings bubble up in ways that make it tricky to find the source... Not engaging helps tremendously here. My goal, ultimately, is to get to the root and repair it or to pull the weed....Or to have the patience to let the wildflower struggle through the growth to the bloom. Sometimes knowing what's what is the toughest. :grouphug: