Mrs. R., that is sweet. Today I didn't feel like a "pro," that's for certain. Can nine-and-a-half year olds be hormonal? I mean, I expect some tears and a bit of eye-rolling from the 6th grader, but the 4th graders? Seriously? You know, there really isn't that much pressure on these kids. I admit it, I am concerned that they are not growing in their ability to handle things, on par with peers, because nothing in their world -- except me -- actually forces them to grow up and be a bit tougher. Sure, they have chores, pets, assignments, and all that. They handle the chores and pets, no problem. They handle most of their independent work with ease. It's this ridiculous emotional over-reaction when they don't understand (or can't easily do) something new within the first five seconds. So you struggle a bit? Pull yourself together and work through your frustration. Don't be dominated by your feelings at every turn in the road. I have spent the last month very gently saying, "Pull yourself together" or "Go dry your tears and come back" or "When you are ready to handle this, you may come back and get it done." One day it's one kid, the next day, it's another. Add that up, multiply by five, times 52 weeks, and I feel like this is more emotional management than I really want to do for the rest of the year. :blink: Don't anyone with teens tell me it gets worse, either! :toetap05: Today was not very fun, KWIM? And while I'm ranting.... I was telling my husband, "What could possibly be more gentle than a CLE math lesson?" I mean, it's like half of a new concept per day, plenty of hand-holding, plenty of review, and plenty of practice. They know this! They know that I am there, across the table, willing to walk through all these things with them, but the first split second that something seems "hard," cue the tears. So, yes, it was Mom-Gives-a-Speech Day here. Hopefully, tomorrow will be better! :thumbup1:

Lousy, crappy homeschool day here. How's it going where you are?

Actually, no, you don't. What you are doing sounds perfect for Pre-K, honestly. Reading picture books Aquarium & Science Center field trip Some phonics Snuggles? meals? rest? (I'm assuming) Grandparents visiting Parents working to make a living These are all very good things. Don't discount the value of them. :grouphug: I can sympathize with erratic schedules, since for years we haven't had anything remotely approaching "regular" here (hubby's work & travels). But it's good to roll with it, and aim for productively relaxed days. I remember our days doing homemade-FIAR with Ping. :001_wub: Sigh. The girls got out their stuffed animals (one was a duck, LOL) and acted it out, over and over. We made "boats" out of old dresser drawers, to put the characters in. We ate Chinese food (definitely NOT duck)! We read library books about China. We looked up China and the beautiful yellow Yangtze River on a map and globe. We listened and danced to traditional Chinese music. I think we can still, years later, all recite Ping, word for word. Same with Make Way for Ducklings. Whenever we see a family of ducks, the girls still always say, "Hey! There go Jack, Kack, Lack, Mack, Nack, Ouack, Pack, and Quack!" Same with Where the Wild Things Are, Millions of Cats, The Fox Went Out on a Chilly Night, and many, many more. You are making memories for years to come, perhaps for a lifetime. It's okay to go slowly.

Are we really back around to Sunday already? :svengo: Okay, here goes: Sunday 9/18 Church My parents Monday 9/19 Regular chores, meals, laundry, pets, exercise, hygiene & rest School Work -- Composition (6th only), Assigned Independent Reading with written work (all), Science (all), Piano Practice (all) Afternoon/Evening -- free time Tuesday 9/20 Regular chores, meals, laundry, pets, exercise, hygiene & rest School Work -- Math (all), Assigned Independent Reading with written work (all), Science (all) Afternoon/Evening -- mandatory nap time :nopity: Trust me, they need it. Wednesday 9/21 Regular chores, meals, laundry, pets, exercise, hygiene & rest School Work -- a regular full day Church midweek Thursday 9/22 Regular chores, meals, laundry, pets, exercise, hygiene & rest School Work -- a regular full day Children's choir practice Friday 9/23 Regular chores, meals, laundry, pets, exercise, hygiene & rest School Work -- not sure yet, possibly a lighter day? Family Movie or Game night

We had a good day. Hubby is now mowing the lawn with the last bit of daylight, the girls are playing out back, and I need to change out the bunny bedding and workout before the sun goes down. Well, I could workout after it's dark (treadmill in the garage), but the rabbits can't wait until then. We have finished almost all of our September work, and I am so pleased with how this year is going so far. The girls are excited and happy, too. They enjoy doing their work most days, and they are so much more independent this year than last. I'm proud of them, to be honest. We still have one Composition assignment for oldest, plus some Assigned Independent Reading (with written work) for all three, plus a good chunk of Science to accomplish. I think that next week, I'll hold off on assigning anything other than these things, and we'll really focus on Science on Monday and Tuesday. That should wrap up September's work, thankfully a bit "early." Tomorrow is Picnic on the Beach Day. :coolgleamA: I love going in September, when all the heat and crowds are gone. It's so pleasant! On Sunday, my parents are meeting us at church, then coming back for the afternoon. My husband is making something involving eggplant. I think a low-carb pizza? When he cooks, it's delicious, but my kitchen looks like a Grease Bomb hit it. :laugh: Well, gotta go. The bunnies are calling.

You could try distilled white vinegar in the rinse cycle (or in the fabric softener dispenser). Or, if she sends stinky clothes again, try soaking his clothes first in warm water and white vinegar. If that doesn't work, you could try borax or washing soda. Sometimes in the summer, my workout clothes get a bit ripe, and I just blast them with all three (plus detergent, plus Oxi-Clean), so I'm not really certain which one is working, LOL. :lol: Yes, they are that stinky! But never do they smell like cigarettes. Yuck.

:hurray: If I did only one of those things, I would feel (1) exhausted and (2) like a champion.

Oh, wow, an option I hadn't thought of! How could I miss that? Yes, it could have been the name of something from Ikea! :) Svärtan, Valje, Lakheden, Lindshult, Vårvind, Ivor.

This is what we've been up to, just like we planned it -- Tuesday 9/13 Regular meals, chores, laundry, pets, exercise School Work -- lots and lots Early bedtime Wednesday 9/14 Regular meals, chores, laundry, pets, exercise School Work -- a good, solid work day Church midweek Thursday 9/15 Regular meals, chores, laundry, pets, exercise School Work -- a bit lighter, because of choir Choir practice The laundry is caught up, the cleaning is caught up, the meals have been good (my cooking!), the house is now peaceful and quiet. I'm drinking herbal tea and a pumpkin spice candle is burning. :) We're almost wrapping up our work for September, and the month is only half done (we started up at the end of August). I'm glad for that bit of a head start. We were able to go to the lake on Monday, and we'll probably get to the beach this weekend, too. And I'd like to head out at least one other day, probably to something farmy and fallish, either a corn maze or a pumpkin patch or something like that. AND, for sure, at least two fall family hikes. ;) School is going well this year, it's rolling along as a vital, enjoyable part of things, but doesn't feel like the "whole deal." Staying home on Monday nights (instead of going to AWANA) has really helped, too. This way, Monday gets off to a strong start, and keeps on going strong, since we know we won't be going until 9:30 pm! We're not good at being out at night, it just wonks us out. The girls started back to church midweek this week, and they love it. They are also doing children's choir, and that is going well. And they've gone back to children's church on Sundays. They had been sitting with us in the service since January, for a change, but they want to be in with their friends now that a few things were switched up for the better. Take some time to reflect a bit this weekend. These years are passing by swiftly, and your children will soon be grown. Your job as homeschooling mom will end. Your relationships and memories will remain. What do you treasure now? What is the lasting fruit of all your daily work and toil? Where your treasure is, there your heart will also be. And yes, like Chester Cricket, I am feeling Septemberish.

:lol: :lol: :lol: Now I'm going to have to name my red clicky pen something. Maybe "Preciousssssssss." I can say it like Gollum. "The Preciousssss. We wantsss it. We needsss it. The Precioussssss." All things in the homeschool room (boring name) are shared, but the red clicky pen... is mine. Be afraid. Be very afraid. :scared:

Well, what I would do would be to (1) give her a placement assessment in Writing with Ease, and then (2) start her on the appropriate level and consistently work with her through the lessons. I would use WWE precisely because her response was "Frogs died." She is absolutely right to say, in response to the prompt she was given, "Frogs died." Yup, that is what happened as temperatures went up. Those frogs died. If you want a better response, you need a better set of questions. There may be so much more that you would like her to write, but her response actually answers the question she was given. What I've realized over the years we've been using Writing with Ease is that Susan Wise Bauer seems to have written this course for these kinds of young writers -- the kids who would write "Frogs died," if given half a chance. Writing with Ease doesn't teach writing the way you've described above. That is to say, it doesn't start by giving a student a (rather) complex passage, followed by a (rather) open-ended, vague question (that could be answered tersely, and still be "answered"), and providing little to no guidance on the required complexity of the response. In that approach to writing, a reluctant writer will write things like "He was sad" or "She ran." Of course. If you don't naturally like to write, then the shorter, the better! :) Usually, the student has actually completed the assignment, as given, but done it succinctly. What we tend to do when we don't care for the student's response is to pick apart the response. Often, though, the assignment and the scaffolding to get the student from Point A to Point B are lacking. This approach to writing instruction seems to assume that if we throw a lot of words at students (e.g., reading complex passages, using open-ended questions designed for natural writers), then they will throw a lot of words back at us. It doesn't always work. Instead of the "Global Warming" type of assignment you described, WWE begins with simple, doable skills and incrementally stretches the student's abilities (and willingness) to express thoughts on paper. Any explicit teaching the student needs in order to succeed is right there, along with better questions, to guide the student's answer into eventual fullness and depth of expression. We're working through WWE 3 for the second time with twin 4th graders, and through WWS 1 for the first time with a 6th grader (we don't do WWE 4). I am impressed with my 6th grader's ability to handle the complexities of the passages and assignments in WWS 1, but she didn't get there overnight, that's for certain. Writing with Ease provided much of the groundwork that built the skills I now see coming into play in my daughter's more advanced (though still intermediate) writing. HTH.

:bigear: Your cabinet is named Ivor, because....? My theories, in no particular order: A. The cabinet is not really white, but ivory, and to masculinize the name, you took off the y. Thus, Ivor. B. You were studying Old Norse mythology, came across this cool old name, and thought your cabinet needed naming. C. You once had a beloved large, white dog named "Rover," who walked backwards, and whom you nicknamed "Rovi," and to commemorate his, well, memory, you named your large, white cabinet "Ivor," which is "Rovi" spelled backwards. D. It has something to do with Minecraft. E. It has something to do with Music. F. It has something to do with Trains. G. None of the above. H. All of the above. I. Are you out of your mind, Sahamamamamamamama? Yeah. It's been one of thoooooooooose days here. :rolleyes: I drink only water, coffee, and tea, so my winding-down options are limited.

Monday 9/12 We got up and did our regular morning routine -- exercise (me), breakfast, rabbits, chores, and clean up. Then we packed a picnic and headed out to the lake (it's actually a reservoir). The girls and I really, really needed an outdoor day, after this extremely hot and humid summer. We had felt too closed in, but the weather yesterday was outstanding. And we had done school work on Saturday, which was hot and sticky, so we didn't feel any guilt, LOL. We all just played all day. It was nice. It reset our Connected with Nature Button. A good day. Tuesday 9/13 So far today we have done most of our regular morning routine -- exercise (me), breakfast, rabbits, chores, and clean up. I just need to throw in a load of laundry, and we'll be good to go. The girls are working on their independent stuff... no, scratch that, they are screaming about a bug in the homeschool room. Okay, it was just a cricket, crisis resolved. They can handle crickets, no problem, but we have had some assassin bugs and wasps in the house lately, so we're all jumpy. They are now NOT doing independent work. They are examining the cricket under the magnifier. :) We have our usual Tutor Time lined up after Independent Work -- Math, Composition, Grammar, French, Reading Check-In. Then a long afternoon of Science, which I'm looking forward to. Then maybe a nap or quiet time? They will say, "We don't need it," and I will say, "I know, but you needing it is not the point." I think we all need time to read and be alone, KWIM? So go find your little corner of the world and curl up with a book or your crochet stuff or your sketch book and be happy there. And then we'll do an evening read aloud = finish By the Shores of Silver Lake. This is my least favorite book in the whole Little House series. I find myself repeatedly irritated with Pa, more than usual. I'm sure this is coming across in my reading. Well, of course it is, because I come right out and say how annoyed I am at his decisions and how they impact his family. And then we talk about it, so I suppose there is merit in that. But... :cursing: .

I agree, it is sometimes like a wistful, unsettling realization for me, to see that the thread is four or six or eight years old, and the question at hand is now most likely obsolete for that OP. When I inadvertently come across an old thread, I do reflect on the years passing, seeing how others have come and gone from this scene, how their children have grown, how the homeschooling years have come to an end, and how many of the moms have moved on (or, as you say, passed away). It is sadder, in a sense, than what I would like a "normal" thread to be. I know my time for all of this will come, but for now, I am in the full swing of homeschooling, so I don't really want to think too much right now about how quickly it will all fly by. I will face that season when I get to it, and it will come soon enough. So... I have really tried lately to pay more attention to the date of origin on each thread before reading it. I do tend to steer clear of old threads, but every now and then I trip over one. It took me a while to be certain that I would rather not, most of the time. So I do try to pay attention to the dates now. There is enough in life to feel nostalgic about, without being sad about an old thread. HOWEVER, when there are links to old threads within in a newer thread, that is a different story (I'm not sure why this is?). It's just when I think a thread is current, then realize it is old and the "story" of the thread has itself passed on... that is more " " than I want to handle on a regular day.

:grouphug: I hope someone makes you hot Throat Tamer tea with honey. Extra rest, no guilt.

We used 409 through 510 last year for 5th (skipped 501). We're using 602 through ??? (however far she gets, as she wants to accelerate) this year for 6th. I do purchase the Teacher Manual, but now that you've asked the question, I'm not sure why. :huh: :laugh: In thinking about this a bit more, I do sometimes use the extra "board work" problems to teach (or reteach) a new concept (on a small whiteboard). Sometimes, the notes on "teaching the lesson" are helpful, and I usually just read them aloud, straight out of the manual. It isn't that the concept is new to me, or I can't put it into my own words, but since the words are already there, why not use them? But, so far, my three girls just "get math" most of the time. At this point, they don't seem to need a lot of hand-holding with math. They must get that from their father's side. :blushing: One thing you might want to consider if you do decide to go with Answer Keys only -- will you miss having a copy of your student's lesson in front of you? I was annoyed and disappointed last month to find that the TMs for LA do not have copies of the student pages, and the answer keys only have the answers. This makes it harder to move my students through their lessons, since I have to constantly ask, "What do you have on your page?" (or stand behind them the entire time). I ended up ordering my own set of student books, one for LA 600 and one for LA 500. Of course, this was extra money and shipping. I did hear that CLE plans for future (revised) editions of the LA TMs to have copies of the student pages, but these will come out "behind" the trajectory for my kids. Oh, well. HTH.

Our plans for this week: Sunday 9/11 :patriot: 15 Years, Never Forget Church as a family Lunch & clean up Nap (for me); free time (for the kids) Monday 9/12 Regular meals, chores, laundry, pets, exercise Pack a picnic & head out to the lake (we did school on Saturday, when the weather was awful, so Monday will be our "day off") :) Tuesday 9/13 Regular meals, chores, laundry, pets, exercise School Work Early bedtime Wednesday 9/14 Regular meals, chores, laundry, pets, exercise School Work Church midweek Thursday 9/15 Regular meals, chores, laundry, pets, exercise School Work Choir practice Friday 9/16 Regular meals, chores, laundry, pets, exercise School Work Family Game Night Saturday 9/17 Errands, chores, yard work Rest

To me, all of this sounds exactly like CLE Language Arts. HTH.

Oh, I don't think it's necessarily better. I agree with you there! For some people, though, DIY may be the only viable possibility. If the local schools are terrible and the money is simply not there for outsourcing, what other option is there? Since I am in that exact situation -- not now perhaps, but down the road a bit -- I often feel that vulnerability keenly. What will I do, in a year or two or three, when my student's need for a teacher exceeds my ability to be that teacher, but I can't afford to outsource that teaching? Of course, this assumes that between now and then, nothing changes. Since I certainly can't become an expert in every subject by then, and I don't see how the income is going to change, and our school system isn't going to be radically better in a year or two.... well, this begs the question, "What then?" Is it failing my student for us to aim at the best academics that we can actually reach? I'm not talking about failure because of a lack of diligence or effort on anyone's part, but rather a lack of (a) parent-teacher expertise (in certain areas) and/or (b) resources to pay for outside expertise (in those areas). I was simply wondering if, years ago, there was less pressure for homeschooling parents to facilitate every subject at the level of experts, either personally or through outsourcing. Then again, I suppose it doesn't really matter what anyone did "back then!" ;) I'm enjoying this conversation. I'm not trying to offend anyone or judge others' choices, just figure out a way to do our best in our family's circumstances. Chiguirre, thanks for the link for the music theory book. :)

Someone I know had, for a time, three children in three different schools. None of the start times, end times, holidays, summer breaks, snow days, half days, teacher in-service days, assemblies, or anything else ever lined up. Different schools, different principals, making different decisions. If one child missed a bus, but another child needed a ride to school (no bus), then what? It was crazy, and the mom just about lost her mind for those years. To simplify your life, go with the public school, especially since: She can ride the bus, so You can get on with your day Her brother is already there You know the school, the teachers, and the school culture (the other school's culture is an unknown) The school knows you and your family They teach phonics She would still get specials She'll have little to no homework, and more time for other (better) things Your children's school schedules will coordinate, since "school" will be ONE school She won't have to "get in" to public school (no hoops) You won't have to purchase uniforms If your daughter ends up being a "big hyper" like her brother, the public school will still keep her; the charter school may not It's only kindergarten! Does history really matter to a five year old? You probably won't feel as much anxiety or regret a few years from now when you do pull her out It won't sabotage your plans for homeschooling Simple now, classical later. HTH.

Two months later, I remembered this thread, LOL. :) Anyway, a few thoughts.... Someone upthread (I don't remember who at this point) mentioned the possibility that an increasing number of people are turning to homeschooling because of the poor state of public schools and the high cost of private schools. Your experience with your local schools reflects this sad reality. But I think that perhaps 15 or 20 years ago, in the homeschooling community, there may have been a higher percentage who chose homeschooling for reasons other than primarily academic ones. Their motivations may have included good academics, but also things like spiritual development, faith formation, character training, not being institutionalized (i.e., part of the institution of government-run schools), passing on practical skills, instilling a strong work ethic, and so on. There is an implied question in some of these posts that I encounter now more frequently than I did even a few years ago – “If you can.†The focus is still on making the academics the focus! And measuring ourselves as teachers and mothers against the academic standards of the establishment, rather than against some other criteria. In other words, we ourselves may not be in the best school districts, but we take the standards of whatever the “top tier†is and apply those to our homeschools—and feel inadequate to attain that on our own, perhaps? Is this the wisest way to go about it? I am not at all saying “don’t outsource.†Not at all! In fact, we very well may do just that, and you can see that we’re only working on 6th grade at this point! :) What I am saying is that before all these online/outsourcing options were available, what did parents do to parent and guide and teach their children through to high school? For those of us who can’t afford even the moderately priced providers, what are the paths to making this homeschooling thing work for a few more years? Didn’t people used to have to create their own courses, assemble resources, and work out labs the best way they could? IMO, there is an assumption now that high school (and middle school to some extent) will be outsourced, because it’s impossible to do it well. Also, some definitions: To me, outsourcing does not mean that there is no interaction with peers, other adults, or outside-the-home experiences. What it means is that the parent turns over the role of primary teacher to someone else, and becomes the manager of that subject, but not the teacher of it. For example, the parent researches options for Subject X—providers, tutors, pricing, scheduling, and so on. A decision is made to go with Option A, the money is transferred, and the student enrolled. This could be an online course, a tutor, a university model school, a college course. But whatever it is, that course then is primarily between another instructor and the student. The teaching responsibility is no longer on the parent—the planning, organizing, scheduling, assigning, testing, and so on—all this is the responsibility of the instructor. That, to me, is outsourcing. Now it is true that when we purchase, say, a textbook or a video course or other materials ourselves, we are in a sense relying on the expertise of the author or creator of that material. But all the “running†of it is on us. I guess the question could be, “Who is assigning the work?†Mom or Mr. Online? Even if the parent organizes a book group, a science lab co-op, an apprenticeship, or language study group, the work of doing that is on the parent. To me, that is not the same as outsourcing, even if it involves outside resources. Or perhaps the question could be, “Are we paying for something other than materials?†If you DIY homeschool, you basically buy things you can touch and see and hold in your hand, whereas if you outsource, you are paying for an educational service. Again, I don’t know and I’m not judging any option. I am, for my own sake, just trying to work it out, probably because we can’t afford to pay for these services. In the end, I am thankful we can afford to have me home and purchase the “stuff,†but it is a ton of work to work our way independently through everything. I admit it: I like the thought of taking something off my plate! I do. Since we can’t pay for online courses (x3 children), tutors, lessons, co-ops, and the like, my only option for taking something off my plate is to unschool. We do this to some extent, but as an overall approach, I am not going there. So that leaves the work-it-hard option. Many of us are in that position, let’s face it. There has to be a way to tackle middle school and high school—and to do it well—without falling down from fear, discouragement, fatigue, comparison, uncertainty, and a general sense of “lacking†what is needed. I suppose part of my set of questions comes from the fact that (for me) the community seems to be saying that (1) most moms really can’t effectively teach upper level courses at an adequate level, and (2) if we do not then provide the adequate outsourced alternative, we are failing our children. One thing that I think we have going for us these days is that we have so many amazing resources to pull from that, while not strictly outsourcing, do “put the teacher in the book.†I have in mind things like SWB’s WWE and WWS series. I can purchase those and teach composition confidently, because Susan has done an outstanding job of putting her Writing Teacher Self into those texts. And the same could be said for resources available for Science, Math, History, Literature, and more. For us, the hardest subjects to find good resources for (at this point) are Music (mostly theory, I’m having a hard time with that) and French. But even then, we’re very happy with our line-up for French for the next few years. After that, we’ll see what there is to tap into. Every year brings more exciting changes to the homeschool scene, and outsourcing through online providers is certainly one of them. I’m sincerely glad these options are available to those who can afford them. I only would like the community to try to retain the knowledge of how good, solid middle and high school homeschooling can be done without that option. If it is possible to do it well, how is it possible? Even if DIY homeschooling is more work than outsourcing (also debatable), that DIY work may be what some of us realize we must do for the sake of our children. Let’s retain the knowledge of how it’s done.

For Chemistry this year, we are using this video course, along with this and this. Our additional reading includes: The Trailblazer of Science: Robert Boyle (Sowers Series, which really needs a better editor!), by John Hudson Tiner Exploring the World of Chemistry, by John Hudson Tiner Exploring Creation with Chemistry & Physics, by Jeannie Fulbright (they will listen to just the chemistry chapters, on audiobook, while following along with the text) The Mystery of the Periodic Table, by Benjamin Wiker (as a group read aloud) If we finish up our scheduled work on time (it could happen), :laugh: then we'll work through Ellen McHenry's Elements over the summer. We have learned to keep some fun science for summer time. It helps those hot and steamy days go by faster. ;)

Feel better, Happy Smiley Lady and Critter Fixer. :grouphug:

I'm tired tonight! I'm supposed to be typing up the lists for tomorrow, but here I am. We had productive school days on Wednesday and Thursday. On Wednesday, both of my twins woke up on the wrong side of the bed! Good grief, they were out of sorts all day. I attributed it to being tired, and put them to bed earlier. They both were great today. I know they need more sleep than they are getting. When my oldest was their age (9.5), she went through the same thing -- moody, needed naps, needed to sleep in, needed to get to bed early from time to time. So, I'll work on this in the next few weeks, to help them get caught up on sleep. I think they've just been getting up with the sun all summer long, and not taking any naps, and going to bed later than they should. It piled up, and Wednesday was the fall-out. We'll sort it out. Today (Thursday) was a good day. All three girls were happy, cheerful, productive, and nice to each other (and to me)! :) We managed to get quite a bit done. If I didn't need to get tomorrow's DWL done, I'd list what we did today, but I'm too tired now to do both. Children's choir started today. Fewer kids than last year, and last year had fewer kids than the year before. Even so, the girls seemed thrilled to be there, happy to see their friends who came back, and glad to be singing again. So, we'll see how it goes. Well, I have to finish up my pre-bed work and get to bed. Good night!

I would be concerned about why your church suddenly feels it is necessary to do this. The leadership may sincerely want to foster family learning, but there may be another reason that is being hidden behind the nice-sounding language. Then again...