Wow! So many people teaching or studying 20th C next year! There is another post begun today by Cafelattee that has some responses.

I'm designing an online history/literature course for next year using Johnson's Modern Times. I also have TOG yr. 4, and am pulling some ideas from that, along with some from Ambleside! Johnson's book, while fabulous, covers from the 20s to the 90s, so the other resources help with the early 20th C. I'm reading several other 20th century books (from Gilbert, Roberts, and a couple more) because we need to supplement Johnson. That will be the glue that holds everything together, but we'll also add two or three books by Albert Marrin (Hitler, Stalin, Vietnam), along with Only Yesterday (about the 20s), possibly Vera Brittain's book mentioned at Ambleside, The Three Whys of the Russian Revolution, Over Here (about America during WWI), something about WWII (still checking on these), The Cold War, and no doubt some others from later in the century. I'm trying to get the first quarter nailed down by the end of this month. For literature, we are reading 8 (approx) novels, including Heart of Darkness, My Antonia, The Great Gatsby, Cry the Beloved Country, The Remains of the Day, Fahrenheit 451 (?), The Old Man and the Sea, and the rest I'm still working on. We'll also read short stories by Faulkner, O'Connor, Steinbeck, Garcia Marquez, Nabakov, Joyce, etc., along with poetry and plays! Honestly, it scares me to read this :D. One thing I'm trying to do with the students who will take the class is stress that the 20th century happened as it did in part in response to ideas and trends from earlier times (of course), so we will delve into more than just the facts. I also aim to give more than one side to the issues--which is why I'm balancing Johnson's book with the liberal-leaning The Century by Peter Jennings and Todd Brewster. I aim to have lots of good discussions among the students! Discussions, that, by the way, will be a mandatory part of the grade, along with papers (including a research paper), quizzes, and exams. The Ambleside site, by the way, contains some great links to 20th C speeches and other primary source material!

Thank you, Karen! That was very helpful. I'm off to check out that scope and sequence!

Is there some aspect of your son's essay writing that you think needs help? He's still young--as you discovered, many high school students don't have a good handle on it. For that matter, many college students don't, either! Just ask my son who works in the writing center at Baylor (he's an English grad student). In any case, you can do it. Some people, of course, take to writing more naturally than others, but I think anyone can learn to write a good, solid, organized essay. Some of the things that have helped me especially are a small book titled, Writing to the Point by William Kerrigan. I have the 4th edition, ISBN 015598313X. Another is The Lively Art of Writing by Lucile Vaughan Payne, ISBN 0451627121. Either (or both) of these books will teach how to write a good, solid essay. Beyond that, I love Classical Writing. It teaches students imitation and analysis of great (ancient) writing, and along the way relates this to the modern essay. It's a multi-year program, but your son is young enough to begin it with the "older beginners" books, and even finish the series (assuming it is done on schedule) before he graduates. These aren't the only options, but they are ones that have worked for me, or that I have used and liked. I'm sure you'll get many good responses!

Karen, is there somewhere at the TOG site that explains the literature changes in the rhetoric levels? I have searched and searched and can't find a thing--other than that they have a "literature expert" who wrote them. I did look at the sample weeks, but I couldn't really get a feel for it. Is there some sort of overarching plan?

Gulp. Wow, what a huge difference. I did think $85 was pretty low way back when, and when one factors in all the subjects that I mentioned above, I still think it's a pretty good deal.

I used it with my oldest in high school, and he was the only student. I thought it was very worth it. Now, that was back when it cost $85 for a year plan! As for using different levels with the same student--well, it's not really done by grade level (except for the writing assignments). There are learning levels (for lack of a better term): lower grammar, upper grammar, dialectic, and rhetoric. So the only thing you could do is have, say, a rhetoric student do a dialectic assignment if you thought he wasn't up to the rhetoric reading. As to the cost, though, TOG is very easily resold. Assuming you didn't write all over everything, you can recoup much of the cost. Or, if you don't need the redesign, you can find used copies of the Classic plans for very good prices. And, when you think about it, $185 (I think that's the price for the new ones) isn't that bad for all the subjects you get--history, literature, geography, government, fine arts, church history, and writing, and philosophy (hope I'm not forgetting anything!).

It's 970000.

I have a 10th ed. Structure, Sound, & Sense and the Sonlight key for the 11th edition. It matches up very well (not perfectly, but good enough for me).

My response is different! The colleges to which my older son applied and the ones to which my younger son (I think) will apply did not ask for course descriptions. We happen to have them just in case, though, and it's a good idea, I think, because you never know what the trend will be when it's time to apply for your kids. I happen to agree with you, Deece! People often say that homeschoolers are an "unknown" factor, but public high schools across the country are so very different in what they teach and require of their students, it really doesn't seem fair that homeschoolers are singled out like this. Even schools within the district we live in are very different. An A student in one might be a B- student in another.

I honestly don't think most high schoolers read Faulkner novels--they may read a short story, like A Rose for Emily, or The Bear. His novels are pretty dense (though I like them). I think you can safely read excerpts of Fenimore Cooper. He's not known for his excellent prose style! But he's important historically. Hawthorne's classic is The Scarlet Letter, of course, and I think I would pick The Old Man and the Sea for Hemingway. I'm not a Steinbeck fan and have only read The Grapes of Wrath. He has a lot of good short stories, though! I'm actually going to tackle East of Eden this summer to see if we'll add that to the 20th C lit class I'm teaching next year. If I'm not mistaken, William Golding is British, so you're off the hook there :). (He wrote Lord of the Flies). With Irving, I would do a short story, and maybe a poem--Sleepy Hollow?

I definitely don't advocate doing "deep analysis" with every book! Goodness no. But the friend who digs really deep with her kids has a blast, and the kids enjoy it, too. Plus, it's not just to understand the book better--it's also a way for them to understand how to write better, use rhetorical techniques, and the like. It's not something I've done, but I can see the value in it (and both of my kids would have liked it).

I'm sure there will be different answers to this question, but mine would be doing a close reading of a work, and delving into the author's technique, layers of meaning, use of literary devices, allusions, structural elements, and then drawing conclusions based on this. It would include trying to figure out what the author was trying to convey with his work. It could also include understanding the author's culture and biases, and evaluating his "worldview" (a much overused word!). I know someone who tackles works down to the individual word level! She has her kids do imitation and analysis on paragraphs and sentences. Why did the author choose this word and not another? Why does he use this particular rhetorical technique? How effective is it? Etc. Doing things her way, you could limit yourself to just a handful of works per year! But you'd sure know them well.

"My first question is: do you think the literature and texts you've selected would work for a 10th grader? (I'm esp. wondering about Heart of Darkness and the Great Gatsby)." Well, of course it depends on the background of the student, but I don't think either of those two you mention are beyond the ability of a well-read 10th grader (especially a 16 year old one). "Second: do you have a schedule/syllabus available?" Not yet, but I'm workin' on it! I hope to have the first 9 weeks mapped out by the end of this month. "And last: where would I find more information on your online class -- or is that either already filled, or for upper level high school students? Not sure we're ready to try an online course yet -- esp. one so far-reaching! But I would love to start gathering information as we toy with the idea. : )" Because I'm not advertising the class--just going by word of mouth--I don't have a brochure or anything ;), but you can feel free to ask me about it. It will be on a moodle format, on which I will post information, assignments, quizzes and exams, and discussion fora. It is not filled--so far three students are confirmed (including my son, of course), with three more possibles. I do plan to limit it to no more than 10 students. I was thinking of mainly 11th and 12th graders, but would consider mature 10th graders. And I love Anne's ideas for videos, too. I plan to suggest optional extra readings, films and documentaries to round out our studies. I'm trying to keep the cost reasonable for everyone, though, so I'm not requiring gobs of resources.

Just wanted to mention that I finished So Brave, Young & Handsome a few days ago and loved it, too! Not as much as Peace Like a River (hard to top that), but it was wonderful in its own way. I'm going to give my summer reading list a thought! Of course, I'll probably just be immersed in 20th C history and literature because I'm teaching that class next year, but I'll have to throw in some stuff just for me, too :tongue_smilie:. Oh, and Lori, if you haven't read Strong Poison or Have His Carcase, I would strongly suggest reading those before Gaudy Night. They are a trilogy (well, a tetralogy really because of Busman's Honeymoon). You won't be disappointed! These 4 novels are the "Harriet Vane" novels.

If students do the government assignments throughout the four years of Tapestry, they will have a government credit. I believe in yrs 3 & 4 is a recommended plan for 1/2 credit in economics, too.

Yes! I am teaching a 20th C history/literature course next year (online). We are using Johnson's Modern Times, as Michelle said, along with The Century by Peter Jennings and some other guy whose name escapes me at the moment. Modern Times will be the glue that holds it all together, and The Century offers more of a linear approach to the 20th C, along with more liberal views for a good balance and discussion (not that I'm liberal--far from it! but hey, we need to balance my viewpoint :D)! We will also read a couple of Albert Marrin books, Over Here by David Kennedy, possibly Only Yesterday, a book about the 1920's (I've just checked that one out from the library), and I'm sure a couple of others that cover later trends or events. We'll also study primary sources (speeches, Supreme Court decisions, etc.). One of the hardest things in doing study for this period is winnowing the vast amounts of material. I want to include so much, but I have to be reasonable. For literature, I'm definitely having the students read Heart of Darkness, The Great Gatsby, The Old Man and the Sea, Remains of the Day, Cry the Beloved Country, and My Antonia. Other works I'm considering include Things Fall Apart, The Quiet American, something by Kafka (Metamorphosos? The Trial?), and something by Solzhenitsyn. We'll also read short stories, poetry, and drama. That way I can include many more 20th C authors, some whose novels we won't read because of content, but who have written short stories that are more tame. I plan for this class to be a full two credits (one for history and one for literature). Please don't hesitate to contact me for further information. All plans are not set in stone yet, by any stretch. You can private message me if you like. I'm no expert here, though--I expect this to be a great class, filled with lots of good discussion, but I'm sure I'll learn just as much as the students (assuming they learn anything, that is :001_huh:).

I think a combination is best. My son took Western Literature to Dante with Scholars Online, and they read tons of works/books. They didn't do a whole lot of in-depth study, but got a lot of exposure. The next year he took English literature--they read only 4 whole novels, I believe, but covered an immense amount of poetry, many short stories, plays, and essays. They went a bit deeper in study that year. This year he has taken AP English literature, and, like Gwen's daughter's class, they read relatively few novels (7), but studied them in great depth, along with explicating a lot of poetry and something like 23 short stories. I think both methods have value, and with 4 years of high school, there is room to do both.

I'm glad my post encouraged you, Colleen. As to why we didn't use Mind Benders, etc., it's because I know Tina in Ouray, who posts here sometimes, and she's the logic "expert" around here, and she doesn't use them! She said in one of her many posts on logic, "The thing that I've given up over the years is the "pre-logic" material I used to do. I find that our time is much better invested in grammar, mathematics, and Latin," and I agree with this. I'd rather spend time on Classical Writing with my elementary age children. Here is another relevant quote from her: "You see, as strong an advocate as I am of rigorously teaching formal and material logic, I part ways with those who feel it necessary or advisable or even desirable to fill our children's time with "pre-logic" curriculum before they are ready to begin formal logic. I think that our children are better prepared by strong grammar and mathematics programs than they are by some of these other kinds of "critical thinking" type curricula." And one more (with a link): "That said, I'm not a fan of "Critical Thinking" -- the text by that name or the concept as it has been taken up in modern academia. (See linking article if you're interested in more on this.) So I'd drop it in a heartbeat anyway. " And her link to Critical Thinking in the Ivory Tower.

My son is just finishing AP English literature with Mrs. Green. He feels very prepared for the test next Thursday, and he's sad for the class to end. He loves Mrs. Green! She just sent him an "AP survival pack" with all kinds of things to help (some funny) for the test. She's just wonderful, and I highly recommend her class.

Patty, I can only answer for my own son, but I would probably get Diogenes Maxim and give it a try. If it didn't seem to be working, I'd bump back to Homer and do the older beginner thing for as long as necessary to get up to speed. Since I'd want to be able to get the benefit of the whole series before finishing high school, I'd probably make my kid work through the summer if necessary (which would be okay for him because he loves to write). Not fair that this came out after my kids were older! But, then, God knows what He is doing :).

Oh, please don't be so hard on yourself (or him)! Some people just don't test well. You say he is a good student and gets good grades, so you and he are surely doing something right! In which areas are his scores lowest, or is it across the board? If you can pinpoint the areas of difficulty, perhaps you can come up with a game plan. Also, if you get the score book (or whatever it's called), perhaps you can go over the things he missed and find out if he's reading questions/problems wrong, or just what. How does he do in the practice books? Did you have him take practice exams? If so, how did he do? If his scores were much higher doing that, perhaps he feels lots of pressure during the "real thing." Fortunately, you've still got time to work with him. Also, test scores aren't the be-all-to-end-all. It's just a number, and it isn't necessarily a reflection of how hard a person works, or how bright he is. Also, you might want to try having him take the SAT. Some students do much better on that than on the ACT (and vice versa). My son did much better on the SAT.

I agree with Martha! If I had younger kids, I would begin with CW and do it all the way through. In fact, believe it or not, I'm going through it for myself. Maybe I can teach it to other children (maybe even my own grandchildren) someday. Not to mention become a better writer myself.

I have used (and liked) this program, but I don't have any advice for your friend. LRTEG is so different from other Latin programs that there is really no way the students could go into something else that would be deemed "Latin II." They really would need to start over in something else, or keep going in LRTEG. In other words, no matter which way they go, they will need to do 2 more years of Latin, as LRTEG is 2 credits for all three levels. Wheelock's or Henle can both be done in 2 years for 2 credits.

You can absolutely do this! If I did it (and am still doing it), believe me, you can, too. I have been homeschooling for 17 years now and when we began I had a 2nd grader and a one-year old. The former 2nd grader is now in graduate school, and the youngest is a junior in high school. I had a terrible public education, so I had to learn right along with my kids. We didn't even know about classical education until the oldest was in 9th grade and the youngest in 3rd. Nevertheless, my oldest was well-prepared for college, graduated with honors, with a Latin minor!! He studied Henle by himself, with absolutely no outside help, and tested into intermediate Latin in college. Obviously, my youngest has had many more advantages of classical education, even though it has taken a long time to get it all straight (well, we still don't have it all straight). Although I have used WTM extensively, I have never used it rigidly. We never used, for example, Mind Benders or Critical Thinking. We just plunged into logic in 7th grade with Traditional Logic. I studied it one chapter ahead and even taught it to a group of kids one year! We didn't study science formally until high school (the kids did always check out science books from the library, so they had informal science). We probably mostly stuck to the history and literature recommendations. When or if you get to a point that you can't stay ahead, you can do one of two things--learn right along with your children, or farm out a course. I have done this a bit with my youngest--he takes Latin online. I mostly learned right along with my kids, and now I even teach some literature and history courses to other kids besides just my own (always with fear and trepidation, I might add). So, all that rambling is just meant for encouragement! There are many ways to do it, and you seem motivated, for sure. In all honesty, I almost never worried about it--if there's one thing I see more of lately, it's worry that moms will ruin their childrens' chances at a good education or whatever. Maybe when there weren't quite so many different curricula choices around we didn't worry as much. I don't know. In any case, I muddled through without internet support for a very long time--just books checked out from the library on how to homeschool highschoolers, how to get them into college, and all that. There is so much more support now! My best advice is not to worry--do your best, and likely that will be just fine.