Just a warning--this thread will probably go downhill very fast. Copyright laws and all that.

But (correct me if I'm wrong) didn't the Swanns school through summer? 3 hours a day, 5 days a week, 52 days a year is way different than 2 hours a day, 5 days a week, 36 days a year. If I'm right, the Swanns would be schooling over twice as much as the hypothetical family we're discussing. And the OP said "less than" 2 hrs/day, which could possibly mean an hour or less some days.

I would not address it with someone who wasn't interested in my opinion, but no, that isn't enough. It might be enough to meet high school diploma requirements, but the question was whether a 10+ year old child can be adequately challenged in all necessary subject areas in 2 hours or less. I personally believe that any student over 6th grade should be spending a bare minimum of 30 min a day on math until they've finished at least pre-calc. They should also be reading 30 min a day minimally, not including content subject reading. That leaves 1 hour for everything else, and again, that's an extremely bare minimum. The only exception I can see is if a high school student opted to spend his/her last 2 years at the skills center learning a trade. But it doesn't sound like that's what the OP is talking about. I can also see allowing a student to only do 2 hours of formal schooling a day if they were a "true unschooler"--someone who spent his/her time learning through life--volunteering, gardening, reading quality books for pleasure, interning, studying animal specimens, etc and did minimal video games or TV watching. It wouldn't be my first choice for my kids, but I would consider that a viable educational option.

My only suggestion--do not eat today. :) Esp if you get a main dish...I could barely walk after finishing all 4 courses! Have fun! I love Melting Pot--as much for the experience as for the food, if not more.

That's what we do--it is working well for us.

That does help and is kind of what I was thinking. I really do like TT, but I wouldn't feel comfortable going from TT Pre-Calc into a college-level calc class...and I'm thinking I can either switch her after Alg 1 and redo Alg 1 with a more rigorous curric, or switch her later, but then I'd feel like I had to redo both Alg and Geo/Trig to get her up to speed. Thanks for helping me think this through!

Based on what you've shared, I'm not sure why you'd be having a decline in enrollment. It sounds like it has all the elements of a successful group. The only other thing I can think of is (if you haven't already) to register on your state homeschool org's website, maybe send out fliers to churches each semester before registration, get a table at homeschool conventions, or do some sort of outreach event (like getting a popular speaker). Or if you think the base of families you have now are stable, maybe just chalk it up to the normal ebb and flow of a group and hope things pick back up in the future. Just because a teacher is paid doesn't mean she (or he) has the ability to teach her subject while maintaining adequate crowd control. When the class is only 1 hour long, there simply isn't time to waste on behavior issues, particularly when many students aren't accustomed to a classroom setting. These "paid instructors" are getting, at the most, $375 for a 10-week class (15 students at $25/student). That is $37.50 per class, and that includes prep time, curriculum (which can cost a substantial amount), communication with parents outside of class, sometimes materials (there is supposed to be a separate fee if there are necessary materials, but most teachers will tell you that they pay a significant amount out of pocket), etc., not to mention that many times a class only has 10 students, maybe fewer, and the teacher has no control over whether or not the class fills. They need to deduct their own co-op expenses from the $$ they make teaching. And these are (mostly) all parents, who are fitting their co-op commitments in around homeschooling their own kids and other obligations. So while the money is helpful, no one is getting rich off of teaching co-op classes. For most people, the best we can hope to do is break even. And finally, as the OP mentioned, even if teachers were willing to fly solo, most facilities wouldn't allow it for liability reasons. Most TAs don't have to do much anyway. Unless I am teaching a particularly labor-intensive class, my TAs could pretty much just sit in the back and work on their own stuff while keeping their ears open for behavior issues.

As a parent who teaches, I absolutely think parents should receive a fee for teaching. I put a ton of work into my classes, and the class fees cover the cost of my kids attending. I don't mean this to be rude, but my contribution as a teacher is more valuable than a TA's contribution. TA's are necessary for sure, but you don't have a co-op without the teachers. This also brings up the point that for someone who is financially stretched, teaching will cover their co-op costs. I break even or come out ahead every semester by teaching 2-3 classes, and I have 4 kids that I am enrolling. We have many moms who teach so that co-op won't be a financial hardship for their family. Also, I do believe that a class is more highly valued if it is paid for. That is just an opinion, but in my experience people look down on free classes or feel like they can skip if they want, or not do their homework, etc. When I sacrifice something to be somewhere, I tend to take it more seriously.

Your group is very similar (as far as I can tell) to one that my family is involved with. The fee structure is similar and totally reasonable. Also, I don't think a parent can expect that a class that costs $2.50 for an hour's worth of instruction will not also involve some sort of volunteer commitment. That said, our co-op offers a free period to any parent who is there all 4 periods. I think it's a nice balance. But besides that I don't think there's anything wrong with your fee structure, religious approach, etc.--ours is very similar and we are full and turning people away at both of our campuses. My primary concern in your situation would be the fact that new families join and quit after one semester. Are they being made to feel welcome? Are the families who have been there for many years actively reaching out to them? Are the younger kids' classes engaging and age-appropriate? Are there field trips, activities, etc that work for younger kids? Do the moms have opportunities to talk to other moms, particularly more seasoned homeschoolers? I would look at all of those things first. Many times moms join a co-op for themselves as much as for their kids.

Another thought--we have found at our co-op that most parents aren't interested in having their kids do Bible at co-op, unless it's a little kids' class. It's one of those subjects that most parents don't want anyone else teaching their kids. That might be a way you can shorten your day--do an opening assembly with a devotion and assign a memory verse? You could also have one of the other subjects be optional--Latin might be one that you could offer optionally at the end of the day. That would be a way of shortening your day to 5 hours, which is much more doable.

It sounds like too much for me, at least if it is partially or mostly an enrichment co-op. Who will be teaching the classes? If she is relying on parents, she will have a very hard time getting that many classes covered. Especially if they require any sort of preparation. I typically teach 3 at a time and it is a very full load. If she is hiring out the teaching, it would be a good idea to find out if the parents want that. I know of a co-op that does 6 45-min classes. It is an academic co-op where they do all of the core subjects. Something like that might be ok, because the parent won't be teaching all week long.

I'm pretty committed to TT Alg 1. She likes it, she is learning, and the pace seems right for now. I know it's not as rigorous as other curric and we'll have to redo a year before she does Calc, it's just a matter of deciding which one. She's only in 5th so even if I have to redo 2 years it's not the end of the world. If Foerster's is going to be too demanding, I'd rather wait until she's older. But if it's not going to be painful for her, I don't mind starting it when she's still young. I probably just need to look at it and figure out if she's ready for it yet.

Thanks, everyone, for your input! How long does a Foerster's problem set take?

Then I would cut out at least an hour's worth of schoolwork. You really can do just Bible, reading, writing and math with your 1st grader, and then for your 3rd grader add in an easy to implement history, grammar, and science. Art/music if you have time. Good for your pastor. None of this is worth losing your marriage or your own sanity. Maybe now isn't the best time to be in leadership. I would drop the Bible study and just be part of the music team for now. You can't do everything, and if you're going to let your kids' schooling and activities take as much time as they do you'll have to cut back somewhere else.

I wouldn't bother doing anything with the younger kids, except letting them sit in on the group activities, and any Bible lessons at their level. If they *really* want to do something, I would get them some workbooks and leave it at that. Dance lessons for your DD if she loves them, but I wouldn't worry about any sort of lessons for a 2 year old. How much time do you spend doing school? I would keep it to 3 hours at the very most and do whatever you can fit into that time. Something that I have done before that might help you is to do a "time budget"--figure out how much time each thing *realistically* takes that you need to get done during the day, and how much time you have from the time you get up until the time your husband gets home. If you get up at 8 and he gets home at 6, you have 10 hours. 3 for school, 1 for music, 2 for cleaning, 2 for running the kids around, 1 for meal prep and 1 for downtime. I would also pray about your husband's high expectations--and maybe pray for another Christian man to encourage him to lighten up a little, or take on more of the responsibility (or hire it out--at least the laundry and maybe get a housekeeper to come in once a week and do deep cleaning). This is something we've gone back and forth on in my house, and it is almost impossible to keep a clean house with little kids. Finally, I wouldn't worry about language studies, logic, intensive art & music, etc. You'll have more time for those things when the kids are older and able to help more with the housework and do their schoolwork more independently.

DD10 is finishing up TT Pre-Al. We already have TT Alg 1, but now I'm trying to figure out what to do after that. She'll be in about 6th grade, and I'm trying to figure out what would be a good balance of rigor and age-appropriateness. As it is, she tends to get frustrated with how long it takes her to finish a math lesson...usually about 45-60 min. It seems that middle school math texts are made for a middle school attention span and maturity level...she's mostly there, but I don't want to push her too hard.

Bumping for you...there are probably many moms on here with Eagle Scouts. :)

Since MUS is mastery-based, I would only supplement if she was stuck on a concept and needed it taught from a different approach. She's probably going so fast through it because her brain was ready for the concepts. You can slow her down when she's not catching on so quickly.

In addition to the ones Jean mentioned, Tahoma (Covington-Maple Valley area) and Sumner are also good school districts. Both are about 45 min-1 hr outside the city (SE and S, respectively).

Oh, and the children's museum in Seattle opens an hour early on Saturday morning for kids with autism. I'm sure there are other similar opportunities, but that's the one that sticks out most in my mind.

Congratulations on your decision to move! Seattle is a wonderful area! This is hard to do. I have found that it usually takes me about a year to get established after a move. Do you go to church? If so, and you know where you intend to go after moving, I would contact that church and ask them who in the congregation homeschools, and go from there. Otherwise, there are so many variables and the Seattle area isn't nearly as compact as much of the East Coast, so a lot will depend on where you end up living. There are many opportunities for homeschoolers, so it is easy to find co-ops and support groups of all flavors. WHO is our statewide homeschool org, they have listings of different groups. They also hold a huge conference every year in Puyallup (about 45 min. from Seattle). I don't have direct experience with special needs, but this area is very open to people with disabilities. There are a number of virtual charter schools in the area that allow you to choose your curriculum--if you're interested in going that route you can get resources that way. For the most part, the public schools are open to working with homeschoolers. If you really want to be in the city and it is affordable for you, I would start with Queen Anne, Wallingford, Ballard/Fremont, Mercer Island. West Seattle is nice too. Don't expect to find a family-sized house for under $500k. There are some lovely areas outside the city. There is a commuter train that hits Tacoma, Puyallup, Sumner, Auburn, Kent, and Tukwila. These would all be substantially more affordable and would still allow an <1 hr. commute. The only other public transportation is the bus.

Welcome! And congrats on taking the first step to decide to homeschool! For starters, I would find out if there is any flexibility with your charter--if you can work ahead, or if you can take weeks off and make them up later. If not, I would just do your best to get on a good schedule and help your kids (particularly the older one) learn to do work independently. The less hand-holding you have to do, the better. Some kids will need it, and that's fine, but if you're busy you'll want to be able to clean or pack while they're working. Also, if you're the kind of person who *needs* a clean/orderly home to function well, consider schooling at the library when you're in the throes of packing/moving. I've also known families who school at their favorite coffee shop. And since your husband is somewhat reluctant, I would try to involve him as much as possible--not in the actual teaching necessarily, but have them tell him what they're learning and show him their homework. Once you are comfortable with what you're doing, maybe ask him to take a day off so he can spend a day with you guys as you school. If he sees how well homeschooling is working out for you, it might buy you some flexibility down the road if you want to switch to a more flexible charter or go independent. Good luck, and *enjoy* your homeschooling journey!

I just let each kid work at his/her own pace, regardless of what the others are doing. I know some people will hold back a kid who is quickly approaching the ability level of an older sibling, but I would hate to rob the younger kid of realizing their full potential. I always hoped I could teach my older two together and my younger two together. It hasn't worked out that way. However, I try to use curricula that will allow me to teach them all together and/or tweak to work at their levels. The way it has actually worked out is that DS9 and DD7 are at virtually the same level academically and DD6 isn't far off in some areas, so I keep the three of them together for a lot of what we do. *Our Bible curriculum (BSG4AA) is leveled, so we can hear the Bible story together but then each person works at their ability level. *SOTW works well for all of them. I have to have DD10 do some additional work at her level, but she likes the stories and maps. *WWE2--the younger 3 do this together. They can all do copywork no problem. I'll have DD6 do dictation if it's only one sentence, otherwise I'll have her tell me one thing she remembers and copy it down. They all answer the questions and work on narrations together. *Spelling, science notebook pages, and math--they do these individually. DD7 does Teaching Textbooks, which she loves. I tried to teach her with DS, but they learn very differently and she wasn't getting it. DS and DD6 use MUS (Gamma and Alpha, respectively). DS still needs me *right there* with him while he does math, and I'm pretty relaxed with DD6. DD10 is very independent, so she'll come to me with questions but then she's fine. So DS is the only one that I need to spend time teaching math to at this point. *Reading--they all pick a book at their level and read to me. Anyway, all that to say you may be able to still work with them together while giving them room to work at their levels.

First of all, I'm sorry for your loss. :grouphug: I think there is nothing wrong with homeschooling an only child. You may need to work a little harder at getting her time with other people than if she had siblings, but if she has homeschool group and classes/lessons, I personally think that is plenty. One thing I might try if I was in your shoes--if you belong to a church or some other group, you might consider reaching out to the newer moms and offering to help them out. This would be something you two could do together. You could babysit for them at your house or go to their house and clean/babysit while the other mom took a nap or went grocery shopping. We have a friend we try to do this for and my kids love it! It is fun for them to be the "big kid", and it's a good opportunity for them to learn to care for someone younger.

Bring your winter coat, even if you're coming in August. I wish I was kidding. :P There really isn't a shortcut from Port Angeles to Bellingham. If you time it perfectly, the Edmonds/Kingston ferry will shave an hour off of your trip, otherwise it's 6 of one, half dozen of the other. I'm only saying that so you know that to do both will probably mean you'll need to go further south. That said, there is a ton to see and do all over Western WA. :) If you like to hike, there are wonderful hikes anywhere in the Cascades. Tacoma has a really nice waterfront if you go out toward Ruston/Pt. Defiance, and the museum district is fun (and some are free if you're there on the third Thurs of the month). In Seattle, everyone has different ideas of what to do--if you want to be touristy, you definitely can't beat Pike Place Market and the Seattle Center (that's where the Space Needle is, as well as many other destinations). Some other fun places are the Sculpture Park, Fremont, Alki Beach (crowded, but it's close if you're already in the city), etc. Smaller towns worth checking out: Bainbridge Island (a ferry ride from Seattle), Edmonds, Sumner, Poulsbo, Port Townsend. If you're going to be in Port Angeles for a few days, you definitely need to see Hurricane Ridge, Lake Crescent, and Salt Creek if it's a low (pref. minus) tide. My favorite of the northern Pacific Ocean beaches is Kalaloch (clay-lock). The Dungeness Spit area in Sequim is nice too. The San Juans are amazing if you can make it out there, as is Victoria B.C. In Bellingham, WWU has a lot of interesting sculptures and a beautiful campus. Fairhaven is sort of the college town part of Bellingham. Everyone raves about Chuckanut Drive. If you're looking for a place to stay and can drive a bit, Semiahmoo resort is amazing and a great value during the off-season (or even on a weekday). It's supposed to be excellent golfing if either of you are golfers. Let us know if you have any specific interests that you'd like more information about. Enjoy! And I wasn't joking about that winter coat. :P