Those using AAS w/dyslexic child

[Ms. Riding Hood]

I'm really thinking about trying this out next year w/ 5th grade dyslexic ds. He's been through Barton level 5, so he's seen all these rules before (in fact AAS looks eerily like Barton to me). I suppose my hesitation is this: his spelling improved very little using Barton. He can *know* the rule, and yet fails to apply it in writing. Same for decoding, but that's another story. :001_smile: I suppose I get to a point where I wonder if I should still keep drilling, drilling, drilling for spelling, or if I should let it go and focus on more productive endeavors. I'm wanting to hear experiences of people using AAS, good and bad. Have you seen improvement? Is it worth the time and cost to you? Have you tried it and moved on to something that's working better? :confused:

 

I'm also trying to figure out Apples and Pears, so feel free to comment on that too.

[Ms. Riding Hood]

Okay, so after looking through all the A&P samples I feel like that is what we're going to do. I've been thinking AAS was my best option, O-G based, very thorough, etc. But I *hate* what it is. It makes me cringe to think of it. I did not like Barton, and I think even ds would rebel at anything Barton-like. We took that medicine for a long time and now blech! But the A&P morpheme approach really clicks with me, especially since ds's big decoding issues tie right into this. Whether it will work for him or not, at least I'll feel like it's practical. All the rules just sit in his head like so much syrup.

 

Hmm, I seem to be answering all my own questions today. Something about posting them here helps me to clarify things in my mind. But thanks!

[m4given]

Are you still interested in some input?

[PeterPan]

Did you do the placement test for A&P? He might be beyond it, not sure. In any case, I know what you feel. With my dd we did SWR till we thought we would spit or surely need to burn it. It's just not their strength. I finally decided we'd take a different route, less analytical, and we started doing a lot of dictation. That worked well, because it's practice IN CONTEXT. It doesn't reek of spelling, so it doesn't get balked at so much. For the decoding, I've been using vocab words she doesn't know (so she can't guess) and having her work through them on a whiteboard. So I'm going for small, consistent, gradual bits of progress, a drip, drip, rather than thinking one program is going to be the magic bullet. In the past we've also done topical workbooks, things like Spelling Works, Grammar Works (both by Halverson), etc., just little things to drip drip and keep working on it.

[Ms. Riding Hood]

I hate to say not interested, because I'm definitely interested in hearing others' experiences with this. But I'm not sure I am still open to persuasion, kwim? But sure, I'd still love to hear what you've got to say!

[proudmamma]

:lurk5:

[Ms. Riding Hood]

Did you do the placement test for A&P? He might be beyond it, not sure.

 

:lol: Oh I wish he were!

[siloam]

What is A & P?????

 

I've been considering Barton's for ds, and I was wondering about AAS. I'm all :bigear:.

 

Apples & Pears Spelling

 

Heather

 

[m4given]

I hate to say not interested, because I'm definitely interested in hearing others' experiences with this. But I'm not sure I am still open to persuasion, kwim? But sure, I'd still love to hear what you've got to say!

I mainly wanted to give you a "bump" since I was hoping to "hear" the responses too. (We use AAS, but dd is not dyslexic & so am not qualified to answer your questions.)

 

Just looked at Apples and Pears -- I find it quite interesting that they state that infants have learned to read thru their program.

[Lovedtodeath]

Well I was going to direct you to the threads with an apples and pears tag. You may have already seen them, but I added it to this one anyone.

 

Will someone tag this thread with AAS please? I am only allowed two tags.:)

[m4given]

Well I was going to direct you to the threads with an apples and pears tag. You may have already seen them, but I added it to this one anyone.

 

Will someone tag this thread with AAS please? I am only allowed two tags.:)

 

I've never edited tags before, but I think I accomplished your request to tag this thread with "AAS". :001_smile:

[Lovedtodeath]

 

I've never edited tags before, but I think I accomplished your request to tag this thread with "AAS". :001_smile:

Yes you did! Thank you!

[Shay]

This conversation on a blog may help you feel at ease with your decision to go with A&P. The author, Tom Burkard, has a lot of info in the "comments" section. I am using A&P with my ds (we're only on the first book). Once I knew that A&P had similarities with Spelling Mastery, a Direct Instruction program, I knew that I wanted to use it. I think your ds will appreciate that it has no tiles (since he's BTDT) and does not at ALL seem babyish.

 

http://d-edreckoning.blogspot.com/2008/11/efficiency-and-spelling.html

 

HTH!

Shay

[Ms. Riding Hood]

What is A & P?????

 

I've been considering Barton's for ds, and I was wondering about AAS. I'm all :bigear:.

 

 

Maybe somebody who's used both can address this, but Barton is very, very expensive, *intensive* reading and spelling. AAS addresses the spelling side of it, but not sure it would be nearly as comprehensive in scope. In other words, I wouldn't see it as a choice between one or the other. Or maybe this isn't what you meant?

[jg_puppy]

I am using Apples and Pears spelling with my oldest. It is the first spelling program that I have actually noticed working for her. We have completed book B and are in the middle of book C.

 

I have AAS level 1. I want to use this with my youngest, but I could just never get into it. My youngest is however using Barton with his speech therapist. I am happy with the progress he has made with Barton, but we are only on level 1.

 

Jan

[AngieW in Texas]

I found that my dyslexic dd doesn't do well with rule-based programs, but does do well with pattern-based programs. You might have an issue like this. When given rules to follow, she gets confused about which rule to follow when and starts applying rules that have nothing at all to do with the word she has. Patterns don't confuse her.

 

some rule-based programs:

Barton

Wilson

AAS

Megawords

 

some pattern-based programs:

Abecedarian

Reading Reflex (phonographix)

Sequential Spelling

Spelling through Morphographs

 

I haven't looked through A&P to see whether it's rule-based or pattern-based.

 

I just thought you might like another perspective on why Barton didn't work for your ds.

 

One type of program is not better than the other. Some kids learn better with a rule-based approach and others learn better with a pattern-based approach. You often have to try them both out to see which works best.

[rafiki]

.

[siloam]

Maybe somebody who's used both can address this, but Barton is very, very expensive, *intensive* reading and spelling. AAS addresses the spelling side of it, but not sure it would be nearly as comprehensive in scope. In other words, I wouldn't see it as a choice between one or the other. Or maybe this isn't what you meant?

 

I from what little I have used of Barton's, no they are not really the same animal.

 

If someone needed something cheaper than Barton's I would direct them to a program like Wilson Reading, Preventing Academic Failure, Seeing Stars, S.P.I.R.E., Horizons Reading (the one on one version not the computerized version), those are all o/g programs that are still expensive but not as expensive as Barton's.

 

Barton's still has a reputation for being more in depth than all of the above, but the above have a full controlled reading portion. AAS readers, but I am not sure how controlled they are (as in every word is introduced to the child before they are expected to read it in the story). I know you have to teach some sight words. In addition it is not enough practice for most dyslexic children. Then if you use outside resource for readers you might loose the controlled part.

 

If the child has mild issues then AAS would be a good solution, if their issues are more mid level then any of the above should work, but AAS would require modification in both how much review is done and in finding and adding readers (which I have to do for my 9yo). If the child issues are severe then I would just do Barton's. It has the best track record in those situations.

 

As for Apples & Pears, I haven't used it. Mostly because I prefer using as many muli-sensory methods as possible. The original o/g research though was based on writing being the only tactile sense used, so A&P would qualify there, and it does look to be incremental. In my book it looks like a strong program. I also have no clue how it would work as a full reading program instead of just spelling. They do have a reading program listed on the same site, and again I don't know if they go hand in hand to make a full, controlled program or not. I would love to know, but don't have the time to figure it out. :D

 

Heather

[Ms. Riding Hood]

Arrghhh! STM is one I'd forgotten about. :001_huh: Maybe I'd better look at that again while I'm at it. Thanks for mentioning it.

[Ms. Riding Hood]

Shay,

The blog was great reading! It does reassure. Much appreciated!

[Ms. Riding Hood]

Hmm, and thanks to the blog Shay recommended I just realized that STM has the same authors as Spelling Mastery. Interesting.

[Ms. Riding Hood]

OhElizabeth, just wanted to pass along that ds did the placement testing for A&P today and placed into Book A, Level 51. So almost to the end of the first book! : )

[MerryAtHope]

I've seen great improvement in my kids' spelling in their writing this year, after doing AAS Level 3. Here's how AAS has helped my kids:

 

1, the dictations start short and get progressively longer. This has built up stamina for writing, and also gives them "real world" spelling practice that's harder than a list or an isolated word, but easier than spelling in the context of making up your own content.

 

2, Beginning in level 3, AAS includes a section on "Word Analysis" with every step. This walks kids through how to think about words and the various strategies they can use. We incorporate these in the editing process of writing, and it's a valuable tool for us. More on that in a minute.

 

3, Also beginning in level 3, AAS includes "The Writing Station." Kids write sentences using 5 of their spelling words. The words often relate to each other and lend themselves to a story. They write the words first, and then they use them in sentences or a story. After they're done, we go back through and edit as needed. I think of it as another bridge or step to writing--words to dictation phrases to dictation sentences to writing their own sentences with spelling words to writing, if you will. It's been a valuable progression for us.

 

Here is a blog I wrote on how to help spelling skills translate into their writing. In there I also talk about how we use word analysis and review in the editing process. HTH, and I hope you find what will work for you & your son! Merry :-)