WWE 2 & dyslexia

[seemesew]

We have used TGAB for my 10-year-old from Pre-K through his 5th-grade year, and he has done moderately well with it. However, I do have to make adjustments for him due to his slight dyslexia. Last year, we enrolled him in dyslexia therapy, and he is progressing quite well. He will continue with therapy this school year, so I'm not worried about his spelling or reading. I share this background to seek input on his writing. TGAB Level 3 was perfect for him, and he made significant progress in writing using it. However, Level 4 seems like a big leap, and I don't believe he can handle it without considerable assistance from me, causing frustration. Therefore, I am exploring other writing programs.

I've researched several programs within my budget, but many, like IEW or WriteShop, require more time and mental energy than I can currently manage. This search led me to WWE 2.

He already narrates and summarizes well, but he struggles with writing longer pieces, and his spelling is poor. When we reviewed Level 3, he observed that the sentences were too lengthy, echoing my thoughts. Thus, I believe Level 2 may be more suitable for him. Do you think WWE 2 would be a good fit? Alternatively, is there another straightforward curriculum similar to WWE that might be better?

 

Edited July 14 by seemesew

[desertflower]

Hi! I would also ask on the Learning Challenges Board.

 

I hope you find something. 

[seemesew]

Just now, desertflower said:

Hi! I would also ask on the Learning Challenges Board.

 

I hope you find something. 

Thanks! Me too 🤪

[caffeineandbooks]

WWE has been our main writing for grades 1-3, but I have no experience of dyslexia so I will stick to telling you about the program and hope that helps you to decide for yourself whether it could be a fit for you.

WWE2 separates composition and writing, which might be helpful for dyslexia/dysgraphia.  Each week the child listens to you read two passages and is guided to summarise them, copies 1-2 sentences, and takes those same 1-2 sentences as dictation.  I have found it really useful in helping my kids (no known LDs) to learn how to summarise and causing them to pay more attention to spelling and mechanics.  It took us under 15 minutes per day.

That may well be below the level your son is already at, so WWE3 might also be on your radar.  In that level you're slowly bringing together composition and physical writing.  The child reads two longer passages for themselves (but you could certainly read to the child if needed), discusses with you (scripted and only takes 5 minutes), then summarises the passage.  You write their summary down and then dictate some of it back to them for them to write down, and they continue to take dictation on two other days of the week without copying the sentences first.  By the end of level 3, my kids were able to read 3-4 pages, summarise into 3-4 sentences, and write those sentences down independently.  They were also able to apply that skill to creating written narrations for SOTW chapters.

In both levels, the passages come mostly from novels, with a few weeks of poetry included as well.  There is no attempt to write stories, news articles etc - just a focus on putting thoughts into words and getting those words on paper, with some light instruction about punctuation along the way.  It's open and go for the parent, and while it was never the favorite subject in my house, it was completed without fuss.

[seemesew]

3 hours ago, caffeineandbooks said:

WWE has been our main writing for grades 1-3, but I have no experience of dyslexia so I will stick to telling you about the program and hope that helps you to decide for yourself whether it could be a fit for you.

WWE2 separates composition and writing, which might be helpful for dyslexia/dysgraphia.  Each week the child listens to you read two passages and is guided to summarise them, copies 1-2 sentences, and takes those same 1-2 sentences as dictation.  I have found it really useful in helping my kids (no known LDs) to learn how to summarise and causing them to pay more attention to spelling and mechanics.  It took us under 15 minutes per day.

That may well be below the level your son is already at, so WWE3 might also be on your radar.  In that level you're slowly bringing together composition and physical writing.  The child reads two longer passages for themselves (but you could certainly read to the child if needed), discusses with you (scripted and only takes 5 minutes), then summarises the passage.  You write their summary down and then dictate some of it back to them for them to write down, and they continue to take dictation on two other days of the week without copying the sentences first.  By the end of level 3, my kids were able to read 3-4 pages, summarise into 3-4 sentences, and write those sentences down independently.  They were also able to apply that skill to creating written narrations for SOTW chapters.

In both levels, the passages come mostly from novels, with a few weeks of poetry included as well.  There is no attempt to write stories, news articles etc - just a focus on putting thoughts into words and getting those words on paper, with some light instruction about punctuation along the way.  It's open and go for the parent, and while it was never the favorite subject in my house, it was completed without fuss.

That is extremely helpful! He can read fairly well I'm not worried about that but he struggles with writing. After seeing what you have written I do think level 2 would be the place to start and maybe we'll just go faster through it, and since he can summarize well it should go quicker, anyways its worth a try! He could use a confidence boost in writing and I think this will help him. Level 3 writing passages look too long though the readings seem fine, but I know he would struggle with the longer dictations and copy work.

I guess all I can do is try it and see how it goes!

[Resilient]

https://support.welltrainedmind.com/hc/en-us/articles/360058758033-Can-we-use-The-Well-Trained-Mind-as-our-guide-if-we-deal-with-dyslexia-or-dysgraphia
 

There used to be an article by a staff member who told how she used WWE with her dyslexic child but I can’t find it now.  Too bad.  

[EKS]

On 7/13/2024 at 12:49 PM, seemesew said:

When we reviewed Level 3, he observed that the sentences were too lengthy, echoing my thoughts.

Too lengthy for what?  Are you talking about the dictation exercises?  You have my permission to modify those as you see fit!

That said--why do you need a writing program?  Why not just let him write about what he's learning?  It would give him a chance to consolidate his current skills and, if you allow it, experience with expressing his own thoughts about things.

[seemesew]

Im not explaining it well, i guess. I don't care about a real writing program but I need something simple to help him write ANYthing. He can just barely do simple sentences,  so writng about what he's learning isn't and won't happen. I have gone easy on writing and i can see its hurt him, so now we need to do something more. I am also maxed so I can't commit to anything too complicated like writeshop or iew, and I've tried the just write on what you want thing and this has not helped this particular child. WWE I hope will give him practice at simply writing anything but be easy for me to implement and be consistent which has been my biggest struggle.

Hopefully that makes sense!

[SilverMoon]

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Edited Thursday at 09:19 PM by SilverMoon

[EKS]

54 minutes ago, seemesew said:

Im not explaining it well, i guess. I don't care about a real writing program but I need something simple to help him write ANYthing. He can just barely do simple sentences,  so writng about what he's learning isn't and won't happen.

You absolutely can have him write about what he is learning.  Start with single sentences.  If you have him write one sentence per day, by the end of the week he will have a whole paragraph.  I am completely serious.  If this is daunting (and it might be), have a discussion with him and you take notes.  Then he can refer to the notes to write each sentence.

Another possibility is having him do keyword outlines.  This is introduced in IEW and really worked well for my dyslexic son who had trouble with deciding what to write.  To do this, find a paragraph related to something he is learning about.  Those illustrated children's encyclopedia books have the sort of paragraphs that work well for this.  Have him write down three key words for each sentence in the paragraph.  The next day you take away the paragraph and the student writes a new paragraph from the keyword outline.  

I'm not a fan of IEW otherwise, but the keyword outline thing was a lifesaver!

 

[Clarita]

1 hour ago, EKS said:

You absolutely can have him write about what he is learning.

The Writing Revolution scaffolds this really well from 1st grade all the way through high school. You can get the book and read all about it or you can type in The Writing Revolution and see the things teachers have done with it. 

FWIW I have 2 little kids so I only know that it can get students who can not write a sentence to write about what they've learned. Super formulaic but you know it's better than nothing.

[EKS]

32 minutes ago, Clarita said:

The Writing Revolution scaffolds this really well from 1st grade all the way through high school.

The Writing Revolution came after my time, but I thought it looked so interesting that I bought a copy and have it on the shelf.  I really need to read it.

[seemesew]

9 hours ago, EKS said:

You absolutely can have him write about what he is learning.  Start with single sentences.  If you have him write one sentence per day, by the end of the week he will have a whole paragraph.  I am completely serious.  If this is daunting (and it might be), have a discussion with him and you take notes.  Then he can refer to the notes to write each sentence.

Another possibility is having him do keyword outlines.  This is introduced in IEW and really worked well for my dyslexic son who had trouble with deciding what to write.  To do this, find a paragraph related to something he is learning about.  Those illustrated children's encyclopedia books have the sort of paragraphs that work well for this.  Have him write down three key words for each sentence in the paragraph.  The next day you take away the paragraph and the student writes a new paragraph from the keyword outline.  

I'm not a fan of IEW otherwise, but the keyword outline thing was a lifesaver!

 

A sentence a day...that is brilliant! I also really appreciate how you laid out the other writing ideas, and I think I will try it at least a couple times a week and see how it goes. Thank you 😊 

[seemesew]

We are finishing up our first week with WWE 2 and so far it's been a perfect fit! He reads me the passage for reading practice and we get writing in as well! Level 2 is absolutely where he needed to be 😊

[seemesew]

We're finishing up our 2nd week and he's starting to get tired of the repetition but I can see so many benefits of what he's doing! His spelling is getting more practice and his handwriting is looking better. I think I'll tweak it to 2x per week and only do 1 narration/dictation/copywork a week and skip some of the lessons...adding the sentence idea above on the other days.

[Clarita]

1 hour ago, seemesew said:

We're finishing up our 2nd week and he's starting to get tired of the repetition but I can see so many benefits of what he's doing!

For a while I used WWE as a guide and used reading DS picked. He was ok with that for a while (the reading selection brought enough interest). Although 2 weeks ago we discussed me just picking reading selections because he didn't want to do the narrations from the book he is reading.

[Lovinglife234]

If it doesn’t work well and you’d like more structure/ less thinking on your part- Rod and Staff has been perfect for my 6th grader with dyslexia.  He started with grade 2 in 4th grade, grade 3 in 5th and now in 6th grade he is confidently doing grade 4.  It has completely blossomed his writing in all areas.  He writes stories for fun.  I have not done anything else for writing.

[seemesew]

2 hours ago, Lovinglife234 said:

If it doesn’t work well and you’d like more structure/ less thinking on your part- Rod and Staff has been perfect for my 6th grader with dyslexia.  He started with grade 2 in 4th grade, grade 3 in 5th and now in 6th grade he is confidently doing grade 4.  It has completely blossomed his writing in all areas.  He writes stories for fun.  I have not done anything else for writing.

Are you using the full English program or do they have just a writing one? That may be a possibility for us to try!

[Lovinglife234]

English- it includes writing.  What I love about it is that you can relax a bit.  If my child finishes grade six it is sufficient for highschool level grammar & they are prepared for more advanced writing.  For my struggling reader/writer it is a simple attainable goal.  Everything is bite size and incremental.