One last thought: do you have a therapist (or another trusted advisor) you could talk this stuff out with? It feels like you could use some feedback from someone who'd see the whole picture. This isn't sounding like a purely homeschooling problem to me. It's sounding like you feel stuck and powerless, and the way out of that state is usually personal growth. We start being able to change our circumstances when we start feeling that we CAN.

Glad you're feeling better. Good luck sorting stuff out!

I've talked to a few people who're interested in discussing, but they've indicated they'd prefer to do it privately, so I'm going to start a club. Please let me know if you'd like to join in!

The US hasn't had to fight any wars on its soil. It's a uniquely privileged position. Those of us who've lived in Europe know that things are a lot more chaotic when the war is at home.

We had to get an elderly relative out of Ukraine recently. (A sort of grandmother -- the mom of my first stepdad, who I'm still close to.) The only thing that was useful in that case was just moving. Her building didn't have heat or electricity and had holes in it from being shot at. It's true that she lived in a city and didn't have a garden, but trust me . . . it wasn't going to make much of a difference when there are HOLES in your residence. She did move to a different apartment before she left the country entirely, but it wasn't at all obvious how long that was going to last. There are lots of eventualities you really can't prepare for. That's why I said upthread that the best thing can just be to be wiling to adjust. If she hadn't been willing to move to California in her 80s, I'm pretty sure she'd already be dead.

Goodness, @Ting Tang. I'm sorry you're being put on the defensive because you prioritize the kids' social lives. For what it's worth, we're a very academic family, and we spend TONS of time outside the house socializing with other kids, because that's what makes my kids happy and allows them to have warm, consistent friendships. I only have 2 kids. They start climbing up the walls and their relationship suffers if they only interact with each other. Different families are different. It sounds you're having a tough time balancing everything. That's OK. You're not doing it wrong. It's YOUR family and you need to do what's right for THEM.

If I stop being snarky (although I genuinely think weapons are a good idea if one is serious about this!), I think the greatest asset one would have in the event of a societal collapse is the ability to adjust to circumstances. Most catastrophes are relatively slow moving. What you want is to be the person who finds allies/leaves before things are dire/otherwise adapts. People are TERRIBLE at adapting. I saw people going to birthday parties and to work when the pandemic started in NYC, when everything was already abundantly clear even if you weren't following the international news (which I stupidly was not.) You can always get a serious leg up by not just moving forward like an automaton. ETA: You see this very well during world wars and other catastrophes, too. People don't evacuate until it's too late. They don't want to leave their lives behind.

As for World War 3… I do worry. But I don’t think it makes sense to stock up. The one thing it did change for me is I don’t want to get rid of our car. We live in Manhattan and perhaps could live without… but I really like the freedom of motion it buys. ETA: but it’s not current events. I’ve been worrying about it for more than 5 years now.

That’s what DH always says. If you’re serious about prepping for genuine disaster, better buy lots of guns. (Our friends who lean this direction are decidedly not gonna buy guns, given their political persuasion. He’s just making the same point you are.)

Oh, and another thing. We aren't in your head. We don't actually know what's best for you. To do the right thing, you have to get secure with your own decision, not listen to strangers on Internet. The more you let strangers on the Internet make up your mind one way or another, the less ownership you wind up having of this decision. And that's not so different from letting the kids run things, is it? The point is for YOU to be in charge and make the decisions, no matter how scary it may be.

I'll second this one. We've found this really helpful. I'll also push back against the idea that putting them in school is the wrong thing. Sometimes we can only fix things when we get some space and time and get our head on straight. And the kids might very well appreciate homeschooling more when they have to deal with people's arbitrary authority at school. Remember: putting them in school doesn't have to be permanent. They can be in school for a bit while you figure things out, and they can either stay in school or go back to homeschooling according to what makes sense for your family.

Yeah. I hear you. It’s too bad, because this situation seems to call for individualized attention, and it can be easier with a non-parent 😕

Oof. Tricky. Can you afford a tutor?

Please do!!!!

Just cleared some space.

I couldn't relax enough to really listen to my body with the second baby. My first we did with a doctor who was very midwife-y, so she let me labor in a bath (which was not an official birthing bath, lol, just a normal bath), which was the ONLY thing that relaxed me enough to get me in touch with my body. And then I really felt in sync with what I was supposed to be doing and it just kind of . . . went. (They'd check on the baby with a portable device once in a while, but I wasn't hooked up to things.) My second, there was no bath, they'd occasionally let me get in the shower but with all the monitoring things it just wasn't relaxing enough. So then I wound up never relaxing enough and got an epidural . . . which actually moved things forward for us, because I was never going to relax the way things were going. I think I got the urge to push both times, with and without the drugs (although I got the epidural quite late with the second one.) I didn't feel it with the epidural as much, though. So from personal experience, I'd guess that the medicalization of birth does make it harder for moms to listen to their bodies and to know when to push. For me, the correct relaxing environment was totally not optional. (And I say this as someone who's to no end grateful to hospitals for making births so much safer.)

From peeking on Reddit, it didn't seem like it! Honestly, one was enough . . .

I might be late to the party, but here goes . . . It matters and it doesn't. You don't need a "brand name" school. I didn't go to a brand name undergraduate school and I got into all the top graduate programs I applied to. But on the other hand . . . 1) I went to a school known for its undergraduate program. It attracted excellent students and had advanced coursework. You wouldn't be able to get that everywhere. 2) It had at least some faculty that published in top journals. You do want recommendations from people respected in the field -- recommendations from someone who isn't research active aren't going to go far. They don't have to be at the very top, but they have to be for real. It's pretty hard to tell the difference from the outside. I'd recommend you ask around -- ask someone you can give enough details so they could actually evaluate your choices. Not knowing exactly what the institutions and professors being considered are makes it impossible to give good advice.

Just saw this! Looks like fun. I'd love to see reviews, too.

Any interest in chatting about the show? I know I got @EKS into it, too 😁. I've only watched Season 1 so far. I identified so much with one of the couples that I'm having a hard time moving on to the next season!!!

Yeah, we had a similar experience. DH recognized himself in one of the characters from Season 1, and that was helpful for both of us. It's so hard to see yourself from the outside . . . (This wasn't anywhere near the first time he'd recognized himself -- he's made tremendous progress with this stuff in the last 2 years -- but still, it was meaningful to him.) The thing I've liked best about the show is that it seems really . . . real. Their relationships and their responses to the therapist scan as very realistic to me. There are so many "tells" in how they react -- you can see which people are stonewalling, and which ones are angry, and which ones aren't expressing their feelings, and which ones are self-involved, and which ones are open to input and which ones aren't. And you can see how some people's problems are in the dynamics between them, and other people's problems are mostly a result of a power imbalance that is not amenable to changes in a dynamic. (In my opinion, there are examples of what I think of abusive dynamics in the show, although I'm sure they tried to screen for actual violence.) I love watching human dynamics in general, and I've found this show incredibly rich and compelling. DH is the same way, and he was also enthralled.

Please, pretty please, keep this off this thread? I loved this show and it’s been meaningful in my ongoing marital issues, and I really want to keep the thread positive from here on out. I’ll come be devil’s advocate on the spin-off thread, I promise 😂. But I’d love it if we could stop debating the ethics here.

Look, if you guys want to talk about how this is unethical, could you maybe start a spin-off thread? I just want to discuss the show with anyone who’s interested.

Yeah, it's filmed through a one-way mirror, apparently. So they are out of the way. I think it'd be hopelessly distorted if the filming was blatant.

Yeah. I totally hear that. Thinking about it, when I've recorded Zoom tutoring, it definitely changed my manner. So . . . yeah. I can see how the fact that someone might be watching would be changing the experience. You're right that it'd be more performative, I think. I wonder to what extent you wind up forgetting about it, though? When I was recording Zoom tutoring, some sessions were recorded and some weren't. But if all of them were recorded, I might have learned to tune the fact out, more or less. It would have become part of the scenery. Anyway, it's an interesting point.